Why does everyone like Gold ?

It sound so generic.

"The Ladder" has the Prince Scream (TM)

paisleyparkgirl said:

RJOrion said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

Why does everyone like Gold ?

It sound so generic.

I dont like it at all...im one of the few people that doent like The Gold Experience Lp...except for Shy, Shhh, and Dolphin...i dig those 3 and thats it...sometimes i can tolerate TMBGITW, but nah..

Butt, try "Shy", "Shhh", "Dolphin", & "Gold" on a mini playlist.

It's a '95 Guitar-Gasm!

While 'Purple Rain' is the well-known 'famous' track and also horrendously overplayed, is it the better song?

I'd say probably not. 'The Ladder' is much more interesting, both musically and lyrically.

Throw a 5 minute guitar solo on The Ladder and it would kill PR in an instant

fragglerock said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

Why does everyone like Gold ?

It sound so generic.

A 90s order of "Purple Rain" with extra cheese.

LoveGalore said:

fragglerock said:

While 'Purple Rain' is the well-known 'famous' track and also horrendously overplayed, is it the better song?

I'd say probably not. 'The Ladder' is much more interesting, both musically and lyrically.

Throw a 5 minute guitar solo on The Ladder and it would kill PR in an instant

What makes The Ladder more interesting lyrically? I'm also curious why it's more interesting musically considering it is the same groove throughout with no solos or key changes or anything.

whoah, whoah, "The Ladder" is not the track on trial here. You PR apologists justify your pick for once in this thread.

I like how you highlight "lyrically" when PR has like five lines total when you omit all repetition/variants of "Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain blah blah Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain"... are there significant key shifts in PR anyway? What is this, modal jazz class? PR is a bland, by-the-numbers power ballad (had a teen rock phase, are power ballads really that beloved of a subgenre?) even if it runs through every key in the alphabet.

[Edited 10/8/22 3:50am]

WhisperingDandelions said:

dodger07 said:

my shocking confession: I was never a huge fan of the song "Purple Rain" and yeah,I know it's one of Prince's signature songs and all,but I was never that crazy about it.Big arena rock ballads have always bored me.

rockford said:

LoveGalore said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

whoah, whoah, "The Ladder" is not the track on trial here. You PR apologists justify your pick for once in this thread.

I like how you highlight "lyrically" when PR has like five lines total when you omit all repetition/variants of "Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain blah blah Purple Rain Purple Rain Purple Rain"... are there significant key shifts in PR anyway? What is this, modal jazz class? PR is a bland, by-the-numbers power ballad (had a teen rock phase, are power ballads really that beloved of a subgenre?) even if it runs through every key in the alphabet.

[Edited 10/8/22 3:50am]

Tsk tsk. Can't answer a straight up question with a straight up answer? The Ladder IS on trial because you redactionistas are tryna rewrite history. The never was and never will be a time where The Ladder is superior to Purple Rain. And that's final!!!!

ha dude, there was an answer: PR lyrics are super generic. "The Ladder" may be slightly vague/cryptic, but that's part of the intrigue, the lyrics are infinitely more interesting because of the style, and I'm probably the least religious on the org. PR is like madlibs/plug-in sentiment with most of lyrics taken up by repeating "Purple Rain" infinitely. At least "The Ladder" has lyrics, "Purple Rain" has like three lines outside the title.

I covered the backing tracks, too, PR is very standard power ballad structure, which is actually a generic genre by design to begin with. Only on the org are "power ballads" spoken of like serialism or classical impressionism, like he conquered the creme de la creme of art.

Maybe "The Ladder" seems less emotionally resonant to some because he sings the verses in that flat, Madonna/Ingrid Chavez "Justify Your Love" borderline spoken word style, but again this makes it more unique than by-the-numbers power ballad with by-the-numbers sentiment. It gives it a more all-encompassing build whereas the build of PR is based purely on the guitar solos.

[Edited 10/10/22 20:04pm]

SoulAlive said:

my shocking confession: I was never a huge fan of the song "Purple Rain" and yeah,I know it's one of Prince's signature songs and all,but I was never that crazy about it.Big arena rock ballads have always bored me.

It's for the big arena rock crowd,

But as a former big arena rock fan who got into Prince for the rawk, even then, ehhhh, it's a standard power ballad. He didn't re-invent the wheel or anything with that. His sparse Linn drum/synth experiments are wayyy more something to break out the shield to stan than "Purple Rain" of all vibes....

WhisperingDandelions said:

paisleyparkgirl said:

Why does everyone like Gold ?

It sound so generic.

I don't like it. The music is derviative and the lyrics are trite.

In fact, "All that glitters ain't gold" might be the most trite lyric Prince has ever put into a song. If it was a throw-away line in the middle of a verse I could ignore it, but it's the center piece of the chorus.

lurker316 said:

LoveGalore said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

ha dude, there was an answer: PR lyrics are super generic. "The Ladder" may be slightly vague/cryptic, but that's part of the intrigue, the lyrics are infinitely more interesting because of the style, and I'm probably the least religious on the org. PR is like madlibs/plug-in sentiment with most of lyrics taken up by repeating "Purple Rain" infinitely. At least "The Ladder" has lyrics, "Purple Rain" has like three lines outside the title.

I covered the backing tracks, too, PR is very standard power ballad structure, which is actually a generic genre by design to begin with. Only on the org are "power ballads" spoken of like serialism or classical impressionism, like he conquered the creme de la creme of art.

Maybe "The Ladder" seems less emotionally resonant to some because he sings the verses in that flat, Madonna/Ingrid Chavez "Justify Your Love" borderline spoken word style, but again this makes it more unique than by-the-numbers power ballad with by-the-numbers sentiment. It gives it a more all-encompassing build whereas the build of PR is based purely on the guitar solos.

[Edited 10/10/22 20:04pm]

I don't think there's anything standard about Purple Rain and you can always tell a P-cynic by their opinions of that song. It's as if liking it makes you a sycophant or that your taste doesn't elevate beyond the standard of the standard. Let's not pretend that songs need to be complex or whatever the opposite of standard is to be good. There's a reason why standards are... THE STANDARD! Nobody needs to say Purple Rain is the cream of the same crop The Ladder is part of - but I'm glad someone does when threads like this crawl forth from the congealed artistic fatigue of the org. Btw, The Ladder doesn't have anymore lyrics than Purple Rain does. Two verses and an endless parade of the chorus. I think you're griping about some psychosomatic issues rather than what is reality.

...You were literally whining about lack of key changes in "The Ladder" like three posts ago, now you're the musical everyman Joe Six Pack?

LoveGalore said:

What makes The Ladder more interesting lyrically? I'm also curious why it's more interesting musically considering it is the same groove throughout with no solos or key changes or anything.

You were even castigating it for being "the same groove throughout", of all things to critique a Prince song of being. Oh no, not the same groove throughout!

And no, Not "a standard", or "the standard", "a standard power. ballad.", sir, as in: generic and standard endemic to the subgenre of rock'n'roll power ballads as a whole. as in, not really even on the same level as say an "Every Rose Has Its Thorn" or "November Rain" or various Journey songs, one of which he admitted to biting... you know, actual power ballad "standards" by your construed definition. I think even that Aerosmith track from that 90s movie is probably a superior (as in, not quite so standard, as in not so quite generic) power ballad.

Never mind getting into the truly great, next level power ballads by a metal band like Lacuna Coil.

"Purple Rain" is a paint-by-numbers generic, plain power ballad to someone who made the rounds with some rock records back in the day and really couldn't even articulate what exactly is a key change anyway. I literally asked you if your post implied PR had one, but now you're defender of the common music man, k.

And you still haven't explained in your various posts why you find "Purple Rain" better than "The Ladder" other than key changes--does it even have a key change?--and now this tirade about standards and cynics and whatever means you're trying to declare one song in the Prince library of thousands as some be-all, end-all fan statement of statements.

It really sounds like you're the one who has ascribed all sorts of psychological baggage into this one single song in a library of thousands and what a fan's opinion on it does or does not say about them macrocosmically... But I do passionately me love "Little Red Corvette" and "When Doves Cry" because those actually surpass/exceed/excel their respective genres.

But anyway, because we both know you're gonna ignore all that blather: "The Ladder" lyrics:

"Purple Rain" lyrics after hitting FIND&REPLACE on all repetition of the title:

man it really repeats a lot of other stuff with slight variations, too. total madlibs lyrics.

And I don't even care about lyrics as a significant marker of song quality, just like the musical elitist key changes critique: you brought the lyrics up.

LoveGalore said:

Prince didn't reinvent any wheels though one COULD say he did for drum machines what Jimi did for strats. [Edited 10/11/22 5:37am]

yes, and we do.

he "didn't reinvent any wheels" except the wheel he reinvented. solid take. Literally all of R&B and pop is synths and drum machines and electronic sounds and raunch now.

He actually exceeds Jimi because starting a strat-led rock band today is like starting a New Orleans jazz band. It might as well be what Bix Beiderbecke did for the cornet as far as gen-Z is concerned. but they do know their drum machines, synthsizers and electronic tapestries...

[Edited 10/11/22 6:11am]

WhisperingDandelions said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

LoveGalore said:

WhisperingDandelions said:

man it really repeats a lot of other stuff with slight variations, too. total madlibs lyrics.

And I don't even care about lyrics as a significant marker of song quality, just like the musical elitist key changes critique: you brought the lyrics up.

Listen, like I told Ian, I don't get down with these long, masturbatory diatribes. I appreciate you can distill your feelings down to such a point, but you're way way more aggressive than I am. I don't care. If you don't like purple rain, go ahead on. You get all the cool kid cred.

oooookay...

just one tl;dr (and all I've been asking since reply #1, actually all OP asked originally):

Why do you (LoveGalore) think "Purple Rain" is superior to "The Ladder"?

(I really want to ask who or what "Ian" is supposed to mean, too, but just focus on the top half if this part is too excessively overwhelming... movie reference? Bill Hicks? "shit, Ian it's a Spalding?")

[Edited 10/11/22 6:28am]

[Edited 10/11/22 6:30am]

LoveGalore said:

lurker316 said:

I don't like it. The music is derviative and the lyrics are trite.

In fact, "All that glitters ain't gold" might be the most trite lyric Prince has ever put into a song. If it was a throw-away line in the middle of a verse I could ignore it, but it's the center piece of the chorus.

Now you know damn well all music is derivative. Prince built a career on derivatively synthesizing his inspirations. Does it create something brand new? I don't think so. One might say they find nothing exciting in Gold (and Purple Rain, etc) but thats cool. It's just... Prince didn't reinvent any wheels though one COULD say he did for drum machines what Jimi did for strats. [Edited 10/11/22 5:37am]

Yes, all music is derivative to a degree. In other words, some songs are more derivate, while other songs are less. Gold would be a song that was the more end of the spectrum. Most of prince's best songs were less derviative and more originiality.

Besides, even if were to excuse the music, the lyrics are trite.

WhisperingDandelions said:

LoveGalore said:

LoveGalore said: