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Thread started 07/11/21 5:21pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

who thinks the vault should remain closed?

Its open now a few years
Some of what we've heard has been bad (those bonnie Raitt demos)
A lot has been amazing
Much has been just interesting to hear and compare
Its obv how much effort prince put into what he released, well most stuff, the good stuff, when you hear what he left in the vault, even though these tracks are still worth listening to

Has it been worth it?

I think he knew this would happen, but didnt want to sanction it himself despite bragging about how much great stuff he had sitting around. He just knew someone would do it anyway.

The reason I ask if it should be opened is not because I think he wouldnt have wanted it open,but because he just had so much unreleased music. More than most. Could it be a case of too much of a good thing??
[Edited 7/11/21 17:24pm]
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Reply #1 posted 07/11/21 6:04pm

Graycap23

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No one.

FOOLS multiply when WISE Men & Women are silent.
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Reply #2 posted 07/11/21 6:19pm

robertgeorge

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I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

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Reply #3 posted 07/11/21 6:38pm

Graycap23

avatar

robertgeorge said:

I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

Lat I hear there was 8,500 plus unreleased songs.

How is that exagerrated?

FOOLS multiply when WISE Men & Women are silent.
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Reply #4 posted 07/11/21 7:11pm

robertgeorge

avatar

Graycap23 said:

robertgeorge said:

I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

Lat I hear there was 8,500 plus unreleased songs.

How is that exagerrated?

Exaggerated in terms of quality, such as Prince having songs better than Purple Rain that he was keeping for himself and his children (well that won't happen), the wildest most psychedelic Revolution tracks or something like that was what he said. Morris Hayes claimed to have heard those better than Purple Rain tracks, but who knows when it is all subjective.

Exaggerated in the sense that the 8500 songs are all unique and completed, and not a reasonable amount of alternative takes, remixes and incomplete jams.

That being said, I am not detracting from the accomplishments of Prince and the Vault. I just don't believe he was sleeping on stuff better than Purple Rain, Parade, Sign O the Times etc.

Sure he kept some cool stuff unreleased (a lot of our faves), I just don't believe all of his process was platinum when his later albums lost that quality control and it factor for me.

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Reply #5 posted 07/11/21 7:20pm

ForceofNature

I see no real reason to not have it be open to hear the contents of. I think it would be a disservice to both, Prince fans and music historians, to not have the full scope of what he was up to in his life

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Reply #6 posted 07/11/21 7:30pm

SoulAlive

let's face it,folks.....in our lifetime,we're not gonna be able to hear everything that's in the vaults.We can only dream about and speculate about what's really there smile I'm OK with this.I enjoy hearing the outtakes on the SDEs.We'll just have to have to settle for that.

..

[Edited 7/11/21 19:34pm]

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Reply #7 posted 07/11/21 7:39pm

Graycap23

avatar

robertgeorge said:

Graycap23 said:

Lat I hear there was 8,500 plus unreleased songs.

How is that exagerrated?

Exaggerated in terms of quality, such as Prince having songs better than Purple Rain that he was keeping for himself and his children (well that won't happen), the wildest most psychedelic Revolution tracks or something like that was what he said. Morris Hayes claimed to have heard those better than Purple Rain tracks, but who knows when it is all subjective.

Exaggerated in the sense that the 8500 songs are all unique and completed, and not a reasonable amount of alternative takes, remixes and incomplete jams.

That being said, I am not detracting from the accomplishments of Prince and the Vault. I just don't believe he was sleeping on stuff better than Purple Rain, Parade, Sign O the Times etc.

Sure he kept some cool stuff unreleased (a lot of our faves), I just don't believe all of his process was platinum when his later albums lost that quality control and it factor for me.

I'll bet u cash money the unreleased stuff from Exodus with Prince singing the lead will kick PR in the behind.

FOOLS multiply when WISE Men & Women are silent.
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Reply #8 posted 07/11/21 11:49pm

Romeoblu

Well personally i think the Bonnie Riatt songs were great.

The Vault is proving to be a wonderful treasure trove and we still haven't had the Parade SDE.
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Reply #9 posted 07/12/21 12:32am

fortuneandsere
ndipity

robertgeorge said:

Graycap23 said:

Lat I hear there was 8,500 plus unreleased songs.

How is that exagerrated?

Exaggerated in terms of quality, such as Prince having songs better than Purple Rain that he was keeping for himself and his children (well that won't happen), the wildest most psychedelic Revolution tracks or something like that was what he said. Morris Hayes claimed to have heard those better than Purple Rain tracks, but who knows when it is all subjective.

Exaggerated in the sense that the 8500 songs are all unique and completed, and not a reasonable amount of alternative takes, remixes and incomplete jams.

That being said, I am not detracting from the accomplishments of Prince and the Vault. I just don't believe he was sleeping on stuff better than Purple Rain, Parade, Sign O the Times etc.

Sure he kept some cool stuff unreleased (a lot of our faves), I just don't believe all of his process was platinum when his later albums lost that quality control and it factor for me.


I heard 8000 but it's probably a latest estimate. And including instrumentals, how are they going to know at this stage? I can't believe everything in the vault has been properly curated yet.

Since Purple Rain is the perfect album, the idea of having songs any better is like, unfathomable. wink

As a huge fan I find tracks like Possessed, The Dance Electric, Purple Music disappointing. Meandering pop jam filler compared to his best work - good maybe, not great. I also think with his alternate (2nd version) takes, as well as his remixes, he forgets about harmony. And I would prefer that those remixes and 2nd song versions make up but a tiny amount of the overall vault content. Was he sleeping on stuff better than Purple Rain, Parade, Sign O the Times?! I've heard enough bootlegs to know the quality is often on the same level. And by that I mean, better than some of the official 90s/00s... material

The hypocrisy of the far-left is something else.
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Reply #10 posted 07/12/21 12:34am

fortuneandsere
ndipity

Romeoblu said:

Well personally i think the Bonnie Riatt songs were great. The Vault is proving to be a wonderful treasure trove and we still haven't had the Parade SDE.

They are. Exhibit A. neutral !!!

The hypocrisy of the far-left is something else.
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Reply #11 posted 07/12/21 1:00am

JorisE73

Graycap23 said:

No one.


Only Sheila E. wants the vault to remain closed.

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Reply #12 posted 07/12/21 1:26am

fredmagnus

fortuneandserendipity said:

Romeoblu said:

Well personally i think the Bonnie Riatt songs were great. The Vault is proving to be a wonderful treasure trove and we still haven't had the Parade SDE.

They are. Exhibit A. neutral !!!

I too have enjoyed a lot those Bonnie Raitt demos. I'm glad they chose to release them.

.

I'm not waiting for every outake to be "In All My Dreams" or "Witness 4 The Prosecution"

.

Those unheard gems are essentiel to understand the full scope of Prince's artistry.

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Reply #13 posted 07/12/21 2:11am

TheEnglishGent

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Which songs were the Bonnie songs?

What sort of Prince fan doesn't want the vault opened? That's just nonsense.

RIP sad
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Reply #14 posted 07/12/21 2:20am

lust

avatar

JorisE73 said:



Graycap23 said:


No one.




Only Sheila E. wants the vault to remain closed.



Because she doesn’t want anyone to hear the unreleased track “Lies of engagement”
If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #15 posted 07/12/21 2:22am

Bertrand

robertgeorge said:

I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material

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Reply #16 posted 07/12/21 3:00am

JorisE73

lol

lust said:

JorisE73 said:


Only Sheila E. wants the vault to remain closed.

Because she doesn’t want anyone to hear the unreleased track “Lies of engagement”

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Reply #17 posted 07/12/21 3:07am

JorisE73

Bertrand said:

robertgeorge said:

I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material


Kind of redundant because the Estate is already releasing vault material so I don't see the use of this petition.
Now if someone made a clear and more focussed petition opting for example an subsrcription based NPGMC like website with every single recording (audio and video) Prince did then that would be more useful I think.

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Reply #18 posted 07/12/21 4:01am

RODSERLING

??!!
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Reply #19 posted 07/12/21 4:09am

leecaldon

robertgeorge said:

Graycap23 said:

Lat I hear there was 8,500 plus unreleased songs.

How is that exagerrated?

Exaggerated in terms of quality, such as Prince having songs better than Purple Rain that he was keeping for himself and his children (well that won't happen), the wildest most psychedelic Revolution tracks or something like that was what he said. Morris Hayes claimed to have heard those better than Purple Rain tracks, but who knows when it is all subjective.

Exaggerated in the sense that the 8500 songs are all unique and completed, and not a reasonable amount of alternative takes, remixes and incomplete jams.

That being said, I am not detracting from the accomplishments of Prince and the Vault. I just don't believe he was sleeping on stuff better than Purple Rain, Parade, Sign O the Times etc.

Sure he kept some cool stuff unreleased (a lot of our faves), I just don't believe all of his process was platinum when his later albums lost that quality control and it factor for me.

Obviously, it's all subjective but I've heard plenty of material that could easily have held its own sitting on any of the classic albums. I guess the bigger question is whether there is stuff that hasn't been widely bootlegged that is of similar quality.

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Reply #20 posted 07/12/21 4:13am

jn2

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Its open now a few years
Some of what we've heard has been bad (those bonnie Raitt demos)
A lot has been amazing
Much has been just interesting to hear and compare
Its obv how much effort prince put into what he released, well most stuff, the good stuff, when you hear what he left in the vault, even though these tracks are still worth listening to

Has it been worth it?

I think he knew this would happen, but didnt want to sanction it himself despite bragging about how much great stuff he had sitting around. He just knew someone would do it anyway.

The reason I ask if it should be opened is not because I think he wouldnt have wanted it open,but because he just had so much unreleased music. More than most. Could it be a case of too much of a good thing??
[Edited 7/11/21 17:24pm]

Don't you like Emotional Pump? smile
[Edited 7/12/21 4:14am]
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Reply #21 posted 07/12/21 4:27am

fredmagnus

JorisE73 said:

Bertrand said:

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material


Kind of redundant because the Estate is already releasing vault material so I don't see the use of this petition.
Now if someone made a clear and more focussed petition opting for example an subsrcription based NPGMC like website with every single recording (audio and video) Prince did then that would be more useful I think.

My thoughts too.

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Reply #22 posted 07/12/21 4:56am

databank

avatar

Bertrand said:

robertgeorge said:

I think all of the vault should be released (unfortunately I don't see the market or the Estate being able to do this)

I don't think releasing everything destroys his legacy even if we never got another good song. Why? Because some songs should be treated as pencil sketches, drafts, jottings on a cocktail napkins or a beer coaster. I think it is an important document for an important artist.

The vault was legendary so of course it was exaggerated, but it should still have some stunning songs. The video footage alone should justify opening it.

Everything you wanted or needed to know about is in his music/the vault.

Release it!!!

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material

I don't see how this is going to be of any use. If you wanna bully a private company into releasing something, aren't Twitter hashtags the best way to go anyway?

.

This is how Zack Snyder and DC fans managed to make WB finance and release Justice League's director's cut, with a #ReleaseTheSnyderCut campaign. I see they also had a petition, though, with 179 000 signatures. But I think the hashtag campaign brought more media attention.

.

Good luck getting that many signature for Prince anyway. Motivated Prince fans are probably way too few by comparison to motivated Snyder/DC fans, I doubt there could be an efficient #OpenThePrinceVault campaign. + the situation was different anyway, because it was a case of artist and fans together vs corporate, while in P's case there's no more artist, it'd just be fans vs corporate.

A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #23 posted 07/12/21 5:20am

Se7en

avatar

databank said:

Bertrand said:

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material

I don't see how this is going to be of any use. If you wanna bully a private company into releasing something, aren't Twitter hashtags the best way to go anyway?

.

This is how Zack Snyder and DC fans managed to make WB finance and release Justice League's director's cut, with a #ReleaseTheSnyderCut campaign. I see they also had a petition, though, with 179 000 signatures. But I think the hashtag campaign brought more media attention.

.

Good luck getting that many signature for Prince anyway. Motivated Prince fans are probably way too few by comparison to motivated Snyder/DC fans, I doubt there could be an efficient #OpenThePrinceVault campaign. + the situation was different anyway, because it was a case of artist and fans together vs corporate, while in P's case there's no more artist, it'd just be fans vs corporate.


You could use the Snyder Cut as a reference point, but really only for ONE project. i.e. #ReleaseBlackIsTheNewBlack. You could not strongarm the Estate into releasing the Vault with a simple social media campaign.

I personally feel that the Estate is scrambling to find something new to release. We got P&M'83 and Originals, and then the shelved W2A album. Unless they are holding back until the SDEs have all come out. Pacing things out.


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Reply #24 posted 07/12/21 6:28am

Bertrand

JorisE73 said:

Bertrand said:

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material


Kind of redundant because the Estate is already releasing vault material so I don't see the use of this petition.
Now if someone made a clear and more focussed petition opting for example an subsrcription based NPGMC like website with every single recording (audio and video) Prince did then that would be more useful I think.

When I read the petition, my understanding was that it left room for options.

Read the last point of the petition.

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Reply #25 posted 07/12/21 6:30am

Bertrand

databank said:

Bertrand said:

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material

I don't see how this is going to be of any use. If you wanna bully a private company into releasing something, aren't Twitter hashtags the best way to go anyway?

.

This is how Zack Snyder and DC fans managed to make WB finance and release Justice League's director's cut, with a #ReleaseTheSnyderCut campaign. I see they also had a petition, though, with 179 000 signatures. But I think the hashtag campaign brought more media attention.

.

Good luck getting that many signature for Prince anyway. Motivated Prince fans are probably way too few by comparison to motivated Snyder/DC fans, I doubt there could be an efficient #OpenThePrinceVault campaign. + the situation was different anyway, because it was a case of artist and fans together vs corporate, while in P's case there's no more artist, it'd just be fans vs corporate.

Happy to support a hashtag campaign if somebody wants to start one.

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Reply #26 posted 07/12/21 6:34am

Rimshottbob

no.

[Edited 7/12/21 6:34am]

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Reply #27 posted 07/12/21 6:50am

laytonian

Bertrand said:

Somebody started this :

https://www.ipetitions.com/petition/message-for-the-release-of-princes-vault-material


Another idiotic, useless "petition" that does nothing but collect signers' personal information for sale.
There's nothing sillier than fan petitions. Ignored with good reason.

This one's particularly silly. Too many "quotation" marks and passive "We would like to ask" crap. Well, ASK. No one is keeping you from asking except your own grammar.

Welcome to "the org", laytonian… come bathe with me.
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Reply #28 posted 07/12/21 7:35am

Farfunknugin

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They need to switch the emphasis to live shows ala blu rays & open up access to aftershows. This is what the majority of us want to see/hear.
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Reply #29 posted 07/12/21 8:12am

LILpoundCAKE

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these past few weeks I've rediscovered "Dreamer" and the vault is bound to have a few more of those hard hitting raw rock tracks from his later years in there. i would cut someone for one of those right now. eek smile

If U're lookin 4 dirt look in Ur own back yard - Plant some Peace Flowers in Ur warzone so I can fire my bodyguards.
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