Apologies if this is too obvious..

Throughout the years I've seen a lot of people bypassing the "Sacrifice of Victor", and P's affirmation, at the time (just before changing to ), that his name was "Victor". I even vaguely recall some critics going on about the silly/odd choice of a name. Because yes, there was a brief moment inteween "Prince" and "", where a lot of people thought his name was then Victor.

So... I'm just wondering if somehow the message was largely lost in the sheer abundance that was going on at the time.

I believe "Victor", in P's 1992 vision, stood for "The Victorious", the one who accomplished everything - and therefore needed to be sacrificed in order to pave the way for a clean start.

In other words: the "Victor" persona is P declaring he had conquered all he had wanted to, and therefore needed to end (be "sacrificed") - opening the path to a brand new persona from scratch, a complete reinventon of his rules and expectations without the baggage that came with the "victorious Prince".

[Edited 8/22/21 16:01pm]

[Edited 8/22/21 16:02pm]

OperatingThetan said:

There was also a speculated allusion to the Victor/Victoria film, but I'm not sure whether this was unfounded or not.

He'd have been blatant about it.

hyperpessimist said:

I believe "Victor", in P's 1992 vision, stood for "The Victorious", the one who accomplished everything - and therefore needed to be sacrificed in order to pave the way for a clean start.

In other words: the "Victor" persona is P declaring he had conquered all he had wanted to, and therefore needed to end (be "sacrificed") - opening the path to a brand new persona from scratch, a complete reinventon of his rules and expectations without the baggage that came with the "victorious Prince".

Mine is more specific.

I do believe victor was victory or commercial success as dictated by the business end of the music business. When he opted to put "Slave" on his face and change his name to separate himself, on the outside, to the contract he felt was akin to modern slavery, he sacrified the "victory" of a $100M contract. He sacrificed the accolades and the praise from critics and the media. Why? Because he wanted something money couldn't buy: freedom.

In the song, he not only lays out his life and the odds laid against him (being political tools for busing in 1967, or even being born with the cord around his neck, having epilepsy), but the brings larger figures and their sacrifices to light, like MLK. He even name checked Andre's mother Bernadette as a positive influence in his life, teaching him to stay disciplined and stick to his guns; that the battle for freedom isn't easy. It's a marathon with a stride, not a sprint.

He sacrificed modern and typical victory for that of personal triumph. He takes comfort in it, knowing that despite the trails he goes through now, the personal victory - that will inevitably lead to public and professional victory - will be sublime.

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

the end credit scene of the VHS "3 Chains of Gold":

'is your name Victor?'

'no, but I am victorious when I'm by your side'

He said "My name is Not Prince, and it damn sure ain't Victor."

He also said "you can call me Mr. Happy."

emesem said:

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

Oh lord... that was a big thing in 1992 seems very unlikly.

OnlyNDaUsa said:

emesem said:

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

Oh lord... that was a big thing in 1992 seems very unlikly.

I've never heard that, but I can see people trying to make it a thing.

during the 1992 album era he did play around with the "Victor" name and it wouldn't be too far out to think this was one of his personas during that time.

HOWEVER, after he adopted as his artistic name in 1993, he was asked over and over and over about how to pronounce and he always answered some along these lines: it didn't had a sound to it, it was unpronouncable, people could tell it was him just by the symbol, when god reveals the sound he will speak, etc.

of course, after his conversion in the early 2000s, God must have told him his name was, indeed, Prince.

fms said:

Interesting discussion. I agree the “Victor” thing has gotten bypassed and forgotten. But at the time it seemed legitimate. Also in The Undertaker, Vanessa calls him “Victor” when she calls from the phone.

Yeah, it was definitely a thing he probably played with, briefly, but the symbol took over ultimately.

emesem said:

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

SoulAlive said:

emesem said:

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

Oh good lord.

Did you have this lying around did you just do this for the lulz. Its awesome.

SoulAlive said:

emesem said:

The letters of "Victor" are embedded in the Symbol.

I was literally thinking about this yesterday and wanted to make a post: a few days ago on Twitter I saw a gender neutral bathoom that used the Love Symbol and one of the comments said Prince called the symbol Victor at one point. Which makes sense to me, because if he closed the [Love Symbol] album saying "my name will be Victor" and chnaged his name to the same symbol which was called Victor, the claim wouldn't entirely be a lie. But in the eight years I've been a fan, I have NEVER heard about Prince calling the Love Symbol/ Victor. Anyone have any knowledge or recollection of that ever happening at all?

SoulAlive said:

so,if the letters of “Victor” are embedded in the symbol,then the album that we commonly refer to as “Love Symbol” might really be titled ‘Victor’

Maybe. And monkey might fly out of my butt later. But that's not happening either.

TrivialPursuit said:

LoveGalore said:

TrivialPursuit said:

Maybe. And monkey might fly out of my butt later. But that's not happening either.

Slow night? I guess its only Wednesday.

A boy's gotta recoup. Ice packs and whiskey sours, baby.

TrivialPursuit said:

SoulAlive said:

so,if the letters of “Victor” are embedded in the symbol,then the album that we commonly refer to as “Love Symbol” might really be titled ‘Victor’

Maybe. And monkey might fly out of my butt later. But that's not happening either.

emesem said:

Did you have this lying around did you just do this for the lulz. Its awesome.

This is actually my interpretation, created in Powerpoint and posted to the old 'Symbol variations' thread and to Reddit:

https://prince.org/msg/7/442577

I'm pretty convinced this was the original plan - there's some evidence/suggestions of this in the O{+> album:

Vanessa: "So why are you giving me an interview?“

Prince: "Because I want U... 2 tell the truth.”

Vanessa: "Oh - well, I will if you will. For example, the first song of your opera... why don't you tell me your real name?”

Prince: "My name... is Victor."

"I've got 2 keep on walkin' down this road

When I reach my destination...

My name will be... Victor"

My understanding of the timeline is that, following the name change, Uptown magazine printed the explanation of the new name actually being 'Victor' and that the symbol contained the letters of the new name. Prince seemingly got mad at this leak and shortly after we had the "My name is not Prince... and it sure as hell ain't Victor" pronouncement, during a concert I think. This was then repeated in the credits of the O{+> album video. The intended 'reveal' therefore never happened and the new name remained as O{+> (then, later, TAFKAP)

Clearly there's no 'proof' of this but the 'clues' and the later change of mind seem very on-brand for Prince at that time and it will take something pretty concrete to change my mind!

[Edited 8/28/21 5:27am]

geetee71 said:

emesem said:

Did you have this lying around did you just do this for the lulz. Its awesome.

This is actually my interpretation, created in Powerpoint and posted to the old 'Symbol variations' thread and to Reddit:

https://prince.org/msg/7/442577

I'm pretty convinced this was the original plan - there's some evidence/suggestions of this in the O{+> album:

Segue II - O{+> [1992]:

Vanessa: "So why are you giving me an interview?“

Prince: "Because I want U... 2 tell the truth.”

Vanessa: "Oh - well, I will if you will. For example, the first song of your opera... why don't you tell me your real name?”

Prince: "My name... is Victor."

The Sacrifice Of Victor - O{+> [1992]:

"I've got 2 keep on walkin' down this road

When I reach my destination...

My name will be... Victor"

There's also the symmetry of having "My Name Is Prince" being the first line of the first song & "My Name will be Victor" being the last line of the last song on the album

My understanding of the timeline is that, following the name change, Uptown magazine printed the explanation of the new name actually being 'Victor' and that the symbol contained the letters of the new name. Prince seemingly got mad at this leak and shortly after we had the "My name is not Prince... and it sure as hell ain't Victor" pronouncement, during a concert I think. This was then repeated in the credits of the O{+> album video. The intended 'reveal' therefore never happened and the new name remained as O{+> (then, later, TAFKAP)

Clearly there's no 'proof' of this but the 'clues' and the later change of mind seem very on-brand for Prince at that time and it will take something pretty concrete to change my mind!

[Edited 8/28/21 5:27am]

I like this response. It's well thought out and interesting.

I love The Sacrifice of Victor song, which sounded too crowded for my 11 year old ears to handle when I bought the tape, but has grown into maybe my favorite song on the album.

"Victor", apparently, has some connotations to Christianity too, being related to Christ's 'victory' over death. A year later Prince would also 'die', although by the time Come came out you weren't hearing much about any Victor.

it looks like "VIGTOR"

[Edited 8/29/21 9:50am]

one of the cool things about Prince is that he often kept us guessing and speculating.All these years later,we're still trying to figure out what that damn symbol really means,lol.

We can all read it differently. I'm seeing VAG.

Looks lile a

my name is Victor

been there ever since

it would have been funny if Prince opened his next album with a song called "My Name Is Victor"