kingricefan said:

But where did these books come from? Did they just suddenly appear?

Sent you a Orgnote. I even included the JW analogy to explain this.

[Edited 6/7/21 6:43am]

Mid 90s I knew (one of?) his personal assitant in Minneapolis. he told me Prince flirted with him and his boyfriend while they were bump'n and grinding on each other on the dance floor at Paisley. He came up and was like "You two look you are having fun".

When I was 19, I had a boyfriend who was 33. He told me that Prince 'stole' a boyfriend of his in the late 70s. I also heard from a number of older gay men that Prince had been a regular at gay bars before he was super famous, and everyone thought he was gay or bi.


In some ways Prince's late period, seemingly brief, homophobia didn't matter. He had already been such a beacon for queer people, and for queer kids...I actually find it difficult to explain why that was, but suffice to say, for a long stretch of the 80s Prince's gender performance and approach to sexuality was radical, and that had reverberations that broke apart certain aspects of society combined with everything else that was going on.

OldFriends4Sale said:

jfenster said:

OldFriends4Sale said: ....dear Mr man ....chaos and disorder

Ain't no assistance in AIDS

That's more of a play on the multiple meanings of the word than a commentary on the injustice of the disease. Same with the "happy ain't allowed" line in C&D, that's another reflection on a word having more than one meaning. Although he's certainly making a political comment with the military marching.

I agree with you that there's certainly no "anti-gay" message in his lyrics (aside, maybe, from that kind of unpleasant "you gonna get busy with your brother in here?" live aside from the remade Days Of Wild, which always makes me wince a little), but I don't think he made any overt comments about the injustices of AIDS in the lyrics cited. IMO.

[Edited 6/7/21 8:59am]

[Edited 6/7/21 9:00am]

gsmith5678 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Ain't no assistance in AIDS

That's more of a play on the multiple meanings of the word than a commentary on the injustice of the disease. Same with the "happy ain't allowed" line in C&D, that's another reflection on a word having more than one meaning. Although he's certainly making a political comment with the military marching.

I agree with you that there's certainly no "anti-gay" message in his lyrics (aside, maybe, from that kind of unpleasant "you gonna get busy with your brother in here?" live aside from the remade Days Of Wild, which always makes me wince a little), but I don't think he made any overt comments about the injustices of AIDS in the lyrics cited. IMO.

[Edited 6/7/21 8:59am]

[Edited 6/7/21 9:00am]

I agree

You can't blame Prince, for his beliefs, maybe he wasn't ready to support the community, maybe he did support it, and kept quiet, becuase I think he was moving on from the JW's and going back to supporting God (not strictly). In my opinion, we are Gods, and we are here on this Earth to make an impact, then when we finish our duties, we pass on. I don't really support religion that much, so I'm not affliated with any type. So, maybe he was starting to tolerate the community. #intolerance

"Nothing more ugly in the whole wide world than INTOLERANCE (between) Black, white, red, yellow, boy or girl. INTOLERANCE."

And around the time, Prince passed 2016, the LGBTQ+ movement/ Pride month/ day, etc.., it wasn't big to the point Prince realised it. The movement was just starting. And Prince passed, so he wouldn't know, what it would become. He supported J Monae, Andy Allo(before the breakup), it was his beliefs, or maybe he wasn't fully educated about it.

ffdff123 said:

You can't blame Prince, for his beliefs, maybe he wasn't ready to support the community, maybe he did support it, and kept quiet, becuase I think he was moving on from the JW's and going back to supporting God (not strictly). In my opinion, we are Gods, and we are here on this Earth to make an impact, then when we finish our duties, we pass on. I don't really support religion that much, so I'm not affliated with any type. So, maybe he was starting to tolerate the community. #intolerance

"Nothing more ugly in the whole wide world than INTOLERANCE (between) Black, white, red, yellow, boy or girl. INTOLERANCE."

lustmealways said:

lustmealways said:

this thread will go well

ffdff123 said:

And around the time, Prince passed 2016, the LGBTQ+ movement/ Pride month/ day, etc.., it wasn't big to the point Prince realised it. The movement was just starting. And Prince passed, so he wouldn't know, what it would become. He supported J Monae, Andy Allo(before the breakup), it was his beliefs, or maybe he wasn't fully educated about it.

ffdff123 said:

You can't blame Prince, for his beliefs, maybe he wasn't ready to support the community, maybe he did support it, and kept quiet, becuase I think he was moving on from the JW's and going back to supporting God (not strictly). In my opinion, we are Gods, and we are here on this Earth to make an impact, then when we finish our duties, we pass on. I don't really support religion that much, so I'm not affliated with any type. So, maybe he was starting to tolerate the community. #intolerance

"Nothing more ugly in the whole wide world than INTOLERANCE (between) Black, white, red, yellow, boy or girl. INTOLERANCE."

Hi. The "movement" for LGBT liberation was not "just starting" in 2016. The movement is about 130 years old at this point. Was (nearly) eliminated by the Nazis in the 30s, and got a kickstart after the Stonewall Riots in 1969. I myself was one of the first to March in a youth contingent in the pride parade in Minneapolis in 1987 when I was 15.

Oh well, I look stupid i thought it was new.

ffdff123 said:

Oh well, I look stupid i thought it was new.

How old are you?

ffdff123 said:

Oh well, I look stupid i thought it was new.

I guess it depends on what country you are in

gsmith5678 said:

OperatingThetan said:

laytonian said:

He also went to JW HQ with pointed questions that apparently weren't answered.

The reprimand came when he rewrote some (and recorded new) JW hymns. They may have even been adopted locally until quashed by the upper levels of management.

The CD-R of the album was played to me in its entirety when I was one of Jehovah's Witnesses. For a short period, it was a novelty, until the Governing Body forbade it on copyright grounds and that it was not authorised by them as copyright holders of the Jehovah's Witness Songbook, upon which the album was based. You could detect Prince input here and there and notably on the instrumental of 'Life Without End At Last', but there were also major contributions from George Benson, Larry Graham and other JW artists and vocalists. I don't think it has any appeal outside of the faith and those who are fond of Jehovah's Witness songs, which are all unique to the religion and many of which, aren't particularly melodic or tuneful.

-

Whatever ! Waw. Thank you for this inside info.

Great info by the way.

I nevertheless wouldlooooove to hear it.

How crazy it might be or sound.

-

rabbutt said:

The true disappointment was that we as a group ( me as a non-theist , A Muslim lady , and several non-JW Christians ) had just spent A few hours respectfully discussing religion with prince and to have him come in and end it on such a sour note .

I can't recall if we were in the same group, but when Larry came in and took over from Prince in our discussion, it was one of the most uncomfortable and unsettling half hour's of my life (or however long it was). The friend who I was with actually walked out, and neither of us felt like going back to PP that evening.

Afterwards, I felt in some way violated. I only wish that it could have happened now, when I am older, more assertive and armed with an awful lot more knowledge to respond to what he was saying.

JudasLChrist said:

I also heard from a number of older gay men that Prince had been a regular at gay bars before he was super famous, and everyone thought he was gay or bi.

He was probably there with Lisa. And there he met Vagina.

ffdff123 said:

You can't blame Prince, for his beliefs

I'm gonna stop you right there and say that yes, you can blame Prince for showing intolerance of people who weren't hurting him in any way with their existence. Just as you can (and should) blame any person who uses their religion as a flimsy excuse for their bigotry and intolerance of other people.

Hamad said:

Damn! Didn’t know there was a TRC pt.2

Hopefully, that can get a release like Welcome 2 America.

mbdtyler said:

ffdff123 said:

You can't blame Prince, for his beliefs

I'm gonna stop you right there and say that yes, you can blame Prince for showing intolerance of people who weren't hurting him in any way with their existence. Just as you can (and should) blame any person who uses their religion as a flimsy excuse for their bigotry and intolerance of other people.

Everyones show intolerance of varying degrees to others...

If Prince didn't hurt anyone, he didn't hurt anyone

Strive said:

rabbutt said:

Oh of course I am , I'm a non-theist 😀. But when it comes to this particular scripture , NO not ALL of your gods promises to the Jews have been fulfilled therefore all laws old and new must b kept . Jesus himself the greatest rabbi would have kept to the law .

I apologize for hijacking this thread, to get back on trac . I wonder if he was playing Controversy during this time. I would find it odd if he really really disapproved of homosexuality and yet continued singing about how his past actions lead to people perceiving him as gay.

Well that's probably why Prince clammed up and Larry stepped forward. Haha.

Jesus made the new covernant at the last supper. With his death, and the Jews rejection of him as the messiah, certain things were no longer required and what was expected from humanity was elevated. Simple animal sacrifice and cutting your foreskin was no longer enough to be considered righteous. You were now expected to make yourself the living sacrifice.

But you don't have to wonder. He released Controversy (Live In Hawaii) - He never fully conformed to his religion, even at his most faithful.

Jesus had no authority to create a "new covenant" because he either delusional or a charlatan and his imaginary "father" in heaven (if real), would be a monsterous asshole with the morals of a weasel on speed.

** MODERATORS NOTE **
KEEP THE THREAD ABOUT PRINCE PAISLEY PARK and LGBTQ connection.
Take any directly religious/non religious talk to P&R

-> off topic / anti-religious or disrespectful posts about Prince will be removed

OldFriends4Sale said:

mbdtyler said:

I'm gonna stop you right there and say that yes, you can blame Prince for showing intolerance of people who weren't hurting him in any way with their existence. Just as you can (and should) blame any person who uses their religion as a flimsy excuse for their bigotry and intolerance of other people.

Everyones show intolerance of varying degrees to others...

If Prince didn't hurt anyone, he didn't hurt anyone

Words can hurt, and Prince was reckless with his sometimes. That's all I'll say.

mbdtyler said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Everyone shows intolerance of varying degrees to others...

If Prince didn't hurt anyone, he didn't hurt anyone

Words can hurt, and Prince was reckless with his sometimes. That's all I'll say.

well we all have probably hurt with words, and have been reckless, just because he is an entertainer doesn't put any expectation of higher standards, except for expectations of higher standers of entertaining