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Thread started 01/12/21 7:08am

JayCrawford

Why is Dirty Mind never in the same discussion as 1999, Purple Rain and SOTT?

Every website and other forums I go to, I never see people mention Dirty Mind and that album was just as highly acclaimed as 1999 and Purple Rain and is ranked as one of the best albums of all time but you often hear the trilogies 1999, Purple Rain and Sign O'the Times.

I've always wondered this.
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Reply #1 posted 01/12/21 7:15am

djdaffy1227

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Unfortunatelly because "Dity Mind" didn't have a "Little Red Corvette", "When doves cry" or "U got the look" hit single associated with it. The general public doesn't know the album as well as they know the others.

Making love and music are the only things worth fighting for.
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Reply #2 posted 01/12/21 7:35am

jaawwnn

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I suppose it's a turning point album rather than a pop blockbuster. Some people (FOOLS) have trouble with it's relatively lo-fi production, critics got it right on this one from day 1 though.

I always wonder if When You Were Mine would have been a hit if it had been a single in 1980 or would the production have scared too many people away.

"I think people ought to know that we're anti-fascist, we're anti-violence, we're anti-racist and we're pro-creative. We're against ignorance."
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Reply #3 posted 01/12/21 7:52am

emesem

Dirty Mind is Prince's Rubber Soul

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Reply #4 posted 01/12/21 7:57am

funkaholic1972

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To me DM is one of Prince's finest albums, the critics have always loved it as well. I guess the lack of a hit single is why DM is not held in the same esteem by the general public.

RIP Prince: thank U 4 a funky Time!
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Reply #5 posted 01/12/21 12:21pm

lavendardrumma
chine

I think because the record is basically two classics that people didn't even always associate with Prince, and then a side of the record that writers only talked about in terms of image.

Head, Sister, Partyup, and Uptown are not his best songs, or particularly groundbreaking (You could make an argument for Head though), got written up for the provocative live shows, and the g strings. They didn't have the musical edge of being inventive. The songs are classics once you know what came after.

[Edited 1/12/21 12:22pm]

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Reply #6 posted 01/12/21 12:47pm

LILpoundCAKE

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emesem said:

Dirty Mind is Prince's Rubber Soul


My brain has been trying to formulate a response, or even just my own feelings on this, but it keeps shutting down and rebooting lol I mean, I'm not saying I agree or disagree, my brain just cannot process the comparison. My eyes feel funny. I think I smell burnt toast. Awwwwww I'm in my 20's Awwwwwww.







"You're not my real dad and you never will be!!"
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Reply #7 posted 01/12/21 12:47pm

steakfinger

lavendardrummachine said:

I think because the record is basically two classics that people didn't even always associate with Prince, and then a side of the record that writers only talked about in terms of image.

Head, Sister, Partyup, and Uptown are not his best songs, or particularly groundbreaking (You could make an argument for Head though), got written up for the provocative live shows, and the g strings. They didn't have the musical edge of being inventive. The songs are classics once you know what came after.

[Edited 1/12/21 12:22pm]

Exactly.

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Reply #8 posted 01/12/21 12:48pm

KoolEaze

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In hindsight, I´d say that they (Prince and WB) probably underrated the potential of When You Were Mine, which is, in my opinion, a very catchy and well-written pop song that many listeners beyond his usual fanbase could have related to.

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"
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Reply #9 posted 01/12/21 2:24pm

mynameisnotsus
an

Anyone with more than a passing knowledge about Prince place it near the top. When You Were Mine is absolutely one of his most classic songs. All the critics loved him razz
As far as non-fans/general public who gives a shit?
[Edited 1/12/21 15:01pm]
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Reply #10 posted 01/12/21 2:29pm

jn2

djdaffy1227 said:

Unfortunatelly because "Dity Mind" didn't have a "Little Red Corvette", "When doves cry" or "U got the look" hit single associated with it. The general public doesn't know the album as well as they know the others.


DM has the masterpiece When You Were Mine and the classic Uptown.
[Edited 1/12/21 14:41pm]
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Reply #11 posted 01/12/21 3:36pm

TwiliteKid

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mynameisnotsusan said:

Anyone with more than a passing knowledge about Prince place it near the top. When You Were Mine is absolutely one of his most classic songs. All the critics loved him razz
As far as non-fans/general public who gives a shit?
[Edited 1/12/21 15:01pm]

Nah. I’ve been hardcore for 30+ years. It’s not in my top 10.
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Reply #12 posted 01/12/21 7:52pm

vainandy

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Because it was released after the disco backlash. Even though there's no disco on it, pop radio stopped playing damn near all black artists except some of the hugely well known established ones. They started out playing "I Wanna Be Your Lover", then the backlash hit. They never played the second single, "Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad" which was even more appropriate for pop radio because it was rock but R&B radio played it and they also played the hell out of "Dirty Mind", "Controversy", and many tracks from the "1999" album as soon as it was released long before pop radio finally picked up the second single, "Little Red Corvette". Prince was a big star on R&B radio long before the pop world knew him. He was big enough to already have two side groups under his belt and have Rick James' feathers ruffled and badmouthing him because he knew he was a threat.

Andy is a four letter word.
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Reply #13 posted 01/12/21 8:07pm

jfenster

Cause they's crazee
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Reply #14 posted 01/12/21 8:09pm

vainandy

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KoolEaze said:

In hindsight, I´d say that they (Prince and WB) probably underrated the potential of When You Were Mine, which is, in my opinion, a very catchy and well-written pop song that many listeners beyond his usual fanbase could have related to.

R&B radio was playing "Uptown", "Dirty Mind", "Head", and "Partyup". Radio didn't wait for singles back then. A lead single went out and they played it but once an album hit, they started playing several tracks as soon as they got it. I've often wondered if many artists waited to see what the popularity of the tracks on radio was to determine their follow-up singles. "When You Were Mine" would have been perfect for pop radio at the time but their dumbasses wasn't playing any black artists afer the disco backlash began unless they were huge like Lionel Richie, Diana Ross, or The Pointer Sisters. "When You Were Mine" was even released as the B-Side to the "Controversy" single before that album came out and B-Sides in general for most artists were considered throw away tracks (this was before Prince started doing non-album B-Sides). Actually, a lot of pop fans think it's Cyndi Lauper's song so yeah, it would have been a perfect track for pop radio if they hadn't been so stupid.

Andy is a four letter word.
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Reply #15 posted 01/13/21 2:43am

djdaffy1227

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jn2 said:

djdaffy1227 said:

Unfortunatelly because "Dity Mind" didn't have a "Little Red Corvette", "When doves cry" or "U got the look" hit single associated with it. The general public doesn't know the album as well as they know the others.

DM has the masterpiece When You Were Mine and the classic Uptown. [Edited 1/12/21 14:41pm]

I don't deny that but how many non-hardcore fans know either of those songs? Not nearly as many who know "Little Red Corvette", "When doves cry" and "U got the look".

Making love and music are the only things worth fighting for.
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Reply #16 posted 01/13/21 5:56am

Bluedell

TwiliteKid said:

mynameisnotsusan said:
Anyone with more than a passing knowledge about Prince place it near the top. When You Were Mine is absolutely one of his most classic songs. All the critics loved him razz As far as non-fans/general public who gives a shit? [Edited 1/12/21 15:01pm]
Nah. I’ve been hardcore for 30+ years. It’s not in my top 10.

I'm the same. It's nowhere near my top 10.

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Reply #17 posted 01/13/21 6:05am

JayCrawford

vainandy said:

Because it was released after the disco backlash. Even though there's no disco on it, pop radio stopped playing damn near all black artists except some of the hugely well known established ones. They started out playing "I Wanna Be Your Lover", then the backlash hit. They never played the second single, "Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad" which was even more appropriate for pop radio because it was rock but R&B radio played it and they also played the hell out of "Dirty Mind", "Controversy", and many tracks from the "1999" album as soon as it was released long before pop radio finally picked up the second single, "Little Red Corvette". Prince was a big star on R&B radio long before the pop world knew him. He was big enough to already have two side groups under his belt and have Rick James' feathers ruffled and badmouthing him because he knew he was a threat.



Thank god I was living in the UK then while the whole disco backlash shit was happening 🤣.
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Reply #18 posted 01/13/21 11:31am

Margot

"When u Were Mine" was a sleeper for me as well until I watched the 2009 Montreux version on YT. He rocked that song with such confidence that I sometimes return to it. Even Renato played a

vrtuoso solo; Prince 'hi-fived' him with a guitar response. Very cool.

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Reply #19 posted 01/13/21 11:48am

Genesia

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KoolEaze said:

In hindsight, I´d say that they (Prince and WB) probably underrated the potential of When You Were Mine, which is, in my opinion, a very catchy and well-written pop song that many listeners beyond his usual fanbase could have related to.


When You Were Mine is my favorite Prince song ever. It is just a slice of perfection.

The live version from Sam's Club in 1982. faint


[Edited 1/13/21 11:49am]

We don’t mourn artists because we knew them. We mourn them because they helped us know ourselves.
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Reply #20 posted 01/13/21 11:49am

SantanaMaitrey
a

Do you really think that an LP with "morning, noon and night, I'll give you head" and "my sister never made love to anyone else but me" is going to be regarded as a classic? I love the album, I love it for being rough, both in sound and in lyrics, but he still had some growing up to do.
O tempora! O mores!
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Reply #21 posted 01/13/21 1:01pm

JayCrawford

SantanaMaitreya said:

Do you really think that an LP with "morning, noon and night, I'll give you head" and "my sister never made love to anyone else but me" is going to be regarded as a classic? I love the album, I love it for being rough, both in sound and in lyrics, but he still had some growing up to do.


Huh? What a dumb comment
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Reply #22 posted 01/13/21 1:14pm

ChocolateBox31
21

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Although "Dirty Mind" was critically acclaimed it actually turned a LOT of Prince's(r.i.p.) fans which were mainly his rnb following off. Plus it got hardly any radio play. Even WBR offered his contract back since it was considered a flop after the crossover hit "I wanna B Your Lover". It was Prince's(r.i.p.) most bold artistic statement to date. It turned him into an underground artist & my hero.

"That mountain top situation is not really what it's all cracked up 2 B when eye was doing the Purple Rain tour eye had a lot of people who eye knew eye'll never c again @ the concerts.just screamin n places they thought they was suppose 2 scream."prince
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Reply #23 posted 01/13/21 1:44pm

KoolEaze

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Genesia said:

KoolEaze said:

In hindsight, I´d say that they (Prince and WB) probably underrated the potential of When You Were Mine, which is, in my opinion, a very catchy and well-written pop song that many listeners beyond his usual fanbase could have related to.


When You Were Mine is my favorite Prince song ever. It is just a slice of perfection.

The live version from Sam's Club in 1982. faint


[Edited 1/13/21 11:49am]

My favorite will always be the rendition from August 1983, First Avenue. It has a certain energy and aggressiveness that is missing in later versions. And I like the slight lyric change ( "I´ll kick his ass baby, you know I ain´t too yella." )

And Prince and the Revolution sound extremely energetic and hungry. I just love that version.

-

Now I have to check out that Sam´s Club version if I can find it. My archiving skills have deteriorated in the last couple of years, not even sure if I have it on my hard drive.

[Edited 1/13/21 13:47pm]

" I´d rather be a stank ass hoe because I´m not stupid. Oh my goodness! I got more drugs! I´m always funny dude...I´m hilarious! Are we gonna smoke?"
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Reply #24 posted 01/13/21 2:02pm

Poplife88

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It was NOT a hit. That is the main reason why. I do remember WXRT in Chicago (my sis fave station at the time) playing When You Were Mine back then. I had zero opinion about the song or Prince for that matter (I was 11 and really into arena rock at the time boxed. But got the cassette prob around 85 and it slowly grew on me over the years. I love it now.

We're gonna need a bigger boat
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Reply #25 posted 01/13/21 2:26pm

FasterThan67

i think a lot of other users nailed this one on the head. first, Dirty Mind is regarded well in hindsight because it’s usually seen as Prince’s first big step toward developing a signature sound. this is the first album to deal with VERY (more than Soft and Wet and Bambi) sexually explicit lyrics, which many know him for today. second, let’s look at the singles from all of Prince’s albums from 1979-1984:

1979: I Wanna Be Your Lover, Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad?
1980: Still Waiting, Sexy Dancer, Uptown, Dirty Mind, Do it All Night
1981: Controversy, Sexuality
1982: Let’s Work, Do Me(,) Baby, 1999
1983: Little Red Corvette, Delirious, Automatic, Let’s Pretend We’re Married
1984: When Doves Cry, Let’s Go Crazy, Purple Rain, I Would Die 4 U
note: all songs that reached top 20 on the US Billboard Hot 100 are italicized

if you noticed, the only 2 albums of Prince’s from this 6 year span to not include a song to crack the top 20 are Dirty Mind and Controversy. not many people regard Controversy as one of Prince’s greatest (it is in my personal top 10, but i wouldn’t say it’s as much of a masterpiece as SOTT or 1999) and Prince (the album) isn’t supposed to be a phenomenal album; it was meant to be a way for Prince to get his name out there (and it did). the single choices for Dirty Mind were terrible; When You Were Mine should have been the lead single, followed by Uptown and MAYBE Partyup after (i think the chant at the end of PU alone is enough to get it some radio play).

so i think that alone explains why Dirty Mind isn’t in the same conversation as those 3 albums as far as the general public is concerned. most people remember albums based on what singles they associate with the album. plus, that album is still pretty raunchy, even by today’s standards. i think most critics regard Dirty Mind as one of Prince’s greatest albums, tho. Rolling Stone put it in the top 500 albums of all time when they revised the list last year.
[Edited 1/13/21 14:28pm]
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Reply #26 posted 01/13/21 2:42pm

funkbabyandthe
babysitters

Too dirty.
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Reply #27 posted 01/13/21 3:52pm

TrevorAyer

its too lo fi for universal acclaim amongst the general populus ..

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Reply #28 posted 01/13/21 6:16pm

Margot

Poplife88 said:

It was NOT a hit. That is the main reason why. I do remember WXRT in Chicago (my sis fave station at the time) playing When You Were Mine back then. I had zero opinion about the song or Prince for that matter (I was 11 and really into arena rock at the time boxed. But got the cassette prob around 85 and it slowly grew on me over the years. I love it now.

Didn't Cindy Lauper make it into a hit?

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Reply #29 posted 01/13/21 6:27pm

mynameisnotsus
an

Margot said:



Poplife88 said:


It was NOT a hit. That is the main reason why. I do remember WXRT in Chicago (my sis fave station at the time) playing When You Were Mine back then. I had zero opinion about the song or Prince for that matter (I was 11 and really into arena rock at the time boxed. But got the cassette prob around 85 and it slowly grew on me over the years. I love it now.






Didn't Cindy Lauper make it into a hit?



She's So Unusual sold 16 million copies so it would make sense that many people would have heard her version first.
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