mrjj71 said:

databank said:

A choice of a single from an album is not the same as releasing a song for the first time. You are being confused. There have been occasional cases where labels have abusively released recordings they had in their possession after the artist left said label: it usually didn't end well.

Please reread what I posted as I'm not going to explain it again and end-up in a loop conversation as I did with Shlomo the other day.

Well,forgive me if i've confused what you've said but i'm simply saying that most of the time the record company will have the final decision on what's released...singels,albums and releasing songs for the first time full stop.

But...this definitely doesn't give WB the right to ,as you put it,send goons to raid the vault but they certainly 'existed' whether they were released or not.

Every time any songwriter writes a song he has to register it with his publisher and record company...including any unreleased songs.

I know this only too well because i'm in the middle of trying to get back my own catalogue of songs from a previous publisher myself.

This is also why the Universl deal fell through because...

"The Prince estate hired Troy Carter to replace McMillan – a Jay-Z foe – as entertainment advisor in April after it was discovered that McMillan was less than forthcoming concerning the status of Prince’s catalog: After Universal struck the deal with the estate, the label learned that Warner Bros. owned the rights to Prince’s catalog spanning 1979 to 1995 until 2021, and not 2018 as Universal was led to believe."

Again,sorry if we're meaning different things here

OK, we're cool.

It needs to be noted that Prince never registered most of his unreleased material either with the Library of congress nor his publisher.

Bottom line was, since it was the original reason for this conversation, that WB could hardly sue Prince or the Estate for destroying material, since WB couldn't force neither to release said material.

databank said:

mrjj71 said:

Well,forgive me if i've confused what you've said but i'm simply saying that most of the time the record company will have the final decision on what's released...singels,albums and releasing songs for the first time full stop.

But...this definitely doesn't give WB the right to ,as you put it,send goons to raid the vault but they certainly 'existed' whether they were released or not.

Every time any songwriter writes a song he has to register it with his publisher and record company...including any unreleased songs.

I know this only too well because i'm in the middle of trying to get back my own catalogue of songs from a previous publisher myself.

This is also why the Universl deal fell through because...

"The Prince estate hired Troy Carter to replace McMillan – a Jay-Z foe – as entertainment advisor in April after it was discovered that McMillan was less than forthcoming concerning the status of Prince’s catalog: After Universal struck the deal with the estate, the label learned that Warner Bros. owned the rights to Prince’s catalog spanning 1979 to 1995 until 2021, and not 2018 as Universal was led to believe."

Again,sorry if we're meaning different things here

OK, we're cool.

It needs to be noted that Prince never registered most of his unreleased material either with the Library of congress nor his publisher.

Bottom line was, since it was the original reason for this conversation, that WB could hardly sue Prince or the Estate for destroying material, since WB couldn't force neither to release said material.

Glad we're cool

It may well be that Prince..being the person he was..didn't register all of them but I was looking yesterday on Prs and could see for instance Lust u always (amongst others) were registered,in fact it's fascinating to see what's there!

mrjj71 said:

databank said:

OK, we're cool.

It needs to be noted that Prince never registered most of his unreleased material either with the Library of congress nor his publisher.

Bottom line was, since it was the original reason for this conversation, that WB could hardly sue Prince or the Estate for destroying material, since WB couldn't force neither to release said material.

Glad we're cool

It may well be that Prince..being the person he was..didn't register all of them but I was looking yesterday on Prs and could see for instance Lust u always (amongst others) were registered,in fact it's fascinating to see what's there!

Of course we're cool, we're not savages

I always wondered what brought him to register certain outtakes. Does that mean he had a specific project for each of them at the time? Was it completely random? IDK.

What is PRS? I know how to seach ASCAP and Universal's database but I'm not sure I was ever able to find a LoC database online.

[Edited 10/1/20 10:44am]

jaawwnn said:

databank said:

mrjj71 said:

Glad we're cool

It may well be that Prince..being the person he was..didn't register all of them but I was looking yesterday on Prs and could see for instance Lust u always (amongst others) were registered,in fact it's fascinating to see what's there!

Of course we're cool, we're not savages

I always wondered what brought him to register certain outtakes. Does that mean he had a specific project for each of them at the time? Was it completely random? IDK.

What is PRS? I know how to seach ASCAP and Universal's database but I'm not sure I was ever able to find a LoC database online.

[Edited 10/1/20 10:44am]

Prs is the performing rights society...basically the Uk's ASCAP equivalent.

SquirrelMeat said:

databank said:

It didn't even take a month for cassettes to be circulating? Wow, these guys were fast!

The first vinyl picture sleeve boot I remember was 'From 1999 Till Now'. An unofficial remix set. I got that in 1985. The first unreleased material I got was a cassette in July 86, which contained 'Heaven', the tracks that made up 'Charade' and a June 7th interview with the Electrifying Mojo.

From there, the vinyl bootks started to come thick and fast. I got the Live it Rotterdam set in late 86. Chocolate box wasn't long after and Crystal Ball was out in 1988.

I saw a real copy of The Black Album a couple of weeks before the launch date, but I didn't get a boot cassette copy until Jan/Feb 88. The first crappy vinyl boot of it was out not long after, but I didn't get the excellent vinyl boot reproduction until the June 88.

Wow, your memory is impeccable.

Thank you, that sparked some memories I wouldn't have remembered otherwise, and that's a really solid timeline in case anyone's curious.

Were the vinyl boots with the flimsy tight sleeves? I know I had Pure Sex where they crammed 2 LP's in those stupid sleeves.

jfenster said:

jaawwnn said:

Yes but not on Spotify.

I think a certain amount of adjustment is required because the Prince myth is that he had albums of finished work, but in fact most of it is not finished. The songwriting is finished, and the recording process is finished enough for a decent mix, but the final tweaks/overdubs and mixing decisions will never be known.

Tnere r at least 35 complete albums with art work neverreleased

What is your source?

mrjj71 said:

databank said:

Of course we're cool, we're not savages

I always wondered what brought him to register certain outtakes. Does that mean he had a specific project for each of them at the time? Was it completely random? IDK.

What is PRS? I know how to seach ASCAP and Universal's database but I'm not sure I was ever able to find a LoC database online.

[Edited 10/1/20 10:44am]

Prs is the performing rights society...basically the Uk's ASCAP equivalent.

Ah OK, thx

lustmealways said:

lustmealways said:

dumb thread.

to honor prince's wishes, anytime i want to listen to movie star, i force myself to listen to jam of the year first. it's how he would've wanted it.

^made me LOL

lavendardrummachine said:

SquirrelMeat said:

The first vinyl picture sleeve boot I remember was 'From 1999 Till Now'. An unofficial remix set. I got that in 1985. The first unreleased material I got was a cassette in July 86, which contained 'Heaven', the tracks that made up 'Charade' and a June 7th interview with the Electrifying Mojo.

From there, the vinyl bootks started to come thick and fast. I got the Live it Rotterdam set in late 86. Chocolate box wasn't long after and Crystal Ball was out in 1988.

I saw a real copy of The Black Album a couple of weeks before the launch date, but I didn't get a boot cassette copy until Jan/Feb 88. The first crappy vinyl boot of it was out not long after, but I didn't get the excellent vinyl boot reproduction until the June 88.

Wow, your memory is impeccable.

Thank you, that sparked some memories I wouldn't have remembered otherwise, and that's a really solid timeline in case anyone's curious.

Were the vinyl boots with the flimsy tight sleeves? I know I had Pure Sex where they crammed 2 LP's in those stupid sleeves.

I forgot about the Pure Sex LP. That was one of the early ones. I never got it because the cover freaked me out!

But nothing was as freaky as the 'He's got the Look' cover!

Some amazing jazz work
You'll find the best most heavy tracks that the Revolution recorded,
the ones that we thought were too far gone back in the 80s
you'll find the more psychodelic rock version of the Time
you'll find the really erotic Prince the really erotic sensual Prince
you'll find the future

Kurt: What's going to happen to all that stuff? Will it ever come out?

... . Oh yes, I'll give it away...

SquirrelMeat said:

lavendardrummachine said:

Wow, your memory is impeccable.

Thank you, that sparked some memories I wouldn't have remembered otherwise, and that's a really solid timeline in case anyone's curious.

Were the vinyl boots with the flimsy tight sleeves? I know I had Pure Sex where they crammed 2 LP's in those stupid sleeves.

I forgot about the Pure Sex LP. That was one of the early ones. I never got it because the cover freaked me out!

But nothing was as freaky as the 'He's got the Look' cover!

Agreed! Yikes!

It's like something from The Thing!

they have to pay the tax man for what the tax man says is their cut of what they assume the value of the estate--including unmonotized recordings.

purplethunder3121 said:

LoveGalore said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Agreed! Yikes!

Who would draw such a ghastly image

.

I always took it as a Princely take on the Queen album image from '89:

purplethunder3121 said:

SquirrelMeat said:

I forgot about the Pure Sex LP. That was one of the early ones. I never got it because the cover freaked me out!

But nothing was as freaky as the 'He's got the Look' cover!

Agreed! Yikes!

I had the original photo back then I think it was in MUSICIANS magazine

PRINCE vs PRINCE: An Artist At War With Himself is the inspiration to the painting

It's probably a bit like raiding Tutankhamun's tomb and flogging all his shit. But, then again...

Prince is dead.

And soon we'll all be dead.

And everything and everyone we've ever loved will turn to dust.

A hundred years later, a great oak tree might grow from that dust.

And one sunny August day, a family of squirrels might nestle in its branches.


So, how about that 'Blanche', eh? Aaaaa-aaa-a-aa-aaaa!

mediumdry said:

leecaldon said:

mrjj71 said:

He said alot of things!

I just wonder if, had he made a will, there would have been a stipulation about which songs or who would work on them etc

The fact that he didn't make a will suggests he didn't have any strong feelings about it.

he didnt need a will because he knew he wouldnt die and lived a clean life unlike his idols Hendrix,sly stone,George clinton,& james brown

databank said:

ThePanther said:

Whether or not it is morally right to be listening to tracks intentionally (in most cases) unreleased by a musician after his death -- but then released after his death by his estate/family, who will profit from it -- is an unanswerable question. I guess that's up to each person to decide. Prince didn't specify any of this before he died, so it can go either way, I guess.

But the one aspect of it that does sometimes annoy me is when people -- fans, writers, bloggers -- get into a highly critical mode about this kind of material. Like, it's great that we have outtakes from 1999, Purple Rain, Sign O'the Times, etc., but people have to bear in mind that this was material that, for the most part, Prince himself didn't want the public to hear.

So, I tend to be a bit irritated when you hear people saying that this material isn't up to scratch, or it isn't as good as they had expected, or evaluating it like they would an officially released album in Prince's lifetime. Please bear in mind that the musician didn't authorize people to hear this. You can like it or not, but don't treat it as a Prince album, which it isn't.

True. Posthumous releases should be treated as historical documents not a statement by the artist. Same with authors, painters, etc.

Prince wasnt an artist though... he couldnt paint or draw...he was a musician

funkman88 said:

databank said:

ThePanther said: True. Posthumous releases should be treated as historical documents not a statement by the artist. Same with authors, painters, etc.

Prince wasnt an artist though... he couldnt paint or draw...he was a musician

He was a musical artist.

purplethunder3121 said:

funkman88 said:

Prince wasnt an artist though... he couldnt paint or draw...he was a musician

He was a musical artist.

its kinda hard 2 play guitar and draw at the same time even for prince..he was a musician not an artist

funkman88 said:

purplethunder3121 said:

He was a musical artist.

its kinda hard 2 play guitar and draw at the same time even for prince..he was a musician not an artist

There are different kinds of artists who do different kinds of art. The term "artist" doesn't just apply to someone who can draw and paint.

purplethunder3121 said:

funkman88 said:

its kinda hard 2 play guitar and draw at the same time even for prince..he was a musician not an artist

There are different kinds of artists who do different kinds of art. The term "artist" doesn't just apply to someone who can draw and paint.

not true...when i go 2 a art museum there is no music or musical performance...

'Should we really be listening to the vault songs?'

No, send your set to me and you'll never have to worry about this dilemma again.

fragglerock said:

'Should we really be listening to the vault songs?'

No, send your set to me and you'll never have to worry about this dilemma again.

i feel really bad because 90 per cent off SOTT DELUXE is trash! Prince never wanted us to hear this weak stuff...i feel so bad for him that we tarnishing his legacy for money...besides all my dreams the rest is cringeworthy....