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Thread started 09/14/19 12:10am

fabriziovenera
ndi

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Why Estate decided not to release Roadhouse Garden?

I mean: it was a good project, Prince in different interviews revealed different titles of the tracklist, maybe (maybe) somewhere he wrote a temporary tracklist for the album, the songs are from the "old" WB era, most of them are in good sound quality (Splash was released): why they did not release it as Prince Album? Why put the title track or Wonderful Ass in Purple Rain Deluxe "killing" the original project?

Fabrizio

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Reply #1 posted 09/14/19 2:34am

VaultCurator

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Hi fabriziovenerandi.
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We can only speculate, but I'm guessing it wasn't a priority at the time.
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The decision to attempt a Roadhouse Garden album in the first place was likely to capitalise on the '1999' buzz at the time. It would have been an ideal time to release some Revolution era music while that catching song was being played on radio and fresh in everyone's heads. It's such a shame it never came to fruition.
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Prince did have a hand in Purple Rain deluxe prior to his passing. How much involvement he had as far as the vault track selection is concerned is up for debate. For a guy who had decided to no longer use profanity, I'd be surprised if he'd offered up 'We Can Fuck' for release.
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Having said that, maybe Prince had decided for himself the Purple Rain deluxe was a suitable vehicle for Our Destiny / Roadhouse Garden.
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It's highly likely that all the Revolution era albums will be amongst the first to get the Super Deluxe treatment, so it's only a matter of time before all the songs that were likely to appear on that album are released in some form or fashion.
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There's a rather nice bootleg on the Purple Gold Archive label named 'Roadhouse Garden, Unreleased Album: Collectors Edition' that has been assembled using the rumoured tracks. It's obviously a fan make and a lot of liberties were taken as far a track selection goes, but it's a nice taste of the album that could have been.

RIP EXTRALOVEABLE!!! sad
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Reply #2 posted 09/14/19 5:52pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

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A whole lot of stuff not released yet. I doubt they haven't decided not to.

They need to get the momentum going...

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence
I will make you cyber shit in your pants!
What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In
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Reply #3 posted 09/14/19 10:46pm

mikeyaddict

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So far the estate has pissed about with no real direction, 1999 Super Deluxe being the first with some real teeth. Had they got it right from the outset we might be a bit further down the road and things like Roadhouse on the radar at least.

Personally I would like hit and run 3 or black is the new black or a second third eye album, the most recent stuff he made. However they appear to be going for the drip drip effect. An NPGMC style thing mighta brought forth more material.

Roadhouse is a real good shout though.
Comin str8 outta Preston...
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Reply #4 posted 09/15/19 12:42am

jaypotton

IMO (opinion only obviously) the estate and WB have more chance of making money from including vault tracks on super deluxe sets of previously released albums (like they are doing with 1999).

Hardcore fans will buy them anyway despite high prices. You might also get a handful of others who are curious enough to pick up a deluxe or even super deluxe edition of an album they know is good.

Vault only releases will really ONLY be of interest to us hardcore fans.

May be wrong.
'I loved him then, I love him now and will love him eternally. He's with our son now.' Mayte 21st April 2016 = the saddest quote I have ever read! RIP Prince and thanks for everything.
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Reply #5 posted 09/15/19 3:30am

Rimshottbob

For the estate - mostly for Warners, there is no point in releasing the 'unreleased albums' at this point. That will come later.

Don't forget, Warners only have until 2021 with the rights to Prince's catalogue (minus the soundtracks, the rights to which they will retain)... after that nearly all of Prince's albums transfer over to Sony.

So Warners have 2 years to release all they want in terms of those albums and any associated unreleased tracks... so that's what they will focus on first. Hence 1999 Deluxe.

There's no point in releasing Roadhouse Garden (the album) now, when that moment could be used to sell a Parade Deluxe (for example) before Warners' rights to it expire.

From what I understand, Warners have the catalogue until 2021, and can release unreleased music... Sony have part of the catalogue now (hence the later album reissues this year) and will have the rest of them in 2021, and - I THINK - can only release previously released material (hence no bonus tracks on these recent reissues)...

So if Warners didn't release say, Sign O' The Times Deluxe before 2021, all we could then get would be a straight Sign 'O The Times reissue from Sony, with no bonus tracks...

I don't think anybody would want that.

However, once Prince's released catalogue transfers over to Sony in 2021, it's my understanding that Warners can then still release previously unreleased (I'm guessing standalone) material. THAT will be the time to release the Roadhouse Gardens, etc.... when they can release little else.

So I wouldn't expect anything but deluxe editions of the classics for the next two years from Warners, and the filling in of the out of print later titles onto the market from Sony.

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Reply #6 posted 09/15/19 4:10am

jaypotton

Rimshottbob - I agree re Warners needing to up the pace to maximise their window. Great for us fans that we (hopefully) could see more (whole Warner catalogue please) albums get the 1999 style super deluxe treatment over next two years.

I would be VERY surprised if your point on only Warners being able to release vault material post 2021 is correct.

Warners have rights over songs (released and unreleased) that were recorded between 1978-1996 (ie. While Prince was signed to Warners) until some point in 2021. After that the rights revert to the estate (but have been licensed to Sony).

As you point out the soundtrack albums (Purple Rain, Parade, Batman, Grafitti Bridge) however stay with Warners.

There is also some difference between USA (North America?) rights and RoW rights.
'I loved him then, I love him now and will love him eternally. He's with our son now.' Mayte 21st April 2016 = the saddest quote I have ever read! RIP Prince and thanks for everything.
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Reply #7 posted 09/15/19 9:46am

bluefish

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The Roadhouse Garden album is #1 on my wishlist.

ā€ˇhttps://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvmsrcg1qD_wVuS4qnopmQg
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Reply #8 posted 09/15/19 10:55am

Strive

Why? We already have all the songs and the project was never completed.

I wouldn't complain if it got a release. It'd be cool like Camille or Dream Factory but it's not essential.

Also songs being included on other releases doesn't "kill" another project. A number of tracks from 4Ever/Purple Rain Deluxe also ended up on 1999 Deluxe in different forms or improved sound quality.

no yesterday or tomorrow, no better remedy for sorrow
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Reply #9 posted 09/16/19 5:52am

fabriziovenera
ndi

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Thank you for the answers. So, for example, Purple Rain Deluxe sold more than Originals?

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Reply #10 posted 09/16/19 6:11am

TheFman

I dont understand either; i was even thinking this would be posth. issue nr 1! The missing Revolution album is about as holy as the grail comes.

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Reply #11 posted 09/16/19 7:31am

jaypotton

TheFman said:

I dont understand either; i was even thinking this would be posth. issue nr 1! The missing Revolution album is about as holy as the grail comes.



Except Roadhouse Garden wasn't a "missing Revolution album". It was a compilation of vault tracks Prince recorded with the Revolution between 84-86 that he toyed with putting out in 1999.

Those vault tracks actually fit better with the super deluxe approach 1999 is getting to show the evolution towards a final released album and songs that were contemporary to those that came out officially for that album.

So, for example, a super deluxe for SOTT could (I wish) look like this:

Dream Factory -> Camille -> Crystal Ball -> SOTT

Just my opinion obviously!
'I loved him then, I love him now and will love him eternally. He's with our son now.' Mayte 21st April 2016 = the saddest quote I have ever read! RIP Prince and thanks for everything.
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Reply #12 posted 09/16/19 8:00am

TheFman

jaypotton said:

TheFman said:

I dont understand either; i was even thinking this would be posth. issue nr 1! The missing Revolution album is about as holy as the grail comes.

Except Roadhouse Garden wasn't a "missing Revolution album". It was a compilation of vault tracks Prince recorded with the Revolution between 84-86 that he toyed with putting out in 1999. Those vault tracks actually fit better with the super deluxe approach 1999 is getting to show the evolution towards a final released album and songs that were contemporary to those that came out officially for that album. So, for example, a super deluxe for SOTT could (I wish) look like this: Dream Factory -> Camille -> Crystal Ball -> SOTT Just my opinion obviously!

Sure i can be wrong, it's a long time already, but i though from W&L that they said it was an album of the their time, not later (around 1999) but it was disbanded for the obvious reason.

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Reply #13 posted 09/16/19 9:46am

Militant

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The premise of this thread is incorrect.

They haven't decided to not release it. If that were true then by that logic they would have also decided to not release about a million other things in the vault.

Roadhouse Garden hasn't been considered for release (yet) because nobody outside of the fandom knows what on earth it is, and there's tons of things that make a stronger business case to release first.

Also, tracks appearing on one release isn't indicative of anything. Moonbeam Levels came out on the 4Ever set, and it's also going to be on 1999 Deluxe.



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Reply #14 posted 09/16/19 10:29am

jaypotton

Militant said:

Also, tracks appearing on one release isn't indicative of anything. Moonbeam Levels came out on the 4Ever set, and it's also going to be on 1999 Deluxe.





Agreed. Personally as I have said I like the idea of super deluxe editions showing the evolution of a final released album. That means it is inevitable that songs may appear more than once (sure some folks would complain about this though).

Equally we know Prince recorded different versions of the same song (sometimes over a period of years) and I personally would like to hear those.

A great example is We Can Funk (for me the definitive version remains the one with the shoutout to and solo by Miko Weaver).
[Edited 9/16/19 10:30am]
'I loved him then, I love him now and will love him eternally. He's with our son now.' Mayte 21st April 2016 = the saddest quote I have ever read! RIP Prince and thanks for everything.
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Reply #15 posted 09/16/19 1:10pm

jfenster

Prince himself stated that there are Prince and The Revolution , The Time and Vanity 6 unreleased ALBUMS in the vault. What more does the estate need to know?

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Reply #16 posted 09/16/19 1:28pm

Strive

jfenster said:

Prince himself stated that there are Prince and The Revolution , The Time and Vanity 6 unreleased ALBUMS in the vault. What more does the estate need to know?



Prince was the king of illusion. There's a ton of stuff in the vault. Hundreds of songs, a lion's share of his live output, who knows how many different versions or takes of songs.

Outside of known abandoned albums, there's not release ready albums ready to fly. No real truth to the idea that he knowingly left his best material on the shelf.

Remember, he's the guy that claimed to re-record his entire catalog...only for an engineer to clarify decades later that they only re-recorded 3 songs before moving onto something else. That said, the same engineer said that there isn't only the known Electric version of Welcome 2 The Dawn but a number of different versions from Prince taking multiple runs at it.
no yesterday or tomorrow, no better remedy for sorrow
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Reply #17 posted 09/16/19 1:30pm

jfenster

Strive said:

jfenster said:

Prince himself stated that there are Prince and The Revolution , The Time and Vanity 6 unreleased ALBUMS in the vault. What more does the estate need to know?

Prince was the king of illusion. There's a ton of stuff in the vault. Hundreds of songs, a lion's share of his live output, who knows how many different versions or takes of songs. Outside of known abandoned albums, there's not release ready albums ready to fly. No real truth to the idea that he knowingly left his best material on the shelf. Remember, he's the guy that claimed to re-record his entire catalog...only for an engineer to clarify decades later that they only re-recorded 3 songs before moving onto something else. That said, the same engineer said that there isn't only the known Electric version of Welcome 2 The Dawn but a number of different versions from Prince taking multiple runs at it.

"theres not release ready albums readt to fly"....................so wrong!!

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Reply #18 posted 09/16/19 1:44pm

Strive

jfenster said:


"theres not release ready albums readt to fly".....so wrong!!



You left out the "that aren't known abandoned albums" part which is pretty important but please inform me what golden era Revolution, Time and Vanity 6 albums Prince completed but chose not to release? Is there any proof to his claim that he kept the best material for himself/the vault? Because there wasn't any sight of them in the police photos of the Paisley Vault.
no yesterday or tomorrow, no better remedy for sorrow
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Reply #19 posted 09/16/19 1:46pm

jfenster

Strive said:

jfenster said:

"theres not release ready albums readt to fly"....................so wrong!!

You left out the "that aren't known abandoned albums" part which is pretty important but please inform me what golden era Revolution, Time and Vanity 6 albums Prince completed but chose not to release? Is there any proof to his claim that he kept the best material for himself/the vault? Because there wasn't any sight of them in the police photos of the Paisley Vault.

have u heard the intrview where he mentions this?? he mentions something about what it would be like to hear a SLY and the family stone album from back then ..NOW...

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Forums > Prince: Music and More > Why Estate decided not to release Roadhouse Garden?