I've just listened to the Batman album for the first time in a while and I've just been struck by how great an album it is (though I've never been that keen on Batdance, always found it a little cheesy).

But I was wondering though, if instead of being released as a Batman soundtrack album if this set of songs, minus Batdance, had just been released as a regular Prince album called something like The Future, and without the Batman imagery on the packaging and the dialogue samples would it have had a better legacy? Does the album work even better without all the Batman references or are they pretty integral to the whole thing? I'm starting to think that as a regular album this would today be mentioned by music critics as a real part of his classic period rather than being semi-forgotten by them.

[Edited 1/16/18 4:05am]

I like the album quite a bit too..(except for the Arms of Orion song) I think it would be a bit more loved if it was connected to the Batman movie. I think the haters dislike it because to them it doesn't seem dark enough to be music for their precious Batman. (Those of us who don't take Batman that seriously think it fits just fine.). I think had Prince just called it Batman, Vicky and the Joker--a love triangle and thrown a bit more humor in it, it might have been considered a light hearted and funky variation of the comic strip.

ShaggyDog said:

I've just listened to the Batman album for the first time in a while and I've just been strucj by how great an album it is (though I've never been that keen on Batdance, always found it a little cheesy).

But I was wondering though, if instead of being released as a Batman soundtrack album if this set of songs, minus Batdance, had just been released as a regular Prince album, and without the Batman imagery on the packaging and the dialogue samples would it have had a better legacy? Does the album work even better without all the Batman references or are they pretty integral to the whole thing? I'm starting to think that as a regular album this would today be mentioned by music critics as a real part of his classic period rather than being semi-forgotten by them.

for me the only reason watching the movie was prince's soundtrack. I love the entire album as it is but could easily live without batdance and the movie connection.

The album would be different, probably closer to the original Rave tracklist, but I figure it would have been fairly poorly received anyway. He was on the way down, like it or not.

Oh and it's a fantastic album btw, Batdance itself is genius.

jaawwnn said:

The album would be different, probably closer to the original Rave tracklist, but I figure it would have been fairly poorly received anyway. He was on the way down, like it or not.

Oh and it's a fantastic album btw, Batdance itself is genius.

It's a real pity that Dance With The Devil was taken off the album, that would have been a great dark epic closer. I'd also maybe swap out Trust for 200 Baloons.

It would not have been the Batman album we know withought the Batman connection

.

Like jaawwnn said, we probably would have gotten the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

.

which would have had a nice place in purple history especially if the Lovesexy band members were still involved, for me.

.

The Batman/Rave period had some pretty good pieces of music

purplerabbithole said:

I like the album quite a bit too..(except for the Arms of Orion song) I think it would be a bit more loved if it was connected to the Batman movie. I think the haters dislike it because to them it doesn't seem dark enough to be music for their precious Batman. (Those of us who don't take Batman that seriously think it fits just fine.). I think had Prince just called it Batman, Vicky and the Joker--a love triangle and thrown a bit more humor in it, it might have been considered a light hearted and funky variation of the comic strip.

I take Batman very seriously and love the album.

Well, we know for sure "Batdance" and "Vicki Waiting" would not exist.

I think this would've been a great record:

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Crucial

4. Partyman

5. Mind Bells

6. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

7. Feel U Up

8. Scandalous

9. Dance with the Devil

This would've been a solid, solid album. I know "Crucial" didn't originate from that time, but it deserved attention and as a song it slaughters "Arms of Orion."

67Cadillac said:

Well, we know for sure "Batdance" and "Vicki Waiting" would not exist.

I think this would've been a great record:

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Crucial

4. Partyman

5. Mind Bells

6. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

7. Feel U Up

8. Scandalous

9. Dance with the Devil

This would've been a solid, solid album. I know "Crucial" didn't originate from that time, but it deserved attention and as a song it slaughters "Arms of Orion."

Would Partyman have 'existed' as well? Didn't he make that to replace Baby I'm A Star in the movie?

67Cadillac said:

Well, we know for sure "Batdance" and "Vicki Waiting" would not exist.

I think this would've been a great record:

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Crucial

4. Partyman

5. Mind Bells

6. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

7. Feel U Up

8. Scandalous

9. Dance with the Devil

This would've been a solid, solid album. I know "Crucial" didn't originate from that time, but it deserved attention and as a song it slaughters "Arms of Orion."

Doesn't Pink Cashmere date from the same time period as well? I so I think it would have gone nicely right before Dance With The Devil, a nice smooth and (seemingly) soft acoustic track before Prince goes dark, really dark.

[Edited 1/16/18 12:26pm]

OldFriends4Sale said:

It would not have been the Batman album we know withought the Batman connection

.

Like jaawwnn said, we probably would have gotten the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

.

which would have had a nice place in purple history especially if the Lovesexy band members were still involved, for me.

.

The Batman/Rave period had some pretty good pieces of music

Exactly. Batman exist because of the Batman connection lol.
This is what we would have got:

1. Rave Unto The Joy Fantastic
2. If I Had A Harem
3. Good Judy Girlfriend
4. Pink Cashmere
5. Electric Chair
6. Am I Without U?
7. God Is Alive
8. Still Would Stand All Time
9. Moonbeam Levels

There were some really classic songs still on the release, but prob would not have been that successful as none of these tracks around that time fit with the sound other than Electric Chair and Pink Cashmere. This was when New Jack Swing was about to start taking over. I don't know what he was thinking putting Good Judy Girlfriend on there doesnt fit the other songs. The only one not circulating is Am I Without U which is supposed to be a very nice ballad.

[Edited 1/16/18 12:41pm]

ShaggyDog said:

67Cadillac said:

Well, we know for sure "Batdance" and "Vicki Waiting" would not exist.

I think this would've been a great record:

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Crucial

4. Partyman

5. Mind Bells

6. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

7. Feel U Up

8. Scandalous

9. Dance with the Devil

This would've been a solid, solid album. I know "Crucial" didn't originate from that time, but it deserved attention and as a song it slaughters "Arms of Orion."

Doesn't Pink Cashmere date from the same time period as well? I so I think it would have gone nicely right before Dance With The Devil, a nice smooth and (seemingly) soft acoustic track before Prince goes dark, really dark.

[Edited 1/16/18 12:26pm]

Pink Cashmere is from June 1988, so not from the same sessions. But it is tied to Anna Fantastic who I connect with the Batman period.

67Cadillac said:

paisleypark4 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It would not have been the Batman album we know withought the Batman connection

.

Like jaawwnn said, we probably would have gotten the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

.

which would have had a nice place in purple history especially if the Lovesexy band members were still involved, for me.

.

The Batman/Rave period had some pretty good pieces of music

Exactly. Batman exist because of the Batman connection lol.

lol YEP

and Steve Park had art work in the making for the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

Rave, following Lovesexy seemed to have a more hopeful/lighter vibe.

paisleypark4 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It would not have been the Batman album we know withought the Batman connection

.

Like jaawwnn said, we probably would have gotten the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

.

which would have had a nice place in purple history especially if the Lovesexy band members were still involved, for me.

.

The Batman/Rave period had some pretty good pieces of music

Exactly. Batman exist because of the Batman connection lol.
This is what we would have got:

1. Rave Unto The Joy Fantastic
2. If I Had A Harem
3. Good Judy Girlfriend
4. Pink Cashmere
5. Electric Chair
6. Am I Without U?
7. God Is Alive
8. Still Would Stand All Time
9. Moonbeam Levels

There were some really classic songs still on the release, but prob would not have been that successful as none of these tracks around that time fit with the sound other than Electric Chair and Pink Cashmere. This was when New Jack Swing was about to start taking over. I don't know what he was thinking putting Good Judy Girlfriend on there doesnt fit the other songs. The only one not circulating is Am I Without U which is supposed to be a very nice ballad.

[Edited 1/16/18 12:41pm]

Right,

there seemed to be a darker side to the Batman sessions. Which I understand that being the undercurrent of both Batman & the Joker and Gotham City and makes sense.

Do you think Good Girl Judy sounded different than the released?

After reading through subsequent responses, this would be my proposed alternative:

Electric Chair

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Scandalous

4. Moonbeam Levels

5. Anna Waiting

6. Feel U Up

7. Pink Cashmere

8. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

9. Power Fantastic

10. Dance with the Devil

I actually think "Power Fantastic" makes an even better lead-in to "Dance with the Devil"; that song's always had a very eerie, spectral quality to it, yet it's also very subtle and mysteriously disarming.

67Cadillac said:

After reading through subsequent responses, this would be my proposed alternative:

Electric Chair

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Scandalous

4. Moonbeam Levels

5. Anna Waiting

6. Feel U Up

7. Pink Cashmere

8. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

9. Power Fantastic

10. Dance with the Devil

I actually think "Power Fantastic" makes an even better lead-in to "Dance with the Devil"; that song's always had a very eerie, spectral quality to it, yet it's also very subtle and mysteriously disarming.

what would be the 'vision' or painting for this album?

.

I would leave Moonbeam Levels off, unless there is a new 89 version, ML is sooooo 1999/PR

.

I wouldn't think Power Fantastic would work either, because that is all Prince & the Revolution(Lisa Coleman composition). I know he did a litte of that on SOTT songs and even Graffiti Bridge(and Jill Jones) Power Fantastic is too Prince & the Revolution.

.

I do like We Got the Power, and it has the feel of the rest of the music and recorded in the same time. / Power From Above...

Rave into The Future Joy of Repetition (Triple Album!)

Side 1

Rave into The Joy Fantastic

If I Had A Harem

Electric Chair

Pink Cashmere

Side 2

By Alien Means

Stimulation

Anna Waiting

Soul Psychedelicide

Side 3

The Future

We Got The Power

Judy Good Girlfriend

Cookie Jar

Side 4

American In Paris

Am I Without U

Me Touch Myself

God Is Alive

Side 5

Joy In Repetition (Long Intro)

Feel U Up (Long Stroke)

Arms Of Orion

Lemon Crush

Side 6

Dance With The Devil

Scandalous

I Love U In Me

Still Would Stand All Time

[Edited 1/16/18 16:34pm]

While Rave would've ended his 80's "genius" run on a high note, musically would've been very strong, would deff have that same Lovesexy trip vibe to it... However commercially it would've been a disaster for Prince... I doubt Rave would've been commercial at all, being Lovesexy was his first album since Controversy that did not go Platinum in the U.S. Barely selling 750,000 copies... Batman while obviously not his strongest work from his run of brilliant albums, was really a saving point in his career at that point. Batman really gave him commercial clout once again selling over 4 million copies. Don't forget Lovesexy the album failed commerical expectations and the Lovesexy tour financially barely broke even... If he were to go down with the Rave album, artistically and musically it would've been much more appreciated to end his 80's career, but commercially it would've been really bad for him because I doubt that album would have any commercial relevance. But then again if Rave wouldn't sell well I dout WB would help finance the Graffiti Bridge movie

OldFriends4Sale said:

67Cadillac said:

After reading through subsequent responses, this would be my proposed alternative:

Electric Chair

1. The Future

2. Electric Chair

3. Scandalous

4. Moonbeam Levels

5. Anna Waiting

6. Feel U Up

7. Pink Cashmere

8. Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic

9. Power Fantastic

10. Dance with the Devil

I actually think "Power Fantastic" makes an even better lead-in to "Dance with the Devil"; that song's always had a very eerie, spectral quality to it, yet it's also very subtle and mysteriously disarming.

what would be the 'vision' or painting for this album?

.

I would leave Moonbeam Levels off, unless there is a new 89 version, ML is sooooo 1999/PR

.

I wouldn't think Power Fantastic would work either, because that is all Prince & the Revolution(Lisa Coleman composition). I know he did a litte of that on SOTT songs and even Graffiti Bridge(and Jill Jones) Power Fantastic is too Prince & the Revolution.

.

I do like We Got the Power, and it has the feel of the rest of the music and recorded in the same time. / Power From Above...

I just wanted to try and create an album of dark, moody songs that kind of harkened to the vibe of Batman. You are right, "Moonbeam Levels" is probably too close the 1982-85 era to warrant a spot. I'd still include "Power Fantastic" just because it's so haunting and it just fading into "Dance with the Devil" would send a chill down my spine.

feeluupp said:

While Rave would've ended his 80's "genius" run on a high note, musically would've been very strong, would deff have that same Lovesexy trip vibe to it... However commercially it would've been a disaster for Prince... I doubt Rave would've been commercial at all, being Lovesexy was his first album since Controversy that did not go Platinum in the U.S. Barely selling 750,000 copies... Batman while obviously not his strongest work from his run of brilliant albums, was really a saving point in his career at that point. Batman really gave him commercial clout once again selling over 4 million copies. Don't forget Lovesexy the album failed commerical expectations and the Lovesexy tour financially barely broke even... If he were to go down with the Rave album, artistically and musically it would've been much more appreciated to end his 80's career, but commercially it would've been really bad for him because I doubt that album would have any commercial relevance. But then again if Rave wouldn't sell well I dout WB would help finance the Graffiti Bridge movie

I think the Rave album music had more commercially accessible music than Lovesexy. I mean even people in the band from Sheila E to Eric Leeds were saying they 'didn't really understand it...but you might if you come to the show'

.

But songs like Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic, Electric Chair, Pink Cashmere, etc seem like good singles.
But again, promotion would have to be key, as well. Which Prince fell short of after 1986

.

But your post overall is on point

OldFriends4Sale said:

paisleypark4 said:

Exactly. Batman exist because of the Batman connection lol.

lol YEP

and Steve Park had art work in the making for the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

Rave, following Lovesexy seemed to have a more hopeful/lighter vibe.

WOW!!!!

Critically about the same but it wouldn't have sold nearly as much.

OldFriends4Sale said:

paisleypark4 said:

Exactly. Batman exist because of the Batman connection lol.

lol YEP

and Steve Park had art work in the making for the Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic album

Rave, following Lovesexy seemed to have a more hopeful/lighter vibe.

I'd love to see how that artwork would have looked in colour! That could well have been Prince's best album cover right there, and would have looked awesome as a gatefold sleeve.

By the way am I the only one that likes Arms Of Orion? I remember as a kid when it was released and seeing it on Top Of The Pops but to little me it just seemed like a boring slow song after the craziness of Batdance. But now I can really appreciate it, it's a great song for a soundtrack album. Does anyone else think that this song has a real Kate Bush feel to it?

It would not have been commercial at all, and if it would have been another commercial flop right after the commercial flop of Lovesexy I think it would have been a big game changer and a much earlier feud with WB.

However based on several configurations for Rave, songs like, Pink Cashmere, Electric Chair, Elephants & Flowers, If I Had A Harem, Moonbeam Levels, all great songs but I don't know what the concept was for Rave, all those songs seem so out of place to be on ONE album together, like a mashup of just singles rather than an album...

feeluupp said:

It would not have been commercial at all, and if it would have been another commercial flop right after the commercial flop of Lovesexy I think it would have been a big game changer and a much earlier feud with WB.

However based on several configurations for Rave, songs like, Pink Cashmere, Electric Chair, Elephants & Flowers, If I Had A Harem, Moonbeam Levels, all great songs but I don't know what the concept was for Rave, all those songs seem so out of place to be on ONE album together, like a mashup of just singles rather than an album...

yes, replace a few of them... like If I Had a Harem, Moonbeam Levels, Good Judy Girlfriend

add the Future, We Got the Power and 1 or 2 others

It definately feels like a space after the new found Lovesexy salvation, continuation of love, taking that message to the world while expressing love to a new muse etc

I honestly can't see a big hit out of any those songs. At least Lovesexy had "Alphabet Street," which was kind of a watered down "Raspberry Beret" and thus had a bit of commercial appeal. I can't see something like "Moonbeam Levels" being a hit in 1989.

67Cadillac said:

I honestly can't see a big hit out of any those songs. At least Lovesexy had "Alphabet Street," which was kind of a watered down "Raspberry Beret" and thus had a bit of commercial appeal. I can't see something like "Moonbeam Levels" being a hit in 1989.

not a 1989 version of Rave?

67Cadillac said:

I honestly can't see a big hit out of any those songs. At least Lovesexy had "Alphabet Street," which was kind of a watered down "Raspberry Beret" and thus had a bit of commercial appeal. I can't see something like "Moonbeam Levels" being a hit in 1989.

Agree... At most it would have been a very average album, musically "better" than BATMAN to close out his 80's career.

There is no hit on the Rave album, even if those configurations have "good" songs, nothing is groundbreaking. Pink Cashmere yes it's a great beautiful song, would it be a hit in 1989? No. Moonbeam Levels would not be a hit either, to be honest none of those songs would be a hit. Electric Chair might have cracked Top 40 but it wouldn't be a big hit especially since the rest of the album really sounds nothing else like the rock vibe of Electric Chair...

I think 89 was a big turning point in Prince's career, it's almost as if he been there done that and was at an artistic block... I mean juding by the configurations of Rave it was a bunch of songs that really didn't belong with each other, Electric Chair to If I Had A Harem to Pink Cashmere all in one album? I really don't think that would flow properly, I guess he really didn't have a concept at that time he was doing so much all at the same time, Rave album, Graffiti Bridge script, was a lot, then the Batman offer popped out of nowehere.