novabrkr said:

leadline said:

He sings these guide songs as if he were the artist he is giving them to, taking into account their vocal strengths and weaknesses. That is why he sounds different on a lot of these.

[Edited 12/18/17 5:57am]

Is there any info that suggests he wrote the song for Patti LaBelle or anyone else to perform? Quite often he simply gave away the songs to others later when he didn't feel that they were suitable for an inclusion on his own albums.

He wrote several songs just intended for someone else like Martika's Kitchen, Love Thy Will be Done, Sugar Walls, Glamorus Life, I Hear your Voice, Nasty Girl, Bliss, Emotional Pump, Mindbells..list goes on and on.

bluegangsta said:

scififilmnerd said:

Only If The Kid Can't Make U Come, Feel U Up (medium Edit), Bobbi Jo and Madhouse: 18 And over. Purple Rain is incomplete.

Purple Rain is not incomplete. This is the edit as it appeared on the September-October configuration. Chances are, the guitar intro was not yet recorded.

No, that guitar intro was from the original recording (live at First Avenue) as part of that long intro. If you've heard the original live recording (pre-overdubbs), you know exactly where it's at. They just removed the other tracks to make that the intro including Prince's guitar solo before the first verse.

[Edited 12/18/17 8:50am]

paisleypark4 said:

novabrkr said:

He wrote several songs just intended for someone else like Martika's Kitchen, Love Thy Will be Done, Sugar Walls, Glamorus Life, I Hear your Voice, Nasty Girl, Bliss, Emotional Pump, Mindbells..list goes on and on.

"Yo Mister" is a song written by Prince for Patti LaBelle. She recorded the song for her 1989 album, Be Yourself, and the song was released as a single. It became a top ten R&B hit.

The song is one of LaBelle's biggest R&B hits to date, peaking at number six on the Billboard R&B chart.^[2] The song failed to hit the Billboard Hot 100.

The song was written by Prince^[2] and also features Prince on various instruments and background vocals. The single mix and corresponding video version was mixed by Chris Lord-Alge.

There are times where he did have songs sitting on the side waiting to be recorded for someone like U (Paul Abdul), Dopamine Rush (Eric Leeds), The Dance Electric (Andre)

I don't think the choice of a preposition used in the first sentence for the description of the song on PrinceVault really suffices as evidence that it was always intended for Patti LaBelle.

I mean, it might have been or might have been not. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just questioning its origins. The production style of the song suggests he might have intended it for himself, as it has much of the same sound as SOTT has. The LaBelle version has been "updated", with more contemporary sounds used for it, far less prominent guitar parts, etc.

novabrkr said:

paisleypark4 said:

novabrkr said:

He wrote several songs just intended for someone else like Martika's Kitchen, Love Thy Will be Done, Sugar Walls, Glamorus Life, I Hear your Voice, Nasty Girl, Bliss, Emotional Pump, Mindbells..list goes on and on.

There are times where he did have songs sitting on the side waiting to be recorded for someone like U (Paul Abdul), Dopamine Rush (Eric Leeds), The Dance Electric (Andre)

I don't think the choice of a preposition used in the first sentence for the description of the song on PrinceVault really suffices as evidence that it was always intended for Patti LaBelle.

I mean, it might have been or might have been not. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just questioning its origins. The production style of the song suggests he might have intended it for himself, as it has much of the same sound as SOTT has. The LaBelle version has been "updated", with more contemporary sounds used for it, far less prominent guitar parts, etc.

the thing with songs surfacing that he (eventually) gave to others, is that people are somehow

convinced that they were always meant to be for that person, even when evidence is scarce or
non existent.

the evidence they produce is that prince's vocal track sounds 'like he put hardly any effort into
it' or 'these are CLEARLY just guide vocals' etc.

next argument (which imo has always been a bit contradictory to the first) is that these songs
are sung in a way that imitates the intended singer of the track. which in itself would already
need a certain amount of care and effort on prince's part anyway.

and what if the person who the song was sent to didn't record it? would prince then record the
vocals AGAIN, this time with the vocal inflection of the next artist he intended to have it?

prince sings in so many voices and in so many ways on all of his own released material that it's
already something akin to amazing that he managed to sound different on so many tracks.

so why can't 'yo mister' be another one of his slightly different sounding vocals? or '101' etc?
why are they 'obviously just guide vocals' to so many people? couldn't it be that the people
who ended up singing these songs imitate/try to emulate prince's take a bit?

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

it's the chicken vs egg thing.

3...2.....

[Edited 12/18/17 18:28pm]

IstenSzek said:

novabrkr said:

paisleypark4 said:

I don't think the choice of a preposition used in the first sentence for the description of the song on PrinceVault really suffices as evidence that it was always intended for Patti LaBelle.

I mean, it might have been or might have been not. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just questioning its origins. The production style of the song suggests he might have intended it for himself, as it has much of the same sound as SOTT has. The LaBelle version has been "updated", with more contemporary sounds used for it, far less prominent guitar parts, etc.

the thing with songs surfacing that he (eventually) gave to others, is that people are somehow

convinced that they were always meant to be for that person, even when evidence is scarce or
non existent.

the evidence they produce is that prince's vocal track sounds 'like he put hardly any effort into
it' or 'these are CLEARLY just guide vocals' etc.

next argument (which imo has always been a bit contradictory to the first) is that these songs
are sung in a way that imitates the intended singer of the track. which in itself would already
need a certain amount of care and effort on prince's part anyway.

and what if the person who the song was sent to didn't record it? would prince then record the
vocals AGAIN, this time with the vocal inflection of the next artist he intended to have it?

prince sings in so many voices and in so many ways on all of his own released material that it's
already something akin to amazing that he managed to sound different on so many tracks.

so why can't 'yo mister' be another one of his slightly different sounding vocals? or '101' etc?
why are they 'obviously just guide vocals' to so many people? couldn't it be that the people
who ended up singing these songs imitate/try to emulate prince's take a bit?

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

it's the chicken vs egg thing.

3...2.....

[Edited 12/18/17 18:28pm]

Its because Prince is clearly not using his best ability to sing on Yo Mister in particular. Maybe there are other vocals recorded but this clearly is not in the right key...hes just singing it off not using his best effort. He did this same thing in many other guide vocal tracks we can see compared to stuff like Large Room, Wonderful Ass or Other here With Us, which is def not intended for anyone else but him.

Delerted - l'ange bleu - moderator

IstenSzek said:

novabrkr said:

paisleypark4 said:

I don't think the choice of a preposition used in the first sentence for the description of the song on PrinceVault really suffices as evidence that it was always intended for Patti LaBelle.

I mean, it might have been or might have been not. I'm not saying it isn't, I'm just questioning its origins. The production style of the song suggests he might have intended it for himself, as it has much of the same sound as SOTT has. The LaBelle version has been "updated", with more contemporary sounds used for it, far less prominent guitar parts, etc.

the thing with songs surfacing that he (eventually) gave to others, is that people are somehow

convinced that they were always meant to be for that person, even when evidence is scarce or
non existent.

the evidence they produce is that prince's vocal track sounds 'like he put hardly any effort into
it' or 'these are CLEARLY just guide vocals' etc.

next argument (which imo has always been a bit contradictory to the first) is that these songs
are sung in a way that imitates the intended singer of the track. which in itself would already
need a certain amount of care and effort on prince's part anyway.

and what if the person who the song was sent to didn't record it? would prince then record the
vocals AGAIN, this time with the vocal inflection of the next artist he intended to have it?

prince sings in so many voices and in so many ways on all of his own released material that it's
already something akin to amazing that he managed to sound different on so many tracks.

so why can't 'yo mister' be another one of his slightly different sounding vocals? or '101' etc?
why are they 'obviously just guide vocals' to so many people? couldn't it be that the people
who ended up singing these songs imitate/try to emulate prince's take a bit?

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

it's the chicken vs egg thing.

3...2.....

[Edited 12/18/17 18:28pm]

You are right (as you normally are); we simply don't know, but as strangers chatting shit on the internet it's interesting to speculate!

.

I'd guess most cases he already had these songs sitting on the shelf. Even in 2 of the strong looking cases there are doubts, like Yo Mister; he does sound like he's impersonating Patti but according to Pvault he recorded it 2 years before she did so you wonder.

.

Similarly with Come Home; he sounds a bit like he's mimmicking Mavis but according to Pvault he initially recorded it in 87 and it was 'originally intended for' Mel'isa Morgan. But then the plot thickens as he 'revised' it in 88 just before Mavis recorded it so maybe he was impersonating her after all, depending if we have the 87 or 88 version!

dodger said:

IstenSzek said:

the thing with songs surfacing that he (eventually) gave to others, is that people are somehow

convinced that they were always meant to be for that person, even when evidence is scarce or
non existent.

the evidence they produce is that prince's vocal track sounds 'like he put hardly any effort into
it' or 'these are CLEARLY just guide vocals' etc.

next argument (which imo has always been a bit contradictory to the first) is that these songs
are sung in a way that imitates the intended singer of the track. which in itself would already
need a certain amount of care and effort on prince's part anyway.

and what if the person who the song was sent to didn't record it? would prince then record the
vocals AGAIN, this time with the vocal inflection of the next artist he intended to have it?

prince sings in so many voices and in so many ways on all of his own released material that it's
already something akin to amazing that he managed to sound different on so many tracks.

so why can't 'yo mister' be another one of his slightly different sounding vocals? or '101' etc?
why are they 'obviously just guide vocals' to so many people? couldn't it be that the people
who ended up singing these songs imitate/try to emulate prince's take a bit?

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

it's the chicken vs egg thing.

3...2.....

[Edited 12/18/17 18:28pm]

You are right (as you normally are); we simply don't know, but as strangers chatting shit on the internet it's interesting to speculate!

.

I'd guess most cases he already had these songs sitting on the shelf. Even in 2 of the strong looking cases there are doubts, like Yo Mister; he does sound like he's impersonating Patti but according to Pvault he recorded it 2 years before she did so you wonder.

.

Similarly with Come Home; he sounds a bit like he's mimmicking Mavis but according to Pvault he initially recorded it in 87 and it was 'originally intended for' Mel'isa Morgan. But then the plot thickens as he 'revised' it in 88 just before Mavis recorded it so maybe he was impersonating her after all, depending if we have the 87 or 88 version!

see now that is very interesting because that would be more proof toward him actually laying
down a vocal in the style of the intended singer

paisleypark4 said:

Its because Prince is clearly not using his best ability to sing on Yo Mister in particular. Maybe there are other vocals recorded but this clearly is not in the right key...hes just singing it off not using his best effort. He did this same thing in many other guide vocal tracks we can see compared to stuff like Large Room, Wonderful Ass or Other here With Us, which is def not intended for anyone else but him.

i'm not saying you're wrong, not at all, it's as valid a theory as any, but in that case why
would he not sing it in the right key? i mean, for prince that should have been no effort
at all. wouldn't he want a guide vocal to be in the right key? not only is he sending this
track to an artist he respects, but they are then going to work on the track with their own
production team etc. as much of a perfectionist as prince was, i can't see him sending off
a track with vocal take so lazy that it's even in the wrong key. so that probably means it's
intentional - to me.

but maybe that's just me overestimating the time and effort prince put into these tracks,
since the man sometimes recorded 4 songs a day. he really couldn't have had the time to
polish all of them and maybe he did just lay down vocals in 1 take and just send stuff off
and move on to the next thing. it's a miracle how he got so much stuff done at all, what
with the rehearsing, touring, dating, designing 90% of his surroundings from clothes to
musical equipment etc. where on earth did he find the time

IstenSzek said:

paisleypark4 said:

Its because Prince is clearly not using his best ability to sing on Yo Mister in particular. Maybe there are other vocals recorded but this clearly is not in the right key...hes just singing it off not using his best effort. He did this same thing in many other guide vocal tracks we can see compared to stuff like Large Room, Wonderful Ass or Other here With Us, which is def not intended for anyone else but him.

i'm not saying you're wrong, not at all, it's as valid a theory as any, but in that case why
would he not sing it in the right key? i mean, for prince that should have been no effort
at all. wouldn't he want a guide vocal to be in the right key? not only is he sending this
track to an artist he respects, but they are then going to work on the track with their own
production team etc. as much of a perfectionist as prince was, i can't see him sending off
a track with vocal take so lazy that it's even in the wrong key. so that probably means it's
intentional - to me.

but maybe that's just me overestimating the time and effort prince put into these tracks,
since the man sometimes recorded 4 songs a day. he really couldn't have had the time to
polish all of them and maybe he did just lay down vocals in 1 take and just send stuff off
and move on to the next thing. it's a miracle how he got so much stuff done at all, what
with the rehearsing, touring, dating, designing 90% of his surroundings from clothes to
musical equipment etc. where on earth did he find the time

Paisleypark4 probably meant that it's in a key that doesn't suit his voice, although I found that comment equally puzzling myself. I don't think he usually took such factors into account and just went with what worked. He wasn't afraid to sound strained ("strangled"), as it was "his thing" throughout the years. He's using the "Camille" effect on the recording as well, and that complicates making such perceptions.

Seriously though, I find it a bit odd that a song with the word "Yo" appearing in the title would have been intended for LaBelle originally. It's not a word you would have expected a forty-something woman use at the time. Yeah, sure, it might have been an intentional "artistic choice" by Prince, but there's really nothing on the recording that functions as evidence it was originally intended for a middle-aged "powerhouse" type of a female singer.

I'm not so sure about him trying to "mimic" LaBelle's vocal style either - how exactly is he supposed to sound like her on the recording? The way he sings the song sounds like a mellower take on what he did on "If I Was Your Girlfriend" to me (as noted earlier, he had just recorded that song and moved onto "Yo Mister" as the next thing). The song isn't really comparable to, say, "The Voice" or "Melody Cool". On those songs it's far more evident he wrote them for someone else.

[lots of edits - I haven't used English that much lately, sorry]

[Edited 12/19/17 6:36am]

Let us not forget he had at one point an Editing sub-company along Controversy Music ASCAP, called Girlsongs.

What I mean by that is he had those songs where he heard more of a female lead.
To think "I Wanna Be Your Lover" originally was... It explains a lot.
This forced Prince to play the "chanteuse", as Jeff Buckley said.

He had songs with very feminine melodies.
He never went full on, he had to croon, he's not feminine to the bone.
So he croons on "Adore", on "Do Me Baby", on "Condition Of The Heart",
and of course the perfection being "If I Was Your Girlfriend", where subject meets form.

His most troubling delivery is still "Love Thy Will Be Done" for me.
It's a children choir, a female lead, the tape and trebles go on and off.
A real electro-punk gospel. Punk for the laziness of the "on repeat" gimmick.

I can't help but thinking that his obsession with androgyny (in music, in visuals) may come from reconciling
his parents couple, and all the couples of the world, which is kinda sweet, and the kinda sweetness I wish Donald Trump white version had.
"Purple Rain"’s main subject is divorce. Prince looked for a way to reconcile both worlds for all the rest of his career, with his big ol' empathy.

And of course, his big ol' glyph.

IstenSzek said:

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

I always thought that 101 was another song he recorded following the break-up with Susannah and that he just ended up giving it to Sheena seeing as how Susannah didn't take no taxi or subway train back to him anyway.

[Edited 12/20/17 9:38am]

scififilmnerd said:

IstenSzek said:

last thing, like, let's say '101', which for all we know was always meant for sheena, the whole
story about it, the way she told it etc. but you still can't be CERTAIN of that. he could have let
half a dozen other women hear it before her. how many women weren't told by prince either
in conversation or on stationary that TMBGITW was written for them and them alone?

so you can say 'you can hear prince singing like sheena on 101, he tries to sound like her' or
you could say 'prince gave her this amazing track with a great vocal and she did her take on
it and sang in much the same inflection/tone etc, which is part of the track's atmosphere to
begin with anyway'

yeah, i don't know. it just pisses me off, that whole 'oh i know everything about prince and i'm
so knowledgeable about him that i KNOW these are guide vocals, he clearly sounds like sheena
here, or mavis, or patti. i can tell!' no you can't. in many cases we simply don't know.

I always thought that 101 was another song he recorded following the break-up with Susannah and that he just ended up giving it to Sheena seeing as how Susannah didn't take no taxi or subway train back to him anyway.

[Edited 12/20/17 9:38am]

IstenSzek said:

off topic slightly (no one's created a thread yet?) anyone heard the 'Christmas Present' tracks yet?

haven't had a chance to listen fully (there on my work computer), and was wondering are there any differences in the tracks that we havent got already?

Dandroppedadime said:

off topic slightly (no one's created a thread yet?) anyone heard the 'Christmas Present' tracks yet?

haven't had a chance to listen fully (there on my work computer), and was wondering are there any differences in the tracks that we havent got already?

???

Dandroppedadime said:

off topic slightly (no one's created a thread yet?) anyone heard the 'Christmas Present' tracks yet?

haven't had a chance to listen fully (there on my work computer), and was wondering are there any differences in the tracks that we havent got already?

It's a mixtape of unreleased 1999 tracks. Nothing special.

novabrkr said:

leadline said:

He sings these guide songs as if he were the artist he is giving them to, taking into account their vocal strengths and weaknesses. That is why he sounds different on a lot of these.

[Edited 12/18/17 5:57am]

Is there any info that suggests he wrote the song for Patti LaBelle or anyone else to perform? Quite often he simply gave away the songs to others later when he didn't feel that they were suitable for an inclusion on his own albums.

I never connected Yo Mister as being the precursor to Anna Stesia, but i cant hear Yo Mister without wanting to sing Anna Stesia.

olb99 said:

MrMoops said:

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

.

Thanks for the information, Mike! I'm glad to read that I'm not crazy. I hope that we'll someday get to hear those sessions as they were meant to be heard. I understand your frustration.

Near the end of this vid:https://www.youtube.com/w...ELRUiSB_BE

u hear how "Timp, Harp and Bells" were also going to be added to the track. I dont hear any of those on any of the versions on the eye release. Hugely disrespectful on the part of eye records and whoever supplied them to put these out...especially after claiming they are all about "preserving Princes legacy". Punks

[Edited 12/25/17 19:09pm]

I've been taking my time through these but I absolutely adore "A Million Miles." I play it constantly. My new favorite so far.

So, I took a break from my obsession with "If the kid can't make you come" to cleanse my palet. I've been listening to DJ Quik, UGK, some New Jack Swing (Ralph "She's my love Thang" and Guy "Do me right"). And then I came back to this so song after a week. And I'm going on record saying that this song is the best instrumental he's ever recorded. I've been in awe since the first time I heard this full version and still are. And I've been listening about 30-50 times total.

KingSausage said:

Dammit. I keep missing all the news about fresh leaks because I take breaks from the Org. Too much negativity around here, you know? But then I pop back in and see I missed a big development. It sounds like Closer to God is the way to go, rather than BFTP 6.0. Is that right? Also, why does Eye keep putting “.0” after all the numbers? 2.0, 3.0, etc. What, are they going to update this shit at some point? Release a patch to take away some of the noise reduction?!

Naw it's just to sound hype. But ".0" is so 2000's. Now they should go with "Phase" like the MCU. Hell, even Prince did it

databank said:

Found a new obsession! "Yo Mister."

There's a teaser out for 7.0...

sulls said:

There's a teaser out for 7.0...

Unfortunately it's fake

Mindbells9 said:

Mindbells9 said:

sulls said:

There's a teaser out for 7.0...

Unfortunately it's fake

REALLY???