It is a known fact that MJ was a JW and he allegedly would go knocking on doors to spread the word (in makeup of course). Yet Prince has a hard time NOT celebrating his birthday. What are the chances that Prince will go knocking on some Canadian doors on a sunday morning as a good JW is suppose to do,to spread the word?
What would you do if Prince showed up at your door with the Watchtower in hand?

enjoyniki said:

he wouldn't get past the security door 2 my apartment buildin. he'd have 2 speak his piece thru the speaker-thing on the doorbell.

Prince is a very serous JW right now.
What makes you think he celebrates his birthday?
...from what I hear he did not do that prior to becoming associated with JWs...
And yes, believe it not, he is a very enthusiatic evangelist.
Since I don't live near his congregation, it is not likely he will be knocking
on my door.
Melody

We tried to tackle this issue, albeit from a different angle here:

Understanding Prince's co...cal model?

enjoyniki said:

I would attempt to show him the faulty premises upon which this entire religious movement is based. Mainly focusing on where Charles T. Russel got his presumptuous chronology and date setting. How what was predicted for certain dates did not come to pass and subsequently how, after the dates, what was predicted was altered. From Russel to Rutheford to Knorr. Let the old Watchtower literature speak for itself. Since the Society claims to be the only true prophet of God, then out of it's own mouth show the fruit of it's doings.
How, the whole doctrinal superstructure hangs on lies concerning the dates 607 B.C. and 1914.
Then I would plunge into my prince.org "diatribe" about the Deity of Jesus Christ and the wacko "translation" known as The New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures.
After we got done "arguing for artistic control, so to speak" I would agree to take a Watchtower in exchange for him taking a copy of Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz(former member of the Governing Body of JW's). If he promised to read the book, I'd promise to read his scagazine.
If he truly read the book he would tightly clench up his buttcheeks and feel a major electrical shock.
Oh, then I'd ask him if he was gonna put another album out and tell him I greatly enjoy his music and will buy it when released but I'm not interested in becoming a Jehovah's Witness. I'm a happy freaky holy rock'n'rollin' Jesus Witness.

Is that Larry hidin' out there behind that bush in the yard?
I see some big ol' white shoes stickin' out.

Goodbye. Close door.

Door bell rings. Open the door.
Two disciples of Brigham Young and Joseph Smith.

Said in a Morris Day manner...
[i]Oh Lawd, here we go again![/]

Father, why isn't it ever the Avon Lady or Fuller Brush man anymore?
Take this cup away from me, nevertheless, Love, thy will be done.

NuPwrSoul said:

I read it. It was very nice... Very thorough.
But of course, U knew that would not end it, didn't you?

Let's hope not too serious. Poor Prince led to believe he must do everything this religion says to be saved, when he is already saved.

U can't an ARTIST and a JW at the same time. And If u really wanna, u have to have xceptions, which shouldn't b allowed by the elders.

So i think Prince wouldn't and COULDN'T b a totaly serious JW, cause it's just against his princips.!

I think PRINCE THINKS that having CONCERTS is the equivilant of going door 2 door ... thats just what I think

lastdecember7 said:

But the truth is - he ain't no real JW, and he could never b!

mistermcgee said
I would attempt to show him the faulty premises upon which this entire religious movement is based. Mainly focusing on where Charles T. Russel got his presumptuous chronology and date setting. How what was predicted for certain dates did not come to pass and subsequently how, after the dates, what was predicted was altered. From Russel to Rutheford to Knorr. Let the old Watchtower literature speak for itself. Since the Society claims to be the only true prophet of God, then out of it's own mouth show the fruit of it's doings.
How, the whole doctrinal superstructure hangs on lies concerning the dates 607 B.C. and 1914.
Then I would plunge into my prince.org "diatribe" about the Deity of Jesus Christ and the wacko "translation" known as The New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures.
After we got done "arguing for artistic control, so to speak" I would agree to take a Watchtower in exchange for him taking a copy of Crisis of Conscience by Raymond Franz(former member of the Governing Body of JW's). If he promised to read the book, I'd promise to read his scagazine.

***

I'm sure Prince is familiar with these accusations. They are quite common among those who seek to criticise Jehovah's Witnesses.

I too, have heard them, but I discovered by experience that they were untrue. The vast majority of these rumours have been created by rival churches and religions whose leaders dislike Jehovah's Witnesses. While most religions are struggling to retain membership, Jehovah's Witnesses have grown year after year. 5,000 new ones are baptised each week. There are now well over six and a half million baptised Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide. There are also another 9 million unbaptised one's who regularly associate with them. I very much doubt that the 'information' you claim to have would affect the strength and certainty of their faith.

In addition, I wouldn't put much trust in a book that was written by a disgruntled, disfellowshipped person. If a director was fired from McDonalds would it be wise to believe his entire story? Any sensible and intelligent reader would realise his bias and the motivation behind his writing such a publication. There have been critical books about various religions since the advent of the printed page.

'The entire religious movement' of Jehovah's Witnesses is bible-based Christianity. But whether you personally agree or disagree, I cannot understand why can't just respect each others beliefs and discuss matters amicably.

I find it slightly ironic, that the very people on this site who criticise Jehovah's Witnesses agressively as being unchristian, write in a most unchristian manner themselves.

Live and let live. If you are happy with your faith, then I am happy for you. I trust that you have made the right decision for yourself. I certainly do not feel the need to provide you with a book that criticises your particular religion, nor do I feel the the need to respond to you with a christian, doctrinal viewpoint or interpretation that differs from your own.

Peace.
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 3:40:41 PDT 2003 by Mr7]

I think Prince likes to study all religions, and study their "similarities, not their differences". However he can only focus on one at a time, and for now, that is JW.

Remember the Lords Prayer in Controversy?...and all the alchemy references during the / Gold days?...and a bit of his own medicine during the Lovesexy era? Give it a few years, and he'll be onto something new.
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 3:40:53 PDT 2003 by toejam]

Mistermcgee said:

Door bell rings. Open the door.
Two disciples of Brigham Young and Joseph Smith.


haha mister mcgee. That was me!!! i was a mormon missionary about three years ago. i was in London England though.

Yup. but there is one thing though. we generally know when to call it a day. those JW's though, they got their foot in the door so you cant close it and stuff. Oh man. When they come knocking on the door just tell them your a mormon and they wont bother you. They think you will be too challenging for them. they will never talk to me. its sad really cuz i'd luv to have a chat.

Mr7 said - "I find it slightly ironic, that the very people on this site who criticise Jehovah's Witnesses agressively as being unchristian, write in a most unchristian manner themselves."

That's because you assume that these people have a faith of their own.

You also say "I too, have heard them, but I discovered by experience that they were untrue. The vast majority of these rumours have been created by rival churches and religions whose leaders dislike Jehovah's Witnesses." - that is only true to an extent. A lot of the criticisms aimed at the JW faith are also based on fact. And, there is nothing that mrmcgee said that is not true. Charles T Russel DID translate the bible with his own interpretation, predicitions for events HAVE been made and have not come to pass, the Witnesses DO claim to be a prophet (though, ironically, not inspired). NONE of these things can be denied, yet you attempt to dis-credit these issues as mere "rumour"!!!

"But whether you personally agree or disagree, I cannot understand why can't just respect each others beliefs and discuss matters amicably." - nothing in mrmcgees post was unfriendly or aggressive., he just gave his opinion.

This is the best bit though - "Live and let live. If you are happy with your faith, then I am happy for you. I trust that you have made the right decision for yourself. I certainly do not feel the need to provide you with a book that criticises your particular religion, nor do I feel the the need to respond to you with a christian, doctrinal viewpoint or interpretation that differs from your own." - REALLY?? THEN WHY DO YOU GO KNOCKING ON PEOPLE's DOORS??!!
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 5:40:01 PDT 2003 by Mindflux]

How serious of a JW is Prince?

The truth is only Prince knows himself. There is NO point speculating if, when, what, where.
The only time you will hear the truth if Mr Nelson tells you.

If you look at the information we have been told by Mr Nelson himself: (what I can remember):

1:The beautiful strange interview with one off the spice girls he stated he does not celebrate birthdays.

2:Come on music video:
Mr and Mrs Graham handing out the book knowledge that leads to everlasting life

3:A magazine pictorial:
Prince is holding the new world translations.

4:The celebrations:
JW teachings information.

5:The Rainbow Children.

As you can see he does associate with JW and teachings.

The truth is none will believe unless a camera follows him 24/7 and photos are published off him going door to door handing out the watchtower and the awake (I still have doubts people would believe it even if they did see with there own eyes.)

I just do not understand why people do not just be happy with what others beleive & beliefs.

We all just have to respect each others differences and move on.

We are all adults and not little children in a playground no need to gossip, speculate, intimidate, tell lies or spread rumours.

What i have written is not meant to disrespect anyone, this is only my point of view.

& 2 U All



Wise words:
Ah, Mr Push, allow me to introduce you to Ms/Mrs Shove.
I am sure you will get along just fine.
In fact, let me take you both to a special place i know. It is a gloriously isolated spot, just in between a rock and a hard place.
If you sit there long enough you may spot the irresistible force as it meets the immovable object.
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 6:32:13 PDT 2003 by katt]

mistermcgee said:

amen

enjoyniki said:

Have you guys thought of just asking Boris about this, He seems to know everything Prince. Maybe he has some knowledge about this subject.

Mr 7, I haven't read of this book, so I can't speak of it, but I dare you to read 'Awakening of A Jehovah's Whitness' by Diane Wilson, She was a baptised Whitness, she says for 25 miserable years and everything she writes in her book she has in her book which Watchtower she got her information. and she left on her own.

Forgive my ignorance but, I don't understand WHY it is SO important to everyone whether or not Prince is a serious JW. Would it kill you to find out that he was? Better yet, would it determine whether or not you still liked him as an Artist and bought his nusic? C'mon people. Let's be real here. It shouldn't matter to anyone what someone else's beliefs are. What we should be focused on is the fact that he's most likely found what he was looking for in his personal search for religion. Why can't we just be happy for him? Let's take a look at this from a different a perspective. Let's say your best friend decided to start attending a different church/congregation that you didn't know anything about. What would you do? Stop being thier friend? Or start speculating on their beliefs and whether they were serious about it? This is no different from Prince. I mean, after all, we are his friends and family. Right? That would be like my family doggin' me for visiting a Muslim Temple with my Muslim friend or because I decided to study Wicca (for those who don't know, it is one of the oldest religions out there and some people think is a form of witchcraft) or that I've studied Paganism. It still does not change the fact that I am a Christian and believe in GOD. I know alot about different religions but it doesn't mean anything. Why should it be any different with Prince. Whether he's serious about JW or not.

Preistess said:

simple: cuz folks are bored.

See I don't have a problem with who or what P beleives in. If it gives him peace with himself, then so be it. Problem is don't push your veiws on me. I'm not religious and I buy your music and go to your shows for the music. I don't go to ge preched at. As much as I loved The Rainbow CHildren I had to tune out some of the things that were said. But hey P has alwasy done that right, but now it's more in your face. I liked it when his beleifs were suttle.


On the real, I just want P to be down and dirty, oozing with funk.

But nothings wrong with clean and beautiful flowing with jazz.

I just perfer the rawness!

Lark§anDers

Priestess said "C'mon people. Let's be real here. It shouldn't matter to anyone what someone else's beliefs are."

I think you'll find, at least in the REAL world, that people's beliefs are important and it is bizarre that you suggest otherwise. Why is it important? Because, far more often than not, what one person believes in affects another. White supremacists (just as one example), who believe that any other race is a by-product or even a problem to be eradicated, inflict pain, suffering and fear on many people. Is it wise to ignore their beliefs? Should that matter to anyone?

By the same token, some are concerned about the JW faith and, if people think that this is harmful or could have a negative impact on someone (be that Prince or others he associates with, or even us, the fans!) then they are going to say so.

The fact is, people's beliefs and ideals DO matter - it is what makes us what we are and defines what happens in our society.
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 8:49:23 PDT 2003 by Mindflux]

SensualMelody said:

if you don't live near him, how the hell do you know whether he's a serious JW or not?

Its what she's heard - can't question that!

Mindflux said:

***

None of the things I mentioned above are done by Jehovah's Witnesses when they go door-to-door. Jehovah's Witnesses engage in the ministry because we believe that the Bible commands this. All you have to do is say you are not interested. You can even request that Jehovah's Witnesses never knock at your residence again.

lovebird said:

***

I dare you to listen to Jehovah's Witnesses with an open mind. I understand that your family and yourself have had some personal upset that you feel is connected to Jehovah's Witnesses. However, it is hardly appropriate to apply this experience to the entire faith. It is a massive generalisation.

There have been books critical of various religions since the advent of the printed page. There are numerous books that are critical of Catholicism, Protestantism, mormonism etc.

I'm glad to hear that Diane Wilson 'left on her own'. That was her choice. But if Jehovah's Witnesses were such a 'Cult' she wouldn't have the choice to leave and write a book about it !
[This message was edited Mon Apr 14 10:00:39 PDT 2003 by Mr7]

Mr7 said:

Mr7, what about those of us who have listened to not only JWs but other faiths as well with an open mind? I have said time and time again that I studied. I was at a place in my life where I was looking for answers. My mind was an open book and when you have people tell you that they are God's chosen people and the one true religion, what am I supposed to think? What am I supposed to think when I post questions here, without an ounce of malice in my heart, to Witnesses and I don't get an answer? Who's being closed minded then?

Hehe - really? Or are you just generalising (as you accuse anyone who has had a bad experience within the JW organisation of doing?)?

Yeah, you can request that they never knock again but, in reality, they always do! Let me cite you an example, that occured in just the last week.

The weekend before last, 2 JWs knocked at our door on Saturday morning. They were immediately informed that this is the place of residence of a dis-fellowshipped person and that we would appreciate them making this house a "Do Not Call". They went away...

Only to return mid-week with a reminder that the Memorial was taking place on April 16th. We asked if they recalled the conversation we had just a few days ago and were again requested that we be noted as a "Do Not Call".

What happens the Saturday just gone?? Our door goes at 10am and there is one man at the door. He begins to explain that he is an Elder from the local congregation. He acknowledges that he is aware that a member of the household is dis-fellowshipped and wondered if there was anything we wanted to talk about!! I again made our position clear, very precisely and somewhat more forthright than before. He said that he would put us down as a DNC, but then...he says, "However, it is our policy to call on people who have been dis-fellowed once every 12 months...would you object to this?" - ???!!! How many times do we have to say the same thing? And it is the same in every area where we have lived. Of course, I made certain he was aware that there will be the strongest objections should they continue to harass my family.

Now, I'm not generalising here, this type of thing has happened more than once and I know of many people who have had the same happen to them.

It is also extremely interesting (and mildly irritating) that your response to my post avoids all of the salient points I have made - but that is simply because you cannot dispute them.

And, at least now when you try and accuse me of not knowing what I am talking about (following on from your post in another thread that you were "qualified" to answer Lav's question, whereas I would only respond with "nonsense") you may perhaps remember that I have experience and know exactly what I'm talking about.

Mindflux said:

Quote: "Some are concerned about the JW faith..."

Yes they are concerned with it and I agree with you on that point because there are some who just don't understand it. But, my question still remains, would it really determine whether or not you would still like Prince as an Artist and buy his music if he were truly serious about being JW? That's the point I'm trying to get people to think about. I was not reffering to peoples' overall beliefs and ideals. I was reffering to religious beliefs. All I'm saying is that if we were true fams, it shouldn't matter to us what religion he choses to believe in. That's what I meant by "It shouldn't matter to anyone what someone else's beliefs are."

Mindflux said:

At least they're persistant. They're not lazy, you can't fault their committment!