Many of you probably already know that both men are from Minnesota but there is (at least) one other connection between them... Does anyone know what it is?

I think I remember years ago reading the Traveling Wilburys song "Dirty World" (mainly written by Dylan I believe) was about Prince. If you listen to the lyrics it could make sense. Anyone else remember this?

yukoncornelius said:

I think I remember years ago reading the Traveling Wilburys song "Dirty World" (mainly written by Dylan I believe) was about Prince. If you listen to the lyrics it could make sense. Anyone else remember this?

I didn't know that lol

It was another fact I had in mind though

Prince/Bob Dylan/Religion (pt II)

part 1,2003

Prince/Bob Dylan/Religion

Even though Prince has always had a religious background-overtone in his lyrics and career, it was always seen as open ended or universal ala Lovesexy. Not a single doctrine. When he supposedly did begin to show a more organized religion side to his music with TRC it created a hailstorm from his fans. Sides were taken, controversy ensued and things would never be the same in purple fandom. Things have still been split down the middle and the after taste of his religious stance still effects how some fans regard his most recent amount of material. I once said the fans views may now be tainted for a myriad of reasons but now the TRC religion has pushed it to its highest levels I feel. This is why TRC has been his most controversial record ever. It was not Darling Nikki and it was not Head…and even though the brilliant Controversy had controversy as it’s title, that was not it either.

It seems that a similar thing had happened with another artist from MN that had a loyal following and lead the way in musical outrage and style. Bob Dylan. A folk hero to electric rock star...when he performed in an electric style ( plugged in if u will) for the first time in concert with “almost” no warning at the Newport Folk Festival, the crowds booed and almost ate him alive. They booed because they didn’t like seeing Bob plugged in. But Bob kept on keepin’ on. However he did return with one last song played on acoustic ( for many reasons none so obvious—it was not giving in, it was slamming it down the throats of the old guard fans who would not let an artist be…well, an artist). He had his plugged in vision and said nothing was going to keep him from doing it and he continued to play. Some say it was "rock ‘n’ roll’s greatest transformation". Just as Princes new direction continues to be at the forefront of his new style. He was daring enough

(or prolific enough may be an excuse for safety) to release his new direction TRC, NEWS, etc. suspect when Prince had a Dirty Mind, separate from his disco r’n’b hits of before, there were some who left.

And just as Dylan has been seen as a spokesman for his troubled generation in the 60’s Prince could be seen as a spokesman for ribald liberation , lewdness, lasciviousness etc in the early eighties. And both would probably deny ( and have) the label put upon them. Dylan said “I don’t write protest songs” and his buddy Joan Baez said “Bobby was never a marcher, I don’t think I ever saw him on a march”. Prince has went on record stating that his songs were less about sex per se’, and more about love. Both Dylan and Prince may have been boolshetten because they did do those things..maybe they were just on the inside that they did not realize that they did write in those terms they were labeled as, as well...many times.

Then Dylan had a spiritual or religious conversion much later in his career. Sound familiar? Uncut writes “Here was the man once hailed as rock’s premier revolutionary force and it’s most valiant voice of freedom, remade as a Conservative religious reactionary”…sound familiar..? Sounds as if Princes supposed or possible conversion to a specific faith could be juxtaposed with Dylan’s situation. The same attitude that happened with his acoustic to plugged in style was happening with his new religious stance. Seems like Dylan had his own “dark night of the soul”. Again in Uncut it is stated “Even the story of his conversion sounded like something out of a sci-fi tale. As Dylan later described it, he was alone in a hotel room in Tucson after a show. Suffering from an unspecified illness he found himself fingering a small crucifix that had been thrown onstage a few nights previously. Then he felt it-nothing less than the power of Jesus, Lord of Lords, King of Kings. Jesus put his hand on me, it was a physical thing. I felt it all over me, my whole body trembled. Th e glory of the lord knocked me down and picked me up”. Biblical imagery has also always been a part of Dylans career.

Prince’s dark night of the soul: in Per Nilsens’ DMSR The First Decade

Although Prince never fully explained to Warner Bros why he wanted to pull the album, a number of factors behind the decision later came to light. A week prior to the planned release date, Prince had taken the Black Album to MN club Ruperts to gauge the audience reaction to the record. At th e club, he met singer-songwriter-poet named Ingrid Chavez. According to her, they started talking and drove out to Paisley Park together. Suddenly Prince left, saying he had a stomache-ache. She later learned that Prince had been nervous and was going through a conscience crisis that made him realise that it would be wrong to release the Black Album. Prince has spoken of a crucial ‘dark night of the soul, when a lot of things happened all in a few hours’ and described a vision of a vast field with the letters G-O-D hovering overhead. ( He would refer to that night, Tuesday December 1st, as Blue Tuesday’ in the Lovesexy tour program. Prince became very concerned about what he perceived to be his responsibility to his fans and younger kids). He went on to do Lovesexy.

Somewhat similar to Dylans tale.

Many things were said to have lead Dylan to that point and time of religion..the death of Elvis (Miles Davis?), a divorce, critical disaster of a personal movie he was in etc…but he came out with Slow Train Coming with songs Goota Serve Somebody, When You Gonna Wake Up, Precious Angel that discussed the “horrors facing so called friends who had not heard the call of Jesus”., “I Believe In You” etc. But the music was as powerful as any of his previous heyday as is TRC. Later he would release the really overt SAVED.

Live Dylans audience were “treated/subjected to between song sermons where Dylan preached to the unconverted and in Tempe AZ poured wrath onto student hecklers saying: ‘You may have your college education to hang on to now, but you’re going to need something very solid when these end times come”…TRC shows were said to include some stern warnings during Anna-stesia...and there were some heckles in some of the shows when the subject of religion came up.

Picketing by aetheist groups put Dylan in a mood to give some of the most “dramatic and committed performances” of his live career. Similar to Prince and the TRC ONA tour…Prince s’ tour was a critical and fan viewed success.

Dylan began mixing pre-gospel classics with new material...seems like Prince may be following suit. It seems hard to serve a saviour and a muse at the same time at least for Dylan…he changed his stance and output after 3 religion based releases…Prince seems to have done it all with TRC and the subsequent ONA tour.

A famed jazz musician who’s name escapes me now had problems touring in Europe due to his Scientology religion. Right or wrong. Prince does not seem to have any problems with is stance on religion and tour promoters, in the staes or abroad.

Bob Geldof is quoted as saying “I didn’t give a F*** about Electric Bob or Folk Bob, and I didn’t know anyone who did. It was the words, the voice, the shirt.”

I don’t care about dirty mind Prince, or religious Prince. It’s the voice, the shirt, and the music for me (and obviously for others as well).

Indeed.

2012 pt 2

The new part for 20 2 is Dylans dismissal of whatever relevancy he and his music represented in that Rolling Stone interview a few months ago. Not only this but the way he tossed off the interviewer and was blase' about the importance of his music. Now I understand that Dylan takes the piss after all these years at being considered the emporer of the substantial in music. After so long it seems like he has to stir up something by falsehoods and changes in attitudes during interviews just out of boredom of them after several decades. I take this as a stance as how Prince played and continues to toy with interviews. I just hope he uses Dylan as a reference point in content material of the next release. Im not really interested in his new daliances unless they are discussing the relevancy of the love...and not the love below (hi 3 stacks). RnRLA is not exactly Lay Lady Lay but...

Connection between them?

Thanks rdhull and dance4me3121! But there is still something else...

I have gone to great lengths to understand the genius of Dylan. It hasnt worked. His vocals never worked for me. Highway 61 is the only album that i really dug. Ive tried and will try again. he is probably the only legendary musician that I cannot seem to dig.

DarkKnight1 said:

I have gone to great lengths to understand the genius of Dylan. It hasnt worked. His vocals never worked for me. Highway 61 is the only album that i really dug. Ive tried and will try again. he is probably the only legendary musician that I cannot seem to dig.

most of his stuff is lost on me too, but then, i have a short attention span, a couple of his tunes are fan fucking tastic though, hurricane, watchtower but mostly i just wonder what the fuss was about.

fourletterwords said:

There are a number of connections/analogous artistic traits 1) highly publicized and controversial dogmatic religious phase (Dylan full Christian conversion in late 70s, P w/ JW in early '00s) 2) love/hate cat/mouse relationship with media 3) Charlie Chaplinesque stage presence (see 1960s Dylan) 4) somewhat "compact" physical presence. 5) both play(ed) Piano extremely well, while are more known by general public as guitar players (somewhat unknown is Dylan's excellent skills on piano) 6) a number of different female muses (Dylan had his first NY girlfriend that got him into leftist protest politics, John Baez, his wife Sarah (mid 60s to mid 70s) 7) drastic shifts in style between albums often times matching new personae 8) mercurial temperament/intensely private 9) both motorcycle enthusiasts 10) both influenced by Little Richard 11) both had close relationships with/ worked with mavis Staples 12) both shied away from rock "community" events (Dylan w/ Woodstock, p with we are the world) 13) Both are considered to have peaked in the earlier stages of their careers 14) substantial unreleased material 15) scrapped versions of albums near release 16) material obsesssively dissected and interpreted by fans

only thing i can think of is how they both were shrewd in their climbs to the top, Joan Baez was dogging him out for how easily he dropped her in a docu. Sounded like a shrewd, clever guy, even today though, he's a mystery, he said a couple years ago how america was doomed because of slavery, he got away with it too because he's Dylan. You'd think an asshole like that wouldn't be that critical of america because he's an american asshole, but he is.

fourletterwords said:

There are a number of connections/analogous artistic traits 1) highly publicized and controversial dogmatic religious phase (Dylan full Christian conversion in late 70s, P w/ JW in early '00s) 2) love/hate cat/mouse relationship with media 3) Charlie Chaplinesque stage presence (see 1960s Dylan) 4) somewhat "compact" physical presence. 5) both play(ed) Piano extremely well, while are more known by general public as guitar players (somewhat unknown is Dylan's excellent skills on piano) 6) a number of different female muses (Dylan had his first NY girlfriend that got him into leftist protest politics, John Baez, his wife Sarah (mid 60s to mid 70s) 7) drastic shifts in style between albums often times matching new personae 8) mercurial temperament/intensely private 9) both motorcycle enthusiasts 10) both influenced by Little Richard 11) both had close relationships with/ worked with mavis Staples 12) both shied away from rock "community" events (Dylan w/ Woodstock, p with we are the world) 13) Both are considered to have peaked in the earlier stages of their careers 14) substantial unreleased material 15) scrapped versions of albums near release 16) material obsesssively dissected and interpreted by fans

Is that good then?

DarkKnight1 said:

I have gone to great lengths to understand the genius of Dylan. It hasnt worked. His vocals never worked for me. Highway 61 is the only album that i really dug. Ive tried and will try again. he is probably the only legendary musician that I cannot seem to dig.

I recommend "Greatest Hits Vol. 2" - classic songs from 60s and early 70s - all with vocals a bit more approachable. He almost sounds like Tom Petty. Another great way in is the Martin Scorsese film "No Direction Home", which is has a lot of warmth and kick to it.

.

Also, three cheers for not getting things. There's no problem in having a long list of brilliant artists who don't speak to you. Mine includes Jimi, Joni, the dead, bjork, the beastie boys...

PeteSilas said:

DarkKnight1 said:

I have gone to great lengths to understand the genius of Dylan. It hasnt worked. His vocals never worked for me. Highway 61 is the only album that i really dug. Ive tried and will try again. he is probably the only legendary musician that I cannot seem to dig.

most of his stuff is lost on me too, but then, i have a short attention span, a couple of his tunes are fan fucking tastic though, hurricane, watchtower but mostly i just wonder what the fuss was about.

Hurricane is indeed awesome and one of my Dylan favs, hardly a short attention span required for that one, lenghty tune with tons of lyrics. Blood on The Tracks is album full of emotion and great beautiful tunes, much prefer the musicality of this to his 60s stuff.

Thought I read Dylan and Prince once met, but little was spoken between them, just a sense of mutual awe

Mavis Staples

well, what i mean is that if an artist doesnt catch me quick within a few tunes, i usually never have gotten into them. I know it's not right which is the reason i have a shitload of dylan stuff on this laptop but i never get around to listening. Like I said though, a couple of his tunes have just knocked my socks off. He was pretty complimentary to Prince in an 80's RS interview, called him a boy wonder.

runningbear said:

PeteSilas said:

most of his stuff is lost on me too, but then, i have a short attention span, a couple of his tunes are fan fucking tastic though, hurricane, watchtower but mostly i just wonder what the fuss was about.

Hurricane is indeed awesome and one of my Dylan favs, hardly a short attention span required for that one, lenghty tune with tons of lyrics. Blood on The Tracks is album full of emotion and great beautiful tunes, much prefer the musicality of this to his 60s stuff.

Thought I read Dylan and Prince once met, but little was spoken between them, just a sense of mutual awe

Thanks for your replies everyone!

The connection I had in mind was, first that they both used Sound 80 studios in Minneapolis:

- Bob Dylan's 15th album, Blood on the Tracks, was released in 1975 by Columbia Records. Dylan started recording the album in New York in September 1974. Then in December, shortly before Columbia was due to release the record, Dylan abruptly re-recorded much of the material at Sound 80 Studios in Minneapolis. The final album contains five tracks from New York and five from Minneapolis (including one of my all-time favourite 'Tangled Up In Blue').


- Prince recorded the demo tapes for his first album For You at Sound 80 Studios in 1977. A mention appears in the 'Thanks' note on the album.

"Special thanks to God, Owen, Britt, Bernadette, My Father and Mother, Russ Thyret, Gary, David Rivkin / Sound 80 Studios, C. Moon, Eddie, Sharon and Eleanor, L. Phillips, Bobby "Z" Rivkin, Tom Coster, Graham Lear, Joe Giannetti, Patrice Rushen, Charles Veal, Jr., Shirley Walker, Knut Koupee Music, Chuck Orr, Lisa H., and You!"


After a little more research, it appears that Bobby Z (Rivkin) and his brother David Z Rivkin (who then worked at Sound 80 Studios) are associated with David Zimmerman (Bob Dylan's brother), also an engineer at Sound 80 Studios, who had convinced Bob Dylan to record those 5 tracks in Minneapolis.

"Dylan played the test pressing for his brother, David Zimmerman, who persuaded Dylan the album would not sell because the overall sound was too stark. Robert Christgau also heard the early version of the album and called it "a sellout to the memory of Dylan's pre-electric period".[16] At his brother's urging, Dylan agreed to re-record five of the album's songs in Sound 80 in Minneapolis, with backing musicians recruited by David. The new takes were accomplished in two days at the end of December 1974. Blood on the Tracks was released into stores on January 20, 1975.[17]" (Wikipedia)


AND THEN I FOUND THIS: http://www.magicmarcprodu...gg-inhofer

"Celebrating BOB DYLAN with Blood on the Tracks Live featuring Peter Ostroushko, Kevin Odegard* and Gregg Inhofer

BLOOD ON THE TRACKS LIVE was formed in 1974 when Bob Dylan re-recorded tracks for his seminal album "Blood on the Tracks" in Minneapolis using local musicians. This group has reunited for a handful of performances beginning with Dylan's 60th birthday celebration at First Avenue in 2000 and a sold-out performance at the Pantages Theater in 2004. In 2005, the studio band was inducted into the Mid-America Music Hall of Fame. Scheduled to appear are Peter Ostrousko, Gregg Inhofer, Stan Kipper, Chico Perez, Larry Suess, Scott Dercks, Kevin Bowe, Dan Israel, Matt "Dr" Fink from Prince and the Revolution, and special guests."

AND THIS:
http://www.magicmarcprodu...nd-credits

Billy Hallquist, Jeff Dayton, Kevin Odegard*, Bobby 'Z' Rivkin and Gary Lopac / Photo by Nancy Bundt © 1975


*Well known for his participation as a guitarist on Bob Dylan’s “Blood On The Tracks” 1974 Minnesota recording sessions. Kevin Odegard has released two albums; The self-titled Kevin Odegard on Wooff (1971) and Silver Lining on ASI Records (1975). Silver Lining is a well polished album compared to his debut album. Widely influenced by country, folk and pop music of the 1970’s, Silver Lining is a fine example resembling mid 1970’s singer-songwriter music. It is supported by the famous Bob Rivkin (Bobby 'Z') and David Rivkin with a production credit by David Zimmerman.

[Edited 8/8/17 8:36am]