http://podcastjuice.net/t...interview/

Great informative interview with Scottie Baldwin, Prince's former live sound engineer. At the 2 hour and eight minute mark , Scottie Baldwin really put some people in check about former associates in the tabloids calling Prince "the loneliest person I knew" (Chris Moon). I would have liked to know more about what Scottie meant by things going "sideways" during the Australia leg of the Piano And Microphone Tour.

[Edited 6/4/17 9:05am]

This sounds interesting; I'll have to listen later when I have more time. Thanks for posting.

pretty good. the people P seemed to work with generally seem to be some very competent folks, as a musician, that ain't easy for most of us to find.

rogifan said:

Wow I wonder what happened during the Aussie P&M shows that Scottie left.

He said it was not any one thing and that he just did not want to be around and that he had done this a few times before and that he and Prince would patch things up and work together again.

He said he was sure they would be working together later on so I do not get the impression anyone specific thing was bugging him. I know he said on the Dr. Funkenberry podcast that he the past Prince could be really hard on him about the sound and they would get into it.

Thank you for posting this. Its fascinating to hear his stories!

rogifan said:

Wow I wonder what happened during the Aussie P&M shows that Scottie left.

ya, i wondered too, it sounds like whatever health issues P might have been having were a possible culprit too. it's impossible to say, he really was vague about it. Also, it's very unusual for people to go back and forth with Prince, most people are done when they are done. Whether they feel disrespected, worked too hard, not paid enough, they don't go back. In later years, that seems to have not been quite an issue.

I couldn't disagree with him more on his point toward the end of the podcast about that sound quality (bitrate/high end low end) doesn't matter. Just because he is nostalgic for hearing certain music as a child in lower quality or no low end doesn't mean that and album like Sign of the Times either recorded or re-enginnered to today's standards wouldn't sound a million times better. There are a lot of era's of music that I can't listen to anymore not because the music is bad it's just the sound and engineering of the time isn't good.

PeteSilas said:

rogifan said:

Wow I wonder what happened during the Aussie P&M shows that Scottie left.

ya, i wondered too, it sounds like whatever health issues P might have been having were a possible culprit too. it's impossible to say, he really was vague about it. Also, it's very unusual for people to go back and forth with Prince, most people are done when they are done. Whether they feel disrespected, worked too hard, not paid enough, they don't go back. In later years, that seems to have not been quite an issue.

Scott said on the Funkenberry podcast that he had been going back and forth for years and they did have rows all the time. If he thought he was coming back at a later time it could not have thought it was anything that serious.

laurarichardson said:

PeteSilas said:

ya, i wondered too, it sounds like whatever health issues P might have been having were a possible culprit too. it's impossible to say, he really was vague about it. Also, it's very unusual for people to go back and forth with Prince, most people are done when they are done. Whether they feel disrespected, worked too hard, not paid enough, they don't go back. In later years, that seems to have not been quite an issue.

Scott said on the Funkenberry podcast that he had been going back and forth for years and they did have rows all the time. If he thought he was coming back at a later time it could not have thought it was anything that serious.

sure, just unusual for prince, very unusual. only in the last 15 years had i seen people come and go. usually, once they were done, they were done. Wendy performed one or two times after 86 and that's unusual too. It's understandable somewhat, prince didn't have to fuck around with anyone, he could have any position filled at any time, no need to hash out issues.

chaocracy said:

I couldn't disagree with him more on his point toward the end of the podcast about that sound quality (bitrate/high end low end) doesn't matter. Just because he is nostalgic for hearing certain music as a child in lower quality or no low end doesn't mean that and album like Sign of the Times either recorded or re-enginnered to today's standards wouldn't sound a million times better. There are a lot of era's of music that I can't listen to anymore not because the music is bad it's just the sound and engineering of the time isn't good.

that was a high point for me, i could relate as a musician and aspiring filmaker. I really don't think it's the quality within reason, I'd take any of the early rock over the crap we have today even though the technology was primitive. I've known so many musicians who get hung up on gear when it's not really about that, it's about soul, of course the gear has to be functional but after a certain point what moves people is soul not all the bullshit that people get sold about quality so that they can go buy the latest gizmo. It's why I don't really think it's a big deal to get remastered stuff. That said, i must say, i loved how the mp3's i bought from the parade era really had the bass standing out more than i remembered from the vinyl.

Interview made me sad. It sounds like Scottie and Prince respected each other and mostly got along with a few disagreements here and there (he said 3 relatively big ones). He wasn't a doormat for Prince (which is good). He did call Prince a gentleman and did seem to have several good memories but he also was another person stating that he didn't know how many true friends Prince had. I am sad to hear that he hestitated to answer Prince when he asked him if they were friends. What does that mean exactly? Does it mean he didn't like Prince? Does it mean he never truely understood Prince beyond being able to determine some of his tell-signs.? (he knew him but never entirely understood him.) (He said Prince just thought differently and his black was most people's white...or something to that effect). Did it mean that Prince never let him stay on long enough for a true friendship to develop? Does it mean Prince's fame made it difficult for people to entirely be themselves around him? Does it mean that their relationship had too many conditions (professional and other wise) for it to be categorized as a friendship? Kind of like how I like my boss most of the time but we don't hang out for coffee...

Sad that Prince's abandonment issues and obsession with music disconnected him from the very people he sought to connect to with his music. Scottie seemed to think that Prince didn't mind his aloneness. But if we judge him by his music (the June song in particular), is it possible that he was still lonely but had resigned himself to being alone and depended on it.

Also, additional question. Do men and women define friendship differently? BEcause most of the women Prince hung with called him a friend without hestitation? Even recently, Selma Hayek defended Prince by calling him funny and one of her closest friends. Most women he knew don't hestitate to call him a friend. Most male associates are extremely relunctant to do so even when they respect him and seem to have fond memories (Bobby Z is one of the few men who called him a close friend and I am not sure how honest he is being.). The men even seem to ignore his female relationships (when making statements about his lack of friendships) or maybe they are just assuming they are romantic interests more so than friends.

[Edited 6/5/17 17:11pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:14pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:16pm]

not sad at all, i have no friends and i like it. I've had friends before and they are a pain in the ass.

purplerabbithole said:

Interview made me sad. It sounds like Scottie and Prince respected each other and mostly got along with a few disagreements here and there (he said 3 relatively big ones). He wasn't a doormat for Prince (which is good). He did call Prince a gentleman and did seem to have several good memories but he also was another person stating that he didn't know how many true friends Prince had. I am sad to hear that he hestitated to answer Prince when he asked him if they were friends. What does that mean exactly? Does it mean he didn't like Prince? Does it mean he never truely understood Prince beyond being able to determine some of his tell-signs.? (he knew him but never entirely understood him.) (He said Prince just thought differently and his black was most people's white...or something to that effect). Did it mean that Prince never let him stay on long enough for a true friendship to develop? Does it mean Prince's fame made it difficult for people to entirely be themselves around him? Does it mean that their relationship had too many conditions (professional and other wise) for it to be categorized as a friendship? Kind of like how I like my boss most of the time but we don't hang out for coffee...

Sad that Prince's abandonment issues and obsession with music disconnected him from the very people he sought to connect to with his music. Scottie seemed to think that Prince didn't mind his aloneness. But if we judge him by his music (the June song in particular), is it possible that he was still lonely but had resigned himself to being alone and depended on it.

Also, additional question. Do men and women define friendship differently? BEcause most of the women Prince hung with called him a friend without hestitation? Even recently, Selma Hayek defended Prince by calling him funny and one of her closest friends. Most women he knew don't hestitate to call him a friend. Most male associates are extremely relunctant to do so even when they respect him and seem to have fond memories (Bobby Z is one of the few men who called him a close friend and I am not sure how honest he is being.). The men even seem to ignore his female relationships (when making statements about his lack of friendships) or maybe they are just assuming they are romantic interests more so than friends.

[Edited 6/5/17 17:11pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:14pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:16pm]

Do you at least have family or love interests? Do you at least like people? You seem like a nice enough guy on here.

PeteSilas said:

not sad at all, i have no friends and i like it. I've had friends before and they are a pain in the ass.

purplerabbithole said:

Interview made me sad. It sounds like Scottie and Prince respected each other and mostly got along with a few disagreements here and there (he said 3 relatively big ones). He wasn't a doormat for Prince (which is good). He did call Prince a gentleman and did seem to have several good memories but he also was another person stating that he didn't know how many true friends Prince had. I am sad to hear that he hestitated to answer Prince when he asked him if they were friends. What does that mean exactly? Does it mean he didn't like Prince? Does it mean he never truely understood Prince beyond being able to determine some of his tell-signs.? (he knew him but never entirely understood him.) (He said Prince just thought differently and his black was most people's white...or something to that effect). Did it mean that Prince never let him stay on long enough for a true friendship to develop? Does it mean Prince's fame made it difficult for people to entirely be themselves around him? Does it mean that their relationship had too many conditions (professional and other wise) for it to be categorized as a friendship? Kind of like how I like my boss most of the time but we don't hang out for coffee...

Sad that Prince's abandonment issues and obsession with music disconnected him from the very people he sought to connect to with his music. Scottie seemed to think that Prince didn't mind his aloneness. But if we judge him by his music (the June song in particular), is it possible that he was still lonely but had resigned himself to being alone and depended on it.

Also, additional question. Do men and women define friendship differently? BEcause most of the women Prince hung with called him a friend without hestitation? Even recently, Selma Hayek defended Prince by calling him funny and one of her closest friends. Most women he knew don't hestitate to call him a friend. Most male associates are extremely relunctant to do so even when they respect him and seem to have fond memories (Bobby Z is one of the few men who called him a close friend and I am not sure how honest he is being.). The men even seem to ignore his female relationships (when making statements about his lack of friendships) or maybe they are just assuming they are romantic interests more so than friends.

[Edited 6/5/17 17:11pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:14pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:16pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:29pm]

purplerabbithole said:

Do you at least have family or love interests? Do you at least like people? You seem like a nice enough guy on here.

PeteSilas said:

not sad at all, i have no friends and i like it. I've had friends before and they are a pain in the ass.

[Edited 6/5/17 17:29pm]

not really, i love music, i love cats and I love being alone. I have great social skills when i need them I just really don't feel i need them. When i do, they are there. thanks for saying i'm a nice guy, probably too nice really, a real sucker.

anyway, scottie i right, he wasn't a friend of Prince's, he was a partner, employee. Friend is a misused term especially in this modern era when people have thousands of "friends" on social media. Prince sounded like he was asking "are you someone who means me well or not" rather than was he a friend, he obviously thought scottie was doing something wrong which was in his capability and know how to do right. Prince was probably just being Prince, he loved dressing people down, i'd have loved for him to do that to me, i'd probably laugh all the way through it.

Is it possible that Prince was one of those people who defined a friend as "someone who means me well", 'someone who works hard for me and is loyal professionally'. Maybe that is where the difference lies, how Prince's white was everyone else's black. He connected to people through music; therefore people who loved and wanted to protect his music, (to him) he might have thought of them as his friends. He was dressing down Scottie (sure) but his way of dressing down might indicate more about how he preceivied friendship than we realized.. I think Scottie should have answered.."I don't know. Do you consider me your friend?" I wonder if he ever considers that Prince saying his name publically and asking folks to show love was not required or even expected. MOst musicians wouldn't bother to give a shout out to a sound engineer. What would be the point beyond just being kind.

Maybe his female friends were able to see him as a friend because he went beyond just the professional into the little more intimate with them (sometimes a lot more intimate). Maybe women would have answered his dressing down by asking him if he felt of them as friends and he might have answered them. (Men might have just dropped the subject.) He was one compartmentalized man.

PeteSilas said:

anyway, scottie i right, he wasn't a friend of Prince's, he was a partner, employee. Friend is a misused term especially in this modern era when people have thousands of "friends" on social media. Prince sounded like he was asking "are you someone who means me well or not" rather than was he a friend, he obviously thought scottie was doing something wrong which was in his capability and know how to do right. Prince was probably just being Prince, he loved dressing people down, i'd have loved for him to do that to me, i'd probably laugh all the way through it.

[Edited 6/5/17 17:51pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 17:53pm]

purplerabbithole said:

Is it possible that Prince was one of those people who defined a friend as "someone who means me well", 'someone who works hard for me and is loyal professionally'. Maybe that is where the difference lies, how Prince's white was everyone else's black. He connected to people through music; therefore people who loved and wanted to protect his music, (to him) he might have thought of them as his friends. He was dressing down Scottie (sure) but his way of dressing down might indicate more about how he preceivied friendship than we realized.. I think Scottie should have answered.."I don't know. Do you consider me your friend?"

Maybe his female friends were able to see that because he went beyond just the professional into the little=more intimate with them (sometimes a lot more intimate). He was one compartmentalized man.

PeteSilas said:

anyway, scottie i right, he wasn't a friend of Prince's, he was a partner, employee. Friend is a misused term especially in this modern era when people have thousands of "friends" on social media. Prince sounded like he was asking "are you someone who means me well or not" rather than was he a friend, he obviously thought scottie was doing something wrong which was in his capability and know how to do right. Prince was probably just being Prince, he loved dressing people down, i'd have loved for him to do that to me, i'd probably laugh all the way through it.

ali once said he didn't consider Cosell his friend and said he'd use him and discard him for the next fighter. However, most people do look back and describe them as friends. everyone got different definitions. I tend to like Dubois' statement at the end of his life, it paraphrases how I feel; "the negro has nothing but friends and god save him from them for they are like to lynch his soul".

Prince may not have meant "friend" in the literal sense, he might have meant friend in the same way Max cady said "are you my friend" to the lawyer in cape fear, knowing that he wasn't a friend. Prince was saying it to make a point, "do what I want you to do".

in your analogy is Prince Cosell or Ali?

PeteSilas said:

purplerabbithole said:

Is it possible that Prince was one of those people who defined a friend as "someone who means me well", 'someone who works hard for me and is loyal professionally'. Maybe that is where the difference lies, how Prince's white was everyone else's black. He connected to people through music; therefore people who loved and wanted to protect his music, (to him) he might have thought of them as his friends. He was dressing down Scottie (sure) but his way of dressing down might indicate more about how he preceivied friendship than we realized.. I think Scottie should have answered.."I don't know. Do you consider me your friend?"

Maybe his female friends were able to see that because he went beyond just the professional into the little=more intimate with them (sometimes a lot more intimate). He was one compartmentalized man.

ali once said he didn't consider Cosell his friend and said he'd use him and discard him for the next fighter. However, most people do look back and describe them as friends. everyone got different definitions. I tend to like Dubois' statement at the end of his life, it paraphrases how I feel; "the negro has nothing but friends and god save him from them for they are like to lynch his soul".

Prince may not have meant "friend" in the literal sense, he might have meant friend in the same way Max cady said "are you my friend" to the lawyer in cape fear, knowing that he wasn't a friend. Prince was saying it to make a point, "do what I want you to do".

purplerabbithole said:

in your analogy is Prince Cosell or Ali?

PeteSilas said:

ali once said he didn't consider Cosell his friend and said he'd use him and discard him for the next fighter. However, most people do look back and describe them as friends. everyone got different definitions. I tend to like Dubois' statement at the end of his life, it paraphrases how I feel; "the negro has nothing but friends and god save him from them for they are like to lynch his soul".

Prince may not have meant "friend" in the literal sense, he might have meant friend in the same way Max cady said "are you my friend" to the lawyer in cape fear, knowing that he wasn't a friend. Prince was saying it to make a point, "do what I want you to do".

prince would be scottie who admits that prince wasn't a friend. I appreciate that kind of honesty. I hate when people say things like "I love you" or "you're family" to me. those are declarative statements like saying "i'm proud of being---(gay,black,asian whatever). they usually mean the opposite.

I am still confused? Is Prince Cosell or Ali? you said "Prince would be scottie"

PeteSilas said:

purplerabbithole said:

in your analogy is Prince Cosell or Ali?

prince would be scottie who admits that prince wasn't a friend. I appreciate that kind of honesty. I hate when people say things like "I love you" or "you're family" to me. those are declarative statements like saying "i'm proud of being---(gay,black,asian whatever). they usually mean the opposite.

purplerabbithole said:

I am still confused? Is Prince Cosell or Ali? you said "Prince would be scottie"

PeteSilas said:

prince would be scottie who admits that prince wasn't a friend. I appreciate that kind of honesty. I hate when people say things like "I love you" or "you're family" to me. those are declarative statements like saying "i'm proud of being---(gay,black,asian whatever). they usually mean the opposite.

sorry,meant ali would be scottie

Well, remember Scottie worked with numerous musicans himself. He wasn't exactly tied to Prince either. So it goes both ways. Scottie seemed to understand Prince's need to work with what artist fit what musical direction he was going. But it wasn't as if Scottie just waited around to get the call again from Prince. He moved around and worked with the best artists as well. And would he want to work for Prince if he wasn't Prince, if he was irrevelent or considered so past his prime that no one attended his concerts. Part of staying relevant is re-inventing one's sound, going in different directions etc.

I see your point that these relationships are conditional and dependent upon mutual need at the time. But Scottie, as good of a sound engineer as he was (and he must be great to work with the picky-ass Prince thousands of times) he is still replaceable but Prince still choose to work with him numerous times. Scottie obviously was capable of standing up for himself (I have to admit that smart ass note to Prince was pretty funny and might have even made him laugh) but obviously there was an dynamic beyond skill that worked between the two of them. I wonder if he under-estimates the value of the personal dynamic because of his inability to completely understand Prince's motivations and because it wasn't consistent work (even if it was stretched out over time.).

Let's look at the time spent with Prince. He said he had 1000's of hours working on sound during live performances. Now I am going to estimate his time directly working with P (rehearsing etc) to to be about 40,000 hours. I think that is pretty generous (a total guess with no reason other than I took a 1000 times 20 years times 2). Now, 40,000 divided by 24 is 1667 days. 1667 days is 4.5 years. He basically knew Prince for 4.5 years spread out over 17 years in a working relationship. That really isn't very long when you condense the time. He is going to know his working habits and a bit about his personal life here and there but its not like 20 something years of seeing a person every day. My understanding is that he was his sound engineer on live performances (musicology, ONA, Piano and Microphone, not Welcome to America, not much with 3rd eyegirl and it doesnt sound like he did 3121 Vegas stuff and he was drum engineer for Bland for years before that in the 90's). He wasn't susan rogers working for him non-stop but Prince still came back to using him periodically so obviously Prince had some fondness for the dude and I don't think it was just his talent.

PeteSilas said:

purplerabbithole said:

I am still confused? Is Prince Cosell or Ali? you said "Prince would be scottie"

sorry,meant ali would be scottie

[Edited 6/5/17 20:25pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 20:29pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 20:34pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 20:36pm]

[Edited 6/5/17 20:38pm]

Another thing odd to me was that the interviewer didn't ask Scottie about whether Prince was showing signs of drug usage in January (and his obvious weight loss) during the Piano and Microphone tour. Scottie was going on and on about how good of a keyboardist Prince was and how great he was at it during that tour but no mention of drugs. In fact, I would think Prince's odd blank look on his face when Scottie said he was leaving beacuse it wasn't fun anymore might be indicative of something. (Although Scottie did mention Prince seeming stressed). I get that Prince changing the set list over and over again with little heads up to Scottie and then accusing him of messing with the sound (in almost paranoid way) would be pretty irritating. Scottie left and said NO. He seemed to be proud of himself for not being a yes man. But saying No to avoid Prince being demanding on him is not the same thing as saying no to Prince's wanting you to help him destroy himself.

Maybe this would be a good reason for Scottie to remind people now that we weren't friends/we are just co-workers. So people don't ask questions like"why didn't you notice drug usage?" Bringing this up about Prince having no true friends (because he didn't think like others) and then disagreeig that he was actually lonely is a bit self defensive. Its like saying I didn't know he was in need because we were on different wavelengths as human beings anyway. I have gotten annoyed by Leeds generalizations about Prince in the past, but I am not sure Scottie is right to totally dismiss them either.

I think maybe Prince was like a puzzle who gave out his puzzle pieces to different individuals throughout his life. He was compartmentalized. The closest to fully understanding the dude that people could get would be if they come together and put the puzzles pieces together. In other words, no one account of Prince is definitive. When Leeds was with Prince, he might have been a super lonely dude. When Baldwin was with him, Prince might have coped with this loneliness by throwing himsefl into religion and music etc and wouldn't admit the times with loneliness crept back in. All human beings experience loneliness..Prince was no different. It just comes in different times and people cope differently with it.

[Edited 6/6/17 4:19am]

[Edited 6/6/17 4:23am]

[Edited 6/6/17 4:33am]

purplerabbithole said:

I agree with Scotty everybody does not need company and if Prince pushed people away or did not want to let people in at all he was deciding what sort of life he was going to live.

Remember he told a reporter from Essence magazine that he had music playing in his head 24 hours a day and sometimes what was going on in his head was more interesting to him than what was going on outside his head. He was more interested in his work than personal relationships. He worked on his music and let the relationships go to the wayside.

purplerabbithole said:

Another thing odd to me was that the interviewer didn't ask Scottie about whether Prince was showing signs of drug usage in January during the Piano and Microphone tour. Scottie was going on and on about how good of a keyboardist Prince was and how great he was at it during that tour but no mention of drugs. In fact, I would think Prince's odd blank look on his face when Scottie said he was leaving beacuse it wasn't fun anymore might be indicative of something. I get that Prince changing the set list over and over again with little heads up to Scottie and then accusing him of messing with the sound would be pretty irritating. Scottie left and said NO. He seemed to be proud of himself for not being a yes man. But saying No to avoid Prince being demanding on him is not the same thing as saying no to Prince's wanting you to help him destroy himself.

Maybe this would be a good reason to remind people now that we weren't friends/we are just co-workers. So people don't ask questions like"why didn't you notice drug usage?" Bringing this up about Prince having no true friends but disagreeig that he was actually lonely is a bit self defensive. Its like saying I didn't know he was in need because we were on different wavelengths as human beings anyway. I have gotten annoyed by Leeds generalizations about Prince in the past, but I am not sure Scottie is right to totally dismiss them either.

I think maybe Prince was like a puzzle who gave out his puzzle pieces to different individuals throughout his life. He was compartmentalized. The closest to fully understanding the dude that people could get would be if they come together and put the puzzles pieces together. In other words, no one account of Prince is definitive. When Leeds was with Prince, he might have been a super lonely dude. When Baldwin was with him, Prince might have coped with this loneliness by throwing himsefl into religion and music etc and wouldn't admit the times with loneliness crept back in. All human beings experience loneliness..Prince was no different. It just comes in different times and people cope differently with it.

[Edited 6/6/17 4:19am]

[Edited 6/6/17 4:23am]

Yet Scottie said the trait he'll remember most is how much of a gentleman Prince was. Obviously an incredibly complex man that I don't think anyone will ever truly figure out

Which is why not one account should be definitive. Leeds isn't any more right than Baldwin. Baldwin isn't any more correct than Leeds. Leeds can say Yes men destroyed Prince and that he was lonely because no one is going to accuse him of being a yes man (being long out of the picture). Baldwin can accuse Leeds of making assumptions about Prince's 'loneliness' because he did see Prince at the end and may have left in the middle of a possible emotional crisis of Prince's but didn't catch it.

rogifan said:

purplerabbithole said:

Another thing odd to me was that the interviewer didn't ask Scottie about whether Prince was showing signs of drug usage in January during the Piano and Microphone tour. Scottie was going on and on about how good of a keyboardist Prince was and how great he was at it during that tour but no mention of drugs. In fact, I would think Prince's odd blank look on his face when Scottie said he was leaving beacuse it wasn't fun anymore might be indicative of something. I get that Prince changing the set list over and over again with little heads up to Scottie and then accusing him of messing with the sound would be pretty irritating. Scottie left and said NO. He seemed to be proud of himself for not being a yes man. But saying No to avoid Prince being demanding on him is not the same thing as saying no to Prince's wanting you to help him destroy himself.

Maybe this would be a good reason to remind people now that we weren't friends/we are just co-workers. So people don't ask questions like"why didn't you notice drug usage?"/quote] My guess is the podcast host just didn't want to go there. Also Scottie never said he thought something was odd with Prince's behavior. We know Prince could be difficult to work with sometimes. Yet Scottie said the trait he'll remember most is how much of a gentleman Prince was. Obviously an incredibly complex man that I don't think anyone will ever truly figure out.

purplerabbithole said: