LauraTiebert said:

Misslink88 said:

Hi Laura. Did you ever get an answer to these questions? If I remember correctly, in the legal documents, wasn't there a DNA test that excluded Leverette and that's why there are only the current 5 presumed heirs?

We did not get answers to these questions, as this information surfaced after the book was written. However, this is a great example of the type of research we did, and debating back and forth what the sequence of events was. (I didn't mean to imply that John Nelson might be the father of Alfred).

That's unfortunate. I wonder if, as back then records weren't as available from State to State, things were just kept "under the table" when someone moved? This earlier history would also explain why P's Dad would tell him "don't get a girl pregnant; don't get married" and may explain P's distance from his family later on.

Chapter 3 ~ Basements Pgs 66-76

• Andre Anderson (Cymone) comes into the picture. Andre’s father was also in the Prince Rogers Trio with Princes dad.

• Prince moved out of his mother’s house and into his fathers apartment and then into his Aunts house & then into Andre’s house.

• Prince’s cousin Chazz Smith entered the picture.

• Duane Nelson entered the picture.

• Prince tried out for the football team.

• Kim Upsher entered the picture as someone elses girlfriend.

• Prince was equal parts of anger & charm.

Kind of disturbing that the football coach called Prince off the bench to wave the mosquitoes away.

PennyPurple said:

Chapter 2 Dandelions Pages 58-65

Prince’s nickname was Skipper.

.

Tyka was born.

.

John L Nelson’s piano was off limits to Prince. Prince revered his father.

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John and Mattie started having marital problems in part because John was frequantly out of town do to gigs with his band and not arriving home until early morning hours from gigs during the week. John moved out of the home, but the piano stayed and 7 yr old Prince could play when ever he liked.

.

Prince became friends with a classmate Terry Jackson. Terry also noticed that among people Prince didn’t know very well he was shy & almost meek. But among friends he was talkative, playful, and like to pull pranks. Also noted, Prince had multiple personality traits that helped him achieve his goal in many different situations.

.

Prince was free to visit his father when ever he wanted, but his father was often on the road and did supply Prince with allowance.

.

Mattie again got married to Hayward Baker who failed to connect with his step children. Hayward often locked Prince in a room as punishment, another form of punishment was to have him pick dandelions in the yard which isolated Prince from his friends and music.

.

Prince and his friend Terry were able to attend a James Brown concert where Prince jumped on stage and started dancing the mashed potato. A stage hand removed Prince peacefully and Prince was back with his friends to enjoy the rest of the show, he was only 10.

Makes that song "Papa" all the more hard to take now

SNIP - of4$

no baiting or trolling

2freaky4church1 said:

SNIP - of4$

no baiting or trolling

Me, 2. Which brings an interesting point up in this talk. Don't know if you've gotten to the part about "flow" but it explains a lot about P's ability to lose himself in the music. With all this stuff going on in his environment, and the lack of any real, solid relationships that were supportive, it makes sense that he would escape into what made his parents at least come alive in some respects - music. Tyka has talked a bit about this time (referring to it as "the house of secrets" and alluding to other family members drinking heavily) which might also explain his aversion alcohol. Most family experience a sense of shame from this type of environment, which would also explain why P was shy and quiet and his natural exuberance was stilled.

PennyPurple said:

bsprout said:

PennyPurple said:

Kind of disturbing that the football coach called Prince off the bench to wave the mosquitoes away.

Yes, how humiliating 😞

and demeaning.

Even narcissists have low self esteem deep down inside. It's why they need their narcissist supply (constant worshipping). In the end it's never enough.

bsprout said:

Ch. 3. I thought it was interesting how Prince, after sharing a room with Andre for a while, pressed to live in Bernadette's basement. He persisted until she caved and gave in. He wanted to be isolated to create his music. I was impressed by his laser-sharp focus and dedication at such a young age. It's incredible too how he could be so persuasive (and as we learn later, controlling), while still so young. His personality seemed already clearly defined. With every little victory, he was trusting his instincts more and more. He remained disciplined and controlling for the rest of his life.

Bernadette was very kind by allowing him to live there while trying to raise her kids also. And she raised him as her own.

LoriJ said:

PennyPurple said:

bsprout said:

PennyPurple said:

Bernadette was very kind by allowing him to live there while trying to raise her kids also. And she raised him as her own.

I thought so, too. What a special woman. If I recall correctly Prince always respected her and held her in high regard.

Yes, a special woman. I appreciated that she spoke to both his parents before agreeing to let him stay and keeping them in the loop.

Teachers, coaches, etc can be really cruel to some kids. And the kids carry this for the rest of their lives. How many of us can relate to a teacher being cruel to at least 1 kid in the class?

Misslink88 said:

annalizer said:

Misslink88 said:

Yes, a special woman. I appreciated that she spoke to both his parents before agreeing to let him stay and keeping them in the loop.

I agree with all you. Also, it seemed to me that Prince had more of a huge support group that did their best to help him with his anger issues after the divorce. I know it may seem that his parents were careless in allowing him to stay at Andres' because she wasn't fond of him at the time, as Andre stated in an interview that when he would try to play with Prince his mom would always find something for him to do because Andre was hardheaded). I think it was a trial to gauge how it would work to maybe bring him some peace and allowed him to stay due to the positive effect it had on him, but his parents were always there. Although Prince sort of cleared up the public image of his relationship with his parents by admitting his anger issues that were perceived by him in his youth as abandonment were nothing more than his parents, teachers, BB coach, managers and record execs, trying to help discipline and guide him but he, unbeknownst to those helping him, being a natural born leader, rebelled against anyone he perceived as too restrictive, including his parents.

This mosquito story was an upsetting one to uncover. Needless to say, not everyone who experiences such an event becomes as driven as Prince, but these things were certainly formative. He had a very tough childhood and was determined to escape it. At the same time, Minneapolis, and the Northside, retained a powerful sense of home for him.

AlexHahn said:

Although the chapters are short, they are stuffed with ton's of info. It is becoming more difficult because there are so many different people involved, to try to get talking points.

Chapter 4 ~ Grand Central, pgs 77-86

• Prince moved into the Anderson’s basement

• Grand Central was the new name for the band

• Linda Anderson (Andre’s sister) joined the band

• Chazz Smith was out as drummer, Morris Day was in as drummer

Terry Jackson and Prince got into an argument because Prince and Andre would come over to his house uninvited and helped themselves to the food. Prince started to have a grudge against Jackson.

Morris Day convinced Andre to make him drummer.

Prince’s father started coming around more and attending the band’s gigs.

Prince took the lead in the band and became a driving force.

Andre dropped out of school, while Prince continued with his education.

Prince became increasingly frustrated by the bands lack of progress

Hello everyone. I am enjoying reading through this thread. I have a question for authors Alex and Laura. Is this book available for purchase in brick and mortar stores? I ask because I did not see it for sale on barnesandnoble.com. I like to buy books from brick and mortar stores because I love going to book stores. If it's only available on Amazon, I will buy it from there, but if I can buy it from a brick and mortar store, I would prefer that. Thanks for your help.

SNIP - 0f4$

no derailing discussion

I bought the ebook. (I'll buy the hard copy later). Anyway, I think it's interesting on p. 77 that while a member of Grand Central, Prince "usually sang in a low register." This is interesting to me because in his first 4 solo albums, For You, Prince, Dirty Mind, and Controversy, he sings primarily (although not entirely) in a high register.

On p. 84, the authors mention that as Prince experienced more success in his music career as a member of Grand Central, his father John Nelson became more involved in Prince's life. This kind of behavior is certainly not representative of the unconditional love that I would expect a parent to have for a child.

.

I wonder if part of what motivated Prince to have success was to have receive his father's approval/love/attention. My guess is that Prince was aware of his father's musical ambitions. There aren't a lot of photos of Prince and his dad, but a lot of the photos I've seen of Prince and John Nelson are from 1983 to 1986, when Prince was at his peak of popularity. I've seen some photos of John L. Nelson with Prince associates like Jill Jones and Apollonia. I wonder if John Nelson lived vicariously through Prince's music career.

.

Source: https://www.pinterest.com...255500301/

.

Source: https://nz.pinterest.com/...155842168/

.

Appolonia and John Nelson at the Purple Rain movie premeire.

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

.

Jill Jones and John Nelson

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

[Edited 4/30/17 21:08pm]

206Michelle said:

On p. 84, the authors mention that as Prince experienced more success in his music career as a member of Grand Central, his father John Nelson became more involved in Prince's life. This kind of behavior is certainly not representative of the unconditional love that I would expect a parent to have for a child.

.

I wonder if part of what motivated Prince to have success was to have receive his father's approval/love/attention. My guess is that Prince was aware of his father's musical ambitions. There aren't a lot of photos of Prince and his dad, but a lot of the photos I've seen of Prince and John Nelson are from 1983 to 1986, when Prince was at his peak of popularity. I've seen some photos of John L. Nelson with Prince associates like Jill Jones and Apollonia. I wonder if John Nelson lived vicariously through Prince's music career.

.

Source: https://www.pinterest.com...255500301/

.

Source: https://nz.pinterest.com/...155842168/

.

Appolonia and John Nelson at the Purple Rain movie premeire.

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

.

Jill Jones and John Nelson

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

[Edited 4/30/17 21:08pm]

Based on instinct alone I would guess Yes, Yes and Yes...and more to the point, I also suspect John L. was a bit jealous of P.

Understandable, considering P spectacularly surpassed his father's musical abilities and aspirations, but still...

My thoughts exactly. I can attest to the fact that when a parent makes you feel like you can never do anything right, you spend your entire life trying to make them proud or garner praise. Even if you don't realize you're doing it.

Has anyone else seen the MTV special on the fan date for the UTCM PREMIERE? His father was interviewed and seemed to try to take credit for Prince's success. It was disheartening to see as a fan. Imagine how it must of made Prince feel.

LBrent said:

206Michelle said:

On p. 84, the authors mention that as Prince experienced more success in his music career as a member of Grand Central, his father John Nelson became more involved in Prince's life. This kind of behavior is certainly not representative of the unconditional love that I would expect a parent to have for a child.

.

I wonder if part of what motivated Prince to have success was to have receive his father's approval/love/attention. My guess is that Prince was aware of his father's musical ambitions. There aren't a lot of photos of Prince and his dad, but a lot of the photos I've seen of Prince and John Nelson are from 1983 to 1986, when Prince was at his peak of popularity. I've seen some photos of John L. Nelson with Prince associates like Jill Jones and Apollonia. I wonder if John Nelson lived vicariously through Prince's music career.

.

Source: https://www.pinterest.com...255500301/

.

Source: https://nz.pinterest.com/...155842168/

.

Appolonia and John Nelson at the Purple Rain movie premeire.

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

.

Jill Jones and John Nelson

Source: https://www.tumblr.com/se...l%20nelson

[Edited 4/30/17 21:08pm]

Based on instinct alone I would guess Yes, Yes and Yes...and more to the point, I also suspect John L. was a bit jealous of P.

Understandable, considering P spectacularly surpassed his father's musical abilities and aspirations, but still...

LBrent said:

Based on instinct alone I would guess Yes, Yes and Yes...and more to the point, I also suspect John L. was a bit jealous of P.

Understandable, considering P spectacularly surpassed his father's musical abilities and aspirations, but still...

LoriJ said:

My thoughts exactly. I can attest to the fact that when a parent makes you feel like you can never do anything right, you spend your entire life trying to make them proud or garner praise. Even if you don't realize you're doing it.

Has anyone else seen the MTV special on the fan date for the UTCM PREMIERE? His father was interviewed and seemed to try to take credit for Prince's success. It was disheartening to see as a fan. Imagine how it must of made Prince feel.

Yup, it was cringeworthy.

Even more...look at the picture in my last post. Look at John's face. Is that begrudging pride?...or jealousy?

And P looks very uncomfortable under his father's gaze...to me...in my opinion.

Just thinking out loud really.

[Edited 5/1/17 0:13am]

LBrent said:

Prince evidently clothed his father too. Does anyone know if Prince's mom was at the PR premier?

Is this book being sold in a physical format, as in paperback, in any English bookstores, please? Thanks.

MMJas said: