New topic
Printable206Michelle said:
I totally agree with both of you. I think it's harmless for people to put videos of live performances on Facebook and YouTube if Prince never released these recordings. The live performances will allow more people to be exposed to his music. I totally agree that UMG should be going after the bootleggers and those who are illegally posting songs/albums that he has released. -- Regarding merchandise, I wish that the PP and UMG would have a better selection of t-shirts and posters available to compete with those who are selling unauthorized merchandise. PP has a very limited selection of t-shirts and UMG's Bravado doesn't have anything available yet for Prince on their website http://www.bravado.com/. [Edited 3/4/17 17:27pm] Putting up unrealeased stuff is bottlegging. | |
- E-mail - orgNote -  Report post to moderator |
So perhaps I am not totally clear about the definition of bootlegging. My definition of bootlegging is people selling copies of Prince's work. That said, I don't see a reason why the estate or UMG should order users to remove all of Prince's live performances if the users aren't monetizing the videos. In fact, it would be wise for the estate and UMG to allow some of these videos to remain in order for people to be exposed to Prince. It would be great for the estate and UMG to allow some official live performances, e.g. Saturday Night Live, Super Bowl XLI, Arsenio Hall, to remain if the copyright holders consent to it (NBC, NFL, Arsenio Hall) in order to provide exposure to Prince's work. Live 4 Love ~ Love is God, God is love, Girls and boys love God above | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
laurarichardson said: 206Michelle said:
I totally agree with both of you. I think it's harmless for people to put videos of live performances on Facebook and YouTube if Prince never released these recordings. The live performances will allow more people to be exposed to his music. I totally agree that UMG should be going after the bootleggers and those who are illegally posting songs/albums that he has released. -- Regarding merchandise, I wish that the PP and UMG would have a better selection of t-shirts and posters available to compete with those who are selling unauthorized merchandise. PP has a very limited selection of t-shirts and UMG's Bravado doesn't have anything available yet for Prince on their website http://www.bravado.com/. [Edited 3/4/17 17:27pm] Putting up unrealeased stuff is bottlegging. I just watched a 2 minute video of Prince dancing at the end of Kiss from one of the LA Forum shows in 2011. I saw it on Facebook but it came from YouTube. To call that bootlegging is ridiculous. The person who posted it to YouTube is isn't making any money off of it. As I've said before if someone is posting full length concerts to YouTube fine take them down. But to take down clips of one song or a partial song is silly. Those aren't costing the estate any money. If anything they're just exposing more people to Prince's music. Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜 | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I agree. Especially now that new listeners can never see him live. It is like me watching Marc Bolan or Queen. [Edited 3/5/17 0:59am] | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
. You do not mention making money so why? It is about your ethics, not some weird `law`. Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
You know what...
there is not enough money in the world to stop the New seeding and propogation of Princes LOVE SYMBOL..... I have been watching this closely....
There are people making cookie cutters, Jewellery, car decalls, coasters, jewellery, caps, clothing,Decoupage at works, Snowcones or whatever you call those things with glitter in them....and there is new stuff coming out every day....
The LOVE SYMBOL has simply become Public Property and there is no way thats going to stop...they could waste all Future revenue coming in from the Estate and not be able to stop its use...
Its become like the Christian Cross... Or the Ankh, or Ichthus Or the Star of David or Eye of Horus etc....
Princes LOVE Symbol has powerful Sacred geometries and ancient secret coding contained within its every curve every angle...
Closest thing to Magic you can imagine...
Anyone who sees the CROSS thinks of Christ.... Anyone who sees the SYMBOL Thinks of Prince....
Nope they may try and control its use..but its impossible...
Prince will be everywhere....
I have tried to see the FUTURE and I did......
Say and think what you will...
The SYMBOL will become public property , Prince has left his entire legacy and mission behind in the form of that Symbol...
We are only starting to understand this mans Power...
[Edited 3/5/17 4:01am] [Edited 3/5/17 4:04am] | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I've got Symbol decals, earrings, Prince teeshirts, a purse ... Now I am buying the NARS lip pencils named after Prince songs. If it isn't purple, it's the symbol ... it's like a brother and sisterhood of Prince devotees worldwide. I don't think he would mind that. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
He is happy about it..Im sure... | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
All of the songs are copyrighted works. If you share or sell you are violating copyright laws. At the end of the day the material does not belong to you to share or sell.
UMG has a deal with the estate to make money. They are not in the business of perserving his legacy by letting people look and listen for free. I am sure they are going to put up some of his content for purchase or subscription looking at some point but people are not going to buy something if they can get it for free. Youtube has been around for over 10 years and we have not seen an increase in record sales because people are looking at videos.
If you think about UMG is just doing exactly what Prince would still be doing if he were around. So his wishs are being honered by someone. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
You're making an excellent point!!! 1000%
| |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Live 4 Love ~ Love is God, God is love, Girls and boys love God above | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Well said, rogifan. I TOTALLY agree. udo said:
. You do not mention making money so why? It is about your ethics, not some weird `law`. I never mentioned the law. I'm just saying in my opinion if an entire concert (or large portions of one) get on YouTube I can understand the Estate going after that. Like when Montreux 2013 surfaced. But sYmeone's cell phone quality video from the crowd of one song or a guitar solo? that's like cutting off your nose to spite your face. They've got to have bigger fish to fry and more important things to care about. Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜 | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
if someone is looking to profit off his symbol ...he wouldnt like that. use as promotion would be acceptable
| |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
rogifan said: udo said:
. You do not mention making money so why? It is about your ethics, not some weird `law`. I never mentioned the law. I'm just saying in my opinion if an entire concert (or large portions of one) get on YouTube I can understand the Estate going after that. Like when Montreux 2013 surfaced. But sYmeone's cell phone quality video from the crowd of one song or a guitar solo? that's like cutting off your nose to spite your face. They've got to have bigger fish to fry and more important things to care about. -It does not matter how long the footage is it violates copyright law. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Lovejunky said:
You know what...
there is not enough money in the world to stop the New seeding and propogation of Princes LOVE SYMBOL..... I have been watching this closely....
There are people making cookie cutters, Jewellery, car decalls, coasters, jewellery, caps, clothing,Decoupage at works, Snowcones or whatever you call those things with glitter in them....and there is new stuff coming out every day....
The LOVE SYMBOL has simply become Public Property and there is no way thats going to stop...they could waste all Future revenue coming in from the Estate and not be able to stop its use...
Its become like the Christian Cross... Or the Ankh, or Ichthus Or the Star of David or Eye of Horus etc....
Princes LOVE Symbol has powerful Sacred geometries and ancient secret coding contained within its every curve every angle...
Closest thing to Magic you can imagine...
Anyone who sees the CROSS thinks of Christ.... Anyone who sees the SYMBOL Thinks of Prince....
Nope they may try and control its use..but its impossible...
Prince will be everywhere....
I have tried to see the FUTURE and I did.....
Say and think what you will...
The SYMBOL will become public property , Prince has left his entire legacy and mission behind in the form of that Symbol...
We are only starting to understand this mans Power...
[Edited 3/5/17 4:01am] [Edited 3/5/17 4:04am] Love your post, feel it is true. Anyone who met him knows this  | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Laura, you are correct about the violations of copyright law. However, there is a balancing act that must take place. There must be a balance between addressing violations of copyright law and providing exposure to Prince's work. It is in the estate's interest to allow for a certain amount of content to remain on YouTube in order to generate and maintain interest in Prince's work. To my knowledge, the estate has not established a VEVO type of page that can generate revenue. There are some videos of Prince's performances that official sources have posted: the NFL posted a video with part of his Super Bowl performance, the Ellen Degeneres show posted a performance he did on her show, a couple of videos from Live Nation about his Welcome 2 America Tour, and the Rock & Roll HOF posted the epic performance of "When My Guitar Gently Weeps." It would be best if the estate would get its act together and release some of the most sought-after performances on DVD sooner rather than later. There are a lot of Prince fans who want access to footage of live shows and are willing to pay for it. But we need to have access to it in the form of DVDs that we can buy. Live 4 Love ~ Love is God, God is love, Girls and boys love God above | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
206Michelle said:
Laura, you are correct about the violations of copyright law. However, there is a balancing act that must take place. There must be a balance between addressing violations of copyright law and providing exposure to Prince's work. It is in the estate's interest to allow for a certain amount of content to remain on YouTube in order to generate and maintain interest in Prince's work. To my knowledge, the estate has not established a VEVO type of page that can generate revenue. There are some videos of Prince's performances that official sources have posted: the NFL posted a video with part of his Super Bowl performance, the Ellen Degeneres show posted a performance he did on her show, a couple of videos from Live Nation about his Welcome 2 America Tour, and the Rock & Roll HOF posted the epic performance of "When My Guitar Gently Weeps." It would be best if the estate would get its act together and release some of the most sought-after performances on DVD sooner rather than later. There are a lot of Prince fans who want access to footage of live shows and are willing to pay for it. But we need to have access to it in the form of DVDs that we can buy. --There is not going to be a balance. UMG is in this to make money they are not going to make it giving it away for free. I am sure when the cataloging of the material was completed we will get out Prince channel. Some of you were so delighted to see UMG in the picture you did not understand what was going to happen. They have the reduced to erase all free material from the net which Prince would not have been able to do if NPG LLC wound not have been able to do. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Prince does have a Vevo page on YouTube. However, there are no videos up at this time.
| |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
laurarichardson said: 206Michelle said:
Laura, you are correct about the violations of copyright law. However, there is a balancing act that must take place. There must be a balance between addressing violations of copyright law and providing exposure to Prince's work. It is in the estate's interest to allow for a certain amount of content to remain on YouTube in order to generate and maintain interest in Prince's work. To my knowledge, the estate has not established a VEVO type of page that can generate revenue. There are some videos of Prince's performances that official sources have posted: the NFL posted a video with part of his Super Bowl performance, the Ellen Degeneres show posted a performance he did on her show, a couple of videos from Live Nation about his Welcome 2 America Tour, and the Rock & Roll HOF posted the epic performance of "When My Guitar Gently Weeps." It would be best if the estate would get its act together and release some of the most sought-after performances on DVD sooner rather than later. There are a lot of Prince fans who want access to footage of live shows and are willing to pay for it. But we need to have access to it in the form of DVDs that we can buy. --There is not going to be a balance. UMG is in this to make money they are not going to make it giving it away for free. I am sure when the cataloging of the material was completed we will get out Prince channel. Some of you were so delighted to see UMG in the picture you did not understand what was going to happen. They have the reduced to erase all free material from the net which Prince would not have been able to do if NPG LLC wound not have been able to do. Tell me how the Estate is losing money by this 51 second clip being on Twitter. https://twitter.com/serpa...5456342021 Like I said it's cutting off your nose to spite your face. And I'd say the same thing if Prince was still alive. Let's not go putting this all on UMG. I saw plenty of videos removed from YouTube last year before UMG was ever in the picture. They were removed at the request of web sheriff and/or NPG. Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜 | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
rogifan said: laurarichardson said: --There is not going to be a balance. UMG is in this to make money they are not going to make it giving it away for free. I am sure when the cataloging of the material was completed we will get out Prince channel. Some of you were so delighted to see UMG in the picture you did not understand what was going to happen. They have the reduced to erase all free material from the net which Prince would not have been able to do if NPG LLC wound not have been able to do. Tell me how the Estate is losing money by this 51 second clip being on Twitter. https://twitter.com/serpa...5456342021 Like I said it's cutting off your nose to spite your face. And I'd say the same thing if Prince was still alive. Let's not go putting this all on UMG. I saw plenty of videos removed from YouTube last year before UMG was ever in the picture. They were removed at the request of web sheriff and/or NPG. --It is a copyright violation that is the law. It does not matter how long the clips are the material does not belong to that Twitter holder. It belongs to the estate and they did not give permission or receive payment. If people are looking at stuff free what motivation do they have to purchase. No proof that free content drives sales. Yes, Prince was taking down material but he did not have the resources to do what UMG can do and remember UMG is being monitored by the court. Already some sibs questioned some of the agreements so UMG needs to show they are actually going to do their part. Also I believe we will get an official channel eventrully and will be able to actually buy something which I hope fans are going to do. [Edited 3/6/17 2:43am] | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
It must be me. After nearly a year of this, I am just tired of the whole estate/who gets what/who cares for what/ drama. I don't think we'll ever know the "real" reason and facts behind why we are in this situation - and I have given up wanting to know. Just put out the records, put out the DVDs, put a Prince channel up online (I'll pay) and let us at it. License out his music to movies, TV and commercials - really the best way to get it in front of new ears. Try to get Kendrick Lamar or the Weeknd to sample Prince music into their records ... Just get it going. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
laurarichardson said: rogifan said: Tell me how the Estate is losing money by this 51 second clip being on Twitter. https://twitter.com/serpa...5456342021 Like I said it's cutting off your nose to spite your face. And I'd say the same thing if Prince was still alive. Let's not go putting this all on UMG. I saw plenty of videos removed from YouTube last year before UMG was ever in the picture. They were removed at the request of web sheriff and/or NPG. --It is a copyright violation that is the law. It does not matter how long the clips are the material does not belong to that Twitter holder. It belongs to the estate and they did not give permission or receive payment. If people are looking at stuff free what motivation do they have to purchase. No proof that free content drives sales. Yes, Prince was taking down material but he did not have the resources to do what UMG can do and remember UMG is being monitored by the court. Already some sibs questioned some of the agreements so UMG needs to show they are actually going to do their part. Also I believe we will get an official channel eventrully and will be able to actually buy something which I hope fans are going to do. [Edited 3/6/17 2:43am] That's why I said I understand going after full length concerts like the Montreux 2013 shows. But come on, seeing 51 seconds of a concert on Twitter isn't going to make someone not buy something. You say no proof free stuff drives sales. Also no proof that clips like this are making it more likely people don't purchase. And there are degrees. Go after the people that are making money off his trademarked symbol. Or that are selling DVDs of concerts. Don't go after some fan in a Facebook group that shares a clip of cell phone video from a concert. Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜 | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
1Sasha said: It must be me. After nearly a year of this, I am just tired of the whole estate/who gets what/who cares for what/ drama. I don't think we'll ever know the "real" reason and facts behind why we are in this situation - and I have given up wanting to know. Just put out the records, put out the DVDs, put a Prince channel up online (I'll pay) and let us at it. License out his music to movies, TV and commercials - really the best way to get it in front of new ears. Try to get Kendrick Lamar or the Weeknd to sample Prince music into their records ... Just get it going. Think that is what they have wanted all along ... Wear us out with no real answers as to why. This has made it very hard for some of us to move on. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
The estate should consider making the Prince symbol jewelry and other merchandise available to purchase at the upcoming Revolution shows... | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
If there's no proof free stuff drives sales then why has every musical artist in the last 60 years made promotional videos? Every artist from the 80s onwards scrambled to get their videos on MTVs playlist? Musicians don't earn money off singles, they're purely to promote album sales. People need to have access to some free Prince content for promotion. I believe the main reason P was so adamant about keeping clips off YouTube was because he didn't want inferior quality footage on there, I don't think it was ever about losing money. So if the estate is hell bent on removing every fan clip etc. they should make sure everyone has access to "something", anything, official for free. A few music videos, maybe one or two live concerts. It would 100% raise sales. Speculate to accumulate! There's always a rainbow 🌈 , at the end of every rain ☔️ | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
petalthecat said: If there's no proof free stuff drives sales then why has every musical artist in the last 60 years made promotional videos? Every artist from the 80s onwards scrambled to get their videos on MTVs playlist? Musicians don't earn money off singles, they're purely to promote album sales. People need to have access to some free Prince content for promotion. I believe the main reason P was so adamant about keeping clips off YouTube was because he didn't want inferior quality footage on there, I don't think it was ever about losing money. So if the estate is hell bent on removing every fan clip etc. they should make sure everyone has access to "something", anything, official for free. A few music videos, maybe one or two live concerts. It would 100% raise sales. Speculate to accumulate! Apparently they are cracking down hard on FB. Prince groups being told to no longer post video clips for fear that FB might shut the group down. And some going from closed to secret (whatever that means). I think it's complete BS. A lot of these short clips on FB and elsewhere are helping people grieve and celebrate Prince's life. The people on these FB groups aren't out to make money or scam the estate in any way.  .Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜 | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Nope! I refuse to put any money in his estate or the hands of his family! He's gone and that is who an where I would want my money to go to. Since he's not here to benefit from it, I will stick to getting my music and stuff "underground" I for sure am not going to put any money in the hands of the big labels like UMG. I will gladly pay to go see certain musicians he worked with or buy their music because they are still here and can benefit from it, but unless I know exactly where my money is going to, who it's going to, and why then I will not put any money into anything just because Prince's name is behind it. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
Omar has served Londell with a subpoena. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
I actually GET where you are coming from JustAmeda...
Prince made sure he was paid while he was here, His family will benefit more than enough from what he left behind....
WHy do we have to make others rich from work that Prince did for US ? | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |
petalthecat said: If there's no proof free stuff drives sales then why has every musical artist in the last 60 years made promotional videos? Every artist from the 80s onwards scrambled to get their videos on MTVs playlist? Musicians don't earn money off singles, they're purely to promote album sales. People need to have access to some free Prince content for promotion. I believe the main reason P was so adamant about keeping clips off YouTube was because he didn't want inferior quality footage on there, I don't think it was ever about losing money. So if the estate is hell bent on removing every fan clip etc. they should make sure everyone has access to "something", anything, official for free. A few music videos, maybe one or two live concerts. It would 100% raise sales. Speculate to accumulate! --Do you really think videos you look at maybe 3 times a day on MTV is the same as millions of people viewing and being able to download the clip. I mean really think about that for a minute and wait and see when cable subscriptions are free or Hulu or Netfilx. | |
| - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator |