PeteSilas said:

1Sasha said:

Physically, his appearance changed dramatically. Anyone could have seen that. Emotionally, he seemed to have changed as well. Open, vulnerable ... Yes, Prince letting his guard down, humanizing himself. Everybody was on the payroll in one form or another and no one stood up to him early on (that we know of) to confront him on his health. Unless there was no hope, and he was just riding out the last months of his life. That autopsy report is the key. If it was clean, save for the Fent use, why not release it? End the speculation. Unless, of course, there are results the family does not want us to see.

i've used the Analogy of Bruce Lee's death many times since Prince passed. The given cause was more out of a political kind of thing than the actual truth. Hong Kong authorities saw no upside in telling the idols of millions that he used cannibis and had an allergic reaction to it even though most of the proof point to that so they fudged the report by calling in a british coroner who either was pressure and/or gave them the result they wanted, that Bruce had a freak sensitivity to an equagesic pill. People lie all the time, for all knds of reasons and I just think that with Prince, if they aren't lying they are being evasive and misleading. Too many things don't make sense really, here we have a guy who one way or another could get what he wanted, why would he need a batch of pills that would kill him and why oh why would he take a second one after a close call the week before. Maybe the close call wasn't an overdose, no one ever confirmed that. Prince, smart, calculating even prophetic about many things had to have a reason for rolling the dice like that. Honestly, I could see a man of his generation being ashamed of an AIDS diagnosis even though many people have gotten the disease through several other means than gay sex. Maybe he didn't want people thinking that, and maybe the reason why he wasn't hesitant to taking another pill was he knew his time was short anyway. I don't think we'll get answers anytime soon really. We can't really demand anything and it seems like everyone is just hinting and being just as contradictory and evasive as prince ever was. I couldn't see Prince covering up cancer, there is no shame in that disease, aids is another matter and there is still plenty of ignorance and shame associated with it. Either way, i do not think it is as simple as Prince being an out of control drug addict.

It is possible that his health outside of pain pills may have taken a turn for the worst in the last month or even days of his life. Any type of illness takes time for people to process it for your self much less to think about how his family or the public would respond. Whatever it was he may not have had enough time to do much of anything.

In a similar vein of amazement — most of the posts by "cynics" that I've read on this site, have graciously conceded many times that, "Of course, I could be wrong with my cynical take on things…".

But the same cannot be said for people who refuse to accept that Prince probably had a "pill issue".

That side of the fence, have never conceded that their subjective take on the issue, could also be wrong. Even though the "cynical" take on the issue is arguably way more objectively provable — when looking at the big picture.

That's the kind of thing that amazes me.

[Incidentally — my comment is directed at neither NouveauDance nor rogifan — I'm just commenting in general]

petalthecat said:

petalthecat said:

rogifan said:

petalthecat said:

I had believed for months this was sadly just another case of painkiller addiction ending in a tragic death. I've read with great interest all the speculation and theories on here, some more ridiculous than others, but whatever way we look at it, none of us know exactly what happened so anything is possible. A lot of things simply don't add up, and the proverbial spanner in the works came for me with Tykas comments. That being said, a few weeks ago while researching rheumatoid arthritis for a friend I just couldn't believe some of the parallels with P. We know he had hip problems, we know he had surgery, which doesn't seem to have improved the condition..The symptoms of RA include pain, weight loss, flu like symptoms. It's an auto immune disease that affects the whole body. Also quite interesting is that having RA knocks 10-15 years of a person's lifespan. So if we consider someone like P living to 80ish he could have been looking at the possibility of death in 8 years time. Does this explain the making amends with people, the memoir, the PP museum plans? Does this explain Tykas comments?( especially her contradictions in different interviews) She knew he wouldn't be around much longer just not exactly when? There are definitely signs of a degenerative disease getting worse, the covering up, wearing of gloves, the shades(RA sufferers can be prone to eye infections), the piano and microphone tour, the comment on the 16th April that he was struggling to play the guitar these days. There is no cure for RA, just healthy living and pain management. Seems likely that he couldn't get long term scripts for painkillers so he was forced down the illegal route. Sorry for rambling on, I just needed to get my thoughts off my chest!

.

Petalthecat said: There are definitely signs of a degenerative disease getting worse, the covering up, wearing of gloves, the shades(RA sufferers can be prone to eye infections), the piano and microphone tour, the comment on the 16th April that he was struggling to play the guitar these days. There is no cure for RA, just healthy living and pain management. Seems likely that he couldn't get long term scripts for painkillers so he was forced down the illegal route. Sorry for rambling on, I just needed to get my thoughts off my chest!

.

Everything you said is quite plausible. However, I don't think that he had RA or any other disease. I haven't seen him wearing gloves on a regular basis. He wasn't wearing shades all the time, so I'm on the fence with regards to the RA. I don't believe Prince ever said he was struggling to play the guitar. He said something along the lines of "I'm not able to play much these days." I think what he was referring to was that he was more focused on the "Piano & Microphone" tour, so he wasn't picking up the guitar much. I'm sure if his pain was so severe, that his Doctor would have prescribed him something -- at least a mild pain reliever (not Advil); no good doctor would allow a patient to be in constant pain. He had no scripts for any pain medications within the last year of his life.

cloveringold85 said:

for me, i'd like to know exactly what mani meant a few years ago when she compared prince to charlie sheen.

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Petalthecat said: There are definitely signs of a degenerative disease getting worse, the covering up, wearing of gloves, the shades(RA sufferers can be prone to eye infections), the piano and microphone tour, the comment on the 16th April that he was struggling to play the guitar these days. There is no cure for RA, just healthy living and pain management. Seems likely that he couldn't get long term scripts for painkillers so he was forced down the illegal route. Sorry for rambling on, I just needed to get my thoughts off my chest!

.

Everything you said is quite plausible. However, I don't think that he had RA or any other disease. I haven't seen him wearing gloves on a regular basis. He wasn't wearing shades all the time, so I'm on the fence with regards to the RA. I don't believe Prince ever said he was struggling to play the guitar. He said something along the lines of "I'm not able to play much these days." I think what he was referring to was that he was more focused on the "Piano & Microphone" tour, so he wasn't picking up the guitar much. I'm sure if his pain was so severe, that his Doctor would have prescribed him something -- at least a mild pain reliever (not Advil); no good doctor would allow a patient to be in constant pain. He had no scripts for any pain medications within the last year of his life.

--- But he scripts for non-controlled substances and he was seeing Dr.S who is listed as a critical care doctor on at least one website and had no back ground in pain management or addiction consulting. The unamed source also said they found OxyContin bottle in his room. [Edited 11/26/16 14:12pm]

.

They said he was taking Percocet, yet he had no scripts for pain meds in the last year. So many unanswered questions remain. Sad to think that he was taking Oxy and all this other stuff. I just don't understand why he wasn't under a doctor's supervision for his pain? I wonder if more information will come out soon?

XxAxX said:

for me, i'd like to know exactly what mani meant a few years ago when she compared prince to charlie sheen.

.

Yea, me too. I'm not sure what she meant by comparing Prince to Charlie Sheen.

cloveringold85 said:

XxAxX said:

for me, i'd like to know exactly what mani meant a few years ago when she compared prince to charlie sheen.

.

Yea, me too. I'm not sure what she meant by comparing Prince to Charlie Sheen.

yeah. even assuming she was bitter over their failed relationship, it would be intriguing to know exactly what she meant by that. sounds like an accusation that prince was using drugs like sheen, to whit, cocaine and heroin.

[Edited 11/26/16 15:36pm]

XxAxX said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Yea, me too. I'm not sure what she meant by comparing Prince to Charlie Sheen.

yeah. even assuming she was bitter over their failed relartionship, it would be intriguing to know exactly what she meant by that. sounds like an accusation that prince was using drugs like sheen, to whit, cocaine and heroin

.

It's hard for me to fathom the thought that Prince was a coke-head and partying like Charlie Sheen. Prince didn't live the party lifestyle. I mean, there are no pictures of him out partying like the Hollywood Celebs. TMZ would be all over that, if it were true!

.

And another thing, Prince was too damn calm to ever be strung-out on coke & drugs! I've never witnessed him having erratic behavior like a drug-addict.

.

He used to have parties at PP all the time and he had a strict "no drug" policy!!

cloveringold85 said:

XxAxX said:

yeah. even assuming she was bitter over their failed relartionship, it would be intriguing to know exactly what she meant by that. sounds like an accusation that prince was using drugs like sheen, to whit, cocaine and heroin

.

It's hard for me to fathom the thought that Prince was a coke-head and partying like Charlie Sheen. Prince didn't live the party lifestyle. I mean, there are no pictures of him out partying like the Hollywood Celebs. TMZ would be all over that, if it were true!

.

And another thing, Prince was too damn calm to ever be strung-out on coke & drugs! I've never witnessed him having erratic behavior like a drug-addict.

.

He used to have parties at PP all the time and he had a strict "no drug" policy!!

here is the original prince.org thread:


Hoping never to see prince on 20/20 doing a charlie sheen-esque rant. so sad

http://prince.org/msg/7/353953

and

http://prince.org/msg/5/353938?&pg=1

[Edited 11/26/16 15:38pm]

XxAxX said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

It's hard for me to fathom the thought that Prince was a coke-head and partying like Charlie Sheen. Prince didn't live the party lifestyle. I mean, there are no pictures of him out partying like the Hollywood Celebs. TMZ would be all over that, if it were true!

.

And another thing, Prince was too damn calm to ever be strung-out on coke & drugs! I've never witnessed him having erratic behavior like a drug-addict.

.

He used to have parties at PP all the time and he had a strict "no drug" policy!!

here is the original prince.org thread:


Hoping never to see prince on 20/20 doing a charlie sheen-esque rant. so sad

http://prince.org/msg/7/353953

and

http://prince.org/msg/5/353938?&pg=1

[Edited 11/26/16 15:38pm]

.

Interesting. Maybe she used Charlie Sheen as a reference in terms of being upset, but not the "drug" thing? She was probably just upset and bitter at the time.

.

I've never seen Prince behaving anything like Charlie Sheen does. Maybe he did that stuff, in the privacy of his own home. I wish I coulda seen Prince get really pissed. Did he ever get mad? I've seen his tweets, and even when he was upset, he still seemed very nice! LMAO!!

cloveringold85 said:

XxAxX said:

here is the original prince.org thread:


Hoping never to see prince on 20/20 doing a charlie sheen-esque rant. so sad

http://prince.org/msg/7/353953

and

http://prince.org/msg/5/353938?&pg=1

[Edited 11/26/16 15:38pm]

.

Interesting. Maybe she used Charlie Sheen as a reference in terms of being upset, but not the "drug" thing? She was probably just upset and bitter at the time.

.

I've never seen Prince behaving anything like Charlie Sheen does. Maybe he did that stuff, in the privacy of his own home. I wish I coulda seen Prince get really pissed. Did he ever get mad? I've seen his tweets, and even when he was upset, he still seemed very nice! LMAO!!

at the time i simply dismissed Mani's vicious little dig at prince as her being just plain.... vicious.

i've never liked the way she squirmed in between two married people (prince/mayte) and i couldn't help noticing how her commitment to the JW faith rapidly went POOF! after her divorce, so i am not impartial at all.

but now i wonder if her remark really was about something other than her desire to stay in the limelight via her association with prince.....

XxAxX said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Interesting. Maybe she used Charlie Sheen as a reference in terms of being upset, but not the "drug" thing? She was probably just upset and bitter at the time.

.

I've never seen Prince behaving anything like Charlie Sheen does. Maybe he did that stuff, in the privacy of his own home. I wish I coulda seen Prince get really pissed. Did he ever get mad? I've seen his tweets, and even when he was upset, he still seemed very nice! LMAO!!

at the time i simply dismissed Mani's vicious little dig at prince as her being just plain.... vicious.

i've never liked the way she squirmed in between two married people (prince/mayte) and i couldn't help noticing how her commitment to the JW faith rapidly went POOF! after her divorce, so i am not impartial at all.

but now i wonder if her remark really was about something other than her desire to stay in the limelight via her association with prince.....

.

I have seen many people get divorced, and then years later, remain friends, but usually because there are children involved. I think Mani was just bitter at the time, but I think Prince was very kind to her and gave her a generous divorce settlement (probably why she wants the divorce docs to remain sealed) and she has been silent.

.

I don't condone what Prince did to Mayte. I have read so many different stories, so not sure what is fact. I'm sure he had regrets about they way he handled things.

XxAxX said:

Ignore d'Ignint^®

at the time i simply dismissed Mani's vicious little dig at prince as her being just plain.... vicious.

i've never liked the way she squirmed in between two married people (prince/mayte) and i couldn't help noticing how her commitment to the JW faith rapidly went POOF! after her divorce, so i am not impartial at all.

but now i wonder if her remark really was about something other than her desire to stay in the limelight via her association with prince.....

Thanks for posting those links, XxAxX.

The exes' follow-up quote, speaks volumes — in hindsight…

Shorty said:

whoa! here's her response to all the responses“So sorry to have upset so people simply because of my concern for someone else. It was not a personal attack by any stretch. I was thoroughly disturbed by Charlie Sheen's interview and wouldn't wish that state of being on anyone. It's such a slippery slope when you're surrounded by yes men and enablers. ”

hmm, that's the first time i saw that response from mani. what to make of it? who knows, i doubt if she was that concerned about Prince though, couples that break up, friends that break up, bands that break up get pretty nasty with each other and say all kinds of stuff. who knows what to make of it. how many women leave men and then say he was "abusive" "scared me" or whatever, if you're not there you don't know what kinds of games went on or didn't go on.

phatphuk said:

XxAxX said:

Thanks for posting those links, XxAxX.

The exes' follow-up quote, speaks volumes — in hindsight…

Shorty said:

whoa! here's her response to all the responses“So sorry to have upset so people simply because of my concern for someone else. It was not a personal attack by any stretch. I was thoroughly disturbed by Charlie Sheen's interview and wouldn't wish that state of being on anyone. It's such a slippery slope when you're surrounded by yes men and enablers. ”

no problem. i'm digging through old threads for fun to see which posts were Prince's.

along the way it's struck me that those conducting the official homicide investigation should thoroughly analyze some of the things posted here over the years and speak with those who posted such

phatphuk said:

XxAxX said:

Thanks for posting those links, XxAxX.

The exes' follow-up quote, speaks volumes — in hindsight…

Shorty said:

whoa! here's her response to all the responses“So sorry to have upset so people simply because of my concern for someone else. It was not a personal attack by any stretch. I was thoroughly disturbed by Charlie Sheen's interview and wouldn't wish that state of being on anyone. It's such a slippery slope when you're surrounded by yes men and enablers. ”

PeteSilas said:

hmm, that's the first time i saw that response from mani. what to make of it? who knows, i doubt if she was that concerned about Prince though, couples that break up, friends that break up, bands that break up get pretty nasty with each other and say all kinds of stuff. who knows what to make of it. how many women leave men and then say he was "abusive" "scared me" or whatever, if you're not there you don't know what kinds of games went on or didn't go on.

phatphuk said:

there were lengthy discussions about this topic at the time.

mnfriend said:

Am I missing something/ are we not suppose to talk about this?

I feel like it's the elephant in the living room.

Do you think possibly Mani was making the comparison

Charlie Sheen/ HIV positive/ big secret?

If you haven't heard the news of Prince's cause of death…and/or if you think that someone talking about being “surrounded by yes men and enablers” has anything to do with being HIV positive — then it is probably fair to say — with all due respect — Yes. You're right. You are missing something.

But don't sweat it though. You're certainly not alone.

yes, i remember the mani/sheen statements, i don't remember the follow ups. either way, hard to say how seriously to take it. I never take sides when a man or a woman comes to me with a lot of that kind of shit because I know how people are, they just sort of demonize the other person and badmouth them. I learned not to trust those people. I've got a female relative who got a divorce and said something about "abuse" but I've also seen women call anything "abuse" and I have to take it with a grain of salt. Same with men who bitch and moan about horrible divorce situations, you just know they aren't telling you everything and you're not asking to begin with. After enough of that, you just don't even wanna hear any of it.

XxAxX said:

PeteSilas said:

hmm, that's the first time i saw that response from mani. what to make of it? who knows, i doubt if she was that concerned about Prince though, couples that break up, friends that break up, bands that break up get pretty nasty with each other and say all kinds of stuff. who knows what to make of it. how many women leave men and then say he was "abusive" "scared me" or whatever, if you're not there you don't know what kinds of games went on or didn't go on.

there were lengthy discussions about this topic at the time.

mnfriend said:

Am I missing something/ are we not suppose to talk about this? I feel like it's the elephant in the living room. Do you think possibly Mani was making the comparison Charlie Sheen/ HIV positive/ big secret?

I've wondered that, but no one knew sheen was hiv positive at the time, everyone just thought he was losing his mind to drugs.

what, in your opinion, should they look at, i'm interested. Also, recently i've been watching some Walter Payton footage, he's a guy who had cancer in his forties and was dropping weight at such an alarming rate that the aids rumours were starting to get out of hand so he held a press conference to state that he had cancer. What I'm wondering though, is whether or not pill abuse can cause liver cancer or anything like that, it came out later that Walter abused pain pills for the same reasons many pro athletes do. I wonder if it caused his problems. I think he had Pancreatic Cancer.

XxAxX said:

no problem. i'm digging through old threads for fun to see which posts were Prince's.

along the way it's struck me that those conducting the official homicide investigation should thoroughly analyze some of the things posted here over the years and speak with those who posted such

phatphuk said:

um, for starters, they might inquire as to why mani posted what she did. here's a thought: try using the upper-right-hand-corner google search engine to search Prince.org for references to 'drugs'.

PeteSilas said:

what, in your opinion, should they look at, i'm interested. Also, recently i've been watching some Walter Payton footage, he's a guy who had cancer in his forties and was dropping weight at such an alarming rate that the aids rumours were starting to get out of hand so he held a press conference to state that he had cancer. What I'm wondering though, is whether or not pill abuse can cause liver cancer or anything like that, it came out later that Walter abused pain pills for the same reasons many pro athletes do. I wonder if it caused his problems. I think he had Pancreatic Cancer.

XxAxX said:

no problem. i'm digging through old threads for fun to see which posts were Prince's.

along the way it's struck me that those conducting the official homicide investigation should thoroughly analyze some of the things posted here over the years and speak with those who posted such

XxAxX said:

um, for starters, they might inquire as to why mani posted what she did. here's a thought: try using the upper-right-hand-corner google search engine to search Prince.org for references to 'drugs'.

PeteSilas said:

what, in your opinion, should they look at, i'm interested. Also, recently i've been watching some Walter Payton footage, he's a guy who had cancer in his forties and was dropping weight at such an alarming rate that the aids rumours were starting to get out of hand so he held a press conference to state that he had cancer. What I'm wondering though, is whether or not pill abuse can cause liver cancer or anything like that, it came out later that Walter abused pain pills for the same reasons many pro athletes do. I wonder if it caused his problems. I think he had Pancreatic Cancer.

thanks sherlock, i've already done that. forget i asked you anything ok.