XSX said:

1. MUSIC, MASTERS AND RIGHTS AT NPG. Not 'willable' because it's all wrapped up in whatever policy and other documents are in place at NPG (effectively a fiercely independent and imaginatively radical publishing company, conceived, organised and belonging to Prince that's been around for about 23 years). Everything that is Prince's intellectual property (not owned or entitled to by others like WB) is held there and to be put out or not according to whatever he, The Boss, said.

NPG is an LLC that will ultimately do whatever its member(s) dictate, subject to whatever ongoing contractual arrangements NPG has with third parties. It's possible that Prince was the sole member (most likely), and that the LLC interests were one of the assets of his estate. Alternatively, it's possible that the LLC interests were structured in some other manner. However, either way, Prince is no longer the boss of what NPG does. Whomever now owns the interests in the LLC is the boss. If the new boss decides to make choices that are different than what the old boss would have done, they have complete freedom to do so, subject to whatever ongoing contractual arrangements NPG has to third parties.

Big picture, we have every reason to believe that NPG is going to end up owned by the beneficiaries of the estate (Tyka et al), and they can then do whatever they want with NPG, including selling its assets to Tidal, WB or any other person/entity they choose.

XSX said:

And I'd like to hear opinion or information from those with some, as to whether PP will now, as per most museums, be about to assume a special tax status. Indeed, is it and was it already operationally a non-profit? I don't know but I'd imagine its re-zoning is part of a move in something like that direction which, again, would make this alleged 'tax crisis' another red herring.

The tax-exempt status of an entity has no bearing on the re-zoning of land. Re-zoning is a function of the land use classification and activities that will occur on a site. The zoning classification is also independent of the ownership (e.g., a not-for-profit entity can own a site that is to be used for-profit by a separate entity, but the zoning determines what general activities are allowed there).

The only respect in which the tax status of Paisley Park matters is in regard to whether it is subject to federal or state income taxes.

Depending, again (albeit in a slightly different way) on the nature of the use and activities, the land may or may not be exempt from property taxes. In most states, land owned by a non-profit is not automatically exempt from property taxes unless the land is used for an eleemosynary (i.e., charitable) purpose.

Noodled24 said:

XSX said:

Because it gets quite technical to look into it, the detail of Prince's setup before and after April 21 is rarely summed up because those in a position to will talk technicals and most will go 'Whaaa?' and then react to some clickbait shite instead.

But, I believe I'm in the area of being succinct when I say:

1. MUSIC, MASTERS AND RIGHTS AT NPG. Not 'willable' because it's all wrapped up in whatever policy and other documents are in place at NPG (effectively a fiercely independent and imaginatively radical publishing company, conceived, organised and belonging to Prince that's been around for about 23 years). Everything that is Prince's intellectual property (not owned or entitled to by others like WB) is held there and to be put out or not according to whatever he, The Boss, said.
Therefore Maurice wasn't autonomously negotitating anything with Jay Z unless he was sent to hand over a memory stick of tracks that are to be coming out under existing agreements with Tidal that Prince/NPG set up. Maybe that memory stick was in his pocket beside the purple hankerchief but more likely he called in for a donut (Jay Z and Maurice likes Donuts, see). It is possible that people visit each other for, like, 'passing by' reasons...INCREDIBLY

It seems highly unlikely they would fly from MPLS to New York to drop by the offices of a billionaire they've never met. For reasons not related to Prince.

It seems more likely Jay-Z was romancing T&M in an attempt to curry favor with them down the line.

Doesn't NPG only have the songs Prince registered? (the catalog) Many of the songs in the vault never were. Which is why there are songs fans don't even know the titles of.

Jay-Z already has an exclusive streaming deal regarding Prince's catalog in place, and I'd imagine it'll stay in place for the duration which P agreed with J.

With respect, if Jay Z was romancing anybody, I think he'd be the one booking flights.
Meanwhile, there's absolutely no way one can jump from 'Jay Z meets Maurice' to 'Maurice selling Prince out' which is the tone of some comments, based upon more media twaddle.

As someone above had pointed out (thanks!):
Prince was happy with Jay Z/Tidal and said so.
Jay Z is loyal to Prince and has said so.

That'll do for me and, I suspect, anybody operating their brain while reading this forum.

On the previous WB/Controversy Music arrangements, registration with ASCAP and availability of records on songs registered was automatic because under such arrangement, the masters of every recording, even at PP, belonged to WB and the copyright in every song was to Controversy.

After he ceased these arrangements, his songs' ownership, both as master recordings and copyrights are with NPG, set up for this explicit purpose.

All licensing of these songs will occur as per 'corporation' policy documents and instructions from Prince. Therefore the chances of a song being used to advertise pancakes are dependent on Prince's sense of humour, not anybody else's ideas.

The stuff about Londell being untrustworthy or Jay Z or Kirky J or whoever being a snake or whatever belongs in the 'Hater Rants' thread group (set it up, Mods ) along with their historic /histrionic /hysterical opinions on Prince himself.

It looks to me like Prince had everything sorted as it's likely these 'vast' property holdings belong in a separate corp or trust in which there are further policy documents and instructions from Prince that will never come into dispute in court because they ain't nobody's damn business.

Prince looked after business. Not your business or somebody else's business but HIS business.
In effect he'd become self-managing a long time ago, contracting services and licensing product.
The tittle tattle of 'OMG he's going to end up on a Yoghurt advert' belongs on a separate forum, IMO, one that nobody would set up because they're not stupid enough

[Edited 10/30/16 1:48am]

XSX said:

With respect, if Jay Z was romancing anybody, I think he'd be the one booking flights.
Meanwhile, there's absolutely no way one can jump from 'Jay Z meets Maurice' to 'Maurice selling Prince out' which is the tone of some comments, based upon more media twaddle.

The article does say that Jay-Z flew them out to NY. Maurice & Tyka can't make a decision ATM. That's not to say Jay-Z couldn't invite them out to his offices for champagne and handshakes with some of his other high profile artists.

Also, I've never used the term "selling out" there is no such thing. At some point these recordings will be sold. It's plausible to me that Jay-Z wanted to meet the people who will eventually make that decision.

Making a high profile offer for less than half the reported value of the vault might actually help the estate in the longrun.

Ya'll are so naive...can't get over the amount of Prince fans okay with this.

^

1) Nobody has to be "OK with" anything. It's not our decision and nothing has actually happened.

2) Why wouldn't fans be OK with it? Prince released 3 albums via tidal along with a few other one-off tracks. If Prince was happy with Tidal why wouldn't his fans be?

[Edited 10/30/16 8:36am]

mjscarousal said:

Ya'll are so naive...can't get over the amount of Prince fans okay with this.

We are not okay with anything because we don 't know anything. We also know the difference between licencing and selling unlike TMZ

mjscarousal said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

mjscarousal said:

Ya'll are so naive...can't get over the amount of Prince fans okay with this.

I'm a Prince fan and I could care less. Hell, Suge Knight could buy it as long as it comes out and it's not butchered.

even if its used to sell alcohol or tampons???

luvsexy4all said:

Noodled24 said:

XSX said:

With respect, if Jay Z was romancing anybody, I think he'd be the one booking flights.
Meanwhile, there's absolutely no way one can jump from 'Jay Z meets Maurice' to 'Maurice selling Prince out' which is the tone of some comments, based upon more media twaddle.

The article does say that Jay-Z flew them out to NY. Maurice & Tyka can't make a decision ATM. That's not to say Jay-Z couldn't invite them out to his offices for champagne and handshakes with some of his other high profile artists.

Also, I've never used the term "selling out" there is no such thing. At some point these recordings will be sold. It's plausible to me that Jay-Z wanted to meet the people who will eventually make that decision.

Making a high profile offer for less than half the reported value of the vault might actually help the estate in the longrun.

OK, fair enough. Assuming he flew them out (which sounds to me like the kind of thing a sub-editor adds to pad out an article rather than the result of fact-checking Jay Z's flight bookings, were that possible), let's recap on the fact that Prince has been tight pr getting tight with Mr and Mrs Beyonce since at least 2007, a period during which he's also been tight or getting tight with his sis and her hub.
Given the general confusion and mystery surrounding "the dear departed", I wouldn't think a catchup would be out of the question but we've already firmly established that NPG is in charge of the golden eggs, that they're not included in any (lack of) will and it's as obvious as anything is obvious that were Jay Z to be looking to buy some tracks that aren't for sale or to extend or expand his company's licensing of tracks, he'd probably wanna fly Londell out.

The picture around which this 'story' is built appears to have been arranged with the people in it.
What it shows is a bond between people who had separate bonds with Prince. Kinda like when you introduce a Facebook friend to another Facebook friend and then they appear in a pic together cos they're, like, friends.

As for those saying 'naive' to this 'presumption of innocence', have to say I don't wanna appear in your courts anytime soon.

http://www.vh1.com/news/5...ock-stars/ Great little article

luvsexy4all said:

LittleBLUECorvette said:

mjscarousal said: I'm a Prince fan and I could care less. Hell, Suge Knight could buy it as long as it comes out and it's not butchered.

even if its used to sell alcohol or tampons???

.

Pop music is a commodity, people - not art. Use it to sell anything - it's all about the $$$.

Starbucks Coffee / muffins, maple syrup & Jam etc... would be a step too far. I'd rather they just licence kiss to cosmetics brands.

CAL3 said:

luvsexy4all said:

even if its used to sell alcohol or tampons???

.

Pop music is a commodity, people - not art. Use it to sell anything - it's all about the $$$.

it was not HIS ideology...shouldnt THAT be respected?

luvsexy4all said:

luvsexy4all said:

THe last thing we need is mash-up mix tape of KANYE and PRINCE doing Ballad of Dorothy Parker or some crazy stuff like that.

IT"S ALL TOO SOON......everyone chill...lets u mourn

luvsexy4all said:

CAL3 said:

.

Pop music is a commodity, people - not art. Use it to sell anything - it's all about the $$$.

it was not HIS ideology...shouldnt THAT be respected?

.

In an ideal world, probably. But he apparently didn't plan for any of that.

.

So the bills need to be paid. Time to milk the cash cow, it's the nature of the pop music industry.

mjscarousal said:

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

precioux said: Agree with you. Jay Z is a snake....would never support Tidal. [Edited 10/26/16 11:17am]

Jay Z is a snake, backstabber, horrible business man and person and he doesn't care about Prince or his legacy. I can see it now, him bragging about owning Prince music just like how he bragged about having Prince music on Tidal. He doesn't give a fuq about Prince or preserving his legacy. This is a "business deal" to him.

Amen

laurarichardson said:

mjscarousal said:

Ya'll are so naive...can't get over the amount of Prince fans okay with this.

We are not okay with anything because we don 't know anything. We also know the difference between licencing and selling unlike TMZ

There are Prince fans gleefully cheering and hoping Jay Z purchase Prince songs and I just find that disturbing.

LittleBLUECorvette said:

mjscarousal said:

Ya'll are so naive...can't get over the amount of Prince fans okay with this.

I'm a Prince fan and I could care less. Hell, Suge Knight could buy it as long as it comes out and it's not butchered.

I am a Prince fan and I care. If his music ends up in the wrong hands and ends up with someone who does not want to preserve his legacy it will end up butchered!

CAL3 said:

luvsexy4all said:

it was not HIS ideology...shouldnt THAT be respected?

.

In an ideal world, probably. But he apparently didn't plan for any of that.

.

So the bills need to be paid. Time to milk the cash cow, it's the nature of the pop music industry.

he doesnt need to be exploited to generate income..

luvsexy4all said:

CAL3 said:

.

In an ideal world, probably. But he apparently didn't plan for any of that.

.

So the bills need to be paid. Time to milk the cash cow, it's the nature of the pop music industry.

he doesnt need to be exploited to generate income..

.

How else do you think they'll make any money?

.

And what is the PP tour and the accompanying merch, if not a form of exploitation?

.

I don't want to see cheap, vulgar exploitation, but no one is going to get paid unless they do something. Pop music is, after all, driven by exploitation - that's what separates it from fine art.

BanishedBrian said:

XSX said:

1. MUSIC, MASTERS AND RIGHTS AT NPG. Not 'willable' because it's all wrapped up in whatever policy and other documents are in place at NPG (effectively a fiercely independent and imaginatively radical publishing company, conceived, organised and belonging to Prince that's been around for about 23 years). Everything that is Prince's intellectual property (not owned or entitled to by others like WB) is held there and to be put out or not according to whatever he, The Boss, said.

NPG is an LLC that will ultimately do whatever its member(s) dictate, subject to whatever ongoing contractual arrangements NPG has with third parties. It's possible that Prince was the sole member (most likely), and that the LLC interests were one of the assets of his estate. Alternatively, it's possible that the LLC interests were structured in some other manner. However, either way, Prince is no longer the boss of what NPG does. Whomever now owns the interests in the LLC is the boss. If the new boss decides to make choices that are different than what the old boss would have done, they have complete freedom to do so, subject to whatever ongoing contractual arrangements NPG has to third parties.

Big picture, we have every reason to believe that NPG is going to end up owned by the beneficiaries of the estate (Tyka et al), and they can then do whatever they want with NPG, including selling its assets to Tidal, WB or any other person/entity they choose.

Thanks for this informative summation. You've said it exactly as it is and beyond that lies speculation which, frankly, I prefer, really, to conduct privately as an entertainment. Others, I dig, on here, will do it publicly.
It was cool to catch up and wade through all the stuff since April but I think it arrives pretty much at what you just said.

[Edited 11/3/16 16:01pm]

CAL3 said:

luvsexy4all said:

he doesnt need to be exploited to generate income..

.

How else do you think they'll make any money?

.

And what is the PP tour and the accompanying merch, if not a form of exploitation?

.

I don't want to see cheap, vulgar exploitation, but no one is going to get paid unless they do something. Pop music is, after all, driven by exploitation - that's what separates it from fine art.

the PP tour is not exploitation...there's so many unreleased albums /rehearsal /live material no need to sell it for commmercialism

Looks like Tidal wants it's hands in the pie also.

Check out the link for the rest of the story. Looks like the family isn't to hip on Londell either.

But before the Universal deal was reached on Wednesday, Tidal — which exclusively put out Prince’s final albums “Hit n Run Phase One” and “Hit n Run Phase Two” — was already lobbying a Minnesota court as a creditor in the Prince estate case, claiming that Prince granted Tidal exclusive rights to his vast catalog of master recordings. In 2015, Prince pulled all his music from rival apps such as Spotify, leaving his tunes only on Tidal, a boon to the service when Prince passed. But the terms of the deal were unclear.

Sources tell us that on Oct. 21, Tidal told probate court Judge Kevin Eide, via a legal letter, that it will seek injunctive relief if any deals by Prince’s estate violate its agreement with him, which Tidal asserts included a “Hit n Run” remix album, another new album and rights to his catalog.

Another source close to the situation told us that’s wishful thinking — that Tidal only had a one-year deal to stream Prince’s music, and it’s not entitled to rights going forward.

http://pagesix.com/2016/11/04/tidal-and-universal-go-to-battle-over-prince-tunes/

precioux said:

ladygirl99 said:

Wow really? That is news to me because I read articles when was alive he was pleased with Jay-z deal.

I am currently trying to hunt down the exact quote...it wasn't this huge bashing of Jay-Z, just that he was choosing to move away from the Tidal thing. I have researched EVERYTHING from A-Z, and this was stated. I'm just furious because it's like people have stated "Theives in the temple"...and trying to figure out who the "Jubilant Judas" was. It's as if now that P is gone, the bloodhounds are out.

Ask yourself this too....if Jay-Z and P were on good terms and they were so tight, why have we not heard ANYTHING (that I'm aware of) from Jay-Z's camp? He did nothing for any of the tributes, nor was there for any memorials

Did you ever find it? Because you are right, and I dont recall what interview it was in. This is why I don't trust Jay Z because I know he was not friends with Prince and not as close as these fans are painting them

mjscarousal said:

precioux said:

I am currently trying to hunt down the exact quote...it wasn't this huge bashing of Jay-Z, just that he was choosing to move away from the Tidal thing. I have researched EVERYTHING from A-Z, and this was stated. I'm just furious because it's like people have stated "Theives in the temple"...and trying to figure out who the "Jubilant Judas" was. It's as if now that P is gone, the bloodhounds are out.

Ask yourself this too....if Jay-Z and P were on good terms and they were so tight, why have we not heard ANYTHING (that I'm aware of) from Jay-Z's camp? He did nothing for any of the tributes, nor was there for any memorials

Did you ever find it? Because you are right, and I dont recall what interview it was in. This is why I don't trust Jay Z because I know he was not friends with Prince and not as close as these fans are painting them

.

Precioux: I will never understand why Prince got involved with Jay-Z/Tidal. I don't think they were friends, just collaborating. You are right though, you don't see Jay-Z having anything to do with all the Prince Tributes. He did reference Prince in his song, "All the way up", saying "we got P's vault, safe and sound, aint gonna let the elevator take him down."

.

cloveringold85 said:

mjscarousal said:

Did you ever find it? Because you are right, and I dont recall what interview it was in. This is why I don't trust Jay Z because I know he was not friends with Prince and not as close as these fans are painting them

.

Precioux: I will never understand why Prince got involved with Jay-Z/Tidal. I don't think they were friends, just collaborating. You are right though, you don't see Jay-Z having anything to do with all the Prince Tributes. He did reference Prince in his song, "All the way up", saying "we got P's vault, safe and sound, aint gonna let the elevator take him down."

.

Agree He didn't even go to any of the memorials or personal funeral. He hasn't even toured the Museum yet. Beyonce didn't even stay at the BET awards for the Prince tribute. She just perfomed, tried to overshadow the show and left. These people don't give a fuq about Prince. Jay Z only cares about making his pockets bigger. I wish Prince NEVER got involved with TIDAL!