Todd968 said:

Live albums do not sell as well as studio material. Prince could buck that trend, but i seriously doubt it. More likely we'll get live stuff as a bonus on deluxe releases from specific era's. It'd be the most obvious too. Syracuse with Purple Rain, Birthday from Detroit with Parade, Dortmund with Lovesexy. Executives are not imaginative these days, in fact they're young and stupid. See movies and reboots..

Noodled24 said:

purplerabbithole said:

I am weary of just releasing scraps of music from the vault. I am sure there is brilliance in there, but unless his estate is choosy about what they release, they could do more harm than good. After all, if you never read the Great Gatsby but only read Fitzgerald's half-ass notes in his desk, you might not think he was much of a writer.

The live work is what will cement him as a legend for a long time to come--in the way that live work from the great jazz musicians did.

That's where it is at.

The vault material or at least anything that could be released would need to be in a finished or close to finished state.

The trouble with live releases is that in the 80s/90s Prince cursed a lot. The estate isn't going to put that out so live releases would either need to be heavily edited or from 1999 onwards.

Don't be too sure about that. After the Tribute, with all the cursing going on, I'm inclined to believe that they will not hold back explicit works.

Lovejunky said:

mikeyaddict said:

A website where you could just access all the live shows etc and pay per one you get would make the most sense and just u've then all available. I'd defoe buy at least one show for each tour including the shows I was at.

THIS definately...

He is reported to have recorded every Live SHow...so START with those..

It will also gather a new Army of Fans becasue PRICE LIVE was incomparable, mesmerising, exciting, and entertaining from the second he hits the stage....

The rest of it, let them take their time and do it properly...

FlyOnTheWall said:

Lovejunky said:

THIS definately...

He is reported to have recorded every Live SHow...so START with those..

It will also gather a new Army of Fans becasue PRICE LIVE was incomparable, mesmerising, exciting, and entertaining from the second he hits the stage....

The rest of it, let them take their time and do it properly...

Live shows by deceased artists are not interesting to anyone but their hardcore fans only. 'Army of new fans' my arse. Never has happened for any act, never will. It's all a moot point now anyway.

Marrk said:

FlyOnTheWall said:

Live shows by deceased artists are not interesting to anyone but their hardcore fans only. 'Army of new fans' my arse. Never has happened for any act, never will. It's all a moot point now anyway.

Mark I beg to differ...

If you got to the YOUTUBE Clips available right now...

In the comments you will find People who are just discovering his music and are being blown away..

Comments like * I had no idea * appear all over the place...

One comment from a 15 year old

* I am 15 and mad at my parents for not introducing me to Prince.I cant believe such a person even existed....what have I been listening to *

Yesterday on my facebook I made contact with a woman who only came to know about Prince in April....She is as hardcore as you and I now and commented to me that she feels she missed out by never having seen him live, but is grateful for the FEAST shes been having on youtbe and that she wants to buy everything he ever recorded..

I dont think she is alone...

His music is powerful and gets under your skin....

I stand by what I said...

YOu are of course entitled your YOUR Opinion too....

Some artists are performance artists. When Prince died, the hype around him was that he could play many instruments expertly. This talent is exemplified in the live performances. Plus, since some songs actually sound cooler live than they do in the studio--live albums will impress people the most. He may not get a ton of new fans, but he will get ultra loyal ones who will continue to buy any "new" concert footage that comes out. I too have seen the comment sections under the live clips--people are shocked. Now, he still doesn't have the number of people listening to the clips as say Beyonce (who has 150 millions hits per video), but the limited exposure to Prince in the past is part of the reason. And is it really that expensive to package up and distribute what is already there.

Lovejunky said:

Marrk said:

Live shows by deceased artists are not interesting to anyone but their hardcore fans only. 'Army of new fans' my arse. Never has happened for any act, never will. It's all a moot point now anyway.

Mark I beg to differ...

If you got to the YOUTUBE Clips available right now...

In the comments you will find People who are just discovering his music and are being blown away..

Comments like * I had no idea * appear all over the place...

One comment from a 15 year old

* I am 15 and mad at my parents for not introducing me to Prince.I cant believe such a person even existed....what have I been listening to *

Yesterday on my facebook I made contact with a woman who only came to know about Prince in April....She is as hardcore as you and I now and commented to me that she feels she missed out by never having seen him live, but is grateful for the FEAST shes been having on youtbe and that she wants to buy everything he ever recorded..

I dont think she is alone...

His music is powerful and gets under your skin....

I stand by what I said...

YOu are of course entitled your YOUR Opinion too....

airth said:

Imagine a massive, sprawling release

.

Yup. Dream on.

How many releases per year do you suggest the Estate will do?

So how much of this music will we see in our lifetimes?

Too little!

And thus you'll want to avoid generic live shows with hits being played for the umpteenth time.

You will want the interesting versions, rare covers, improvisations. Pre-show stage banter.

There simply is too much of that stuff.

With all respect for everyone's loss (which I share, too), and everyone's desire to see new material being released (which I share as well), creating a new thread every day expressing that desire, or what one wishes to see released in particular, isn't gonna make it happen anytime sooner or influence the estate in any other way, including content. If they seek our opinion, they'll certainly let us know..

Interesting thoughts from you all. Personally, while I love listening to some live recordings of Prince, they have never been as interesting to me as the studio outtakes. As far as I'm concerned they should focus on studio material as "albums" and release video/dvd/bluray live concerts. That way they won't bite eachother too much.

.

What I secretly hope though, is that they get so many people in to work on the studio releases that we not only get the few albums they may release in the coming years, but also a steady stream of new leaks. For commercial and "quality" reasons they won't release enough for my tastes, or even the right stuff. I doubt they are going to be releasing Prince versions of songs done by others... If they ever release "The Family album, as sung by Prince", I'll eat my words and apologize profusely to whoever wants to hear it, but I doubt it'll ever happen.

.

Release studio work please, and distribute the entire vault to people that might "accidentily" leak!

Revolution said:

Completely agree. I believe the vault songs will mostly disappoint, but he always brought it live!

I don't agree with this comment but I do agree with the main topic that thye should focus on live material.

Care needs to be given to releasing his unreleased songs. For the unreleased music, we need someone who:

1. Very close to him, both professionally and personally. You must have both. If you don't, you may have someone who did not care release songs he'd never want out (e.g. work that fat:) THis person would need to know him well to ensure nothing ws put out against his wishes and since the wishes are not written down anywhere, we'd have to rely on totally on someone knowing Prince very very well. We also need someone who was aware of his music...very intimately well.

Morris Hayes should be some part of this process.

2. I believe this person needs to be able to put the same care into a release that Prince did. His albums all worked well as a whole...almost always. He put a lot of care into the pace, and the whole picture. Each album was a trip. I think he'd leave out better songs (sometimes) b/c they did not fit as well as a lesser song (e.g. She's Alway In MY Hair).....the man was all about the whole picture.

Morris Hayes again..

I keep saying Morris but I only mean that Morris should play a lalrge part (if we wanted) b/c he has actually been around the longest and by his lack of comment since the Man's passing, I believe he must have genuinly cared. I really think Morris should oversee due to his strong personal and professional relatinoship with Prince but he should have era 'experts' like Susan Rogers come in and have some say as well.

So, yet another note from me with advice...

JoeyCococo said:

Revolution said:

Completely agree. I believe the vault songs will mostly disappoint, but he always brought it live!

I don't agree with this comment but I do agree with the main topic that thye should focus on live material.

Care needs to be given to releasing his unreleased songs. For the unreleased music, we need someone who:

1. Very close to him, both professionally and personally. You must have both. If you don't, you may have someone who did not care release songs he'd never want out (e.g. work that fat:) THis person would need to know him well to ensure nothing ws put out against his wishes and since the wishes are not written down anywhere, we'd have to rely on totally on someone knowing Prince very very well. We also need someone who was aware of his music...very intimately well.

Morris Hayes should be some part of this process.

2. I believe this person needs to be able to put the same care into a release that Prince did. His albums all worked well as a whole...almost always. He put a lot of care into the pace, and the whole picture. Each album was a trip. I think he'd leave out better songs (sometimes) b/c they did not fit as well as a lesser song (e.g. She's Alway In MY Hair).....the man was all about the whole picture.

Morris Hayes again..

I keep saying Morris but I only mean that Morris should play a lalrge part (if we wanted) b/c he has actually been around the longest and by his lack of comment since the Man's passing, I believe he must have genuinly cared. I really think Morris should oversee due to his strong personal and professional relatinoship with Prince but he should have era 'experts' like Susan Rogers come in and have some say as well.

So, yet another note from me with advice...

It would be a crime not to have the following released:

Old Friends 4 Sale - the original lyrics, sparse arrangement

All My Dreams - right down to the sped up rap that he put on Ack Me

Adonis and Bathsheba

If It'll Make U Happy - definitely not finished but the melody..so beautiful

endless supply of tracks but they need to be packaged together properly...

purplerabbithole said:

I am weary of just releasing scraps of music from the vault. I am sure there is brilliance in there, but unless his estate is choosy about what they release, they could do more harm than good. After all, if you never read the Great Gatsby but only read Fitzgerald's half-ass notes in his desk, you might not think he was much of a writer.

The live work is what will cement him as a legend for a long time to come--in the way that live work from the great jazz musicians did.

.

Totally agree!

.

As long as all temptation to do any radical remixing, any editing, and (most important of all) any overdubbing, then releasing live material is a much safer bet for doing justice to Prince's legacy.

JoeyCococo said:

1. Very close to him, both professionally and personally. You must have both. If you don't, you may have someone who did not care release songs he'd never want out (e.g. work that fat:)

.

He is dead. His considerations, while alive, simply do not matter anymore. Release the original Wally (not possible, I know), release the original Old Friends For Sale. Release Work That Fat. Now is the time for everyone to get to know the real person that he always partially hid. This gives the opportunity to show a vulnerability that he simply could not bring himself to show while alive.

.

Posthumous releases have advantages over "while alive" releases, you can show the person, warts and all. It will only make people love him more.

.

My opinion anyway.

.

Also, we should not have someone decide on the music that is of the mindset he was at the end of his life. The body of work is from his entire lifespan, so whoever decides should be able to take a step back and see things in context. Being afraid of cursing he did when 20, for instance, is not a good idea, even though he didn't use the same words anymore closer to his death. It would do a major disservice to his memory and legacy to only be guided by how he was at the end of his life. Just as it would be to only focus on his 80's output. You need some emotional distance as an archivist.

26ten said:

There isn't much live material availble to be honest

Lovejunky said:

Marrk said:

Live shows by deceased artists are not interesting to anyone but their hardcore fans only. 'Army of new fans' my arse. Never has happened for any act, never will. It's all a moot point now anyway.

Mark I beg to differ...

If you got to the YOUTUBE Clips available right now...

In the comments you will find People who are just discovering his music and are being blown away..

Comments like * I had no idea * appear all over the place...

One comment from a 15 year old

* I am 15 and mad at my parents for not introducing me to Prince.I cant believe such a person even existed....what have I been listening to *

Yesterday on my facebook I made contact with a woman who only came to know about Prince in April....She is as hardcore as you and I now and commented to me that she feels she missed out by never having seen him live, but is grateful for the FEAST shes been having on youtbe and that she wants to buy everything he ever recorded..

I dont think she is alone...

His music is powerful and gets under your skin....

I stand by what I said...

YOu ar

e of course entitled your YOUR Opinion too....

People are checking out his stuff and are just knocked out. They can put out live and unreleased stuff for years if they do it right.

How do we even know that the live stuff is there? I'm sure he taped the shows then erased them later. You can't logically keep that many shows.

Small Club is great but that is a rare gig. I'd like to have a great Diamonds and Pearls gig.

purplerabbithole said:

I am weary of just releasing scraps of music from the vault. I am sure there is brilliance in there, but unless his estate is choosy about what they release, they could do more harm than good. After all, if you never read the Great Gatsby but only read Fitzgerald's half-ass notes in his desk, you might not think he was much of a writer.

The live work is what will cement him as a legend for a long time to come--in the way that live work from the great jazz musicians did.

That's where it is at.

[Edited 10/14/16 22:54pm]

Purple Rabbithole..

I made a thread for outube Comments on his live and other Performances...

I did it mainly for myself becaue it thrills me to see people STILL Discovering his music and now Comments apprear Daily....

I SO agree with you that LIVE shows are where its at....

Here is the Thread...http://prince.org/msg/7/433003..I mean not as popular as threads containing "Crotch Shots" but Ill continue to add to it because as I discover clips that I havent seen myself, I become so overwhelmed with LOVE and Affection for Prince that Im compelled to note what other People say...

and it just makes me so happy and proud of the way he lived his life.....

Till the end he was working and working at his music and on himself...

Prince in a word

INSPIRING

Cool

Lovejunky said:

purplerabbithole said:

I am weary of just releasing scraps of music from the vault. I am sure there is brilliance in there, but unless his estate is choosy about what they release, they could do more harm than good. After all, if you never read the Great Gatsby but only read Fitzgerald's half-ass notes in his desk, you might not think he was much of a writer.

The live work is what will cement him as a legend for a long time to come--in the way that live work from the great jazz musicians did.

That's where it is at.

[Edited 10/14/16 22:54pm]

Purple Rabbithole..

I made a thread for outube Comments on his live and other Performances...

I did it mainly for myself becaue it thrills me to see people STILL Discovering his music and now Comments apprear Daily....

I SO agree with you that LIVE shows are where its at....

Here is the Thread...http://prince.org/msg/7/433003..I mean not as popular as threads containing "Crotch Shots" but Ill continue to add to it because as I discover clips that I havent seen myself, I become so overwhelmed with LOVE and Affection for Prince that Im compelled to note what other People say...

and it just makes me so happy and proud of the way he lived his life.....

Till the end he was working and working at his music and on himself...

Prince in a word

INSPIRING

Personally, i prefer to listen to music recording studio material than live versions ; it is more polished and more accurate (and with a better sound) than live versions that are often a little akward ; for example i don't listen too much Miles Davis live, i prefer to listen to by far his studio tracks.

Of course, Prince was a great live performer, and some songs sound better live than the music recording studio version (i think for example of the live version of 'Screwdriver' which is much better than the one on HNR 2 in my opinion).

But, overall, if you take care of the quality of sound, the accuracy of the playing, the music recording studio version for me is the real deal.

[Edited 10/18/16 2:40am]

[Edited 10/18/16 2:41am]

[Edited 10/18/16 2:43am]

mediumdry said:

He is dead. His considerations, while alive, simply do not matter anymore.

.

Posthumous releases have advantages over "while alive" releases, you can show the person, warts and all. It will only make people love him more.

.

Just... wow...

.

I don't think I've ever disagreed more strongly with something I've seen stated on this site.

.

And yes, it's your opinion - but it is utterly appalling...

.

I was going to say more, but I don't even know where to start.

2freaky4church1 said:

How do we even know that the live stuff is there? I'm sure he taped the shows then erased them later. You can't logically keep that many shows.

Yes, you can. Dave the engineer said he built a screening room in Paisley Park were all of the live video of the show was kept. Prince recorded all of his shows to watch later like game tape.

I am sure he may have erased some but it appears he kept many of the videos. I really have no words for anyone who does not know this by this time.

they'll have to start with the PR remaster....its what they add that will cause others to seek out MORE. put on there the 8/3/83 dvd and ext b-sides...that would make people take interest

luvsexy4all said:

they'll have to start with the PR remaster....its what they add that will cause others to seek out MORE. put on there the 8/3/83 dvd and ext b-sides...that would make people take interest

DVD?

Bluray please.

Give me a reason to buy such a device.

And release many, release often because there's so little time.

Noodled24 said:

purplerabbithole said:

I am weary of just releasing scraps of music from the vault. I am sure there is brilliance in there, but unless his estate is choosy about what they release, they could do more harm than good. After all, if you never read the Great Gatsby but only read Fitzgerald's half-ass notes in his desk, you might not think he was much of a writer.

The live work is what will cement him as a legend for a long time to come--in the way that live work from the great jazz musicians did.

That's where it is at.

The vault material or at least anything that could be released would need to be in a finished or close to finished state.

The trouble with live releases is that in the 80s/90s Prince cursed a lot. The estate isn't going to put that out so live releases would either need to be heavily edited or from 1999 onwards.

What the fuck?

In a way, it's already too late. We already have the good stuff, or at least for the curious, there is still stuff to be found. But the essential, we already have it.

I was listening to the latest "Moonbeam Levels" (from last year) , and smiled at how long I've been waiting for this, and how I got my kicks off of a hissy 33rd generation tape for many years.

Some posts on YT suggest that not everyone has the ultimate pristine All My Dreams.
I've recently discovered Dance Electric by Prince and the Revolution in studio quality.

1986: A Year In The Life is so darn near perfect that it's going to take one heck of an official release to top that. And therefore to get my money.

The hunt for treasures is still open, and for me it includes live, cleaner outtakes, and alternate versions.
I'm not waiting or expecting anything from the estate at this point.

The museum farce, from guitar-licking Lenny-likes to ashtrays in shape of a miniature toilet,
restrains me from believing they know how to handle all of this.

CAL3 said:

mediumdry said:

He is dead. His considerations, while alive, simply do not matter anymore.

.

Posthumous releases have advantages over "while alive" releases, you can show the person, warts and all. It will only make people love him more.

.

Just... wow...

.

I don't think I've ever disagreed more strongly with something I've seen stated on this site.

.

And yes, it's your opinion - but it is utterly appalling...

.

I was going to say more, but I don't even know where to start.

.

I admit that my shorthand notation comes across a bit insensitive, but I didn't mean it that way. What I'm saying, is that Prince did not leave a will. He did not instruct people on what to release when and how. (that I know of, correct me if I'm wrong)

.

Prince changed his mind on things a lot during his lifetime. It seems hardly fair to only look at his legacy through the lense of what he was at the end. While Prince was alive, every release reflected his view on his art and what he wanted to bring across at that time. This is simply not true anymore.

.

Posthumous releases are generally, apart from a moneygrab, meant to shed some more light on specific timeperiods or specific styles of the artist. So any release should be considered from that point of view, not what Prince might think of it, especially since if you were to fill a room with Princes from different periods, you'd probably get more arguments than agreements. (it would be an interesting room to be a fly on the wall in though)

.

I hope they do not get people that want to have some kind of artistic input in the matter. We need archivists and music scholars that can work well with marketers and create something that honours the legacy of Prince. From the beginning to the end, and not with the mindset of Prince in any part of his journey. Because doing that would diminish his legacy and would be, in my mind, a travesty.

.

So, with that framing, I believe that Prince's wishes, whatever they may have been at any given time, are not relevant in the choices that will have to be made for the coming posthumous releases.

[Edited 10/19/16 2:03am]

mediumdry said:

.

I admit that my shorthand notation comes across a bit insensitive, but I didn't mean it that way. What I'm saying, is that Prince did not leave a will. He did not instruct people on what to release when and how. (that I know of, correct me if I'm wrong)

.

Prince changed his mind on things a lot during his lifetime. It seems hardly fair to only look at his legacy through the lense of what he was at the end. While Prince was alive, every release reflected his view on his art and what he wanted to bring across at that time. This is simply not true anymore.

.

Posthumous releases are generally, apart from a moneygrab, meant to shed some more light on specific timeperiods or specific styles of the artist. So any release should be considered from that point of view, not what Prince might think of it, especially since if you were to fill a room with Princes from different periods, you'd probably get more arguments than agreements. (it would be an interesting room to be a fly on the wall in though)

.

I hope they do not get people that want to have some kind of artistic input in the matter. We need archivists and music scholars that can work well with marketers and create something that honours the legacy of Prince. From the beginning to the end, and not with the mindset of Prince in any part of his journey. Because doing that would diminish his legacy and would be, in my mind, a travesty.

.

So, with that framing, I believe that Prince's wishes, whatever they may have been at any given time, are not relevant in the choices that will have to be made for the coming posthumous releases.

[Edited 10/19/16 2:03am]

.

I appreciate your expansion of your thoughts on this topic. I do think you're contradicting yourself somewhat though.

.

I hope they do not get people that want to have some kind of artistic input in the matter.

.

I believe that Prince's wishes, whatever they may have been at any given time, are not relevant in the choices that will have to be made for the coming posthumous releases.

.

We can't have it both ways. I agree about not wanting people have artistic iinput in the way the posthumous releases are handled. So how can Prince's wishes - whatever can be ascertained at this point, obviously - not be the guiding principles used in determining the shape of posthumous releases?

.

As you said, inevitably there will be choices made. As you pointed out, we're not aware at this time of any kind of definitive blueprint left by Prince on how to handle - short of that, there will be some manner of artistic input by outside parties.

Prince recorded every single concert, at least during the past ten years or more and literally hundreds more were professionally filmed, so there's plenty.

As for 'delaying' the unheard songs, we've not heard a single note since Prince passed, so I think the delay is already very real as the estate are more focused on paisley theme parks and trying to organise tribute gigs properly.

Some of those unreleased songs are pure classics and are part of music history. They are Prince's legacy and they deserve to be released.

There are many fans here now who are so almost purely due to the quality of these leaked recordings.

OperatingThetan said:

Prince recorded every single concert, at least during the past ten years or more and literally hundreds more were professionally filmed, so there's plenty.

.

There simply is too much.

We need at least a single CD per month for the next ten years to make an interesting start.