bonatoc said:

When we consider the frantic pace of the midst of the eighties, it's understandable that you can't follow everything. Especially if you fear that delegate is going to be perceived as a sign of weakness.

Thankfully, few are given a drive such as Prince's.
It turned out to be an incredible burden as much as an incredible gift.

Such was Skipper. It's a life lived in studios, for the most part.
What it is? Sacrifice.

I can understand how this sacrifice can impress some to the point of sacralization.
It's no little feat.

Im hearing you and have spent a long time contemplating the Idea that his incredible gift was an incredible burden....

He never dropped that Ball....

Thats what is so Impressive..

And on Sacrifice...

I might start a whole new thread on that, its a worthy exploration, if only to reveal my own weaknesses to myself...

man was amazing, that's the biggest reason I'm having trouble that his passing was just pills. Men like that are unusual, high achievers, people gifted with an inhuman constitution. I mean if we were to try to quantify how much he did in comparison with other artists of similar caliber, how would we do it? and how much more did he do than so many others? 25 times more? 100 times more? more? What I'm saying is guys like that, if you've seen the movie Unbroken, bout Louis Zamperini you'd see a perfect example of a guy who just has an incredible constitution. George Carlin once said that his success was at least partly genetic and that anyone who had his kind of success just has great genes for enduring an inhuman amount of work/bullshit/discouragement/fatigue. I don't know how true or not true it is, but I'd think that idea has some truth to it and prince was the epitome of a freak of nature in that regard, like Duke Ellington or Beethoven, guys who would be railing at death even as it's taking them away. Prince was of that cloth.

Lovejunky said:

bonatoc said:

When we consider the frantic pace of the midst of the eighties, it's understandable that you can't follow everything. Especially if you fear that delegate is going to be perceived as a sign of weakness.

Thankfully, few are given a drive such as Prince's.
It turned out to be an incredible burden as much as an incredible gift.

Such was Skipper. It's a life lived in studios, for the most part.
What it is? Sacrifice.

I can understand how this sacrifice can impress some to the point of sacralization.
It's no little feat.

Im hearing you and have spent a long time contemplating the Idea that his incredible gift was an incredible burden....

He never dropped that Ball....

Thats what is so Impressive..

And on Sacrifice...

I might start a whole new thread on that, its a worthy exploration, if only to reveal my own weaknesses to myself...

Oh dear. Are you sure you're having a healthy relationship to Prince?

I don't think he ever dissed some other artist for not being able to work as hard as he did.
He knew he had the gift of stamina too. He knew he was very lucky.
He was essential to him to have the audience understand that what he had was given, before being transfigured through hard work.
Hence the recurring Special Thanks 2 God, "God (vocal)", the whole Lovesexy era.

It's not the burden that fascinates me, it's "Data Bank" and "Susan, fade the shit out, I'm trough".
The humour, the craft, the fun, the good spirit.
That was all it was about.

Escape, free yo mind from this rat race:
Life is just a game,
We're all just the same.

[Edited 10/11/16 22:49pm]

bonatoc said:

I think he also believed that this was common to all humans, and also his friends, hence the side projects. I really think he wanted "The Family" and "Jill Jones" to succeed on their own.
But the stimulis and the sources of inspiration were too many, coming too quick, from every side.

When we consider the frantic pace of the midst of the eighties, it's understandable that you can't follow everything. Especially if you fear that delegate is going to be perceived as a sign of weakness.

Thankfully, few are given a drive such as Prince's.
It turned out to be an incredible burden as much as an incredible gift.

Such was Skipper. It's a life lived in studios, for the most part.
What it is? Sacrifice.

I can understand how this sacrifice can impress some to the point of sacralization.
It's no little feat.

You've always had a creative way with words, bonatoc, whether I agree with you or not. I am glad you came back here to share your thoughts.

[Edited 10/11/16 22:50pm]

also, as I read about Bruce Springsteens recent trip to seattle and the fawning of fans when they met him, i was reminded of the people on here who have to take it upon themselves to humanize a guy like Bruce. In the comments section people were comparing bruce to a religious figure, and to some of us, he's very close to a religious figure, of course there were the naysayers telling people to get a life. who knows what gets into them, maybe they are jealous, miserable or maybe it's just how humans act when there is any semblance of a collective, you know, how any time you get a group of people together, each takes on different roles, leader/clown/outsider etc.., Maybe some people just feel like filling the role of the doubting thomas. Of course they have a point, humans are just humans, but i believe that as joseph campbell said, all of the gods and all of the devils are within us, some people tap into the good things more than others and vice versa.

PeteSilas said:

also, as I read about Bruce Springsteens recent trip to seattle and the fawning of fans when they met him, i was reminded of the people on here who have to take it upon themselves to humanize a guy like Bruce. In the comments section people were comparing bruce to a religious figure, and to some of us, he's very close to a religious figure, of course there were the naysayers telling people to get a life. who knows what gets into them, maybe they are jealous, miserable or maybe it's just how humans act when there is any semblance of a collective, you know, how any time you get a group of people together, each takes on different roles, leader/clown/outsider etc.., Maybe some people just feel like filling the role of the doubting thomas. Of course they have a point, humans are just humans, but i believe that as joseph campbell said, all of the gods and all of the devils are within us, some people tap into the good things more than others and vice versa.

Uh, I went to see Bruce Springsteen give a talk about his autobiography last week and I certainly don't consider him as some kind of "rock god." Nor did I meet any people who did. Maybe I haven't run into the kind of people who think Bruce is a "rock god" in all these years... I hope I never do. Nor have I run into Prince fans in real life who thought he was some kind of "music messiah." Only on the internet...

see what i mean? I didn't say that fella, i'm just saying that some people said it on a comment section, a woman who had met him, i don't know, I just don't feel comfortable myself telling people what to think or feel about things. If you think a pile of shit is god, i wouldn't argue with you one bit. but i realize not everyone is that liberal.

PeteSilas said:

see what i mean? I didn't say that fella, i'm just saying that some people said it on a comment section, a woman who had met him, i don't know, I just don't feel comfortable myself telling people what to think or feel about things. If you think a pile of shit is god, i wouldn't argue with you one bit. but i realize not everyone is that liberal.

I ddn't disagree with you, Pete. I know you were commenting on what other people said. I was just responding to your comment about what other people said. No reflection on you personally. If it came off like that, then I apologize. What people mean to say gets lost on the internet...

bonatoc said:

purplethunder3121 said:

Anyone looking to a mere human being for total self-identity and salvation will be sorely disappointed in the end...

It's what striving for perfection is. Or rather, growing.
You foresee a better version of yourself.
In the end, you never get there, and so you keep on growing. An even better version.
If one wants to keep on growing, it has to be unattainable: God is a concept, as Lennon would say.

[Edited 10/11/16 19:44pm]

I wonder if Prince's apparent strong desire to better himself and his striving for perfection could have possibly stemmed from a guilt-inducing upbringing and perhaps was later reinforced by his JW's beliefs and the message that people need to prove themselves by doing "the work" (i.e. salvation based on merit, the carrot principle) rather than just accepting Christ's sacrifice (salvation by faith) and the reality that God's creation - of which humans are part of - is very good (Genesis 1:31) although not perfect .

.

[Edited 10/12/16 12:32pm]

CherryMoon57 said:

bonatoc said:

It's what striving for perfection is. Or rather, growing.
You foresee a better version of yourself.
In the end, you never get there, and so you keep on growing. An even better version.
If one wants to keep on growing, it has to be unattainable: God is a concept, as Lennon would say.

[Edited 10/11/16 19:44pm]

I wonder if Prince's apparent strong desire to better himself and his striving for perfection could have possibly stemmed from a guilt-inducing upbringing and perhaps was later reinforced by his JW's beliefs and the message that people need to prove themselves by doing "the work" (i.e. salvation based on merit, the carrot principle) rather than just accepting Christ's sacrifice (salvation by faith) and the reality that God's creation - of which humans are part of - is very good (Genesis 1:31) although not perfect .

[Edited 10/12/16 12:32pm]

bonatoc said:

Lovejunky said:

Im hearing you and have spent a long time contemplating the Idea that his incredible gift was an incredible burden....

He never dropped that Ball....

Thats what is so Impressive..

And on Sacrifice...

I might start a whole new thread on that, its a worthy exploration, if only to reveal my own weaknesses to myself...

Oh dear. Are you sure you're having a healthy relationship to Prince?

I don't think he ever dissed some other artist for not being able to work as hard as he did.
He knew he had the gift of stamina too. He knew he was very lucky.
He was essential to him to have the audience understand that what he had was given, before being transfigured through hard work.
Hence the recurring Special Thanks 2 God, "God (vocal)", the whole Lovesexy era.

It's not the burden that fascinates me, it's "Data Bank" and "Susan, fade the shit out, I'm trough".
The humour, the craft, the fun, the good spirit.
That was all it was about.

Escape, free yo mind from this rat race:
Life is just a game,
We're all just the same.

[Edited 10/11/16 22:49pm]

You are kidding right ?

There are threads pages and pages long on this forum,speculating about Princes Death, Implicating his sister, his best Friend, Judith Hill, so many freaking Conspiracy Theories, even flipping hundreds of " Crotch Shots" .

People spend hours "Chewing the Chewed" thats just fine..?

I am here saying Im spiritually inspired by a life , that has caused me to Introspect with a mind to improve myself and you are questioning whether THIS is Healthy ???

hmmmmmmm

[Edited 10/12/16 23:40pm]

^ I'm sorry, I just wanted to make sure you were on positive rails.

I mean, if I had to compare myself to Prince to list my weaknesses,
I'll end up tiny like a mouse in the process.
It would depress me to the bone.

But I misunderstood. Glad to see it's all constructive.
And hugs for the kind words.

bonatoc said:

^ I'm sorry, I just wanted to make sure you were on positive rails.

I mean, if I had to compare myself to Prince to list my weaknesses,
I'll end up tiny like a mouse in the process.
It would depress me to the bone.

But I misunderstood. Glad to see it's all constructive.
And hugs for the kind words.

Belle réponse.....Merci
tu es adorable

PeteSilas said:

man was amazing, that's the biggest reason I'm having trouble that his passing was just pills. Men like that are unusual, high achievers, people gifted with an inhuman constitution. I mean if we were to try to quantify how much he did in comparison with other artists of similar caliber, how would we do it? and how much more did he do than so many others? 25 times more? 100 times more? more? What I'm saying is guys like that, if you've seen the movie Unbroken, bout Louis Zamperini you'd see a perfect example of a guy who just has an incredible constitution. George Carlin once said that his success was at least partly genetic and that anyone who had his kind of success just has great genes for enduring an inhuman amount of work/bullshit/discouragement/fatigue. I don't know how true or not true it is, but I'd think that idea has some truth to it and prince was the epitome of a freak of nature in that regard, like Duke Ellington or Beethoven, guys who would be railing at death even as it's taking them away. Prince was of that cloth.

Im hearing you PeteSilas...

Its the Pill thing that makes it hard...Had he died of some disease or natural causes or in a Plane Crash we would not be left wondering....

I think those of us with compasionate hearts are choked up by the notion that he was taking something dangerous in order to cope with what must of been a hella lot of pain becasue we KNOW the Beautiful ONE was ordainairy every day NO DRUG Addict ..

He may have become dependant ;but as a means to an end..

He was not taking anything to BLUR out a miserable existance..or addle his mind.

He lived with an almost Supernatural Clarity about why he was here, what he had to do and where he wanted to end up....

He was in pain and that HURTS so bad...to know HE was HURTING...

Personally..I dont buy into the theories that he was hiding his dependance due to stigma or whatever...From what I have come to understand of him, He Would not have wanted anyone to worry about him..Such was his LOVE for Us...

He carried the pain like a personal burden so that WE would not have to....

That Simple....

And to bring this back ON TOPIC....

I do believe that his connection to the Divine, GOD,

and his intense desire for the afterlife took him there,

That idea has given me comfort....

[Edited 10/13/16 2:31am]

CherryMoon57 said:

bonatoc said:

It's what striving for perfection is. Or rather, growing.
You foresee a better version of yourself.
In the end, you never get there, and so you keep on growing. An even better version.
If one wants to keep on growing, it has to be unattainable: God is a concept, as Lennon would say.

[Edited 10/11/16 19:44pm]

I wonder if Prince's apparent strong desire to better himself and his striving for perfection could have possibly stemmed from a guilt-inducing upbringing and perhaps was later reinforced by his JW's beliefs and the message that people need to prove themselves by doing "the work" (i.e. salvation based on merit, the carrot principle) rather than just accepting Christ's sacrifice (salvation by faith) and the reality that God's creation - of which humans are part of - is very good (Genesis 1:31) although not perfect .

I think we “owe” Prince in large parts to:

1. The two hours spent crying in the phone booth
2. Bernadette Anderson

Like Madonna losing her mother, MJ confronting his father and going solo — just to cite the most obvious object-of-insane-cults victims: the potence of the zeal is often related to the number of zeroes one amasses, and it grows in people who are not aware how much capitalism fucks with their heads, through apposite and well chosen christic imagery.

The Sports industry built its business on catholic agonism.
Your Nike is what is going to make you overcome your life sufferings.

Some life events happen to transform you.
And being someone’s progeny is an event.
It’s not something you were able to control.

Moreover, it’s hard to grasp, no matter who the parent is.
“Why was I born from this person? Is it a good or a bad thing, now that I’m seven and I see they’re capable of lying and deceiving?”.

Or, more complicated, what kind of parent he/she is to YOU.
Because there are also very good people being very poor parents.
Or being a poor parent ONLY TO YOU (concept scarier than Freddy if you ask me).
Or, literally very poor.
It goes on and on and on.

The only really bitter thing I’ve personally found is that your Inner Child
gets constantly amputated in the process of acceptance of the world as it is.

That is why artists see the world as it should be.
Because the state of the world pisses’ em off.

No matter how hard it gets, no matter if they starve, no mayonnaise on the potatoes,
they continue to be pissed off by what's going on.
The adolescent faith in them will not be defeated.
Cupid will reign supreme.

Take a look at this kinda depressed Jobs.

He ain’t starving, but here he speaks with a hundred million bucks of debt: minus $50M in Next Computers, a non-profitable (or so it seemed at the time, its engineers created OS X and subsequently iOS) company, and an another minus $50M in Pixar, a confidential studio which makes animated shorts with bureau lamps, very nice but that’s not the way to make money if you ask me.

So when Steve Jobs gives this interview, he’s broke, and the whole Silicon Valley,
while respectful of its 1980-to-1984 achievements, thinks he’s a museum piece, a loser from the past
who "doesn’t get where we're at now".

Did Jobs turn into a bitter person, an alcoholic, a fool?
Fuck no, the Inner Child is still there, alive under this untidy tired beard.
He’s still pissed off at how a mess the adults made of the world, only because they became too lazy to fix it.
The Inner Child has a stamina that goes for ever.

Six months after this simple advice (see how the publisher of the video is himself subject to idolatry? “Secrets of Life” doesn’t reflect it at all), Steve Jobs goes back home and tears the roof down.
There’s more to the picture than meets the eye, as most always Neil Young is right.

I feel we witnessed a miracle in 1986: Prince embodied the Inner Child triumphant,
the “Teen That Got It All Figured Out By Himself”, the fucking American Dream himself.

I, I, Eye, I am the continental principality of America! I am a bird of prey! I will not be compelled!

A split, a swoosh, plate eyes, a grin, and his voice, unstoppable, not even compressed, his lungs connected to his stomach connected to his pelvis shaken, contrived, bashed. Like Ringo yelling “I’ve got blisters on my fingers!”, Prince’s pelvis yells: “I got Life in my balls!”.

Well, that’s no mere human being.

Especially when he apologizes for winning all the Lottery tickets with “Pop Life” (a real “tête à claques” song).
But when “Purple Rain” comes, seems to come the real reason all these hours were spent in the studios: Prince was terrified at the idea to have his heart broken one more time.

Sex is, as often with Prince (and some horny zealots don’t get it), a metaphor.
But sex is also the unstoppable, gosh-we-shouldn’t-do-that, divorce-inducing energy.
Prince was in constant search for the origins, the problematics, the solutions, the aches, the ecstasies that come with physical and emotional interactions. He knew his parents were not living together because of that.

His main, central subject is Love. You try to split physical and emotions, it works for a while until you realize they’re the same. So you try to make a whole, but then a new desire calls. You ache, and you hurt in return if you ache too much.

When Prince screams in “The Beautiful Ones”, he’s pissed off at God, Susannah, Vanity, and himself. And he wants the teens to relate to this. He knows that these burdens are shared amongst all of us. And that they can be excruciating for the Inner Child when it first hits her/him.

“When You Were Mine” is not about a threesome (there’s a difference between being a critic who knows how to let his Inner Child speak, and a childish critic).

What this song really states, is that when you cheat, you fatally bring in a third person into the couple. That’s what “sleeping in between the two of us” means, you pathetic it-all-comes-down-to-the-dick-and-the-pussy schmucks. “When he was there” — He wasn’t physically there, for crying out loud. If it was the case, he would have chosen a “Head” or “Jack U Off” groove. A joyous mood. Prince is sad because he lost his Girl, he doesn’t regret the threesomes, foursomes, whatever happened. He loved her so much he was even ready to accept the emotional presence with another man, but in the end she leaves anyway. That’s all. Just another big emotional trauma.

There was probably, in Prince’s life, as with many of ours, the Big Bang Heartbreak.
The original, the fundamental one.

Be it by a parent, a girlfriend, your friends, and later your associates. The only moments of Prince revealing his frailty were laid on tape, but of course other happened in his life, the hours, the days, the nights, you know the drill.

So should we make him a saint because he turned his heartbreaks into spiritual stadium anthems? No.

Simply because, as any other human being, Prince fought back. He hurt people.
That, no matter the talents and the graces bestowed upon, is sadly very human.


We got a much softer Prince once he had some time to look back.
That is why the “Reflection” performance with Wendy is a miracle.
Prince had become such an extra-introvert, that when he says “sorry” to Wendy, he does it on public television, through singing a song about suspending time.
But that still does not explain what happens in the intertwining of the two acoustic guitars. For a brief moment, there is something otherworldly happening, an event. Call it the "Spirit of Christopher Tracy" or "4:20", it’s all the same.
It's tempting to get religious with such moments of unexplainable, humble beauty.


“If I did drugs, I’d offer you a joint but I’m gonna offer you a tape instead”.
Songs like joints. Prince’s scope was to get higher.
Without pills, thrills, or daffodils.
But that was the scope.
The goal. The Ladder. Life, as the bitch she is, always make sure you get hurt in the process.

Parenting. Being born. Be in love.
Falling in love when you thought you were truly happy.

Do they “happen to” happen, or do they “happen”?
If you believe in the latter, you’re inclined to bring in celestial or cosmic events to explain or justify.
Or, you can go all pragmatic and reduce everything to freudian traumas.

But the end result of a trauma is never guaranteed.
It’s probable God (or whatever you feel calling the Presence) plant seeds on a regular basis. But the number of variables (just turning a street corner and bumping into someone can change your existence) are so many, we’ve left with very few pieces of the puzzle to trace the origin. Astrophysicist can look for the Big Bang’s origins because they deal with objects.
We try to find out the original motivations, but in an human being.

But if we’re just able to take a few minutes to write about this important matter, because other lives are expecting our interactions during the day, how can I pretend to truly grasp somebody else’s hours, days, nights, weeks, months, years?

Is there even a point?


Ain’t this feelings archeology vain, even if laudable is its thirst for truth and inspiration?

Eye, as a “spiritual pragmatic”, see it this way: in the end, it’s what SKipper did with events AND emotions that’s a thing to wonder.
What he did with the events God sent his way: his thirst to spend hours lost into playing the piano instead of going outside and play could have turned him into another good keyboardist. We’re many in that case.

Viva the thirst for playing an instrument, it’s a gift God gives everyone, we just lose time doing something else.
It all boils down to the amount and the quality of the mayonnaise you wish on your potatoes.
Some zealots are in awe of Prince because he actually got his mayonnaise from guitar solos.

Should we thank the Good Lord Prince got that distorted vision (as each one of us have of Prince, and of our parents) about John L., being this Cool Cat hanging in clubs, making people dance, getting the ladies eyes?

Should we thank Joe Jackson to be so hard on Michael?
Would there ever be a Michael Jackson®?

The traumas induced by your parent(s)/lovers/friends happen in everyone’s life. They’re just magnified when they become a biography about a public person. With stars, we chose to have a projection of ourselves on display, it’s easier for understanding our own mechanisms. Or just get lost in your childood dreams. A dangerous path for the Inner Child, nostalgia.
He can stay trapped forever in it. That’s how I prefer to think about zealots, extremists, etc. They just think that going back is the way to cure their pain.
They’re pissed off at life, because it goes forward. They better accept it.
But their Inner Child is so trapped in childish melancholy that it makes them
see themselves as Superman rotating the earth in reverse.

But one's initial trauma cannot be mistaken for the cause:
the stamina comes from unacceptance, from rebellion, from refusing for things to continue the way the are.
The Inner Child wants to start a Revolution.
The Inner Child wants to astound/spank/avenge/hurt/[pick yours] his parents/lovers/friends/[pick one].

You can have a trauma, and make nothing much out of it.
You can have a trauma that leaves you speechless, joyless for many days/weeks/months/years.


I guess it all depends on how much teeth the Inner Child is left with, fight after fight after fight.

If some of us look up to Prince the human being, and see more than mere flesh,
it’s mostly, on an unconscious level, for seeing him taking so much bruises (some self-inflicted, like splits and sleep deprivations)
and having turn them into fun times.


A damn transmogrifier.
How can you not love a guy like that?
He's a hero alright. On earth as...



"Inner Child" is a trademark of the "Supreme Inner Child of the 7th Galaxy Church".
Thou shalt be torn to pieces by our international staff of lawyers were you tempted to use it for you own purposes.
We don't even have a logo, just to tell you how much we care about our copyrights.
Only members can see it. Only High Members can truly see the Member.
Quick, become a dick yourself for only $7.77 a month for a "Mistra Know-it-all" self-comforting booklet full of shit.

[Edited 10/13/16 5:22am]

^Sorry bonatoc, you kinda lost me a little so I am not sure what your precise point is (I'm working on it though).

I was saying that often people are made to feel inadequate about themselves and therefore can be easily "led" to feel that they have a responsibility to "fix" themselves/people/the world. The reason for this could be because of a childhood-originated sense of guilt (it is not uncommon for children to feel responsible about their parents' relationship issues for example) and as a result, and the media/society helping, becoming conditioned to feel that they are required to invest time and effort in [organisation name here] in order to validate themselves or "becoming worthy" by obtaining some form of reward, whether it be in the form of a medal, money, fame, positive feedback from others or a promised man-made and hard to obtain ideal of "paradise".

I was then contrasting this with the original christian message that we are valued by God as we are and that the ultimate goal to be one with God (seen as heaven) is accessible to all, regardless of our talent/actions/looks etc. Which does not of course reject or disregard talent, art, positive contributions to society or the amazing work that a lot of people (God inspired or not) achieve on this planet of course, but it is basically that in the original christian message, God's love is unconditional (the only condition being to believe it sincerely (faith) - as opposed to a belief tainted with society's flaws and deception). It might sound like blind faith to some, but that kind of "faith" is already applied by most people without them even realising, for example you wouldn't get in your car every morning if you didn't have the faith that it was going to work, even if cars do fail a lot and often... Or the faith to consider everything that comes from the media/academic authorities as a valid source, even though the majority of people do not verify any of the information given to them.

I am not entirely sure what Prince believed exactely, or whether he still felt that he owed something to someone / an organisation in the end... not sure either if you agreed with this or not, or simply added some thoughts you had, but I appreciate your very interesting response nonetheless.

^ I'm totally with you.

I just think faith is feeling. Looking for perfection is a call for judgement.
If your parent is judgemental towards you, you will miss his/her/both judgement once you're not his/her/their child anymore.
That's twisted, but alas natural. Or maybe it comes naturally in families growing under the capitalist way of life,
where everything, included how much fun in life you're having, is subject to the judgment of your friends,
families, pairs.

I wish for the human being of the 21st century to get rid of that.
That fear is what makes you an employee.
Someone in service of someone.

See how we're brainwashed? I bet your first thought is to argue that there's nothing bad with being an employee.
That's exactly the behaviour expected, thank you. Now go to bed, you get up early tomorrow morning.

I think transfiguring the faith comes from the realization of these own past skewed views.
One's faith has to evolve, it has to be put under scrutiny once in a while, if only for its own sake.

Psycho-analysis is helpful to some, because it introduces a third eye.
It's not you and your ego anymore, there's a witness in the room while you make them speak to each other.
It can make your beliefs shift over time.
For the best (usually) or the worse.
Worse, "worse" in this case is an inevitable phase to understand yourself,
and how an environment can alter you from the start.

People tend not to look into the mirror for too long.
Faith is the courage to look at yourself and your real place in the world.
Distractions (Candy Crush, a Blu-Ray, fucking another person than the one you're living with, the list goes on)
are easy to come by, because introspection is the first cause of stopping consuming.
And the main goal is to capitalize on this particular human weakness that is not to look at oneself,
to make introspection look goofy, or acceptable if it's in a $300 subscription Yoga Club.

It's of course allowed in Hollywood, using mascots like Yoda, Matt Damon, Di Caprio, Bono.
Ah, it's so beautiful to introspect, once in a while. Pass the pop corn, please.

The prophets, apostles, and other (true) rock stars took the road because
the stage shows everything. The stage does not forgive, except if you are on auto-tune of course.
The stage shows if you have balls or not. If you're a poser, or the shit.

Prince's faith was an ever-evolving, ever questioned quest for the truth.
On "Emancipation" the album, you have the psycho-analyst, the self-analysis,
the comparison to God, the paranoia (where everyone tries to break your heart, everyone except for you).

Prince questioned God, up until Boy Gregory's departure,
and I wish Dirty Larry didn't show up just then, but he did.
And so no hip surgery.

Now that tells you a lot about faith.
The minute you're too much in pain, anything goes to soothe.
If half of your family dies in bombing, you dive into faith, especially
if it promises to bring it all back home.
But faith can be so potent, that it can be about a stranger in that situation,
and blind empathy makes you see a way to redeem all that is wrong in your own life.

Faith.

Same with addicts of any kind: when you're too much in pain,

you grab the SUV and you walk nervously across the parking lot,
all common sense is lost, there is only the pain and you just want it to stop.
You're waiting for your man. The Damage Done.

No offense to the believers, but I think the JW conversion is a direct result of Prince's child death.
I cannot begin to grasp what went on in his mind.
All those sacrifices of hard work for that?
Working on being monogamous just for that?
What did I do to deserve this?

The rest is just observing from outside, Prince trying to give a good face
in the face of mega-maximum adversity, pretending everything's OK, the baby's fine.
Opiaces were just waiting around the corner.
You don't deal with so many pain with a bassist-preacher, especially
if he's only able to play in quarter notes (audience claps).

The art lover in me hoped in something tremendous about to happen.
An album where Prince confronts God. An album in the league of the greatest.

But Prince dived into acceptance, and that is probably braver.
Except he needed help, and alas, we got people who think
it's better to take painkillers than to operate surgery, apparently.

So yeah, faith is as dangerous as the atom.

I think Prince saw, with "Purple Rain" the song,
a way to thank his parents, a way to finally win over the pain of growing without them.
"I just wanted us to be happy, but it didn't work" is directly derived
from Fleetwood Mac's introspections of the couple.

Only a gift of transcedance can turn that kind of pain into an anthem.
Many people will prefer "Bohemian Rhapsody".
Because it's a whine about one self.

"Purple Rain" is about you, your ex, your parents,
going down, and not in a good way.
That's not fucking "scaramouche's fandango", it's fucking depressing.

But there's pop for adults, and pop for wannabe adults.
There is a faith for those who work their innards off,
and lots of ready-made beliefs, where all questions and answers
sit comfortably in books, like some User's Manual for life.

Godforbid.

[Edited 10/13/16 6:26am]

anangellooksdown said:

Oh! Something important I forgot about Prince: he forgave his parents and recognized the good he did get from them. Huge sign of spiritual maturity!

He matured so gracefully didnt he ...

anangellooksdown said:

This is probably the wisest thread I've seen on The Org ever, with very insightful comments. I feel like I've found my home here, because I keep wanting to respond to so many posts saying, "Yes! I agree!" Since so much has already been expressed so well, I'll just add that what I have seen, felt and observed is that it truly is all the Inner Child wounding done by untreated parents that leaves another generation of wounded Adult Children, AND it gets worse with each generation because the affects of never having been treated then pile up more and more on the next generation. There are millions of Adult Children of Alcoholics, Addicts and regular ol' Narcissists walking the face of our planet and they are all suffering. Hence, our society is in deep doo-doo and in an all-out emotional depression. And there is a low self-esteem permeating it. When people have low self-esteem, they either abuse or get abused depending on their "symptoms" (tendencies based on their feeling of being capable), and this is why things are getting worse out there. I have never said this before but maybe here and now is the right place. The reason I became so incredibly sad about Prince's death was that as I began to learn more about him, I saw what someone else described here: the soft heart. I instantly identified with Prince because I immediately felt he was just like me: an Adult Child of a Dysfunction home...of abandonment and neglect of sorts - and the gentler type that gets harmed rather than harms, for the most part. On the positive side, the reason I admire his life so much was that he overcame. Many times I have thought to myself, "Thank God he got out of that home," because getting out at age 12 into a loving environment where he could be himself (at a very key age) saved him the further wounding I was not spared. Prince said later that it was because he was supported (by his friends and community) that he got confidence. Being supported is HUGE. At ANY age. When we are alone, we don't have the love every human being needs...not to mention we become fodder for sick people in society with the other types of symptoms. He also said that he considered himself a strong person. We are not all born the same in that regard, depending on genetics AND simply who our spirit is. That is why some people can come out of a bad childhood unscathed while others can't. And to his credit, and the Universe's/God's/Destiny's, he was able to stay free or get free when necessary and keep working out his Destiny, staying as aligned as possible with what he felt instinctively God wanted him to do. I'm so glad he trusted himself. He was not perfect. Where would the challenges be with that? Without mistakes he wouldn't have had growing pains - but he didn't beat himself up! I think all of this, the Adult Child stuff and the progress and other factors bothbwifh him and a lot of us are one reason so many people are obsessed right now with Prince. We're all feeling the need for change in our society and Prince is someone to identify with and admire around all of that. As for him having become a God of sorts to some, I have to be careful not to make anyone an "idol" I'm worshipping above God or in the place of God. We all People-worship sometimes at varying degrees (ever "go to bat" for a political candidate you've never met?) It is truly a distraction from facing the truth or making changes, which will result in our happiness anyway! Odd, right?! The main change these obsessions "allow" most people to avoid is initiating some work on themselves that will treat them. With each treated person we get a better society with people who all know they are enough, equal, loved and can love others. Yes, truly the only love there is is the love we make. [Edited 10/13/16 11:49am]

Yes...All that and more...

and then there is the apparent contradiction...

This morning I logged and was greeted with

" I sincerely want to fuck the taste out of your mouth ! "

Who amongst us hasnt been consumed with that desire (lust ) at some time in their lives ....

WHo is honest enough to admit it ?

In my own youth I confused LOVE with LUST...hought they were one and the same

Gratefully age and life experience tames and refines ones urges, but GOSH I remember being young and beautiful and "aching" to be well and truly $%&*#@*Cussjar*

Thank you Bonatoc...

Such a wonderful breakdown...

Im going to come back to this again and again....

and Ill probably add to it, when I can find words...

You definately have the Gift of the Gab....

bonatoc said:

CherryMoon57 said:

I wonder if Prince's apparent strong desire to better himself and his striving for perfection could have possibly stemmed from a guilt-inducing upbringing and perhaps was later reinforced by his JW's beliefs and the message that people need to prove themselves by doing "the work" (i.e. salvation based on merit, the carrot principle) rather than just accepting Christ's sacrifice (salvation by faith) and the reality that God's creation - of which humans are part of - is very good (Genesis 1:31) although not perfect .

I think we “owe” Prince in large parts to:

1. The two hours spent crying in the phone booth
2. Bernadette Anderson

Like Madonna losing her mother, MJ confronting his father and going solo — just to cite the most obvious object-of-insane-cults victims: the potence of the zeal is often related to the number of zeroes one amasses, and it grows in people who are not aware how much capitalism fucks with their heads, through apposite and well chosen christic imagery.

The Sports industry built its business on catholic agonism.
Your Nike is what is going to make you overcome your life sufferings.

Some life events happen to transform you.
And being someone’s progeny is an event.
It’s not something you were able to control.

Moreover, it’s hard to grasp, no matter who the parent is.
“Why was I born from this person? Is it a good or a bad thing, now that I’m seven and I see they’re capable of lying and deceiving?”.

Or, more complicated, what kind of parent he/she is to YOU.
Because there are also very good people being very poor parents.
Or being a poor parent ONLY TO YOU (concept scarier than Freddy if you ask me).
Or, literally very poor.
It goes on and on and on.

The only really bitter thing I’ve personally found is that your Inner Child
gets constantly amputated in the process of acceptance of the world as it is.

That is why artists see the world as it should be.
Because the state of the world pisses’ em off.

No matter how hard it gets, no matter if they starve, no mayonnaise on the potatoes,
they continue to be pissed off by what's going on.
The adolescent faith in them will not be defeated.
Cupid will reign supreme.

Take a look at this kinda depressed Jobs.

He ain’t starving, but here he speaks with a hundred million bucks of debt: minus $50M in Next Computers, a non-profitable (or so it seemed at the time, its engineers created OS X and subsequently iOS) company, and an another minus $50M in Pixar, a confidential studio which makes animated shorts with bureau lamps, very nice but that’s not the way to make money if you ask me.

So when Steve Jobs gives this interview, he’s broke, and the whole Silicon Valley,
while respectful of its 1980-to-1984 achievements, thinks he’s a museum piece, a loser from the past
who "doesn’t get where we're at now".

Did Jobs turn into a bitter person, an alcoholic, a fool?
Fuck no, the Inner Child is still there, alive under this untidy tired beard.
He’s still pissed off at how a mess the adults made of the world, only because they became too lazy to fix it.
The Inner Child has a stamina that goes for ever.

Six months after this simple advice (see how the publisher of the video is himself subject to idolatry? “Secrets of Life” doesn’t reflect it at all), Steve Jobs goes back home and tears the roof down.
There’s more to the picture than meets the eye, as most always Neil Young is right.

I feel we witnessed a miracle in 1986: Prince embodied the Inner Child triumphant,
the “Teen That Got It All Figured Out By Himself”, the fucking American Dream himself.

I, I, Eye, I am the continental principality of America! I am a bird of prey! I will not be compelled!

A split, a swoosh, plate eyes, a grin, and his voice, unstoppable, not even compressed, his lungs connected to his stomach connected to his pelvis shaken, contrived, bashed. Like Ringo yelling “I’ve got blisters on my fingers!”, Prince’s pelvis yells: “I got Life in my balls!”.

Well, that’s no mere human being.

Especially when he apologizes for winning all the Lottery tickets with “Pop Life” (a real “tête à claques” song).
But when “Purple Rain” comes, seems to come the real reason all these hours were spent in the studios: Prince was terrified at the idea to have his heart broken one more time.

Sex is, as often with Prince (and some horny zealots don’t get it), a metaphor.
But sex is also the unstoppable, gosh-we-shouldn’t-do-that, divorce-inducing energy.
Prince was in constant search for the origins, the problematics, the solutions, the aches, the ecstasies that come with physical and emotional interactions. He knew his parents were not living together because of that.

His main, central subject is Love. You try to split physical and emotions, it works for a while until you realize they’re the same. So you try to make a whole, but then a new desire calls. You ache, and you hurt in return if you ache too much.

When Prince screams in “The Beautiful Ones”, he’s pissed off at God, Susannah, Vanity, and himself. And he wants the teens to relate to this. He knows that these burdens are shared amongst all of us. And that they can be excruciating for the Inner Child when it first hits her/him.

“When You Were Mine” is not about a threesome (there’s a difference between being a critic who knows how to let his Inner Child speak, and a childish critic).

What this song really states, is that when you cheat, you fatally bring in a third person into the couple. That’s what “sleeping in between the two of us” means, you pathetic it-all-comes-down-to-the-dick-and-the-pussy schmucks. “When he was there” — He wasn’t physically there, for crying out loud. If it was the case, he would have chosen a “Head” or “Jack U Off” groove. A joyous mood. Prince is sad because he lost his Girl, he doesn’t regret the threesomes, foursomes, whatever happened. He loved her so much he was even ready to accept the emotional presence with another man, but in the end she leaves anyway. That’s all. Just another big emotional trauma.

There was probably, in Prince’s life, as with many of ours, the Big Bang Heartbreak.
The original, the fundamental one.

Be it by a parent, a girlfriend, your friends, and later your associates. The only moments of Prince revealing his frailty were laid on tape, but of course other happened in his life, the hours, the days, the nights, you know the drill.

So should we make him a saint because he turned his heartbreaks into spiritual stadium anthems? No.

Simply because, as any other human being, Prince fought back. He hurt people.
That, no matter the talents and the graces bestowed upon, is sadly very human.


We got a much softer Prince once he had some time to look back.
That is why the “Reflection” performance with Wendy is a miracle.
Prince had become such an extra-introvert, that when he says “sorry” to Wendy, he does it on public television, through singing a song about suspending time.
But that still does not explain what happens in the intertwining of the two acoustic guitars. For a brief moment, there is something otherworldly happening, an event. Call it the "Spirit of Christopher Tracy" or "4:20", it’s all the same.
It's tempting to get religious with such moments of unexplainable, humble beauty.


“If I did drugs, I’d offer you a joint but I’m gonna offer you a tape instead”.
Songs like joints. Prince’s scope was to get higher.
Without pills, thrills, or daffodils.
But that was the scope.
The goal. The Ladder. Life, as the bitch she is, always make sure you get hurt in the process.

Parenting. Being born. Be in love.
Falling in love when you thought you were truly happy.

Do they “happen to” happen, or do they “happen”?
If you believe in the latter, you’re inclined to bring in celestial or cosmic events to explain or justify.
Or, you can go all pragmatic and reduce everything to freudian traumas.

But the end result of a trauma is never guaranteed.
It’s probable God (or whatever you feel calling the Presence) plant seeds on a regular basis. But the number of variables (just turning a street corner and bumping into someone can change your existence) are so many, we’ve left with very few pieces of the puzzle to trace the origin. Astrophysicist can look for the Big Bang’s origins because they deal with objects.
We try to find out the original motivations, but in an human being.

But if we’re just able to take a few minutes to write about this important matter, because other lives are expecting our interactions during the day, how can I pretend to truly grasp somebody else’s hours, days, nights, weeks, months, years?

Is there even a point?


Ain’t this feelings archeology vain, even if laudable is its thirst for truth and inspiration?

Eye, as a “spiritual pragmatic”, see it this way: in the end, it’s what SKipper did with events AND emotions that’s a thing to wonder.
What he did with the events God sent his way: his thirst to spend hours lost into playing the piano instead of going outside and play could have turned him into another good keyboardist. We’re many in that case.

Viva the thirst for playing an instrument, it’s a gift God gives everyone, we just lose time doing something else.
It all boils down to the amount and the quality of the mayonnaise you wish on your potatoes.
Some zealots are in awe of Prince because he actually got his mayonnaise from guitar solos.

Should we thank the Good Lord Prince got that distorted vision (as each one of us have of Prince, and of our parents) about John L., being this Cool Cat hanging in clubs, making people dance, getting the ladies eyes?

Should we thank Joe Jackson to be so hard on Michael?
Would there ever be a Michael Jackson®?

The traumas induced by your parent(s)/lovers/friends happen in everyone’s life. They’re just magnified when they become a biography about a public person. With stars, we chose to have a projection of ourselves on display, it’s easier for understanding our own mechanisms. Or just get lost in your childood dreams. A dangerous path for the Inner Child, nostalgia.
He can stay trapped forever in it. That’s how I prefer to think about zealots, extremists, etc. They just think that going back is the way to cure their pain.
They’re pissed off at life, because it goes forward. They better accept it.
But their Inner Child is so trapped in childish melancholy that it makes them
see themselves as Superman rotating the earth in reverse.

But one's initial trauma cannot be mistaken for the cause:
the stamina comes from unacceptance, from rebellion, from refusing for things to continue the way the are.
The Inner Child wants to start a Revolution.
The Inner Child wants to astound/spank/avenge/hurt/[pick yours] his parents/lovers/friends/[pick one].

You can have a trauma, and make nothing much out of it.
You can have a trauma that leaves you speechless, joyless for many days/weeks/months/years.


I guess it all depends on how much teeth the Inner Child is left with, fight after fight after fight.

If some of us look up to Prince the human being, and see more than mere flesh,
it’s mostly, on an unconscious level, for seeing him taking so much bruises (some self-inflicted, like splits and sleep deprivations)
and having turn them into fun times.


A damn transmogrifier.
How can you not love a guy like that?
He's a hero alright. On earth as...



"Inner Child" is a trademark of the "Supreme Inner Child of the 7th Galaxy Church".
Thou shalt be torn to pieces by our international staff of lawyers were you tempted to use it for you own purposes.
We don't even have a logo, just to tell you how much we care about our copyrights.
Only members can see it. Only High Members can truly see the Member.
Quick, become a dick yourself for only $7.77 a month for a "Mistra Know-it-all" self-comforting booklet full of shit.

[Edited 10/13/16 5:22am]

It's really about the music, and the live performing. Music the most otherworldly of all the arts, and Prince, who understood effect in music perhaps better than anyone. Put these two together and you almost end up with a connection to the 'divine' even if you're atheist like me.

bonatoc said:

Lovejunky said:

Im hearing you and have spent a long time contemplating the Idea that his incredible gift was an incredible burden....

He never dropped that Ball....

Thats what is so Impressive..

And on Sacrifice...

I might start a whole new thread on that, its a worthy exploration, if only to reveal my own weaknesses to myself...

Oh dear. Are you sure you're having a healthy relationship to Prince?

I don't think he ever dissed some other artist for not being able to work as hard as he did.
He knew he had the gift of stamina too. He knew he was very lucky.
He was essential to him to have the audience understand that what he had was given, before being transfigured through hard work.
Hence the recurring Special Thanks 2 God, "God (vocal)", the whole Lovesexy era.

It's not the burden that fascinates me, it's "Data Bank" and "Susan, fade the shit out, I'm trough".
The humour, the craft, the fun, the good spirit.
That was all it was about.

Escape, free yo mind from this rat race:
Life is just a game,
We're all just the same.

[Edited 10/11/16 22:49pm]

He had his quirks which were gloriously entertaining, inspiring, and a bit maddening all in one. And he confessed his tinge of madness.

bonatoc said:

Lovejunky said:

Im hearing you and have spent a long time contemplating the Idea that his incredible gift was an incredible burden....

He never dropped that Ball....

Thats what is so Impressive..

And on Sacrifice...

I might start a whole new thread on that, its a worthy exploration, if only to reveal my own weaknesses to myself...

Oh dear. Are you sure you're having a healthy relationship to Prince?

I don't think he ever dissed some other artist for not being able to work as hard as he did.
He knew he had the gift of stamina too. He knew he was very lucky.
He was essential to him to have the audience understand that what he had was given, before being transfigured through hard work.
Hence the recurring Special Thanks 2 God, "God (vocal)", the whole Lovesexy era.

It's not the burden that fascinates me, it's "Data Bank" and "Susan, fade the shit out, I'm trough".
The humour, the craft, the fun, the good spirit.
That was all it was about.

Escape, free yo mind from this rat race:
Life is just a game,
We're all just the same.

[Edited 10/11/16 22:49pm]

.

Prince had an incredible "gift" and we were all so blessed that he shared that gift with US. His music was his "love", and never seen as a "sacrifice" in his eyes. He did only what came natural to him. He did what he was put on this earth to do.