I think we all agree that Emancipation, instead of a sprawling 3 CD set, would have made a real excellent 2 CD set...and one FANTASTIC 1 desk set...

But even that would not be enough to make Emancipation a True Classic Prince album no matter how good some of the songs are given a glarring weakness of the album...

It's flaccid Overall Production and Mix Design.

It's hard to put a finger on the problem but that's the root of it, isn't it?

Many of us have said things to the effect of, "I really like some of Emancipation but for some reason I never listen to it..." or "...it just doesn't sound good, for some reason..."

I think the root of the issue is that Emancipation sounds too "clean". There is no grit or passion in the record (albeit there are some very fine vocal performances). If you compare Emancipation to albums like Dirty Mind or Purple Rain it sounds so clinical and precise and "fussy".

Where are the RIPPING and SLASHING rhythm guitar chords? The hint of aural danger and menace of stuff like Computer Blue and All The Critics?

Nothing sounds organic and spontaneous, right?

It's soudns like a Prince Algorythm Made the Record...or an Prince A.I...

* Moderators Note

People have the right to discuss albums/album configurations. The OP was not nasty nor did they create a flame/bait thread. No reason to display disgust if you don't like the topic. There are many others to click on.
If we start shutting down people desire to critically discuss the music, in a year or two the Org won't have many discussion.

The reason I don't listen to Emancipation as much IS because of the sheer volume of material. People talk about the Internet ruining the album format because it makes individual song purchases easier, but if you ask me, CDs had a detrimental impact - albums became bloated to give consumers "bang for your buck," whereas on vinyl, a single disc was limited to about 44 minutes. That's a nice length. One of my favourite albums is T.Rex, "Electric Warrior." I bought it and played it three times in a row, because it's 11 short songs packed into a little over 30 minutes - it moves really well. That's about half the length of one disc of Emancipation. Can't tell you how many times I've played it since. I like to listen to albums whole, and it's not often I want to hear three straight hours of Emancipation.

I don't think the passion behind this album is in question - it's very passionate, just not, "I'm in a constant sexual frenzy passionate" (see the thread on Extraloveable). Sometimes, mature, subdued music is harder to achieve. People knock the "plastic production," but to people outside Prince world, 1999 sounds like plastic 80s music (I think they're fools who can't appreciate nuance). I agree the drum beats aren't exactly up to Irresistable Bitch standards, and switching to synth bass was consistent with 90s pop rather than the old electric slap method, and really, I start to miss Fink's synths in the 90s and beyond. Prince seemed focused more on songwriting and vocals. But no edge? "Joint 2 Joint" has a fucking tapdancing break. There's edge to be found in the sampling, or building a track around guitar distortion, and yes, if he pared this down, production sound or not it would make one of the most consistent albums in his catalog.

Really? No to a 1-cd... because:



noone here can/ will agree on which songs should be on a 1 cd version and which should be deleted, which should be taken out from the tracklist..

therefor it's impossible...

Emancipation - the album that made me (along with other friends) a true fan.

Different strokes for different folks.

It's art. Prince followed his muse and created it. His muse at that time was more pop and lush. Although, I rate the guitar solo on "The Holy River" as my favorite guitar solo of all time, and it's plenty ripping and slashing.

If you want to make it a 2-CD set, that's what iTunes is for. But Emancipation is Emancipation.

Agreed. Has to be judged on its own terms. But those terms, while ambitious and suited to the whole idea of his "emancipation" from WB, put it outside my top 5 Prince releases.

2 CD ... possibly, cut down to 1 CD ... lol that's BS, besides Prince wanted to release it as a triple and I respect that.

By the way OP, I think you mean to say: its core problem, NOT it's ...

For me, it's true glaring problem is it's a very narrow record, production wise. If you listen to 'Jam of the Year' and 'Right Back Here in My Arms', then you've experienced 85% of the album. A couple songs take risks, but even those feel calculated.

I think it's mostly the drums. Change them to something closer to what they sounded like on TGE and C&D and far fewer people would complain. I've sometimes toyed with the idea of doing minor tweaks like just adding a harder, reverberated snare hit to some songs, upload the stuff to Youtube and see what people's comments would be like.

Interesting point about the rhythm guitar. It might have been interesting to hear TGE / C&D -sounding version of "Damned If I Do", for example.

One of the reasons I dig Prince's production style is that every instrument is usually easily audible and he doesn't rely on a "wall of sound" type of approach. Oh, God, I'm so bored of modern day producers adding all kinds of shit to the choruses to make them sound bigger. Especially when there's not much of a melody present and we're just expected to think everything sounds "epic".

soladeo1 said:

I think the root of the issue is that Emancipation sounds too "clean". There is no grit or passion in the record (albeit there are some very fine vocal performances). If you compare Emancipation to albums like Dirty Mind or Purple Rain it sounds so clinical and precise and "fussy".

Where are the RIPPING and SLASHING rhythm guitar chords? The hint of aural danger and menace of stuff like Computer Blue and All The Critics?

Nothing sounds organic and spontaneous, right?

It's soudns like a Prince Algorythm Made the Record...or an Prince A.I...

I do agree that the production on many songs is "too safe".From a production standpoint,I find the songs on TGE to be much more vibrant and inspired.

NorthC said:

Oh God, when will people finally stop shitting on this album. It's getting boring! If you don't like it, don't listen to it. It really is that simple. I don't like Rainbow Children, but do you see me creating thread after thread about it?!

Lol, no but you seem to like to create posts that bitch about threads that bitch about things.

BombFunk said:

By the way OP, I think you mean to say: its core problem, NOT it's ...

Seriously?

another ..not THIS thread AGAAAIN.... why cant u be happy that he gave us albums + outtakes in one package.....the "sound" is an issue....its different ...deal with it

I never understood this argument against a 3 cd set. When I listened to it for the first time, all I could think was that, "damn 3 cd's worth of music in one release". There are songs I like more than others on the set, but at the end of the day I'm damn glad it's three cd's instead of one or two.

SoEas42 said:

thedance said:

Really? No to a 1-cd... because:



noone here can/ will agree on which songs should be on a 1 cd version and which should be deleted, which should be taken out from the tracklist..

therefor it's impossible...

I'd rather have all 3 discs and choose for myself what the best ones are than have 1 disc that has somebody elses choices and omits mine. With Prince, more is better. Just sayin'...

Galaxian said:

SoEas42 said:

I like Emancipation although I agree that it could be cut down to 2 CDs. Some of my favorites: Saviour Let's Have a Baby I Can't Make You Love Me Friend Lover Sister Mother Wife Betcha by Golly Wow La la Means I Love You Right Back Here in My Arms Jam of the Year Soul Sanctuary Sex in the Summer One Kiss at a Time

Wow, can't believe 'The Love We Make' did not make your list. I think it's a great album.

And that's my point. I can't believe Betcha By Golly or La la Means I Love U would be on anybody's list or that Joint 2 Joint & Face Down could be left off. With the 3CD set we all get to hear our favorites and have the option of skipping the ones we don't like.

When the album came out I was talking to another Prince fan that couldn't get into it because it was so dense. I suggested she approach it as 3 separate albums. Start with disc 1 and spend some time with it, however long it take to absorb a new Prince album, then move on to the next. The next time we talked she had taken my advice and had a much better appreciation of the album as a whole. I'd recommend this approach for anyone having trouble absorbing it.

RodeoSchro said:

i liked it as much or more than any of his albums.

I agree with the critique of the production and too "clean" comment. For example, it took about 5 minutes after this album came out to find a simple way to make Face Down sound like a completely revitalized song... why couldn't this have been done from the start? Even T was able to improve upon the production with minimal effort.

If he'd kept the NPG in place through the full recording of the album, I think the project would have elevated to another level, but with only Kirky J as the soundingboard (who, with all due respect to him, has never been someone to produce fresh/raw sounding material in the studio), it comes off very plastic and non-organic sounding.

Despite its flaws, I still appreciate that it was released as a 3 CD set, as everything on there is worth hearing. It's just a missed opportunity IMO, as some of these songs could have been elevated to classic levels if Prince had been more challenged by himself or others during the recording sessions.

BanishedBrian said:

I agree with the OP that the production is a huge problem on this album. It sounds lifeless, dull and plastic-y. Unlistenable for me and I am a huge Prince fan.

Besides the production issues I also think there are way too many ballads on Emancipation. Also perhaps a 3 disc/180 minutes set is a bit much to take in as a listener (unless it was really good maybe, but I don't think Emancipation was very good at all). And the artwork of the album was atrocious, so tacky, I hated it.

This combination of issues makes Emancipation a really difficult album for me. I hated it when it came out and thought Prince's 'freedom' was a huge disappointment. After my faith had slowly started waning from Lovesexy on, this was the moment where I lost faith in him completely. The run of uneven albums before Emancipation was worrying, but Emancipation made me stop following Prince closely.

I also hated his clothes/hair at the time, Prince and his new music didn't fit in with the zeitgeist at all IMO. At that time I was deep into electronic music like triphop, breakbeat and drum&bass and music in these genres sounded much more innovative and exciting to me than these sirupy Emancipation ballads.

Around the time Rave was released I discovered (the still black and purple) Prince.org and that got me back into Prince slowly. The Rainbow Children surprised me and was an exciting album to me, altough slightly flawed by the deep voice and all the religious mumbo jumbo. An interesting record though musically and great production, unlike Emancipation.