laurarichardson said:

rogifan said:

Hmm...someone allegedly in "grave danger" took in a show at the Dakota Jazz Club in Minneapolis just a couple days before he died. According to people who worked there he looked and seemed fine. I'm a bit skeptical on this whole "grave danger" thing. We know what happened on the plane (at least according to Judith Hill assuming everything she's telling us is accurate and even then it's not the whole story) but we don't know what caused it. There is no official law enforcement report that says it was a painkiller overdose. And the medical examiner's report lists the death as an accidental overdose. I respect that those in P's inner circle aren't talking to the press. And I hope the official investigation stays private. Unless there was some criminal activity involved there is no right to know by the public. Leave it private.

--- I am not sure I buy grave danger either. He left Paisley Park and came back around 8:00pm. Where did the person in grave danger go that afternoon. Who was the aquaitance who dropped him off. Too many things do not add up. Why would Kornfield not just recommend hospitalization at one of the near by rehabs? Why does he need to send meds? Why did Dr. S not prescient something to help with withdrawals?

Geeze people. As has been said plenty above, grave danger is just that. Grave danger. He almost died. People then realized he had a problem. He was withrawing and it's been reported that he was getting more and more agitated as the days went by, prompting the call to the addiction doc. That is where grave danger comes in. Those close to him were concerned. And just because no one stayed with him that night doesn't mean they didn't try to. He was at the hospital the day he died, as well as Walgreens, so how to you know the doctor didn't prescribe something? Lots of conjecture.

rogifan said:

Prince was at the hospital the day he died?

From The Star-Tribune: "Later that day [April 20], Prince was given an intravenous treatment at a local hospital, a source with knowledge of the investigation said."

morningsong said:

BillieBalloon said:

To me I think it means that we know he had almost died on the plane..and had managed to come back from that. So for that day, which he survived they probably felt he was out of immediate danger, and I guess he was if you take it in the literal sense. However, it gets confusing in the following week when they ring up a doctor and say there is still a grave medical emergency. Considering he survived the plane and was moving forward why describe the days AFTER the plane landing in this way? I think they used those words because nobody was sure he had stopped using the pain medication or at least cut down. He probably assured them that he had...but deep down they knew he hadn't. ..hence his life still being in grave danger. I think it's as simple as that. Who really knows there's little informatiom Just thinking out loud. [Edited 7/4/16 9:39am]

They probably thought it was all thrown away.

i don't believe that is true morningsong.

rogifan said:

disch said:

From The Star-Tribune: "Later that day [April 20], Prince was given an intravenous treatment at a local hospital, a source with knowledge of the investigation said."

"a source with knowledge of the investigation". Nuff said.

If we're not supposed to believe journalistic sources (star-tribune, NYTimes, etc.), where do we get our info from? Our "gut instincts"? How we think Prince looked in various photos we saw on the internet? Random uncited rumors about who was with him at various points (the Dakota, etc.)?

The fact is, based on what we know, he was in a grave place health-wise. He ODed and nearly died, and then he OD'ed and actually did die less than a week later. I'm not sure how much more grave the situation could have been.

rogifan said:

Prince was at the hospital the day he died?

From The Star-Tribune: "Later that day [April 20], Prince was given an intravenous treatment at a local hospital, a source with knowledge of the investigation said."

disch said:

morningsong said:

BillieBalloon said:

To me I think it means that we know he had almost died on the plane..and had managed to come back from that. So for that day, which he survived they probably felt he was out of immediate danger, and I guess he was if you take it in the literal sense. However, it gets confusing in the following week when they ring up a doctor and say there is still a grave medical emergency. Considering he survived the plane and was moving forward why describe the days AFTER the plane landing in this way? I think they used those words because nobody was sure he had stopped using the pain medication or at least cut down. He probably assured them that he had...but deep down they knew he hadn't. ..hence his life still being in grave danger. I think it's as simple as that. Who really knows there's little informatiom Just thinking out loud. [Edited 7/4/16 9:39am]

They probably thought it was all thrown away.

^^^^^ This.
Percocet all gone. Good.

Secret stash of something that could have been there a long time....in an elevator-accessible area only he knew the combination to.

disch said:

slvrhrt7 said:

I still find it odd that KJ, LG, or Merone have not mentioned anything. Its like they disappeared. The so called closest have become rather distant. And this term that he was in grave danger....suicidal thoughts, severe joint pain? Makes no sense. And yes these peeps should feel guilty for not being there to support and wait for adequte help to arrive. Still pissed!!!

If you mean Kirk Johnson, he has a lawyer, and is smart not to talk, especially to satiate a fan's need for gossip.

Larry Graham has given a couple of brief interviews, but what's to be said?

Regarding those two, this is still a criminal investigation. The public's eagerness for tidbits is secondary, at best. The truth will come out eventually.

You have no idea if "the closest" are now distant. You don't, I don't - no one does. I mean, what are they supposed to be close to? Should they hang out at Paisley Park on the street to answer questions all day?

"Grave danger" could mean many things. The fact that he just faded off and was in a really, really bad spot on that plane dictates "grave danger" to me. He was dangerously close to death, more than once in a week or two. Danger of being in the grave - yes. Grave danger. Imagine if he was in a private room on a plane, and passed out like Judith Hill told us. And no one found him - oh wait, that happened in an elevator.

I'm not harsh, please understand. I'm just trying to be logical. It's pure conjecture to think everyone has abandoned Prince or whatever. Prince is gone. He's in a vase somewhere. It fucking sucks, but it's the truth. No one is going to burn a vigil all day. People are mourning, in their own way. We all are, including you and me. We hurt. But to point fingers, out of nothing more than your own anger which is valid but misdirected, and wonder why no one was there, or whatever is illogical.

I can only imagine the heartbreak those that knew him are truly going through. I would bet as much as we hurt, their pain is 100x more.

rogifan said:

whizbanggirl said:

rogifan said:

disch said:

If we're not supposed to believe journalistic sources (star-tribune, NYTimes, etc.), where do we get our info from? Our "gut instincts"? How we think Prince looked in various photos we saw on the internet? Random uncited rumors about who was with him at various points (the Dakota, etc.)?

The fact is, based on what we know, he was in a grave place health-wise. He ODed and nearly died, and then he OD'ed and actually did die less than a week later. I'm not sure how much more grave the situation could have been.

Except we don't know for certain what happened on the plane. There is no official investigation that concluded it was an overdose. I understand why people would logically come to that conclusion but we don't know for certain. My point is if he really was in grave condition would he be taking in a show at the Dakota just two days before he died? One would assume he really wouldn't be in any condition to do that. Or be hanging out at a record store buying CDs.

We DO know what happened on the plane. You know why? Because obviously, Judith and Kirk have been interrogated by investigators. They can't change the story.

Your rejection of legitimate reports from Minneapolis journalists who *did know* a lot more than anyone else about P, is telling. You can't reject everything -- especially while making stuff up yourself.

rogifan said:

sonshine said:

morningsong said:

Seems to me if they (the inner inner circle) assumed he had no access to it, they'd assume there was no danger from it and guards went down. There is likely a varible they knew nothing about. Who knows. My mind is spinning with this stuff, sometimes it's stops, but then it starts again and all kinds of scenerios play out in my head. I'm just working with the idea that this investigation is taking longer than it took to get the toxology report, maybe that's normal, maybe it isn't. I guess it isn't normal, especially if, according to TMZ they supposedly have all the pieces to the puzzle.

Good points. I hadn't thought of that. In any case it seems Judith Hill is the one who really sounded the alarm finally and got everyone's attention. He literally died in front of her eyes. She was understandably concerned for his life. After she got the ball rolling with the inner circle there were calls to be made and I imagine it was like walking on eggshells around there as often happens when something is reaching crisis mode. Then imagine that going on at the same time Prince who us known to be difficult on a good day is coming down which in itself is ugly to watch and even worse to go thru. I can only imagine what a horrible week it was leading up to the 21st of April for all of them. And as was mentioned they may have not even known he had anything available that would endanger his life. If he was dope sick and had something he knew would make him feel better you bet he wasn't telling anyone and probably couldn't wait for everyone to leave so he could feel better. Poor Prince. I dont doubt he was in agony. Its just so wrong that he had to battle this secretly. He deserved so much more. He deserved the chance to get better and i know once he finally got help he would have succeeded. He would have beat this. At the very least he deserved a much better exit.

Most not have been too horrible Tuesday night, 2 days before he was at the Dakota nightclub and people work there said he seemed fine...??? Something still don't add up.

[Edited 7/6/16 9:57am]

rogifan said:

whizbanggirl said:

Could it be that Prince did all those things days before he died to keep up appearances? He seemed to be super image conscious and perhaps the fact he was throwing parties, record shopping and attending a show a week after a near fatal overdose indicated a level of denial? "Grave danger" could have meant he acknowledged an addiction he no longer could control on his own. And/or his inner circle were concerned he was going about life like he almost didn't die and knew an intervention was necessary? [Edited 7/6/16 3:36am]

Perhaps. My point is he was well enough to do all those things with people seemingly not noticing anything. And we have official confirmation that he OD'd the week before. This is why I come back whag I've always thought...that it was simply a tragic and unfortunate accident. Again if he was in such grave danger that people feared for his safety he would not have been left alone.

I agree that Prince doing all these things in his final days wasn't a sign the danger wasn't grave -- it could very well be a sign that he himself wasn't taking the the gravity of the situation seriously, (and it was obviously grave -- his problems killed him days later).

As far as "he would not have been left alone" -- he was a fully-grown man making his own decisions. If he demanded that his employees leave, they might not have felt empowered to do differently -- or they just might not have known what exactly to do. Especially if they thought medical intervention was coming first thing in the morning.

rogifan said:

disch said:

If we're not supposed to believe journalistic sources (star-tribune, NYTimes, etc.), where do we get our info from? Our "gut instincts"? How we think Prince looked in various photos we saw on the internet? Random uncited rumors about who was with him at various points (the Dakota, etc.)?

The fact is, based on what we know, he was in a grave place health-wise. He ODed and nearly died, and then he OD'ed and actually did die less than a week later. I'm not sure how much more grave the situation could have been.

Except we don't know for certain what happened on the plane. There is no official investigation that concluded it was an overdose. I understand why people would logically come to that conclusion but we don't know for certain. My point is if he really was in grave condition would he be taking in a show at the Dakota just two days before he died? One would assume he really wouldn't be in any condition to do that. Or be hanging out at a record store buying CDs.

We DO know what happened on the plane. You know why? Because obviously, Judith and Kirk have been interrogated by investigators. They can't change the story.

Your rejection of legitimate reports from Minneapolis journalists who *did know* a lot more than anyone else about P, is telling. You can't reject everything -- especially while making stuff up yourself.

laytonian said:

Astasheiks said:

rogifan said:

laurarichardson said:

And he went to the club with a group of people who must had to have been dragged kicking and screaming due to the horror of being around a raving drug addict. Does anyone see how crazy all of this sounds??

Exactly. And the thing is we don't know for what purpose he had been taking these pain meds. Was it for chronic hip pain or some other illness very few if any knew about? It seems highly unlikely it was for recreational purposes. The other thing is this is a very potent opioid. IF this is something P had been using on a regular basis how is it that he was able to perform (even all the way down under), have people over to PP and people not notice something odd. Even his public appearances in 2014 and 2015 he never looked or sounded like he was under the influence of anything. The only noticeable thing was he looked very skinny though he's looked that way off and on in his career (and I think the large Afro didn't help). Nothing makes much sense...

So much misunderstanding here about drug dependency and addiction. Someone with a dependency isn't necessarily running around "raving" -- there are thousands of people with dependency issues who have jobs, families etc., and look basically "normal" to outsiders. And once someone is dependent/addicted, words like using drugs for "recreation" vs "pain relief" don't apply anymore. At that point, a person HAS to continue taking the drug to avoid withdrawal, which can be uncomfortable at best and deadly at worst. Addiction and dependency are physiological reactions to the drug and have nothing to do with morality or whether there was a "good reason" someone starting taking the drug in the first place.

The misunderstanding about this issue adds to feelings of judgment and shame -- and may make people who are suffering from addiction less likely to admit they have a problem and seek help. Kind of like what someone we "know" might have felt.

[Edited 7/6/16 14:14pm]