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Thread started 07/02/16 4:26pm

mtlfan

Prince's musical shortcomings?

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?

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Reply #1 posted 07/02/16 4:28pm

kidmelody2012

mtlfan said:

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?

his arrangements are to sparse

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Reply #2 posted 07/02/16 4:46pm

Askani

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kidmelody2012 said:

mtlfan said:

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?

his arrangements are to sparse



that's what I love about most of his classic music. it was uncluttered with unnecessary bullshit.

things changed with Lovesexy and his full-time access to Paisley Park.

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Reply #3 posted 07/02/16 5:24pm

runningbear

M

[Edited 7/2/16 17:26pm]

merf
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Reply #4 posted 07/02/16 5:25pm

runningbear

runningbear said:

Maybe I will get roasted for this, his music is better than the rest, though the Stones back catalog comes close, but not sure of too many songs that have a sensational pretty melody running through them, I like his ballads, but things like Human Nature and many Paul McCartney and Billy Joel songs are so pretty. Things like A Case of You come close, likely best ex off album strong on Prince melodies, but then that is a Joni song.

Do enjoy when harmonica was incorporated into his music, could have used more, watch Berlin 2010, sounds so great in classic Prince songs, this ingredient could have been incorporated more frequently, whether played by Prince or not, to my satisfaction.

Minor critical stuff, he was truly the best, strong points to my ears were his ability to arrange music, and of course that second to none guitar playing. This Berlin show really rocks btw, nice full songs, Time songs, Sheila on fire...

merf
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Reply #5 posted 07/02/16 5:34pm

BillieBalloon

mtlfan said:

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?




Are you having a dig at his height or what?
Baby, you're a star.

Meet me in another world, space and joy
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Reply #6 posted 07/02/16 5:41pm

RenaRF

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mtlfan said:

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?



I play in a big horn band locally. One of our trumpet players works with another trumpet player who worked with Prince. The comment was that he couldn't play any of the horns, and so he leaned heavily on the expertise of the people he brought in for instruments that he couldn't actually play. That answers at least part of your question.

The mutual friend we played with, however, did say that plane with Prince involved a rigorous and exhausting rehearsal schedule. As so many of us know, he didn't want mistakes on stage, and the way that he avoided that was by extensive rehearsal sessions. My understanding from the mutual friend is that nobody was ever winging it on stage at a prince show. Hardly breaking news, I know. smile
"Everything that's in your heart, come what may
Even though his might get broken" RIP Prince
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Reply #7 posted 07/02/16 5:58pm

mtlfan

BillieBalloon said:

mtlfan said:

This isn't a trolling thread, but I'm genuinely curious: what were Prince's shortcomings as a musician? In other words, what couldn't he do? And not anything off base, like he couldnt' play the tuba. Unlike a lot of popular musicians, he understood keys; was he a sight-reader? Could he arrange for different voices/instrument groups? Any stories about how he was an amateur, or something he found difficult?

Are you having a dig at his height or what?

I'm writing a blog post on talented musicians with particular shortcomings. For example, Zappa couldn't sing and play guitar at the same time, and The Beatles couldn't read or write notation.

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Reply #8 posted 07/02/16 8:34pm

Cloreen

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.

I would say if he had a musical weakness it would be he was weak when it came to the mixing of his songs.

.

I don't know who exactly did the mixing, but I assume it was Prince. Mixing is an art. Getting the balance of the instruments just right or accentuating certain instruments over others is a musical skill that is difficult to master and it's a wonder to behold when done perfectly. Many, many times when I listen to Prince songs I often question why is the bass so buried, why is the funk rhythm guitar barely audible, why are the drums so prominent....?

.

Granted, Prince sure could pull a rabbit out of his hat now and again when it came to mixing. Just listen to what he did with the Girls / Dez / Prince vocals on the verses of "1999." Brilliant. As was his mixing on "Batdance." An insane mixing tour de force. But more often than not, the mixing on Prince tunes is often disappointing. Example: "I Wish You Heaven" -- chugging, distorted guitar so low in the mix, snare crack too high...

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Reply #9 posted 07/02/16 8:35pm

suomynona

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Askani said:

kidmelody2012 said:

his arrangements are to sparse



that's what I love about most of his classic music. it was uncluttered with unnecessary bullshit.

things changed with Lovesexy and his full-time access to Paisley Park.


Exactly. Imagine "Breakdown" without all of the unnecessary clutter. "Zannalee" would be another example.

Or any of the tracks with horrible rappers. Robin Power. Tony M. Scrappy Dee. How is that even a rapper's name? Even the Doug E Fresh shit was out of place.

"Oh, but I love Doug E Fresh!" someone will reply. Sure. So does everyone. But imagine those songs without some hype man. Prince didn't need hype. He was Prince.

Pre-Paisley Park we got 1999. Post-Paisley Park, we got 1999: The New Master.

His shortcomings (apparently) was not knowing when to say when.

That's okay. He also put out a few good songs after Paisley Park.

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Reply #10 posted 07/03/16 12:10am

mtlfan

I love his mixing. I learn from his mixing. Especially Lovesexy, I love how he puts the wailing guitar in the background so it doesn't overtake the other instruments - Postivity and Dance On come to mind. The rapper thing is funny. We're so quick to accpt the sexy girls in his mixes, but another dude and it's get the fuck out. I think Tony M adds to Sexy MF, if nothing else. Gett Off Prince could have handled himself, My Name is Prince probably would have been stronger without Monsieur M, but the rap isn't that bad. He gets really shit on in this camp, but he could probably outrap Dre (that's not saying much).

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Reply #11 posted 07/03/16 12:28am

suomynona

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mtlfan said:

I love his mixing. I learn from his mixing. Especially Lovesexy, I love how he puts the wailing guitar in the background so it doesn't overtake the other instruments - Postivity and Dance On come to mind. The rapper thing is funny. We're so quick to accpt the sexy girls in his mixes, but another dude and it's get the fuck out. I think Tony M adds to Sexy MF, if nothing else. Gett Off Prince could have handled himself, My Name is Prince probably would have been stronger without Monsieur M, but the rap isn't that bad. He gets really shit on in this camp, but he could probably outrap Dre (that's not saying much).


What sexy girls (and songs that they are in) are you referring to? Because if you're talking about stuff like Beautiful Loved & Blessed, then I'll go there too. Unlistenable, but I'm not sure that's Tamar's fault. It's just a terrible song. I have no problem with Sheila because she fit with Prince's music. Love Bizarre, Erotic City -- no comparison whatsoever to the absolute atrociousness that is Call The Law and Push It Up. Sheila blended in with Prince. Never came across as a hype man.

Maybe I would feel different if I hadn't heard all of those earlier tracks where Prince did almost all of his own backing vocals.

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Reply #12 posted 07/04/16 1:24pm

kidmelody2012

he was terrible at 12 string guitar

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Reply #13 posted 07/04/16 2:06pm

purplethunder3
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kidmelody2012 said:

he was terrible at 12 string guitar

Yeah, we know that the world's greatest guitarist is you. razz

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato

https://youtu.be/CVwv9LZMah0
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