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Thread started 05/24/16 2:49pm

tmtomh

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Updated Sound Info on "Small Club" Releases

20+ year Prince fan but brand new here. Saw an old, closed/locked thread asking about sound quality comparisons of various versions of the "Small Club" concert, and thought I'd share some interesting info I've found.

I've been able to compare 3 versions: the Thunderball release from 2000; the Sabotage release from 2002; and the unlabeled online version that's been posted widely on blogs and download sites for the past few years. Here's what I've found:

I. Sabotage and Thunderball Are Identical. Both are based on the exact same digital source. The digital music files are bit-for-bit identical. The Sabotage is a clone of the Thunderball.

The only sonic difference is that the Sabotage version attenuates a very small number of digital/static "ticks" that plague the original source.

II. The Common Online Version Is from a 1991 Beech Marten Bootleg. The online version has 5 tracks on disc 1 and 6 tracks on disc 2. Only three bootlegs have 6 tracks on disc 2, and only two of those have track titles that match the online version: the original 1988 X Records version from France, and the 1991 Beech Marten version. Since the online version is said to be the only one that sounds as good as the original X Records version, it stands to reason that it can't be the original, and therefore must be the Beech Marten version, which almost certainly is just a clone of the X Records version.

III. The Thunderball and Sabotage sound better (IMHO). The Beech Marten seems to have had EQ or noise reduction applied - it has less hiss, less treble detail, and a slightly muffled high end compared to the Thunderball and the Sabotage. It's also possible that the Thunderball/Sabotage simply boosted the high end slightly. Which sound is better is a matter of preference, but after listening to the Beech Marten for a couple of years and then hearing the Thunderball/Sabotage for the first time, the latter just seems clearer, better balanced, and more open-sounding.

IV. The Thunderball and Sabotage have channels reversed from the X and Beech Marten. I was shocked when I loaded up the Beech Marten vs. the Thunderball/Sabotage in my audio editor and saw that the L and R channels are reversed. I have no idea which one has the correct L-R orientation.

V. The Different Versions Might Be from Different Digital Transfers/Copies of the Tape. The Beech Martin has a small but very audible dropout around 2:58 into the first track, and the Thunderball/Sabotage does not. Thunderball/Sabotage might simply have deleted the dropout (it's short enough to do that without creating a problem in the music). But they might also be from a different, later digital copy of the original source tape. If so, that would explain the added high-end presence and (IMHO) more natural-sounding tape hiss on the Thunderball/Sabotage.

Unfortunately I have not yet tracked down the original X Records version, so I cannot say with 100% certainty that it is identical in sound to the Beech Marten, but all the evidence suggests it is.

I also haven't found the 1996 Moonraker version, but because it's chronologically the first version to group disc 2 into 5 tracks rather than 6 - and because Thunderball uses very similar cover art to Moonraker - I would strongly suspect that the Moonraker is the original source for the sonic version that appears on both Thunderball and Sabotage.

Would love to hear others' thoughts on this!

[Edited 5/24/16 14:50pm]

[Edited 5/24/16 14:51pm]

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Reply #1 posted 05/24/16 2:54pm

RodeoSchro

I have it on vinyl, which I bought in the late '80's. Can't remember the label, but I'm assuming it was pressed directly from the soundboard recording. Does that sound right? It has this cover:

s-l300.jpg (300×225)

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Reply #2 posted 05/24/16 2:57pm

RodeoSchro

Apparently the label was Vigotone. Someone was trying to sell this set for $625 on eBay last week.

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Reply #3 posted 05/24/16 3:09pm

tmtomh

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Yes, almost certainly pressed from the soundboard tape - although since that vinyl issue came out in '88 or '89, it's possible it was pressed from a DAT copy. I suspect, but cannot prove, that most or all bootlegs were pressed from DAT copies; hence the small, seemingly digital-style "ticks."

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Reply #4 posted 05/24/16 3:14pm

Marrk

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'XRecords'. Miss-spelled track names and all. R.A.D.E anyone? lol

[Edited 5/24/16 15:16pm]

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Reply #5 posted 05/24/16 3:49pm

fms

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Awesome post!
More like this please!
Stand at the crossroads, and look, and ask for the ancient paths...(Jeremiah 6:16) www.ancientfaithradio.com

dezinonac eb lliw noitulove ehT
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Reply #6 posted 05/24/16 4:09pm

FragileUnderto
w

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Marrk said:

'XRecords'. Miss-spelled track names and all. R.A.D.E anyone? lol


That's the copy I got lol
Cant believe my purple psychedelic pimp slap pimp2

And I descend from grace, In arms of undertow
I will take my place, In the great below
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Reply #7 posted 05/24/16 4:50pm

h4rm0ny

edited. oops.

[Edited 5/24/16 16:52pm]

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Reply #8 posted 05/24/16 5:00pm

tmtomh

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FragileUndertow said:

Marrk said:

'XRecords'. Miss-spelled track names and all. R.A.D.E anyone? lol

That's the copy I got lol

Since you have the X Records version, can you tell us if the first track has a brief droput around 2:58? That would help establish whether or not the online/Beech Marten version is a clone of the X Records version.

The X and the Beech Marten have the same goofy/incorrect track names, but I haven't been able to get ahold of the X version to confirm whether or not it's actually the same source/sound as the Beech Marten.

Thanks!

[Edited 5/24/16 17:01pm]

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Reply #9 posted 05/24/16 5:08pm

FragileUnderto
w

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My CD's are In storage confused
Wish I could help
Cant believe my purple psychedelic pimp slap pimp2

And I descend from grace, In arms of undertow
I will take my place, In the great below
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Reply #10 posted 05/24/16 5:52pm

suomynona

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FragileUndertow said:

Marrk said:

'XRecords'. Miss-spelled track names and all. R.A.D.E anyone? lol

That's the copy I got lol


Same here. The one from decades ago.

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