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[Edited 5/17/16 16:18pm]

BeelZBubba said:

Or is Toure relying on Susan Rogers' version of events, when even Prince warned people not to listen to these disgruntled former employees?

He didn't sound very "Conservative" to me though Alex Jones and Mancow say he WAS a Truther. What do you think? Did Toure get this wrong too?

when was Susan Rogers disgruntled?

And I believe Prince was conservative or had strong 'conservative' views

BeelZBubba said:

Or is Toure relying on Susan Rogers' version of events, when even Prince warned people not to listen to these disgruntled former employees?

He didn't sound very "Conservative" to me though Alex Jones and Mancow say he WAS a Truther. What do you think? Did Toure get this wrong too?

I don't know the claims (these specifically) but when he was very on fire with the JW stuff, I would call him a conservative then. Anti-gay, anti any kind of sexual "immorality," etc.

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[Edited 5/17/16 16:18pm]

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[Edited 5/17/16 16:19pm]

I think youre defeating yourself with these labels. Normally a person who's friends with Cornell West and Van Jones would never be considered a conservative. But certainly if you're a JW, you're socially conservative. Social, financial and political conservativism are all separate beasts. Don't try to collapse them.

If you're talking politically... well... IDK. On Tavis' show, he talked positively about Pres. Obama, but I also know that JWs do not vote. They're politically abstinent.

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

Listening to Prince talk he seemed to be conservative. Also On Tavis Smiley he spoke clearly against Obama as a president. He mentioned he might be a nice guy...

No. He just said he "didn't have a horse in that race". Nothing against Obama at all, in any way.

.

I think it's obvious from his charity giving, and helping good causes that he felt everyone could do more to help one another though.

PurpleDiamonds1 said:

Listening to Prince talk he seemed to be conservative. Also On Tavis Smiley he spoke clearly against Obama as a president. He mentioned he might be a nice guy...

You obviously didn't listen close enough. If he were political in those regards he wouldn't have performed for the Obama family last year.

It's pretty clear that most (if not all) of the people calling Prince a conservative don't really know what conservatism is.

BeelZBubba said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

when was Susan Rogers disgruntled?

And I believe Prince was conservative or had strong 'conservative' views

Old Friends, in an interview with Miles, P seemed to allude to Rogers a few times. In HIS view she was clearly disgruntled... same with, he implied, the other guy famous for claiming he could interpret P's motives.... as for Conservatism... you mean 'socially' or maybe Libertarian style? Because a few recent professed beliefs don't jibe with Constitutional Conservativism.

Susan Rogers left the camp in 1987 (Blue Tuesday) I think it was Prince who was hurt and upset by her leaving. Susan has always spoken of Prince respectfully. And never came across disgruntled.

paulludvig said:

I don't know if Prince was conservative. But generally I think a handful of people have more or less controlled the narrative when it comes to Prince. Susan Rogers is one of them.

Have U ever read anything that suggested Susan Rogers was disgruntled?

In what way has she 'controlled' the narrative. All she did was talk about how she worked with Prince. And none of it was disgruntled.

OldFriends4Sale said:

con·serv·a·tive/kənˈsərvədiv/

adjective holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation, typically in relation to politics or religion.

And which dictionary did that extremely simple and dumbed down definition come from?

OldFriends4Sale said:

con·serv·a·tive/kənˈsərvədiv/

adjective holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation, typically in relation to politics or religion.

With this definition its clear that it doesn't apply to him. Because even in his JW beliefs it wasn't social conservativism for the sake of being fearful of change or innovation but because he felt that was the precise boundaries they establish to be on the correct path in the eyes of the JW version of God. From that internal perspective its not at all about being fearful of anything. For him he saw himself moving forward, changing and promoting change. I think he wanted to be progressive but from within the boundaries of a spiritual take on life.

Genesia said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

con·serv·a·tive/kənˈsərvədiv/

adjective holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation, typically in relation to politics or religion.

And which dictionary did that extremely simple and dumbed down definition come from?

I posted that one, because I think that is what the topics simple definition of conservative in connection with Prince is dealing with.

If Toure did come to the conclusion. I doubt it is any more complicated than that.

lezama said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

con·serv·a·tive/kənˈsərvədiv/

adjective holding to traditional attitudes and values and cautious about change or innovation, typically in relation to politics or religion.

With this definition its clear that it doesn't apply to him. Because even in his JW beliefs it wasn't social conservativism for the sake of being fearful of change or innovation but because he felt that was the precise boundaries they establish to be on the correct path in the eyes of the JW version of God. From that internal perspective its not at all about being fearful of anything. For him he saw himself moving forward, changing and promoting change. I think he wanted to be progressive but from within the boundaries of a spiritual take on life.

I hear what U R saying but you substituted Cautious with Fearful. And those are 2 very different things.

OldFriends4Sale said:

lezama said:

With this definition its clear that it doesn't apply to him. Because even in his JW beliefs it wasn't social conservativism for the sake of being fearful of change or innovation but because he felt that was the precise boundaries they establish to be on the correct path in the eyes of the JW version of God. From that internal perspective its not at all about being fearful of anything. For him he saw himself moving forward, changing and promoting change. I think he wanted to be progressive but from within the boundaries of a spiritual take on life.

I hear what U R saying but you substituted Cautious with Fearful. And those are 2 very different things.

Ummm yeah there's a difference, but not a big one. The same root feeds both. You don't proceed with caution if there's nothing to fear in a given proceeding. But at any rate my point isnt changed by that adjective. However you define the term conservativism, you'll ALWAYS have a problem applying it to Prince. IMHO its better to not try fitting everyone into in boxes cuz many people just don't fit all that neatly unless they're the types that simply mime ideological perspectives from mass media and jump when their party or religious instituion or financial advisor says jump. Ive never gotten the impression he was in any way shape or form that type of person. He believed what he believed in, did what he wanted to do etc, if someone had a huge problem with it, it didn't seem to bother him much.

lezama said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I hear what U R saying but you substituted Cautious with Fearful. And those are 2 very different things.

Ummm yeah there's a difference, but not a big one. The same root feeds both. You don't proceed with caution if there's nothing to fear in a given proceeding. But at any rate my point isnt changed by that adjective. However you define the term conservativism, you'll ALWAYS have a problem applying it to Prince. IMHO its better to not try fitting everyone into in boxes cuz many people just don't fit all that neatly unless they're the types that simply mime ideological perspectives from mass media and jump when their party or religious instituion or financial advisor says jump. Ive never gotten the impression he was in any way shape or form that type of person. He believed what he believed in, did what he wanted to do etc, if someone had a huge problem with it, it didn't seem to bother him much.

Im not addressing that to you, but to the OP.

Early on he clearly wasn't the conservative type.

Even after he became a Witness... the rudeboy still raised his head (so to speak). Prince - the entertainer certainly wasn't all that Conservative.

Prince the human, it's likely we'll never know. He often said things to the press/media to deliberately set them on a false path. Songs were often written either for other people, or from a different perspective than his own. So attempting to use them to decipher Prince is difficult. No least because it's easy to find another song which contradicts a lyric from another song.

He certainly had some Conservative views on religion later in his life. However even after becoming a Witness, he wasn't on a crusade to convert his fans. He was still singing "Dirty Mind, "Turn Me Loose", "Screwdriver". His message above all else was that people shouldn't just close their minds to religion. Asking questions and remaining open to spirituality in some form was IMO his take home message.

Toure, makes some interesting points. But I think trying to put a label on someone who's no longer with us based on what a young lady who knew Prince when he was a teenager had to say 30 years later should be taken with a pinch of salt.

"He was a Conservative in the mold of I'm successful, I'm making money, I want this protected"

How does that reconcile with the guy who overspent on tours. Willing to risk barely breaking even for his art. Who, when his managers tried to explain "you can't keep spending like this" simply flipped over the chart they'd prepared and told them it was their problem.

Prince evolved a lot throughout his career. It's near impossible to point and say "he is this one thing". At best you could say between this time and that time he seemed to favour XYZ.

[Edited 5/17/16 10:06am]

Toure and Rogers and other liberals in the media and in P's inner circle have always been very confused and ignorant when it comes to certain topics.

[Edited 5/17/16 10:07am]

he said in am early interview that he liked Reagan better than Carter so it seems he's been on the right side since the start.

Toure is no Prince expert. He is just an overrated pseudo intellectual fake hipster negro who poses as one

[Edited 5/17/16 11:46am]

I think Prince, like most people if you are honest, was a mixture of both.

Conservative on some issues, liberal on others, and absent in others.

I do not think any free thinking person is in any one camp but has varying views depending on the topic that is being discussed.

lezama said:

lezama said:

Ummm yeah there's a difference, but not a big one. The same root feeds both. You don't proceed with caution if there's nothing to fear in a given proceeding. But at any rate my point isnt changed by that adjective. However you define the term conservativism, you'll ALWAYS have a problem applying it to Prince. IMHO its better to not try fitting everyone into in boxes cuz many people just don't fit all that neatly unless they're the types that simply mime ideological perspectives from mass media and jump when their party or religious instituion or financial advisor says jump. Ive never gotten the impression he was in any way shape or form that type of person. He believed what he believed in, did what he wanted to do etc, if someone had a huge problem with it, it didn't seem to bother him much.

Im not addressing that to you, but to the OP.

can U edit your post then to seperate what reply was to me and what part was to the OP? lol

....

[Edited 5/17/16 19:08pm]

OldFriends4Sale said:

lezama said:

Im not addressing that to you, but to the OP.

can U edit your post then to seperate what reply was to me and what part was to the OP? lol

Its not important. I was just saying the difference doesn't change the point I was making, which is that whatever you definition, you're never going to fit Prince into a single narrow narrative as if he lived along any ideological lines or as if he was even consistent with himself day to day....

.

But I like BklynDiamond's quote here: "I do not think any free thinking person is in any one camp but has varying views depending on the topic that is being discussed."