Aerogram said:

EddieC said:

On the issue of substituting innocuous words for profanity. He can, of course, create valid art without the old "profane" words--but he can't do it with this sort of substitution. He can't do it by writing "we don't give a duck what you got on" or saying HAM or the ridiculousness that's been Days of Wild the last several years--not only does God (if there is one) know what he means, but everyone else does too. It's dishonest and laughable, and undermines the idea that he'll say the truth when it matters. If he thinks there's something wrong with the intent, then skip the song (as he often does) or the sentiment entirely. If the expression of the idea is still based on the profanity lying underneath the word "flippin'", then you might as well say the real word, because that's what everyone hears. Or, find a different structure and a different means of expression. But be honest. If you're cussing, cuss. If you're not, then don't.

OldFriends4Sale said:

babynoz said:

Everyone does not have the same level of conflict though and not everybody handles it the same. I don't know but I suspect that P has dealt with higher than average conflict both internal and external and he has done very well with his challenges IMO.

We can't define Prince solely through his 80's persona though. There was Prince before the 80s also. We also can't go only by what is obvious and in plain sight such as the God/Temptation performance. That's the easy way but sometimes what is not said can be just as telling.

It's all in knowing how to read the more subtle clues.

LG represents a particular influence that P felt was needed in his life to fill a certain void.

of course every has conflict on different levels. BUT every has conflict. Or they are socialpaths.

Higher than average conflict in what way?

I wasn't defining him solely through the 80s. I said that Prince of the 80s the Sex vs God complex everyone always tried to highlight, I believe was a design of art, not an actual conflict. He's given some cool 85 interviews that showed he had it leveled out pretty well his beliefs. I think after the breakup of his 'community he wrestled with a lot more artistically about God & ____ and expressed it in that 88 period. The whole Lovesexy period and rebirth and such. New Powers, We Got the Power, Dance with the Devil etc

In another post I showed other areas in the 2000s that showed what I think is more outward expressions of an inner conflict.

I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.... The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I don't think it was a huge conflict in the 80s. I think that was more designed.

I think since Larry he has had real conflict. And I think it affects a lot of his life and career.

I think, since Larry, it's been more about how he's handled the conflict within. The conflict was always there, but suddenly he was censoring himself. He wasn't playing out the battle within through song and performance on stage, but was instead changing "dirty" words to nonsense, and that bothered many people.

While I personally have no issue with him not using certain words in concert, or on his newer recordings, I agree wholeheartedly with TheBoneRanger that his older works need to remain uncensored. It shows his progress as an artists, human being and spiritual seeker, and makes his transformation far more profound.

JediMaster said:

I think, since Larry, it's been more about how he's handled the conflict within. The conflict was always there, but suddenly he was censoring himself. He wasn't playing out the battle within through song and performance on stage, but was instead changing "dirty" words to nonsense, and that bothered many people.

While I personally have no issue with him not using certain words in concert, or on his newer recordings, I agree wholeheartedly with TheBoneRanger that his older works need to remain uncensored. It shows his progress as an artists, human being and spiritual seeker, and makes his transformation far more profound.

-

I probably take it a little farther (probably too far for most people) and include the songs he recorded back in that time period (pre-JW conversion) but didn't get to release for whatever reason. Just because it wasn't made available publicly is irrelevant to me....the totality of his work, released and unreleased, old and new....is relevant to the man's journey. It's interesting to hear updated re-recordings like Extraloveable from a technical perspective, but the original was a product of it's time and his mindset and is still part of his overall story, even if it's just gathering dust on a shelf in the vault. To take that original recording and "bleep" out the "curse words" or ban the track altogether damages, or rather, dilutes the impact of his salvation as well as his legacy.

-

babynoz said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

of course every has conflict on different levels. BUT every has conflict. Or they are socialpaths.

Higher than average conflict in what way?

I wasn't defining him solely through the 80s. I said that Prince of the 80s the Sex vs God complex everyone always tried to highlight, I believe was a design of art, not an actual conflict. He's given some cool 85 interviews that showed he had it leveled out pretty well his beliefs. I think after the breakup of his 'community he wrestled with a lot more artistically about God & ____ and expressed it in that 88 period. The whole Lovesexy period and rebirth and such. New Powers, We Got the Power, Dance with the Devil etc

In another post I showed other areas in the 2000s that showed what I think is more outward expressions of an inner conflict.

I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.... The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

huh? It just seems like you're not really reading what I'm saying or something

.

OldFriends4Sale said:I don't think it was a huge conflict in the 80s. I think that was more designed.
I think since Larry he has had real conflict. And I think it affects a lot of his life and career.

Babynoz replied:Disagree. Prince has had inner conflict long before he even met LG.

OldFriends4Sale replied: Well yes everyone has conflict.

Babynoz replied: Everyone does not have the same level of conflict though and not everybody handles it the same. I don't know but I suspect that P has dealt with higher than average conflict both internal and external

OldFriends4Sale replied: of course every has conflict on different levels. BUT every has conflict. Or they are socialpaths. Higher than average conflict in what way?

Babynoz replied: I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.

The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

TheBoneRanger said:

JediMaster said:

I think, since Larry, it's been more about how he's handled the conflict within. The conflict was always there, but suddenly he was censoring himself. He wasn't playing out the battle within through song and performance on stage, but was instead changing "dirty" words to nonsense, and that bothered many people.

While I personally have no issue with him not using certain words in concert, or on his newer recordings, I agree wholeheartedly with TheBoneRanger that his older works need to remain uncensored. It shows his progress as an artists, human being and spiritual seeker, and makes his transformation far more profound.

-

I probably take it a little farther (probably too far for most people) and include the songs he recorded back in that time period (pre-JW conversion) but didn't get to release for whatever reason. Just because it wasn't made available publicly is irrelevant to me....the totality of his work, released and unreleased, old and new....is relevant to the man's journey. It's interesting to hear updated re-recordings like Extraloveable from a technical perspective, but the original was a product of it's time and his mindset and is still part of his overall story, even if it's just gathering dust on a shelf in the vault. To take that original recording and "bleep" out the "curse words" or ban the track altogether damages, or rather, dilutes the impact of his salvation as well as his legacy.

-

I agree.

babynoz said:

I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.... The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

-

Yeah and also how well he expresses it through his art. In my opinion nobody else comes close to him in this regard. It seems so effortless that sometimes I wonder if he's even aware of it. Because back then he didn't necessarily sing about the conflict itself....it just sounds to me like the general feel of a song sounds either sinful or it has a more positive vibe to it.

-

Another point is that the profanity might not even be lyrical in nature. For instance, I was recently listening to the three part version of "I Wish U Heaven" and there's a guitar lead in it that sounds absolutely bathing in sin.....the sound of the distortion as well as the notes he's playing....it's just deliciously sinful and sensual. So if that guitar solo really is profane or has a profane origin from his mindset when he wrote and recorded it, then shouldn't that also be censored?

-

TheBoneRanger said:

babynoz said:

I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.... The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

-

Yeah and also how well he expresses it through his art. In my opinion nobody else comes close to him in this regard. It seems so effortless that sometimes I wonder if he's even aware of it. Because back then he didn't necessarily sing about the conflict itself....it just sounds to me like the general feel of a song sounds either sinful or it has a more positive vibe to it.

-

Another point is that the profanity might not even be lyrical in nature. For instance, I was recently listening to the three part version of "I Wish U Heaven" and there's a guitar lead in it that sounds absolutely bathing in sin.....the sound of the distortion as well as the notes he's playing....it's just deliciously sinful and sensual. So if that guitar solo really is profane or has a profane origin from his mindset when he wrote and recorded it, then shouldn't that also be censored?

-

I don't think Prince is unique in this respect, there are many regular people and many artists that blend it effortlessly. I think as fans we admire and study his music and person. But many people go through this just as well and better.

the I HATE U guitar solo sounds angry, but anger isn't sinful. But Prince seems to think so

Conflict through artistic expression.

That little but loud guitar scream in Sexuality, right before 'Mama are you listening?' so disruptive in a perfect way

OldFriends4Sale said:

I don't think it was a huge conflict in the 80s. I think that was more designed.

I think since Larry he has had real conflict. And I think it affects a lot of his life and career.

-

I think the conflict became rather heightened at this point (was it 1998?) and so then the reaction was the conversion and extreme measures of banning songs or albums and censoring "curse" words. But the irony is his art now has less impact because it's been watered down and even ridiculous in some cases (like when he replaces "fuck" with "duck"). He's still making great music and it's great to see that his story has or will have a positive ending. I just think he does an irreparable disservice to his legacy when he tries to revise his history by censoring words, banning songs, or banning albums.

-

However, it's a promising sign that he's made songs and albums available on Tidal that I thought he never would allow to see the light of day again. I think his ability to harness the profane and profound and channel them into his art is a God given gift, the profane side of which he should never be ashamed to explore and express, especially when it actually serves to magnify the importance of his salvation.

-

JediMaster said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I don't think it was a huge conflict in the 80s. I think that was more designed.

I think since Larry he has had real conflict. And I think it affects a lot of his life and career.

I think, since Larry, it's been more about how he's handled the conflict within. The conflict was always there, but suddenly he was censoring himself. He wasn't playing out the battle within through song and performance on stage, but was instead changing "dirty" words to nonsense, and that bothered many people.

While I personally have no issue with him not using certain words in concert, or on his newer recordings, I agree wholeheartedly with TheBoneRanger that his older works need to remain uncensored. It shows his progress as an artists, human being and spiritual seeker, and makes his transformation far more profound.

I agree...the conflict was always there.

And the older works do need to remain uncensored otherwise it's not an honest reflection of his evolution.

He can evolve but his attempts to sanitize the past are not necessary.

TheBoneRanger said:

babynoz said:

I think we're already aware that everybody has conflict.... The thread is not about everybody's conflict, it's about Prince's level of conflict.

-

Yeah and also how well he expresses it through his art. In my opinion nobody else comes close to him in this regard. It seems so effortless that sometimes I wonder if he's even aware of it. Because back then he didn't necessarily sing about the conflict itself....it just sounds to me like the general feel of a song sounds either sinful or it has a more positive vibe to it.

-

Another point is that the profanity might not even be lyrical in nature. For instance, I was recently listening to the three part version of "I Wish U Heaven" and there's a guitar lead in it that sounds absolutely bathing in sin.....the sound of the distortion as well as the notes he's playing....it's just deliciously sinful and sensual. So if that guitar solo really is profane or has a profane origin from his mindset when he wrote and recorded it, then shouldn't that also be censored?

-

Spot on.

He has conveyed the presence of conflict in more subtle ways at various times. Often brilliantly.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I don't think Prince is unique in this respect, there are many regular people and many artists that blend it effortlessly. I think as fans we admire and study his music and person. But many people go through this just as well and better.

the I HATE U guitar solo sounds angry, but anger isn't sinful. But Prince seems to think so

Conflict through artistic expression.

That little but loud guitar scream in Sexuality, right before 'Mama are you listening?' so disruptive in a perfect way

-

Yeah, I should reiterate that his dominance in this regard as a musical artist is just my opinion. But that's part of what makes me such a rabid fan of his music. It's a fascinating element to his music that makes me more of a fan than I otherwise would be.

-

JediMaster said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I don't think it was a huge conflict in the 80s. I think that was more designed.

I think since Larry he has had real conflict. And I think it affects a lot of his life and career.

I think, since Larry, it's been more about how he's handled the conflict within. The conflict was always there, but suddenly he was censoring himself. He wasn't playing out the battle within through song and performance on stage, but was instead changing "dirty" words to nonsense, and that bothered many people.

While I personally have no issue with him not using certain words in concert, or on his newer recordings, I agree wholeheartedly with TheBoneRanger that his older works need to remain uncensored. It shows his progress as an artists, human being and spiritual seeker, and makes his transformation far more profound.

True,
I believe for everyone (but artists especially) we have to express what is happening inside, in various ways. The artist tend to get it out through song music painting writing dance etc

.

In the 80s Prince had what he called a community, and in that community he had his 'religion' we saw it evolve. He had his reflection, and competition all within Uptown. So I think that was a buffer against 'the real world'. When that community split other things rushed in on him.
.
We saw a kind of conflict connected to a bad trip with the Black album and having a 'spititual' awakening via Lovesexy. He attached Anger to the Black album. I don't remember him saying anything about having issues with sexuality expressed on that album, but that he was fueled with anger in making the album. True or not, design, I don't know. But interestingly, we never hear anything from that album, except for Alphabet St(maybe Annestesia) -not Eye Know, I Wish U Heaven, Glam Slam etc

.

And back then he used 'religious' reference for a shock value in duality of his rebel/rude boy expression. Like in Controversy, using the Our Father prayer, wasn't about any conflict within himself But in a New Wave kinda way in connection with the image of Prince at the time, it sure made it sound dangerous, transgressive...

.

I agree with that too, he should not censor himself in that way. I always thought the placement of 'bad' words in the 80s was pretty poetic and not vulgar. But in the 90s it came across as vulgar and not poetic.

.
I saw it all the time Purple Rain had no curse words and outside of Darling Nikkie's "masturbate with a magazine' was not some dirty song. same with Around the World in a Day and Parade. Foul language in check.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Bohemian67 said:

I don't know why TGE and TRC aren't on Tidal and hadn't noticed TBA absence, but don't mind as one listen of the latter was enough.

-

Good post.

I too don't believe he had much conflict outside of the regular conflict that comes from being human and putting our lives together. In the 70s/80s.

He said that he does not use curse words because curse words call up anger. Which is only minimally true. And even Jesus said 'Be angry and sin not' . He said he doesn't like to write from an angry place anymore. And recently at an aftershow he told the dj not to play Head. So there is obviously struggle and conflict there.

The only time throughout the night that Walker received anything but positive feedback from Prince's camp came when he dropped one of the man-of-the-moment's own hits, Head, which Walker was quickly asked to turn off.

"He gave a requirement that he didn’t want any tracks played with any profanity in it, so I knew that before the gig started and then I was thinking, which track of his do I want to play and that was one of my favourite tracks of his," he says.

"...And then he sent his minder up who said, ‘Take it off’."

His choices of music he will perform. He won't play Head but he will play Cream. He won't play Darling Nikki but he will play Little Red Corvette (which is basically the same subject)
and to name a few more Let's Work,

Also in the 2009/2010 interview where he 'praised' Muslim culture:
"It's fun being in Islamic countries, to know there's only one religion. There's order. You wear a burqa. There's no choice,” he told British newspaper, The Guardian, “People are happy with that.”

Life back home depresses me, just another form of slavery
The cost of freedom is anything but free

There ain't nobody got no chains on me

Lavaux
Lavaux

this says a lot to me that Prince of now, is conflicted. He wants/needs things to be black in white.

I even remember how liberated he seemed when he started the Welcome 2 Europe tour, showing skin, tearing open his shirts, wearing lace clothing. When he got back to America he was covered up again.

There's something on the tip of my tongue
Got a taste for sin -Cause & Effect(Prince)

What is it that Larry represents that you don't agree with? God, Organised religion or JW's?

-

There is nothing wrong with cursing in my book if it releases temporary frustration. But it's something you do in the car when you MF bad drivers, or with your friends who let you vent when you're mad and can't express what you feel. But it's not something you should share with the rest of the world and I don't see why Prince should. This is not conflict. The past might be part of who he is but it is not who he is now. That's why he probably didn't want Head played.

-

In Nikki vs. LRC and Head vs. Cream, both are more sophisticated and radio friendly to the masses (concerts) so choosing those just seem like common sense choices to me, not from a place of conflict. In the recent album he sings 'life is a b***** sometimes' (somewhere). Some things don't need repetition if we know the score and we're on the same page.

-

Is it conflict or cultural observation when he praises Muslim culture? Do you not see how enslaving Western culture is in its consumer driven, individualistic, silicone soul society? He is only recognising the ambiguity of never-ending choices, the so called 'freedom' which actually means we are never free because we never 'have' enough. Compare this to cultures elsewhere where materialism is often replaced by collectivity, purer authenticity and substance. Lavaux: is just saying, freedom might be between your ears but ultimately, we all have to physically participate in society even if its values don't match own own deeply held convictions. (another form of slavery). Melancholy awareness but not conflict in my book.

-

I was out of the country when Prince visited in 2011 and 2014 so I don't know about the shirt ripping. Picture please But if we take your average stereotype American, they do get flustered at the look or mention of a nipple. Europe is a lot more open minded.There isn't a lot we haven't seen and we don't get all 'starry eyed' or loud about it.

-

Don't the cause and effect lyrics say it all? The word sin here is not denoting any kind of personal inner conflict. It's just a collective word that people attach their own associations to. He's still singing what he likes to sing about. 'Keep doing u until you cum'. Wow! When last has he written something that explicit. He sounds pretty happy singing it too.

Bohemian67 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Good post.

I too don't believe he had much conflict outside of the regular conflict that comes from being human and putting our lives together. In the 70s/80s.

He said that he does not use curse words because curse words call up anger. Which is only minimally true. And even Jesus said 'Be angry and sin not' . He said he doesn't like to write from an angry place anymore. And recently at an aftershow he told the dj not to play Head. So there is obviously struggle and conflict there.

The only time throughout the night that Walker received anything but positive feedback from Prince's camp came when he dropped one of the man-of-the-moment's own hits, Head, which Walker was quickly asked to turn off.

"He gave a requirement that he didn’t want any tracks played with any profanity in it, so I knew that before the gig started and then I was thinking, which track of his do I want to play and that was one of my favourite tracks of his," he says.

"...And then he sent his minder up who said, ‘Take it off’."

His choices of music he will perform. He won't play Head but he will play Cream. He won't play Darling Nikki but he will play Little Red Corvette (which is basically the same subject)
and to name a few more Let's Work,

Also in the 2009/2010 interview where he 'praised' Muslim culture:
"It's fun being in Islamic countries, to know there's only one religion. There's order. You wear a burqa. There's no choice,” he told British newspaper, The Guardian, “People are happy with that.”

Life back home depresses me, just another form of slavery
The cost of freedom is anything but free

There ain't nobody got no chains on me

Lavaux
Lavaux

this says a lot to me that Prince of now, is conflicted. He wants/needs things to be black in white.

I even remember how liberated he seemed when he started the Welcome 2 Europe tour, showing skin, tearing open his shirts, wearing lace clothing. When he got back to America he was covered up again.

There's something on the tip of my tongue
Got a taste for sin -Cause & Effect(Prince)

What is it that Larry represents that you don't agree with? God, Organised religion or JW's?

-

There is nothing wrong with cursing in my book if it releases temporary frustration. But it's something you do in the car when you MF bad drivers, or with your friends who let you vent when you're mad and can't express what you feel. But it's not something you should share with the rest of the world and I don't see why Prince should. This is not conflict. The past might be part of who he is but it is not who he is now. That's why he probably didn't want Head played.

-

In Nikki vs. LRC and Head vs. Cream, both are more sophisticated and radio friendly to the masses (concerts) so choosing those just seem like common sense choices to me, not from a place of conflict. In the recent album he sings 'life is a b***** sometimes' (somewhere). Some things don't need repetition if we know the score and we're on the same page.

-

Is it conflict or cultural observation when he praises Muslim culture? Do you not see how enslaving Western culture is in its consumer driven, individualistic, silicone soul society? He is only recognising the ambiguity of never-ending choices, the so called 'freedom' which actually means we are never free because we never 'have' enough. Compare this to cultures elsewhere where materialism is often replaced by collectivity, purer authenticity and substance. Lavaux: is just saying, freedom might be between your ears but ultimately, we all have to physically participate in society even if its values don't match own own deeply held convictions. (another form of slavery). Melancholy awareness but not conflict in my book.

-

I was out of the country when Prince visited in 2011 and 2014 so I don't know about the shirt ripping. Picture please But if we take your average stereotype American, they do get flustered at the look or mention of a nipple. Europe is a lot more open minded.There isn't a lot we haven't seen and we don't get all 'starry eyed' or loud about it.

-

Don't the cause and effect lyrics say it all? The word sin here is not denoting any kind of personal inner conflict. It's just a collective word that people attach their own associations to. He's still singing what he likes to sing about. 'Keep doing u until you cum'. Wow! When last has he written something that explicit. He sounds pretty happy singing it too.

No Larry doesn't represent God in this picture. God was always there. He represents the doctrine of the JW.

I don't have a problem with cursing. I can take it one way or another. 3 of my favorite albums PR ATWIAD and Parade are basically devoid of it.

Cursing, there really is no rule on it. It's used during good sex, comedy, frustration etc

Head has no cursing in it. It's a song that talks about a sexual encounter with a woman, just like Little Red Corvette. I'm conflicted.

I think that observation about muslin culture(which is more about religion) is an admission about the struggle of freedom of choice, and that things in his world as far as his religious beliefs aren't so black and white for him.

I like your take on Lavaux.

No, lol, Americans don't have a problem with men with their shirts off. That is a common thing, especially when it comes to male entertainers. And we cannot rule out rules of conduct from his JW doctrine when it comes to this.

Cause & Effect (not such a good song) but revealing lyrics. The thing is I think Prince wants to go further again with those types of lyrics. When there was a little tribute for him 2010 and Alicia Keys climbed on the piano when singing Adore,... when he is at the mic, he goes on to tell everyone they don't have to do the things he did back then. It just comes off so conflicted.

I'll post the open shirt later

OldFriends4Sale said:

He said that he does not use curse words because curse words call up anger. Which is only minimally true. And even Jesus said 'Be angry and sin not' . He said he doesn't like to write from an angry place anymore.

-

I just listened to "When Will We B Paid" on Tidal and, although it's a cover song and there are no curse words in it, he sounds like he's absolutely seething with rage, especially the guitar solo!

-

On a side note, I have the HIFI subscription to Tidal and I've never heard this song sound so good. Same goes for all of the NPGMC tracks.....they all sound exquisite!

OldFriends4Sale said:

Bohemian67 said:

....

No Larry doesn't represent God in this picture. God was always there. He represents the doctrine of the JW.

I don't have a problem with cursing. I can take it one way or another. 3 of my favorite albums PR ATWIAD and Parade are basically devoid of it.

Cursing, there really is no rule on it. It's used during good sex, comedy, frustration etc

Head has no cursing in it. It's a song that talks about a sexual encounter with a woman, just like Little Red Corvette. I'm conflicted.

I think that observation about muslin culture(which is more about religion) is an admission about the struggle of freedom of choice, and that things in his world as far as his religious beliefs aren't so black and white for him.

I like your take on Lavaux.

No, lol, Americans don't have a problem with men with their shirts off. That is a common thing, especially when it comes to male entertainers. And we cannot rule out rules of conduct from his JW doctrine when it comes to this.

Cause & Effect (not such a good song) but revealing lyrics. The thing is I think Prince wants to go further again with those types of lyrics. When there was a little tribute for him 2010 and Alicia Keys climbed on the piano when singing Adore,... when he is at the mic, he goes on to tell everyone they don't have to do the things he did back then. It just comes off so conflicted.

I'll post the open shirt later

Nice jacket and thanks: (Lavaux)

I forgot, there are other times when we swear too. Head is not exactly a friendly song to one's fellow brother and epitomizes superficiality in the female being seduced on her way down the aisle. Only recently checked the lyrics as I didn't know it though I have the cd.

-

I actually meant female not male anatomy causing raised eye brows sometimes with cultural stereotypes.

-

Prince put an ultra sexy picture of him fingering rosary beads on Instagram yesterday. He knows like his own 3rd Eye lyric, 'your god is inside of you'. Yes if he compares the western take on religion to the Middle east, there is a simplicity there with less choice, which is why western interference always messes things up. (One doesn't move from 'no choice' to 'every choice' politically without a respectable period for social cultural evolution. Their cultural roots are so far removed from western no wonder some of them hate the west so much.)

-

Back on topic, I don't think Larry is 'a' problem, if there were one. As we age, each decade brings new wisdom learnt from experience. Your friendship circle contracts because one becomes more selective. We know ourselves better, know what works and what we need. Larry was there at an important time, he should not be discarded but I am quite sure no one dictates to Prince what he should and shouldn't do.

I've unfortunately lost my Cause & Effect through laptop to lap/tab changes and ITunes sorting but I liked it. Don’t remember those lyrics though so ta for posting. On another note, have you made any nice thread for Artificial age? I've been out of Prince world for a while and couldn't find anything in the search. Merci d'avance.

Bohemian67 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

No Larry doesn't represent God in this picture. God was always there. He represents the doctrine of the JW.

I don't have a problem with cursing. I can take it one way or another. 3 of my favorite albums PR ATWIAD and Parade are basically devoid of it.

Cursing, there really is no rule on it. It's used during good sex, comedy, frustration etc

Head has no cursing in it. It's a song that talks about a sexual encounter with a woman, just like Little Red Corvette. I'm conflicted.

I think that observation about muslin culture(which is more about religion) is an admission about the struggle of freedom of choice, and that things in his world as far as his religious beliefs aren't so black and white for him.

I like your take on Lavaux.

No, lol, Americans don't have a problem with men with their shirts off. That is a common thing, especially when it comes to male entertainers. And we cannot rule out rules of conduct from his JW doctrine when it comes to this.

Cause & Effect (not such a good song) but revealing lyrics. The thing is I think Prince wants to go further again with those types of lyrics. When there was a little tribute for him 2010 and Alicia Keys climbed on the piano when singing Adore,... when he is at the mic, he goes on to tell everyone they don't have to do the things he did back then. It just comes off so conflicted.

I'll post the open shirt later

Nice jacket and thanks: (Lavaux)

I forgot, there are other times when we swear too. Head is not exactly a friendly song to one's fellow brother and epitomizes superficiality in the female being seduced on her way down the aisle. Only recently checked the lyrics as I didn't know it though I have the cd.

-

I actually meant female not male anatomy causing raised eye brows sometimes with cultural stereotypes.

-

Prince put an ultra sexy picture of him fingering rosary beads on Instagram yesterday. He knows like his own 3rd Eye lyric, 'your god is inside of you'. Yes if he compares the western take on religion to the Middle east, there is a simplicity there with less choice, which is why western interference always messes things up. (One doesn't move from 'no choice' to 'every choice' politically without a respectable period for social cultural evolution. Their cultural roots are so far removed from western no wonder some of them hate the west so much.)

-

Back on topic, I don't think Larry is 'a' problem, if there were one. As we age, each decade brings new wisdom learnt from experience. Your friendship circle contracts because one becomes more selective. We know ourselves better, know what works and what we need. Larry was there at an important time, he should not be discarded but I am quite sure no one dictates to Prince what he should and shouldn't do.

I've unfortunately lost my Cause & Effect through laptop to lap/tab changes and ITunes sorting but I liked it. Don’t remember those lyrics though so ta for posting. On another note, have you made any nice thread for Artificial age? I've been out of Prince world for a while and couldn't find anything in the search. Merci d'avance.

lol tha is actually an example of the clothing he was wearing on the Welcome 2 Europe tour: it is a see throuh lace shirt

I came to see head as a woman liberated from societies demands of marriage. She was a virgin, not having experienced life/sex yet. And she made a decision... she went Uptown instead.

I agree with what U said about Western idealogy about Middle Eastern life.

Larry, lol the problematic old Prophet

I never made an official AOA era thread yet. I wanted to see where it went, and it never really panned out at the time. So it will be interesting to do one looking back.

If had the chance to do it all again
I wouldn't change a thing, except my next of kin
There's something on the tip of my tongue
Got a taste for sin
If you stamp your passport full of regret
You have nothing to remember but a lot to forget
Leave no enemies, leave no debt, no!

Made in the image of cause and effect
To no other anekatips.com man am I the subject
I am what i am because & effect
Cause and effect, cause and effect yeah!

(hey, hey, hey)

If i could talk to myself back then right now
I'd say 'son you might wanna, stick around
Something amazing is about to go down'
If i could leave myself just one little note
One that husbands and fathers wrote
It say 'you need to be a superstar or grow up,
but not both, no!

Made in the image of cause and effect
To no other man am I the subject
I am what i am because & effect
Cause and effect, cause and effect yeah!

(hey, hey, hey)

solo

(cause and effect, ladies and gentlemen)
(rock)

I am here. where are you?
Haha!!

Don't let them say your paper's worth more than gold
I see a generation lay down before they get old
And getting endlessly sold

(You need compassion) for one another
(compassion) righter than wrong
that's what needs to be at the heart of every past
and future soul song

Made in the image of cause and effect
To no other man am I the subject
I am what i am because & effect
Cause and effect, cause and effect yeah!

(hey, hey, hey)

look at y'all. brains splattered
all over, moneyapolis

Prince & his 3rd Eye Acolytes

I'd say that Prince dropped into a kind of "inner conflict" between good vs bad / sexuality vs spirituality once he had a major taste of professional success. The assumption in my forthcoming evaluation is that he has a baseline psychological profile comparable to most of us. Coming off the blocks, he's a musician singing his heart and technically crafting song about love, sex, and romance, with no problems at all. You have your joy and your bluesey laments expressed on the grooves. I don't hear conflict in his early published stuff, although I could be wrong!

>

Anyway, come to "1999" and some darkness creeps in--Automatic, Something in the Water(Does Not Compute), Lady Cab Driver, All the Critics Love U in New York. He's feasting of the fruits of his labor with all the attention, money, and resultant temptations coming to his enterprising hands, all the while percieving the spirit of his humble beginnings and setting conditions to cultivate psychological conflict. And he focuses on it a little bit more to fuel the creative tension within. Since the success of Prince, he's expressed waves of the ecstacy and agony of good and bad alternative temptations dampening and overlapping the other to varying degrees from project to project.

>

He has a psychological breakthrough, or breakup, bewteen his "Black Album" and resultant "Lovesexy" projects. He gets funky, fights the recording industry, goes mainstream for a bit, and tweaks some songs from the vault. Once again he hits a breaking point with "The Rainbow Children" signaling his Jehova Witness identity. After stopping the cussing in his songwriting, he is now a different man from the past. Maybe after "Art Offical Age" those coflicting forces of nature will have dampened down and some different expressions will come. Maybe he'll find a new love or some passionate protest and they will flare up again! With any luck, we'll see what comes next.

>

I think that Prince has created his own inner conflicts, like most of us do, with astrological influences being a minor thing. I'd say that his life experiences and dealings with folks weigh the heaviest in all of that influence.

>

It's been interesting seeing where Prince has been coming from and where he's going with his artistic expressions, though, I can sum!

^ great post.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Bohemian67 said:

Nice jacket and thanks: (Lavaux)

I forgot, there are other times when we swear too. Head is not exactly a friendly song to one's fellow brother and epitomizes superficiality in the female being seduced on her way down the aisle. Only recently checked the lyrics as I didn't know it though I have the cd.

-

I actually meant female not male anatomy causing raised eye brows sometimes with cultural stereotypes.

-

Prince put an ultra sexy picture of him fingering rosary beads on Instagram yesterday. He knows like his own 3rd Eye lyric, 'your god is inside of you'. Yes if he compares the western take on religion to the Middle east, there is a simplicity there with less choice, which is why western interference always messes things up. (One doesn't move from 'no choice' to 'every choice' politically without a respectable period for social cultural evolution. Their cultural roots are so far removed from western no wonder some of them hate the west so much.)

-

Back on topic, I don't think Larry is 'a' problem, if there were one. As we age, each decade brings new wisdom learnt from experience. Your friendship circle contracts because one becomes more selective. We know ourselves better, know what works and what we need. Larry was there at an important time, he should not be discarded but I am quite sure no one dictates to Prince what he should and shouldn't do.

I've unfortunately lost my Cause & Effect through laptop to lap/tab changes and ITunes sorting but I liked it. Don’t remember those lyrics though so ta for posting. On another note, have you made any nice thread for Artificial age? I've been out of Prince world for a while and couldn't find anything in the search. Merci d'avance.

lol tha is actually an example of the clothing he was wearing on the Welcome 2 Europe tour: it is a see throuh lace shirt

I came to see head as a woman liberated from societies demands of marriage. She was a virgin, not having experienced life/sex yet. And she made a decision... she went Uptown instead.

I agree with what U said about Western idealogy about Middle Eastern life.

Larry, lol the problematic old Prophet

I never made an official AOA era thread yet. I wanted to see where it went, and it never really panned out at the time. So it will be interesting to do one looking back.

Haha. I expected something completely different after your description!

-

Really don't know the song but get the idea, even though I like your interpretation, that the woman was not given the kindest introduction to love

So we can agree that after all the lyrics of recent times that Prince isn't conflicted, just chooses less blatant/sexist tracks? Hope so then we can put this thread to bed.

-

Larry: 'The problematic old Prophet', haha. You OFFS want Prince to sell off his old friend. You do realise that the org would be up in arms accusing him of Human Trafficking right? I read Larry did the bass in my favourite track Space so I'd rather he stayed.

-

Thanks for the thread link. Informative! Maybe just the pale blue in reading lyrics was somewhat difficult. Hadn't actually studied the lyrics carefully. Dig the album though, especially the segues.

OldFriends4Sale said:

laurarichardson said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Well yes everyone has conflict.

But I think what we saw in the 1980s was by design/promotion.
I've read interviews where Prince is pretty comfortable with God and Sex/Sinful.

We really only saw some kind of 'conflict' lived out in the music on the PR tour with the God/Temptation dialogue. Then he put it on the end of Temptation. Parade was almost devoid of it. Maybe that is why so many feel it is so wonderfully breezy and fresh.

I don't hear/read any real conflict/struggle in Prince's music mostly until possibly Lovesexy.

I'm not blaming Larry specifically, but what he represents. Which defiinately enhanced a conflict. to the point it's more visible in his relations, performances etc

-// He has the Lord's Prayer in Controversy and talks about going to a better place after talking about fucking the taste out of some chicks mouth on LPWAM and of course Temptation. How clueless are you? P conflicted about his religion and his lifestyle long before Larry came and probaly will be for the rest of his days.

As I've said already of course everyone has conflict in their lives. But the whole Sex & God conflict was manifactured. There was not a bunch of overt religious themes in Prince music unti his 4th album and that wasn't about inner conflict, nor on 1999. Definately not on Purple Rain. and only in a little ending of the ATWIAD album. Almost none on Parade.
just because Prince said something connected with an idea of God doesn't make it conflict.

Not until the Tempation piece on the PR tour and then then ending of Tempation on ATWIAD did we ever see/here any real conflict

Prince reciting the Lords Prayer in controvery was to stir controversy in a New Wavish way. And the reciting of the Prayer was not about any Inner Conflict, but a response to the people who were creating controversy questioning race and sexuality. Prince had no cnflict.

Prince has always insinuated that Sex & God went hand in hand. So for him to fuck the taste out of someones mouth and then dream of heaven was not conflicting.

Power Fantastic is equally about Self Love(Pleasuring) and the Love of God

Do a little more study on your princeology. And get more than a clue.

OldFriends4Sale said:

laurarichardson said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

As I've said already of course everyone has conflict in their lives. But the whole Sex & God conflict was manifactured. There was not a bunch of overt religious themes in Prince music unti his 4th album and that wasn't about inner conflict, nor on 1999. Definately not on Purple Rain. and only in a little ending of the ATWIAD album. Almost none on Parade.
just because Prince said something connected with an idea of God doesn't make it conflict.

Not until the Tempation piece on the PR tour and then then ending of Tempation on ATWIAD did we ever see/here any real conflict

Prince reciting the Lords Prayer in controvery was to stir controversy in a New Wavish way. And the reciting of the Prayer was not about any Inner Conflict, but a response to the people who were creating controversy questioning race and sexuality. Prince had no cnflict.

Prince has always insinuated that Sex & God went hand in hand. So for him to fuck the taste out of someones mouth and then dream of heaven was not conflicting.

Power Fantastic is equally about Self Love(Pleasuring) and the Love of God

Do a little more study on your princeology. And get more than a clue.

---- You have skipped a half a dozen songs with conflict. This is when non-Christians need to go read a Bible. Prince's conflict with sexuality and spiritual ty is no more manufactured then any other Christian. It is hard to serve to masters - The Lord or giving in to the secular world.

well discuss, without the nastiness

name the songs. I didn't skip any, I had them all going through my head and ear when I came to the conclusion.

Now later on the inner conflict became real and expanded to all types of things Prince thought was not good like Anger

Aerogram said: