Harps said:

.

That said, at my ripe old age (40), I find Springsteens recent and current work more in line with my maturity - the song writing, the lyrical subjects, the reflections on life etc......

.

I still like to party but I struggle listening to "Like a Mack" from a man who is also capable of writing "Stare".

.

Does anyone share a similar experience, as they age with Prince?

You're not telling me you believe "if you're not a Rita Bot you're a Bludclott" is bad song writing are you?


I dont listen to Springsteen however he seems to have it all spot on, there is a reason he's one of the highest grossing artists still and doesnt only sell out Arena's but stadiums, I will get to a stage where I will start to check out his music though for sure

LittlePurpleYoda said:

What elitism! When Prince is "on" lyrically I find him more clever, humorous, provocative and sensual than anything Springsteen can conjure.

Lyricist and Composer Randy Newman made the same observations about the two.

They are different. Songwriting does not have to be an earnest evaluation of Americana or aging.

jdcxc said:

Too bad he's "on" only about .2% of the time these days, and when he's "off" he's really REALLY off.

jdcxc said:

LittlePurpleYoda said:

While Prince can write a catchy hook & has written a number of astoninishingly amazing songs, I think Bruce Springsteen is just a superior songwriter & a better observer of the human condition. Prince could never have written an album as cohesive as The Rising. He could barely maintain a consistent theme through "Baltimore."

That's been the case since the start of their careers, just as it has that Springsteen has been more open & willing to talk about his craft, or throw his support behind causes he believes in.

(If we're doing a literary background pissing contest, I have 2 MA's, including one in English Literature from one of the most prestigous Jesuit universities in the U.S. & a home library of just shy of 800 books. Granted, no small number of them are Star Wars related, but there are some classics in there, too!)

What elitism! When Prince is "on" lyrically I find him more clever, humorous, provocative and sensual than anything Springsteen can conjure. Lyricist and Composer Randy Newman made the same observations about the two. They are different. Songwriting does not have to be an earnest evaluation of Americana or aging.

1) First, ‘fess up. You’re referencing an interview from 1986: https://books.google.com/...mp;f=false

There are any number of equally reputable musicians who'd counter that assessment.

2) Clever lyrics? Humorous lyrics? Provocative & Sensual lyrics? Springsteen's written countless examples of both. Red Headed Woman, Tunnel of Love, Fever, Because The Night....

No, songwriting doesn't have to be an earnest evaluation of Americana or aging, but it does have to be competent, genuine & thoughtful. The majority of Prince's work, compared to Springsteen's falls far short on most of those characteristics to anyone making a truly honest appraisal. However, it's still possible to enjoy both performers for what they bring to the table.

Watch The Ties That Bind Friday night on HBO & imagine Prince talking about his work like that. It would never happen because Prince just is not that articulate, on paper or onstage.

[Edited 11/24/15 9:18am]

LittlePurpleYoda said:

What a narrow eurocentric view of songwriting. Songwriting is more than lyrics. James Brown is a great songwriter. There are many critics and musicians who praise Prince and call Bruce overrated. When I hear Dancing In the Dark and a lot of his music I am amazed at its simplicity...in a bad way. To reduce Prince to a Song and Dance man is ridiculous. And when Prince seriously discusses music, not being the trickster, it's deep, reflective and complex- read some serious Prince books and analysis. P has the most complicated musical vocabulary of any living pop musician. Bruce couldn't hold the stage with him. Prince has been praised by Stevie, Miles and Bruce...for his songwriting!

Guess who's the only (ridiculous) African-American songwriter in Paste Magazines top ten...

http://www.pastemagazine....s-110.html

Where is Stevie, Smokey, Marvin...what BS

What a narrow eurocentric view of songwriting. Songwriting is more than lyrics. James Brown is a great songwriter. There are many critics and musicians who praise Prince and call Bruce overrated. When I hear Dancing In the Dark and a lot of his music I am amazed at its simplicity...in a bad way. To reduce Prince to a Song and Dance man is ridiculous. And when Prince seriously discusses music, not being the trickster, it's deep, reflective and complex- read some serious Prince books and analysis. P has the most complicated musical vocabulary of any living pop musician. Bruce couldn't hold the stage with him. Prince has been praised by Stevie, Miles and Bruce...for his songwriting!

I have always been a Prince fan...but a few years ago, started to get into Springsteen. Up to "Magic', I was really into his stuff. I sort of dropped off after that album.

Here is how I see them...

They seem to have diff focus. Prince seems not to care anymore about his body of work. He releases clunkers like Hit and RUn when he has so many amazing songs in the vault. He seems to still be trying to sound 'current'. Springsteen is not chasing any of that...then again, he was never trendy. I still believe Prince's raw talent is unequalled and when he's 'on', no one can touch him. However, he's not always 'on'. Springsteen definitely puts more effort into lyrical content. I mean, I have to remind myself that Prince wrote 'Adore' to remember how great a lyricist he can be. I certainly can not tell from what he's done in the last many man years.

JoeyCococo said:

That's lazy. There are plenty of brilliantly crafted songwriting P gems over the last 20 years. Bruce has only put out an album every few years and has a lot less musical output than Prince. Of course that will lead to more experimentation and misses by P. Bruce bores me although I respect his craft...Tunnel of Love is cool. We cannot even discuss a musical comparison.

I Love U but I Don't Trust U Anymore
The Truth Album (Dionne...omg)
Dark
Dinner With Delores
One Nite Alone (Avalanche, Pearls B4 The Swine)

jdcxc said:

JoeyCococo said:

I have always been a Prince fan...but a few years ago, started to get into Springsteen. Up to "Magic', I was really into his stuff. I sort of dropped off after that album.

Here is how I see them...

They seem to have diff focus. Prince seems not to care anymore about his body of work. He releases clunkers like Hit and RUn when he has so many amazing songs in the vault. He seems to still be trying to sound 'current'. Springsteen is not chasing any of that...then again, he was never trendy. I still believe Prince's raw talent is unequalled and when he's 'on', no one can touch him. However, he's not always 'on'. Springsteen definitely puts more effort into lyrical content. I mean, I have to remind myself that Prince wrote 'Adore' to remember how great a lyricist he can be. I certainly can not tell from what he's done in the last many man years.

That's lazy. There are plenty of brilliantly crafted songwriting P gems over the last 20 years. Bruce has only put out an album every few years and has a lot less musical output than Prince. Of course that will lead to more experimentation and misses by P. Bruce bores me although I respect his craft...Tunnel of Love is cool. We cannot even discuss a musical comparison. I Love U but I Don't Trust U Anymore The Truth Album (Dionne...omg) Dark Dinner With Delores One Nite Alone (Avalanche, Pearls B4 The Swine)

I respectfully disagree. I think Prince's musicianship is superior but not his songwriting. Wrecking Ball, Devils & Dust, High Hopes and even Working on a Dream are strong, focused and coherent albums - all recently released and just demonstrate how, in my opinion, Bruce is just getting better with age. Anyone who doubts his ability live needs to watch him take the exceptional E Street Band through "You never can tell"on Youtube.

Not only these albums but his treatment of his old albums with remastered box sets (The Promise, The Ties that Bind) and let's not compare Crystal Ball with Tracks!

The tracks you specifically mention in my opinion do not rank anywhere near Prince's best work and the following tracks from Bruce are far stronger (not even mentioning any of his hits!):

Gypsy Biker

Girls in their summer clothes

The Wrestler

Secret Garden

Hunter of the Invisible Game

One Step Up

Nothing Man

Harps said:

It's a matter of taste. I am attracted to the perverse, sexual, "sick", edgy, kinky, sultry sides of P that I don't see in Bruce. Bruce is more mainstream and in line with the traditional folk American Singer Songwriter (ie White Male) And as far as musicianship, Bruce would not be in the class of any of the great living musicians. His music does not have the complexity of Prince's best arrangements. You could go to NYC, New Orleans and LA and he would be shamed on the stage.

Harps said:

I've grown up with Prince, as I'm sure many of you have.

.

There is not a stage of my life, a relationship, a birth, a death, or a significant event that I cannot associate with a particular Prince album or song!

.

I'm not a newbie but also not one of the elder statesmen on here. I got hooked at the age of 16 in 1991 when I first heard "Cream" and my life changed forever.

.

Some 10 years later I started listening and appreciating Springsteen to almost the same level - although he always registered a close second to Prince.

.

I still love Prince's output now, I don't hanker for the 80s sound but just appreciate the talent and the direction his new music takes us.

.

That said, at my ripe old age (40), I find Springsteens recent and current work more in line with my maturity - the song writing, the lyrical subjects, the reflections on life etc......

.

I still like to party but I struggle listening to "Like a Mack" from a man who is also capable of writing "Stare".

.

Does anyone share a similar experience, as they age with Prince?

Springsteen has always been the 'everyman' and Prince has always been the 'otherworldly man' I can't even begin to compare the two...and I'm from Jersey lololol I find Springsteen so 'common man' that I've never been attracted to anything about him....I understand his talent and skill though and the strength and viruosity of that band, but comparing these two makes no sense...


but I dont understand why people decry the end of Prince just because he made HNR aimed at younger people? It doesnt mean the end of Prince as we knew him, he made an album that sounds like and is to be consumed the way younger people experience music...it wasnt lazy, it was business, and he made what they listen to! That just means he's meeting the audience where it is, and thats just smart business. The best thin about Prince is that he can straddle all these challenges presented to him, and he's freaking brave for attempting it.

He has plenty of songs that are tender, heart breaking and introspective, there was alot of that on AOA, and just because he aimed it at genpop doesn't mean anything in the large scheme of things. I've been on the Prince train since day one, and just like he is, I'm not taking a backseat to popular culture, he'd be a fool to ignore it - they run pop culture now and thats where the money is, and ignoring that would be silly.

[Edited 11/26/15 10:48am]

terrig said:

Well put. To me it's more about him trying to remain relevant. He could easily make $ by releasing track after track from the vault or doing all the nostalgia stuff people on this board want him to do.

Can you see Springsteen covering Housequake...

"I don't go to awards shows anymore," he says. "I'm not saying I'm better than anybody else. But you'll be sitting there at the Grammys, and U2 will beat you. And you say to yourself, 'Wait a minute. I can play that kind of music, too. I played La Crosse [Wisconsin] growing up, I know how to do that, you dig? But you will not do 'Housequake.'"

jdcxc said:

terrig said:

Springsteen has always been the 'everyman' and Prince has always been the 'otherworldly man' I can't even begin to compare the two...and I'm from Jersey lololol I find Springsteen so 'common man' that I've never been attracted to anything about him....I understand his talent and skill though and the strength and viruosity of that band, but comparing these two makes no sense...


but I dont understand why people decry the end of Prince just because he made HNR aimed at younger people? It doesnt mean the end of Prince as we knew him, he made an album that sounds like and is to be consumed the way younger people experience music...it wasnt lazy, it was business, and he made what they listen to! That just means he's meeting the audience where it is, and thats just smart business. The best thin about Prince is that he can straddle all these challenges presented to him, and he's freaking brave for attempting it.

He has plenty of songs that are tender, heart breaking and introspective, there was alot of that on AOA, and just because he aimed it at genpop doesn't mean anything in the large scheme of things. I've been on the Prince train since day one, and just like he is, I'm not taking a backseat to popular culture, he'd be a fool to ignore it - they run pop culture now and thats where the money is, and ignoring that would be silly.

[Edited 11/26/15 10:48am]

Well put. To me it's more about him trying to remain relevant. He could easily make $ by releasing track after track from the vault or doing all the nostalgia stuff people on this board want him to do. Can you see Springsteen covering Housequake... "I don't go to awards shows anymore," he says. "I'm not saying I'm better than anybody else. But you'll be sitting there at the Grammys, and U2 will beat you. And you say to yourself, 'Wait a minute. I can play that kind of music, too. I played La Crosse [Wisconsin] growing up, I know how to do that, you dig? But you will not do 'Housequake.'"

EXACTLY - and it's business, you must remain relevant to stay in BUSINESS, hell I have to do it in my business too, and I'm 52...it doesn't mean you pander - it means you takes what's relevant and put your 30 years of experience in it .....not just recreating your past self, but taking what you know and putting it into packages in ways the current market can hear it.

It's not EASY by any stretch of the imagination even if the techniques themselves are easy(ier) as todays music is fairly flat and one dimensional....as a mature person in a young persons game I totally get where/why Prince is doing what he's doing...as I'm doing it too, and it calls upon us to get out of our established lane see how we can shake ourselves up and continue to move forward.

I LOVE PRINCE FOR THIS, and I admire Madonna for it even though she does make me cringe a bit lololol BUT I GET IT.

Springsteen is amazing in his own way but not even CLOSE to the ways Prince is amazing - I mean Prince could do Springsteens songs, but Springsteen - I doubt he could pull of any Prince songs...

jdcxc said:

The sad thing is that Prince used to remain relevant by blazing his own trail for others to follow. The last time that happened with his actual music was The Rainbow Children, in my opinion.

Bruce remains relevant by doing his own thing - always has always will.

To say Bruce couldn't do Housequake is a ridiculous comparison. Why would he want to pretend he is a black man and rap! That's like saying Prince couldn't do Pavarotti. And for the record, Prince himself hasn't done anything like ,house quake for a long long time too.....

I don't believe P could write a song like Jungleland and Bruce couldn't write Erotic City. If I revert back to the OP, I love them both and it's not about comparing them against each other as they are both very unique - it was more an observation on how my tastes have changed as I have matured and look for different things in music. Springsteen's music currently is filling that need more than P's.

jdcxc said:

LittlePurpleYoda said:

1) First, ‘fess up. You’re referencing an interview from 1986: https://books.google.com/...mp;f=false

There are any number of equally reputable musicians who'd counter that assessment.

2) Clever lyrics? Humorous lyrics? Provocative & Sensual lyrics? Springsteen's written countless examples of both. Red Headed Woman, Tunnel of Love, Fever, Because The Night....

No, songwriting doesn't have to be an earnest evaluation of Americana or aging, but it does have to be competent, genuine & thoughtful. The majority of Prince's work, compared to Springsteen's falls far short on most of those characteristics to anyone making a truly honest appraisal. However, it's still possible to enjoy both performers for what they bring to the table.

Watch The Ties That Bind Friday night on HBO & imagine Prince talking about his work like that. It would never happen because Prince just is not that articulate, on paper or onstage.

[Edited 11/24/15 9:18am]

What a narrow eurocentric view of songwriting. Songwriting is more than lyrics. James Brown is a great songwriter. There are many critics and musicians who praise Prince and call Bruce overrated. When I hear Dancing In the Dark and a lot of his music I am amazed at its simplicity...in a bad way. To reduce Prince to a Song and Dance man is ridiculous. And when Prince seriously discusses music, not being the trickster, it's deep, reflective and complex- read some serious Prince books and analysis. P has the most complicated musical vocabulary of any living pop musician. Bruce couldn't hold the stage with him. Prince has been praised by Stevie, Miles and Bruce...for his songwriting!

Talk about narrow views. You take what's probably Springsteen's "blackest" song as your jumping off point & show immediately how limited your scope is by bringing up James Brown & Stevie Wonder.

Lyrics are at the heart of songwriting. Prince's lyrics, for the most part, more than underwhelm.

Reading your posts? You can't even be bothered to type out Prince's complete name, it's very difficult to even take you seriously, let alone your assessment of Prince's work. Your one dimensional devotion & obvious sycophancy are a bit much. Prince is not the be & end all of music & has not produced work to rival his "glory days" for a very, very long time.

jdcxc said:

Can you see Springsteen covering Housequake... "I don't go to awards shows anymore," he says. "I'm not saying I'm better than anybody else. But you'll be sitting there at the Grammys, and U2 will beat you. And you say to yourself, 'Wait a minute. I can play that kind of music, too. I played La Crosse [Wisconsin] growing up, I know how to do that, you dig? But you will not do 'Housequake.'"

"Years later, you say to yourself: I need a hit! Wait a minute, I'll rip off a U2 song."

Any artist doing Housequake would look silly, while any artist doing a Springsteen song would look serious & mature. Hm....

Hey, I like silly, otherwise I wouldn't be a Prince fan. But these days Prince doing Prince is sounding silly... I have to play Revelation again to keep my hopes up.

The notion that more mature lyrics are "white" and Eurocentric just because this Prince vs. Springsteen comparison is ridiculous. There are SHIT-TONS of great black artists whose music has more "mature" lyrics and themes, especially as they get older. Prince is clowning it up by trying to remain relevant with moose droppings like HITNRUN. Let's not pretend that garbage is the standard for black music or anything aspiring to be more than HITNRUN is somehow white or Eurocentric. Those ludicrous claims are just distractions from the shittiness of Prince's lyrics.

The Truth...lol

http://www.philadelphiawe...17475.html

jdcxc said:

The Truth...lol http://www.philadelphiawe...17475.html

1) We don't need to put another artist down to defend Prince's crap lyrics or "I'm a Star"-posturing.

2) Bruce is no doubt more in touch with reality than Prince. And that means he can draw on reality for lyrics AND it means people can relate to him.

jdcxc said:

The Truth...lol http://www.philadelphiawe...17475.html

Probably a bitter Republican wrote that crappy hit piece

jdcxc said:

The Truth...lol http://www.philadelphiawe...17475.html

Do let us know how you feel about Prince's upcoming HBO special. Or his multiple retrospective boxed sets including the one to be released next week that'll feature 4 CDs & 3 DVDs along with a coffee table book.

Oh. Wait...

You'd be able to do that if anyone gave a crap.

Unlike Prince, & apparently some of his fans, many of us are simply more in touch with reality & that simple fact allows us to better appreciate the work of multiple artists. To understand that while he's certainly a talented individual, creativity did not begin & end with Prince & he's not unparalleled by any stretch, certainly not when it comes to songwriting & certainly not in the last 20 years.

While he continues to chase the trends he once set, other artists, including Bruce Springsteen, have focused on doing what they've always done - making great, accessible, music that is lyrical, melodic & appeals to the core of the human condition. It also doesn't hurt that he's not a dick to his fanbase.

[Edited 11/27/15 8:47am]

[Edited 11/27/15 8:48am]

jdcxc said:

What a poorly written hit piece. I can't tell whether that writer is a Ritabot or a blood clot. Either way, he sure went HAM!

KingSausage said:

Pretty accurate...

Taking into account that musical tastes are extremely subjective and “unquantifiable” exercises, allow me to state that I find Bruce's music tuneless, uninspiring, derivative, uncreative, unmoving, tiresome, dull, repetitive, pointless, cloying, forgettable and wholly lacking in either musical quality or originality.

http://www.ibtimes.com/br...ded-213871

jdcxc said:

Well then, you don't seem like the most objective person to weigh in about Bruce vs. Prince.

KingSausage said:

Lol. Of course not, I am partial to melody, rhythm, diversity of sounds, musicianship, genius innovation and improvisation. Bruce's music is slightly more elevated and interesting than some of the coffee shop poets and corner bar hacks. And I believe most musicians, not including two chord folkies and the arena rock middle age set, would agree.

I love Bruce and many other artists and recognize their lyrics are more geared toward the older and wiser but Bruce is not a pop artist.

Prince can do things as a pop artist that Springsteen can't do, and that includes writing dance songs that are all about the groove and not much about any message or lyrical ambition.

I appreciate that he doesn't just write songs that conform with my so-called maturity, he can write from a young person's point of view like an actor can pass for 30 with just the right wig and you know it's half pop, half tradition so I like a song like FunkNRoll once in a while.

Above all, it's way more fun to be a Prince fan, really most of us are lucky with all the suff laying around we have access to and that is so diverse. As a song collection, Prince's catalog of released and unreleased tracks stands very tall no matter how many misses he's had, as he has consistently been able to deliver a great song or three year after year, and countless more than listenable tracks no one would sneeze at if it was anyone but him.

In a way, being branded a genius so young set expectations so high and ushered such a torrent of creativity that he's forever trying to top legendary perfection.

Prince totally lived up to his whiz kid image in the 80s, then he got older, times changed, shit happened and today he's still making songs like Freeurself, The Breakdown, A 1000 xs and os, Cloud, Baltimore, Revelation -- honestly I never thought it would be this good so late in his carerr, so take heart, gentle Prince fan.

[Edited 11/28/15 13:55pm]

jdcxc said:

I don't think they would agree at all.

KingSausage said:

Now who's not being objective.

For all his gifts as a lyricist, Bruce is an average pop musician. Just look at his pedestrian bands- Compare Max Weinberg to John Blackwell or Sheila E. Prince is better than ALL the instrumentalists that appear on a Springsteen album except horns. And on his biggest albums, Springsteen doesn't even produce himself. Most of his songs are variations on basic traditional rock and roll/folk chord structures. Could you imagine BS sitting in with a tight jazz band?

jdcxc said:

Given the amount of acclaim Bruce has received throughout his career, your statement was ridiculous. That's why I'm disagreeing with it.

Neither Bruce nor Prince could keep up with a truly tight jazz band. Prince needs to keep it simplistic and light. He's not a jazz player.

KingSausage said:

Tell that to Miles.