As a fan of life long devotion for nearly 4 decades, I have stood on the superior craftsmanship and creativity of every album Prince had made - even the most maligned like NewPowerSoul, Come, and PLanet Earth. I found some genius in all of them. THey all gave me something that only came from Prince. I deflected naysayers and haters as many of us here do. I never once even considered subscribing to the notion that Prince was not what he once was and had fell off for good.

However - today - as I look at these last 3 albums and the way he is co-opting his vaunted and exclusive musical production with the least talented associates that he has ever had, I have to at least consider otherwise. Not subscribing - but seriously concerned this time....

FUNKYNESS said:

As a fan of life long devotion for nearly 4 decades, I have stood on the superior craftsmanship and creativity of every album Prince had made - even the most maligned like NewPowerSoul, Come, and PLanet Earth. I found some genius in all of them. THey all gave me something that only came from Prince. I deflected naysayers and haters as many of us here do. I never once even considered subscribing to the notion that Prince was not what he once was and had fell off for good.

However - today - as I look at these last 3 albums and the way he is co-opting his vaunted and exclusive musical production with the least talented associates that he has ever had, I have to at least consider otherwise. Not subscribing - but seriously concerned this time....

Princes legacy is not in danger. You can't undo what he did. I dont understand that thought process.

If he's not worried, we shouldn't be worried. I wish my future was as secure, and I can only dream someone may remember my work after I'm gone.

Princes legacy is fine.

Sadly all is lost.

Prince's legacy? Nevermore..

His whole career is compost.

And I cry...forever more.

People call me dramatic

I call them pathetic

for not knowing

what has endeth

Org Byron, famous poet

Aerogram said:

Sadly all is lost.

Prince's legacy? Nevermore..

His whole career is compost.

And I cry...forever more.

People call me dramatic

I call them pathetic

for not knowing

what has endeth

Org Byron, famous poet

excerpt from "the destruction of prince's legacy" by Lord Byron

The Purple Yoda came down like the wolf on the fold,
As his fans were still reeling from "purple and gold"

FUNKYNESS said:

terrig said:

FUNKYNESS said:

As a fan of life long devotion for nearly 4 decades, I have stood on the superior craftsmanship and creativity of every album Prince had made - even the most maligned like NewPowerSoul, Come, and PLanet Earth. I found some genius in all of them. THey all gave me something that only came from Prince. I deflected naysayers and haters as many of us here do. I never once even considered subscribing to the notion that Prince was not what he once was and had fell off for good.

However - today - as I look at these last 3 albums and the way he is co-opting his vaunted and exclusive musical production with the least talented associates that he has ever had, I have to at least consider otherwise. Not subscribing - but seriously concerned this time....

Princes legacy is not in danger. You can't undo what he did. I dont understand that thought process.

If he's not worried, we shouldn't be worried. I wish my future was as secure, and I can only dream someone may remember my work after I'm gone.

Princes legacy is fine.

The logic behind the damaged legacy is based on the very fact that you cite as the reason that you dont understand it. Indeed, the past can not be undone. It will always be a factor. Therefore, it can only be outdone or failed. Any view of a legacy entails the holistic perspective and acknowledgement of an artist's work and influence. That means that the past and the present are included in the time continuum that most be analyzed in order to develop an informed assessment and a comprehensive understanding.

It can be argued that the enduring legends such as Hendrix, Lennon, and Morrison - who left us abbreviated but consistently brilliant legacies - are so enduring because they didnt live long enough to fuck them up. Hendrix didn't live long enough to become an old desperate hippie who was forcing rap (or EDM) into some new music that wasn't really him to be "produced" by some punk kid flavor of the month. Lennon didn't live to end up doing duets with Justin Bieber or Lady Gaga in order to appeal to an audience that is young enough to be his grandchildren (and who doesn't give a damn about him) for the sake of taking one more shot at the charts or some shamelessly staged comeback. It could be speculated that their legacies were saved by the abrupt rock n roll martyrdom that has canonized them for eternity. We can not talk about any hideous latter-life mutations (see the last years of Elvis or present day Sly Stone) when we talk about them.

I am sure Prince will have his place in history - hell, he already has it. He is a living legend and every sense of the word. An icon. A god of music. But even the most loyal - which includes me - can not deny that this most recent plateau feels different from the others that we have weathered. The essential core of what made us love Prince as something extraordinary and other worldly SEEMS to be showing some tell takes signs of erosion and decline. I say SEEMS because I love Prince too much to adhere to the moratorium issued by doubters - even though it feels as if he is constantly doing something to force the issue.

[Edited 9/10/15 20:22pm]

[Edited 9/10/15 20:31pm]

TheGhostlyNun said:

FUNKYNESS said:

As a fan of life long devotion for nearly 4 decades, I have stood on the superior craftsmanship and creativity of every album Prince had made - even the most maligned like NewPowerSoul, Come, and PLanet Earth. I found some genius in all of them. THey all gave me something that only came from Prince. I deflected naysayers and haters as many of us here do. I never once even considered subscribing to the notion that Prince was not what he once was and had fell off for good.

However - today - as I look at these last 3 albums and the way he is co-opting his vaunted and exclusive musical production with the least talented associates that he has ever had, I have to at least consider otherwise. Not subscribing - but seriously concerned this time....

Oh for goodness' sake, lose the drama. Yes we get it, you don't like this new album or the current direction he's taking. Your concern about him is of no concern to Prince or most Orgers. Prince chose this album to be how it was with the people he chose to record it with. Accept that or move on if you don't like it. Endless threads about what bad decisions he's making just make you look obsessive.

So are you denying me my right to ask the question or offer an opinion because you dont want to hear it?

YES! I think since 20TEN, Prince has been releasing incomplete music of such poor quality, that he has weakened his own legacy. I wonder about his health. I assume drugs aren't his problem. Maybe it's just burn-out., but he doesn't seem interested in finishing what he started in the studio anymore. He doesn't seem interested in making his music the best it can be, in fact he seems to have outsourced that job completely. His work ethic, used to be his calling card.

KingSausage said:

I honestly don't think it is. Why? Because his new music has been largely irrelevant to the world at large for decades now. People are used to thinking that Prince either isn't releasing new music or he's putting out bad albums. His legacy is built on 1980-1988. People don't know enough about the post-name change era to care about whether new music adds to or weakens the legacy.

Yup. Good post. And actually, even though we as fans look at his 'golden period' as being 80-88, a lot of the mainstream still remember some of him from the '90s. I mean, "Cream" and "Beautiful Girl" and such. After that is when his mainstream career took a weird turn. But either way, his 'albums' legacy is long done. Now as long as he can grind that guitar and put on a good show, his legacy is great.

[Edited 9/10/15 19:33pm]

Most people couldn't name a song Prince recorded since "7," maybe with the exception of The Most Beautiful Girl in the World. He could have recorded his most brilliant music or the worst garbage known to human ears since 1994 and it wouldn't affect his legacy, because it's all under the radar.

.

So no, I don't think he's done anything to help or hurt his legacy since "The Golden Years."

jdcxc said:

Lol... about the headline to this thread.........

How can a really strong album damage his legacy?

HITnRUN is amazing, and no I am not kidding, I love this fine album, so many good songs there.


But of course Prince is flying under the radar to the masses out there, but that happened a long time ago.

Prince is an underground artist since many years, only the smaller fanbase cares about him (since he left Warner in 1995 he hasn't been "big").

[Edited 9/10/15 21:52pm]

KingSausage said:

I honestly don't think it is. Why? Because his new music has been largely irrelevant to the world at large for decades now. People are used to thinking that Prince either isn't releasing new music or he's putting out bad albums. His legacy is built on 1980-1988. People don't know enough about the post-name change era to care about whether new music adds to or weakens the legacy.

Precisely

I'm quite happy for Prince music now. I hope the AOA, Plectrum Electrum and HITNRUN are the beginning of a new Prince era after the boring Musicology - 20ten era where Prince, I do not know why, tried to show how damn Prince he was. The himself cloning era.

AOA, PE and HITNRUN have a lot of mistakes, but are new mistakes, not the old ones.

Yeah, I see the point the OP is making, but it's certainly applied with too much drama, I think.

We will look back on this era in a few years, and think, oh, I liked those records, or, I didn't like those records, and, oh, look what he's doing now....

Prince has always been a pop musician ultimately, his approach to things has always been not that different to what it is now... in terms of collaborators, the stuff he chooses to release vs. what he holds back etc... and all the way through there have been people going, oh, now he's lost it (Batman)... ok, wait, now he's lost it (An album with a symbol for a name)... oh, wait NOW he's lost it (name change)... oh, no, now he's REALLY lost it (Jehovah's witness)... etc etc...

The thing to remember is, someone like Prince doesn't see it like that... they're just creating what they want to create as they want to create it... it's more important to do something new than to do something 'for the legacy'.... as anyone creative will tell you, trying to create something for your legacy - that will consciously stand the test of time and be 'a work of quality' leads ususally to work that is just that - self-conscious. That's not how it works... it's about following instincts, trying new things and also enjoying yourself.

Also, may I point you in the direction of the career of Miles Davis... who made a career out of never looking back... constantly forging forward with his sound, exploring new sounds, rock sounds etc... often shedding one audience only to gain another... many people hate the records he released after his five year sabbatical in the late 70s, but those records actually have much to recommend them... the only time he really did something sub-par was at the end of his life when his health was fading and he physically didn't really have the strength to play any more...

Despite those records that many don't like, Davis' legacy is safe and sound as an absolutely resolute musician, band leader and fearless explorer of music... if Prince is lucky, he'll end up in similar fashion....

I'm sure this new phase will shed some more fans and attract some new ones.... no big deal really.

fabriziovenerandi said:

Alexandernvrmind said:

What I think is fucking up his legacy is his stubborn attitude towards remasters and YouTube etc. The kids of today dont know who he is and dont care. They cant find his past work in the places that they frequent online. They have no access to his legacy. A legacy is only good if there is someone around to remember it. When we, the fans, have gone, who will be around to even ask about him, let alone remember what it is he actually did? For some reason that I just cannot fathom, Prince seems to be deliberately out to bury his past. Historians will look back, see there is very little information about Prince, very few people who know anything about him and move onto someone else to write about instead. It says a lot when artisits who are long dead have more of a pressence/legacy online than Prince does.

FUNKYNESS said:

As a fan of life long devotion for nearly 4 decades, I have stood on the superior craftsmanship and creativity of every album Prince had made - even the most maligned like NewPowerSoul, Come, and PLanet Earth. I found some genius in all of them. THey all gave me something that only came from Prince. I deflected naysayers and haters as many of us here do. I never once even considered subscribing to the notion that Prince was not what he once was and had fell off for good.

However - today - as I look at these last 3 albums and the way he is co-opting his vaunted and exclusive musical production with the least talented associates that he has ever had, I have to at least consider otherwise. Not subscribing - but seriously concerned this time....

Miles Davis was about the same age when he embarked in his "synth" period with younger musicians, a period which horrified many of both the purist jazz fans of earlier times and the intellectual elite that fancied his electric period.

But in the end 25 years after Miles died I think this era, while not being considered his strongest by far, has been somewhat rehabilitated.

I'm really not so much into the last 3 albums (though I must admit I have a real thing for Plec), but I somehow appreciate the fact that Prince is doing something different.

No he hasn't.

I don't understand this kind of discussions. Prince is following changes and if you do not change you're dead. I like all the transformations he has/had. If people don't understand they probably need and artist repeating himself several times. Open your mind and enjoy.

Prince has critical low-points and commercial low-points. Sometimes they're the same, sometimes they're at odds with each other.

Usually after a low-point, he rebounds with a strong effort. IF he doesn't rebound from HnR with anything stronger, and this is the beginning of a downward trend, then people will say that HnR is "the album" that killed Prince's legacy.

If he rebounds next year with a Purple Rain II, then HnR will simply be remembered as a novelty like 1999:TNM, Planet Earth, NPS, etc.

[Edited 9/11/15 3:56am]

Se7en said:

We already had a Prince is over and done thread this week BTW, so this is kind of a dupe +

Just sayin'.

But I gave a honest reply abopve, though.