I don't think anything's changed, it's all been par for the course.

Ego101 said:

Great post.

warning2all said:

I was there in the 80's and Prince wasnt that popular before or after "Purple Rain". Sure, a few hits with "Raspberry Beret" & "Kiss", but "Under the Cherry Moon" would have bombed even if it was good. By SOTT, nobody was buying the albums anymore. It was the media who was following this celebrity, more than the public at large. He turned off so many people with his Award show shenanigans with bodyguards, and his "We Are The World" no show, that the majority was turned off for good. He was too weird and unlikeable. There were 2 instances where the public was ready to re-embrace Prince: "Batman" & "Diamonds and Pearls"- but neither album was truly great, had lasting value, & noone bought the followups. Prince had a small hardcore fanbase, but most of us have grown up & dont have time for the weird behavoir and games and subpar releases that take work to track down. We have lives. And Prince doesnt want to share his past in a legacy release form or Youtube, so hes becoming a thing of the past.

[Edited 4/19/15 20:26pm]

This is a great post, and right on the mark. I like how you broke it down: his music itself is for the hardcore, his persona is for the masses - which is exactly why his appearance at awards shows (even when he's not performing or nominated) still makes people go nuts.

Prince is a washed-up fuckbeen, and apparently some of you love him for that...

I wouldn't say his music is 'for the hardcore', as that would imply that it's actually good but too avant-garde for general consumption. If you're saying that only prince.org members listen to it, then yes.

Se7en said:

I've never met an ex-fan of Prince. I've met a lot of moaning, whining Prince fans who would like to believe they're not still fans but still clock his every move.

I definitely have gone through highs and lows with the guy. This time around its frustrating as I really like AOA and think it deserves a better push from Prince. I would've loved to hear Clouds live as well as Time. Its a great album imo that is being ignored, in part because Prince was bored with it as soon as it dropped! He did the same with Gold, Emancipation, Lotusflower, and others. As much he talks bout looking ahead, he also is stuck in the 80s for this live set...however why the remaster delay? Its a vicious cycle. Dwindling fan base? Maybe treat us a little better and maybe we will stick around.

Poplife88 said:

I definitely have gone through highs and lows with the guy. This time around its frustrating as I really like AOA and think it deserves a better push from Prince. I would've loved to hear Clouds live as well as Time. Its a great album imo that is being ignored, in part because Prince was bored with it as soon as it dropped! He did the same with Gold, Emancipation, Lotusflower, and others. As much he talks bout looking ahead, he also is stuck in the 80s for this live set...however why the remaster delay? Its a vicious cycle. Dwindling fan base? Maybe treat us a little better and maybe we will stick around.

He didn't ignore Gold, but by the time it came out it was already pretty old (in Prince terms) and had gone through a lot of changes.

.

Kinda like Breakfast Can Wait on AOA, TMBGITW had been released on its own much, much earlier than The Gold Experience (and on a non-WB label). I was surprised to see that the song was included on TGE.

.

Even though he seemed to have taken a break between 20Ten and AOA/PE, his mindset still seems to be "one album per year, then move on".

warning2all said:

All of this is 100% right on! Really- I was there in the 80's and Prince wasnt that popular before or after "Purple Rain".

.

This is nonsense. Such artists don't sell millions, get concerts broadcast live, etc. The problem is that he was nowhere as popular as artists he was "competing" with, like Springsteen or Madonna etc. in large part due to his self-sabotage. People were almost fan despite his shitty behavior (which we were shielded from).

.

Prince had a small hardcore fanbase, but most of us have grown up & dont have time for the weird behavoir and games and subpar releases that take work to track down. We have lives. And Prince doesnt want to share his past in a legacy release form or Youtube, so hes becoming a thing of the past.

.

What I've been saying for 15+ years.

Time for another US Festival w him in it.

[Edited 4/22/15 14:10pm]

with the 1970s and 1980s being so much integrated in pop culture now, and so many older and younger re/discovering the music and musicians of those times, it would be a perfect time for Prince to reissue his earlier albums and videos along with some concerts

I wonder how many new fans Prince has gained over the past few years ?
And how many older fans he lost ?

Fans like me are dissapointed, already for a long time.
People who really like Prince and think he's a genius, but are no fans, and still say so, will stick around for his mysterious being and cute face.

The guy can rock a show just by being there... but not for me/us fans anymore.

HonestMan13 said:

I just want him to have a consistant way of releasing music, we've had various online shops, online streaming, itunes, various labels, all in varying quality formats. You often have to be around when a certain song is 'released' or you might miss it, that's not right.

Pentacle said:

Prince is a washed-up fuckbeen, and apparently some of you love him for that...

I wouldn't say his music is 'for the hardcore', as that would imply that it's actually good but too avant-garde for general consumption. If you're saying that only prince.org members listen to it, then yes.

That makes you a super frequent visitor on a website devoted to said washed-up fuckbeen, which makes you....?

Prince records and plays music, he's not your heart surgeon or your local sheriff, he has no power over you unless you give him that power (in yo mind), so emancipate.

@ the idea that he's bringing in loads of new (in particular, new and younger) fans!

.

As for the assurances that he can still fill arenas (or stadiums)...unless and until he does another tour of them, there's no way to determine that.

[Edited 4/21/15 17:24pm]

CandaceS said:

@ the idea that he's bringing in loads of new (in particular, new and younger) fans!

.

As for the assurances that he can still fill arenas (or stadiums)...unless and until he does another tour of them, there's no way to determine that.

[Edited 4/21/15 17:24pm]

Except he was very successful when he last did arenas and doesn't seem to have any problem in smaller houses, so the balance of probability is experience vs your own impressions.

the industry has changed so much over the last thirty years it is silly to try to judge prince's success by the old standards.

.

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

not attracting new fans? then why is it i see so many fresh young faces at his parties out at the park? not to mention, tickets to his live shows sell out in under an hour and not just to 'old' people.

.

his music lately has been fresh, innovative as to style and totally enjoyable.

.

he is still going strong after over thirty years in the business. still vibrant, healthy and having fun. if anything, he seems to be growing stronger

.

i think the real issue here is that fans who have dedicated their lives to following prince are just snarky because he has not returned the favor insofar as he won't play what his 'fans' demand him to play, he won't release albums the way 'they' think he should. he does what he wants.

.

he doesn't owe the world a thing at this point. look what he did last weekend. he can walk into any club in LA, join the band and the crowd will love him.

.

talk show hosts fall all over themselves to book him as a guest star. celebrities flock to his parties

.

he's already surpassed his own legend a few times over and now he's helping other artists. what could be cooler?

.

so here's the real issue at hand - when the prince shoe no longer fits a fan, isn't it time for that fan to go buy a pair of rolling stones boots, or something? why hang around here?

XxAxX said:

the industry has changed so much over the last thirty years it is silly to try to judge prince's success by the old standards.

.

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

not attracting new fans? then why is it i see so many fresh young faces at his parties out at the park? not to mention, tickets to his live shows sell out in under an hour and not just to 'old' people.

.

his music lately has been fresh, innovative as to style and totally enjoyable.

.

he is still going strong after over thirty years in the business. still vibrant, healthy and having fun. if anything, he seems to be growing stronger

.

i think the real issue here is that fans who have dedicated their lives to following prince are just snarky because he has not returned the favor insofar as he won't play what his 'fans' demand him to play, he won't release albums the way 'they' think he should. he does what he wants.

.

he doesn't owe the world a thing at this point. look what he did last weekend. he can walk into any club in LA, join the band and the crowd will love him.

.

talk show hosts fall all over themselves to book him as a guest star. celebrities flock to his parties

.

he's already surpassed his own legend a few times over and now he's helping other artists. what could be cooler?

.

so here's the real issue at hand - when the prince shoe no longer fits a fan, isn't it time for that fan to go buy a pair of rolling stones boots, or something? why hang around here?

Bingo.

XxAxX said:

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

Ah yes, the old "nobody is sellign in huge numbers" BS. Because some artists are still selling huge numbers, their releases are events and their music has an impact. I await your "Prince is like other artists, except when he isn't like other artists because that invalidates my weak-ass theory and so I just ignore that" defense.

his music lately has been fresh, innovative as to style and totally enjoyable.

.

And yet he still can't be arsed to promote it and when he plays it live people use it for toilet breaks.

.

Also, since when is following trends from three years ago "fresh" and "innovative"?

.

he does what he wants.

.

Except he doesn't. What he wants is adoration from major labels and people throwing money his way, and that isn't happening.

.

talk show hosts fall all over themselves to book him as a guest star.

.

Really? How many shows was he on in the past year? Five years? Ten years? Oh wait, lemme guess, Prince isn't saying yes to all of their invites. He only goes on the greats like George Lopez or Arsenio Hall.

.

now he's helping other artists.

.

Oh, and how is that going, pray tell?

warning2all said:

Se7en said:

The fan base has been dwindling since right after Purple Rain. His original demographic from his rise to fame and classic 80s period is aged somewhere between 45-50 years old. In realistic terms, we don't buy as many CDs as we did in our teens/20s/30s, don't buy as many "fan club" memberships, and our patience for new protege and backing bands is almost all but gone. We have families, jobs, mortgages and bills…all of which affect our music-buying decisions. We DO buy concert tickets, often at high prices and often for multiple shows. To approach this from another angle: there is a lot of goodwill that is missing from Prince's fan base. We're bitter, and feel jaded after several failed projects and fan clubs. His disdain for the Internet and large portions of his back catalog do not help either.

All of this is 100% right on! Really- I was there in the 80's and Prince wasnt that popular before or after "Purple Rain". Sure, a few hits with "Raspberry Beret" & "Kiss", but "Under the Cherry Moon" would have bombed even if it was good. By SOTT, nobody was buying the albums anymore. It was the media who was following this celebrity, more than the public at large. He turned off so many people with his Award show shenanigans with bodyguards, and his "We Are The World" no show, that the majority was turned off for good. He was too weird and unlikeable. There were 2 instances where the public was ready to re-embrace Prince: "Batman" & "Diamonds and Pearls"- but neither album was truly great, had lasting value, & noone bought the followups. Prince had a small hardcore fanbase, but most of us have grown up & dont have time for the weird behavoir and games and subpar releases that take work to track down. We have lives. And Prince doesnt want to share his past in a legacy release form or Youtube, so hes becoming a thing of the past.

Only on prince.org will Prince's popularity in the '80s be described as that of a minor few-hit wonder star. Funny how everybody else disagrees (just check any 'biggest stars of the '80s' list, he'll be in the Top 5). I know that his album sales lowered as the 80s went on, but there were a significant number of hits post-Purple Rain..

I also agree with Bart, if Prince's popularity was as slight as you suggest, he wouldn't have been selling millions, having concerts broadcast around the world, always in the tabloids, and pretty much always reaching the top 10 albums-wise.

TBH, I agree with an above poster who said we should have a "Prince is done" sticky. They've become more common after Plec/AOA's relative failures..

NouveauDance said:

I don't think anything's changed, it's all been par for the course.

Agreed, I think he's been consistent

BartVanHemelen said:

XxAxX said:

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

Ah yes, the old "nobody is sellign in huge numbers" BS. Because some artists are still selling huge numbers, their releases are events and their music has an impact. I await your "Prince is like other artists, except when he isn't like other artists because that invalidates my weak-ass theory and so I just ignore that" defense.

.

Really? How many shows was he on in the past year? Five years? Ten years? Oh wait, lemme guess, Prince isn't saying yes to all of their invites. He only goes on the greats like George Lopez or Arsenio Hall.

.

now he's helping other artists.

.

Oh, and how is that going, pray tell?

I agree. Nobody's selling millions anymore, but people are definitely selling... I love Prince but we all have to admit, AOA and Plec bombed. There's nothing more to say, they really didn't sell. It has nothing to do with the 'album sales going down'. Lotusflow3r 6 years ago sold more in 1 week than AOA's entire chart run. Sad, but true (especially with Lotus' weird release pattern).

And LOL at the toilet comment

BartVanHemelen said:

XxAxX said:

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

Ah yes, the old "nobody is sellign in huge numbers" BS. Because some artists are still selling huge numbers, their releases are events and their music has an impact. I await your "Prince is like other artists, except when he isn't like other artists because that invalidates my weak-ass theory and so I just ignore that" defense.

.

Really? How many shows was he on in the past year? Five years? Ten years? Oh wait, lemme guess, Prince isn't saying yes to all of their invites. He only goes on the greats like George Lopez or Arsenio Hall.

.

now he's helping other artists.

.

Oh, and how is that going, pray tell?

U really are sick aren't u? Nothing else explains your actions. Do you appear "normal" in person or do you give off the weird obsessive vibe you generate here?

SoulAlive said:

Graycap23 said:

XxAxX said:

the industry has changed so much over the last thirty years it is silly to try to judge prince's success by the old standards.

.

not selling as many records? nobody is. downloads, theft and distribution issues have changed the music publishing industry forever.

.

not attracting new fans? then why is it i see so many fresh young faces at his parties out at the park? not to mention, tickets to his live shows sell out in under an hour and not just to 'old' people.

.

his music lately has been fresh, innovative as to style and totally enjoyable.

.

he is still going strong after over thirty years in the business. still vibrant, healthy and having fun. if anything, he seems to be growing stronger

.

i think the real issue here is that fans who have dedicated their lives to following prince are just snarky because he has not returned the favor insofar as he won't play what his 'fans' demand him to play, he won't release albums the way 'they' think he should. he does what he wants.

.

he doesn't owe the world a thing at this point. look what he did last weekend. he can walk into any club in LA, join the band and the crowd will love him.

.

talk show hosts fall all over themselves to book him as a guest star. celebrities flock to his parties

.

he's already surpassed his own legend a few times over and now he's helping other artists. what could be cooler?

.

so here's the real issue at hand - when the prince shoe no longer fits a fan, isn't it time for that fan to go buy a pair of rolling stones boots, or something? why hang around here?

Bingo.

yep --good points all around

CharismaDove said:

I'm not that interested in watching someone else have massive success.

I like artists that do their own thing and make me feel like I am listening to something sincere, not just acting on someone else's marketing plan to make the audiences bigger.

Prince is a wierdo. But the fact remains he is one of the most popular artists on the planet despite barely trying to keep up.

I think it's healthy, and I'd liketo see other artists do their own thing more, not less.

Aerogram said:

CandaceS said:

@ the idea that he's bringing in loads of new (in particular, new and younger) fans!

.

As for the assurances that he can still fill arenas (or stadiums)...unless and until he does another tour of them, there's no way to determine that.

[Edited 4/21/15 17:24pm]

Except he was very successful when he last did arenas and doesn't seem to have any problem in smaller houses, so the balance of probability is experience vs your own impressions.

.

Cancelling gigs and selling tickets right before showtime at greatly reduced prices demonstrate some problems filling smaller houses. Yes, some shows in some towns have been legitimate sell-outs. But at other times he hasn't done so well. That's a fact, not my impression.

warning2all said:

CharismaDove said:

Only on prince.org will Prince's popularity in the '80s be described as that of a minor few-hit wonder star. Funny how everybody else disagrees (just check any 'biggest stars of the '80s' list, he'll be in the Top 5). I know that his album sales lowered as the 80s went on, but there were a significant number of hits post-Purple Rain..

I also agree with Bart, if Prince's popularity was as slight as you suggest, he wouldn't have been selling millions, having concerts broadcast around the world, always in the tabloids, and pretty much always reaching the top 10 albums-wise.

TBH, I agree with an above poster who said we should have a "Prince is done" sticky. They've become more common after Plec/AOA's relative failures..

As much as fans believe otherwise- NOTHING up until "1999" was a hot seller made Prince popular. The world at large wasn't aware of Prince until the singles "1999" & "Little Red Corvette". "Purple Rain", and everything to do with it blew up. But ATWIAD was a signifigant drop in sales again. Princr turned off a lot of people with the "We Are The World" no-show, or the snobby/shy/arrogance of his Award show behavoir. "Parade" is awesome. But it only sold what-3 mil copies? How quickly was "Under The Cherry Mon out of theaters after playing to empty movie houses? "Sign o'the Times" the movie & album weren't big hits- inspite of the quality. Would a USA tour have helped? Who knows. "Lovesexy" was not hit album. "Alphabet St." was not a big hit. No other singles made waves. Again, "Batman" and "Diamonds & Pearls" found audiences, but he couldn't sustain it to the next albums. How many people on earth? Whats the population? And how many bought "Newpower Soul"? "Come"? "Planet Earth"? "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic"? Know what he's done since "Diamonds And Pearls? How many people know about "The EX's Face"? If Prince is in the top 4 80's acts, he is #4 behind The Boss, MJ & Madonna. Are acts like Bon Jovi ahead of him? Who was his competition in the 80's to be one of the better acts- Howard Jones? Duran Duran? Boy George? Prince survives as a nostalgia act and the cult of personality where the medua hypes him as a personality- not an artist people actually by records of. None of this is to dismiss his talent or amazing discography---the fact is in the grand schemes Prince is not that hugely popular and only was for a brief ammount of time im the 80's.

There is a difference between who's selling the most records and who's popular. Whether it be because of his unusual business strategies/promotion or whatever else, it's a fact that Prince's album sales definitely slipped post ATWIAD, and generally decreased. But that doesn't always equate to popularity. If you look at hitmakers of the 1980s, worldwide, the artist with the most entries is Prince (http://tsort.info/music/faq_decade_artists.htm). If you don't believe me, then feel free to calculate how many of his singles charted in comparison to others, especially Top 10/ Top 40. If we're going with just big hits, he only remains behind acts such as Whitney Houston, Michael Jackson, and Madonna in the 1980s. So regardless of how shitty his album sales were compared to theirs and how many singles such as IIWYG and Anotherlove failed, he released enough singles to have a vast number of hits. If you're telling me that someone who had at least 1 big hit single a year from 1982-1989 was popular for "a brief amount of time in the 80's".... well. I understand what you're saying about his image... that people were turned off by his stage/WATW antics, weirdness, etc, aka he was no longer one of those "everybody loves them" acts by the end of the '80s. But I think that would mean he was just not the zeitgeist anymore... which is true because none of his albums ever lived up to Purple Rain (arguably not even close to).. but that doesn't mean he wasn't popular. Again, with each of his albums selling millions (even if weak compared to peers), a total of 20 worldwide top ten hits, concerts broadcast worldwide, etc... then I don't get how anyone could come to the conclusion that he wasn't "that popular" except for Purple Rain. Never the zeitgeist/number 1 act, true, but not popular? nah

Also some of those acts you listed ARE very successful.. in fact Bon Jovi has sold more records than the Purple One.. but their hitmaking began primarily in 1987, near the end of the '80s, which is why nobody ever really lists them in the top ten of "most popular 80s singers", although of course they still are extremely successful. But the reason Prince is often listed as such is because despite the controversies/unlikeabliity/up-and-down album sales, he still consistently had hits and exposure.

"not a person people remember records by" yeah, he is hyped as a personality, but loads of people remember Rapsberry Beret, 1999, Purple Rain, etc... as far as I know. Also, I'm not trying to argue that Prince is enormously successful today or anything.. I know he's a nostalgia act and that majority of people last remember either TMBGITW or Musicology as his last musical fart. But I disagree with the 80s analogy. Parade, SOTT, and Batman had hits. Even Alphabet St. went Top Ten, if a minor hit at least.

He did relatively well commercially in the late - 80s. Bruce Springsteen, while totally eclipsing him in album sales, is a better argument as someone who had a commercial period for mostly just 1 album. He had hits before and after, but he had just 3 top-tens after BITUA, (and 1 of them was in '94) and just 2 before (in '73 and '80). This doesn't take away from his enormous success or popularity or anything, but he's more of an albums' artist while Prince focused more on hits

Sorry if this seems patronizing or such. Just trying to have a discussion

CharismaDove said:

found

.

Can you please remove the crappy software -- Photozoom I presume, going by the code that is generated -- that causes your posts to randomly change words to links?