Hey guys, this query seemed a tad slight to make a whole thread out of, but I can't really see where else I might put it, so I'll ask here and hopefully it can get answered quickly.

Basically I want to know whether the Extended 12-Inch version of Mountains is a remix of the original as well as being a lot longer. The reason I ask is that when I was comparing the two versions today, something I hadn't done before, I noticed that the extended versions sounded a lot "fuller" and more bright, whereas the album version feels a bit flat in comparison. I'm comparing the HD Tracks lossless version of the album track and a vinyl rip of the extended version. I guess there's a possibility that the vinyl-sourced version comes from the "superior" vinyl master (I wouldn't know myself, I don't have the vinyl) and that's the reason for the more lively sounding extended version, but I wouldn't have thought the difference would be as drastic as it is to my ears, and I've heard that vinyl rips often sound pretty crappy anyway. Thanks for any help.

Its clearly a different mix (with Prince's wishful thinking that it would fill dance floors).

It doesn't sound like the 12" version was the original, editted down for the album, but rather a later stage mix + new recording. There is a clear cover up of sound effects linking the 7" element with the extended part, much like Kiss of the same period and also Let's Work 12", where he clearly made the additional parts some time after the original recording.

Your ear aren't failing you, the beat is much fatter on the 12" Mix, partly due to the mix and probably partly due to it being a vinyl rip.

Was Miko Weaver's (rhythm guitar) on the album cut or just the 12"?

If it was always there, maybe Prince brought it out more, because it's more pronounced on the 12"

Extending on the topic of Mountains, I've always hoped that we would one day hear the version that featured Clare Fischer's orchestration. I guy can hope

Right here's a question, what 'mix' does the 7" single have? Is it the album cut or the 12" mix minus the extended part?

jaawwnn said:

SquirrelMeat said:

jaawwnn said:

Right here's a question, what 'mix' does the 7" single have? Is it the album cut or the 12" mix minus the extended part?

Album mix. When I make playlists or alternative albums I often make a 7" take of the remix to spice things up.

Cheers!

KingSausage said:

I've never noticed that the 12" version is a different mix in the main portion of the song (?) than the album version. I need to listen again!

Put them on one after the other and it's a big difference! I thought it was just a vinyl vs. cd thing at first but it's the same with vinyl vs. vinyl.

SquirrelMeat said:

Its clearly a different mix (with Prince's wishful thinking that it would fill dance floors).

It doesn't sound like the 12" version was the original, editted down for the album, but rather a later stage mix + new recording. There is a clear cover up of sound effects linking the 7" element with the extended part, much like Kiss of the same period and also Let's Work 12", where he clearly made the additional parts some time after the original recording.

Your ear aren't failing you, the beat is much fatter on the 12" Mix, partly due to the mix and probably partly due to it being a vinyl rip.

IIRC the ext portion was recorded later, recording dates were known, but Princevault seems to have missed that or maybe I'm confusing it with another ext?

Thanks for all the replies everyone, you've been very helpful. Listening to them back to back it does seem pretty obvious that it's a completely different (and much better imo) mix, but I was a little unsure. I think I might try and make my own 7-inch edit of the 12-inch as well SquirrelMeat, good idea!

Oh, btw, is there any additional elements or instrumentation in the part of the 12-inch version that mirrors the album one? I can't hear anything beyond the more dynamic mix, but he did do that with, say, the extended version of Hot Thing with that funky underlying synth riff, so maybe something like that was done here.

jaawwnn said:

The Tell-Tale is when you hear the scream twice as the 12" continues.

nayroo2002 said:

SquirrelMeat said:

After the original session on Saturday, November 30, 1985 at the Washington Avenue Warehouse in Minneapolis, some additional work was done on the track in Minneapolis and it was shelved until Friday, March 28, 1986, when it was edited for the 7-inch and 12-inch mixes for release (the 2^nd released from PARADE). “Mountains, a song on the Parade album that I always loved which was Wendy and Lisa's song, the horn parts on the album version are pretty sparse,’ remembered Eric Leeds. “There's a couple of lines, but we did a 12-inch version of that which is my favorite 12-inch that Prince ever did. I think it's a great, great performance, just the whole idea of the 12-inch. There's nothing particularly heavy about the horns on that, but I just really like some very simple stuff. I just remember the whole thing, and just being a part of that was just really nice. I guess the horn parts in themselves don't really stand out as being anything special, but it was just cool.“

The additional horns were overdubbed for the song on April 1, and more mixing and editing followed on April 6, 22, and 27^th.

It was eventually released on May 7 1986 (single release) and the 12 inch was released on May 21.

This information is from an early version of “Prince: The Studio Sessions”.

madhouseman said:

After the original session on Saturday, November 30, 1985 at the Washington Avenue Warehouse in Minneapolis, some additional work was done on the track in Minneapolis and it was shelved until Friday, March 28, 1986, when it was edited for the 7-inch and 12-inch mixes for release (the 2^nd released from PARADE). “Mountains, a song on the Parade album that I always loved which was Wendy and Lisa's song, the horn parts on the album version are pretty sparse,’ remembered Eric Leeds. “There's a couple of lines, but we did a 12-inch version of that which is my favorite 12-inch that Prince ever did. I think it's a great, great performance, just the whole idea of the 12-inch. There's nothing particularly heavy about the horns on that, but I just really like some very simple stuff. I just remember the whole thing, and just being a part of that was just really nice. I guess the horn parts in themselves don't really stand out as being anything special, but it was just cool.“

The additional horns were overdubbed for the song on April 1, and more mixing and editing followed on April 6, 22, and 27^th.

It was eventually released on May 7 1986 (single release) and the 12 inch was released on May 21.

This information is from an early version of “Prince: The Studio Sessions”.

Thanks, this is great information, it should be added to the Princevault article posthaste. I'm glad to hear Eric is so fond of the 12-Inch, I adore it as well.

Btw, are you still working on your book, do you have any plans to release it? It seems like it would be enormously informative and helpful if it contained more of this type of insights.

KlyphIsBackAgain said:

nayroo2002 said:

The Tell-Tale is when you hear the scream twice as the 12" continues.

I could be wrong (need to go actually listen) but can't you hear that second scream faintly on the album version too?

RaspBerryGirlFriend said:

madhouseman said:

After the original session on Saturday, November 30, 1985 at the Washington Avenue Warehouse in Minneapolis, some additional work was done on the track in Minneapolis and it was shelved until Friday, March 28, 1986, when it was edited for the 7-inch and 12-inch mixes for release (the 2^nd released from PARADE). “Mountains, a song on the Parade album that I always loved which was Wendy and Lisa's song, the horn parts on the album version are pretty sparse,’ remembered Eric Leeds. “There's a couple of lines, but we did a 12-inch version of that which is my favorite 12-inch that Prince ever did. I think it's a great, great performance, just the whole idea of the 12-inch. There's nothing particularly heavy about the horns on that, but I just really like some very simple stuff. I just remember the whole thing, and just being a part of that was just really nice. I guess the horn parts in themselves don't really stand out as being anything special, but it was just cool.“

The additional horns were overdubbed for the song on April 1, and more mixing and editing followed on April 6, 22, and 27^th.

It was eventually released on May 7 1986 (single release) and the 12 inch was released on May 21.

This information is from an early version of “Prince: The Studio Sessions”.

Thanks, this is great information, it should be added to the Princevault article posthaste. I'm glad to hear Eric is so fond of the 12-Inch, I adore it as well.

Btw, are you still working on your book, do you have any plans to release it? It seems like it would be enormously informative and helpful if it contained more of this type of insights.

Yes. Life has sort of gotten in the way and I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have finished the rough draft, and hope to get it in the market this year. The book is going to cover 1983/84 and the 160+ sessions for Purple Rain, ATWIAD, The Family, The Time, Apollonia 6, Jill Jones, The Bangles, Sheena Easton, Sheila E, etc. I am looking forward to getting it out there. So far, the book is filled with stories like this. I'm relying on over 200 hours of personal interviews as well as dozens of them from friends, etc. I hope it is a rounded view of what went on in the studio and how that was impacted by the world around him. Thanx for asking.

KlyphIsBackAgain said:

SquirrelMeat said:

Its clearly a different mix (with Prince's wishful thinking that it would fill dance floors).

It doesn't sound like the 12" version was the original, editted down for the album, but rather a later stage mix + new recording. There is a clear cover up of sound effects linking the 7" element with the extended part, much like Kiss of the same period and also Let's Work 12", where he clearly made the additional parts some time after the original recording.

Your ear aren't failing you, the beat is much fatter on the 12" Mix, partly due to the mix and probably partly due to it being a vinyl rip.

Not saying you're wrong, but the difference in sound quality could also be attributed to the album version being a different generation/ dub of the master, or an eq dub or several other options. Lots of times the same album from different countries sounds different because of the copy of the master used, even though its the same mix.

It's definitly a different mix. The snare doesn't have the gated delay as loud, some guitars a definitly more prominent and the vocals are a tad louder.

-

Personally, I like the album mix better, but the extended version is a bit funkier and of course, it has that delightful ending.

[Edited 4/2/15 23:21pm]

madhouseman said:

RaspBerryGirlFriend said:

Thanks, this is great information, it should be added to the Princevault article posthaste. I'm glad to hear Eric is so fond of the 12-Inch, I adore it as well.

Btw, are you still working on your book, do you have any plans to release it? It seems like it would be enormously informative and helpful if it contained more of this type of insights.

Yes. Life has sort of gotten in the way and I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have finished the rough draft, and hope to get it in the market this year. The book is going to cover 1983/84 and the 160+ sessions for Purple Rain, ATWIAD, The Family, The Time, Apollonia 6, Jill Jones, The Bangles, Sheena Easton, Sheila E, etc. I am looking forward to getting it out there. So far, the book is filled with stories like this. I'm relying on over 200 hours of personal interviews as well as dozens of them from friends, etc. I hope it is a rounded view of what went on in the studio and how that was impacted by the world around him. Thanx for asking.

I'm SO looking forward to reading your book. And I SO hope that you will eventually be able to cover P's whole recording career through further books.

I could watch Lisa Coleman blow the hair out of her face endlessly during this video. In fact I think I did when I watched the 110 minute Mountains video outtakes video

databank said:

madhouseman said:

Yes. Life has sort of gotten in the way and I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have finished the rough draft, and hope to get it in the market this year. The book is going to cover 1983/84 and the 160+ sessions for Purple Rain, ATWIAD, The Family, The Time, Apollonia 6, Jill Jones, The Bangles, Sheena Easton, Sheila E, etc. I am looking forward to getting it out there. So far, the book is filled with stories like this. I'm relying on over 200 hours of personal interviews as well as dozens of them from friends, etc. I hope it is a rounded view of what went on in the studio and how that was impacted by the world around him. Thanx for asking.

I'm SO looking forward to reading your book. And I SO hope that you will eventually be able to cover P's whole recording career through further books.

I hope there are further books as well, but this sort of book is very time consuming. A lot will depend on how well the first book is received. Thanx for the props.

madhouseman said:

databank said:

I'm SO looking forward to reading your book. And I SO hope that you will eventually be able to cover P's whole recording career through further books.

I hope there are further books as well, but this sort of book is very time consuming. A lot will depend on how well the first book is received. Thanx for the props.

I don't doubt it's going to be critacally acclaimed at least among fans and music afficionados. The problem could be that it's aimed at a niche audience, unlike general bios. Hopefully the book will reach a broader audience but if it doesn't, IDK, maybe you oughta organize some crowdfunding in order to ask us fans to finance parts of the research and go on with trhe whole project.

While you're here there is a debate on another thread about the possibility that P compiled an album between 1999 and PR, which comes from what I perceive is a huge misunderstanding of P's declaration to Rolling Stone in 1985 (he basically says that he could compile an album that'd be a follow-up to 1999, and people understand that he actually had already did compile it); Maybe you could be the one person to say, once and for all, whether such an album was ever considered? Thx

NorthC said:

I have both versions on the original vinyl. Listened to them both thanx 2 this thread. The 12" version does sound a bit clearer, but I'm going to make things even more complicated by suggesting, maybe it's 33 rpm vs 45 rpm?[/b]

The speed in which a vinyl is played at does not change the mix.