So I've spent a good part of the last few days listening to this new release and I thought I'd share my impressions of each track here in case anyone was curious about what is different from previous releases and maybe wondering whether or not it's worth getting. My impressions are not based on any technological analysis, only on my appreciation as a fan with 33+ years of experience listening to Prince. Mods, if this needs to be merged with the previous thread, I understand.

1. Rebirth of the Flesh - one of only two tracks here that hasn't been officially released in this form, and I must admit that here it's somewhat of a letdown soncially. Not that the sound isn't pristine (I think it is); but the version on Pure Funk's 30 Years of Unreleased Funk (2008) sounds a little sharper and brighter to my ears. Perhaps it's a slightly different mix. But the plus here is that this version segues into Play in the Sunshine the way it was intended to.

2. Play in the Sunshine - nothing different musically from the released version on SOTT (except for the gunfire effects in the fade-in) but sonically this one has some serious thump to it, making the official SOTT version seem flat and compressed by comparison.

3. Housequake - same as version on SOTT.

4. The Ballad of Dorothy Parker - same as released, although there is some very slight tape hiss apparent here.

5. It - same as released.

6. Starfish and Coffee - same as SOTT version, with alarm clock bell intro (unlike the Dream Factory version which omits it).

7. Slow Love - same musically as SOTT, but as with #2 above, sounds more vibrant than official version.

8. Hot Thing - same as SOTT.

9. Crystal Ball - sounds like the same version as the 1998 official release, which it likely is, since Prince would have wanted to distance himself from Wendy and Lisa's input. Like the 1998 version, this one lacks their "Purple Underground" speech.

10. If I Was Your Girlfriend - lacks intro of SOTT album version ("look at the bargains over here, ladies...", but otherwise musically identical.

11. Rock Hard in a Funky Place - musically the same as official release, but sonically much more vibrant. Hey, how can anything not sound better than that thin, flat official Black Album release from 1994?

12. The Ball - ah, the track that we have been pining for the most (the only other track here that hasn't seen an official release), finally in its full form with a brief intro that's NEVER appeared on any of the circulating bootleg versions. It sounds great, the drums and percussion are way up front and the lead vocal parts are crystal clear. Like Eye No from Lovesexy, this song is quite dense sonically. Hearing it like this in its uncut, pristine form is a revelation, but as with #1 above, seems like a letdown. My suspicion is that (as with Rebirth of the Flesh) previous bootleg versions may have tried to compensate for the less than perfect sound by over e-qing, resulting in higher, brighter highs than we have here. But once you realize that this is possibly from an original source tape, you start hearing the songs anew, as if for the first time, the way they were intended to be heard. And there is a mental satisfaction in that which makes up for any shortcomings in the actual sound quality of the material. Again, maybe there are different mixes, or unmastered versions, who really knows?

13. Joy In Repetition - segues perfectly from The Ball, as was intended for this album. Otherwise, it's the same as the released version on Graffiti Bridge, except that it ends and goes directly, without a pause into...

14. Strange Relationship - same as released version on SOTT. Sounds a little distorted in parts, perhaps it's the mix.

15. I Could Never Take The Place of Your Man - same as version on SOTT (with one instrumental breakdown, unlike the Dream Factory version which has two), but puzzlingly clocks in at 6:21, 10 seconds shorter than the time listed on the official SOTT album (I haven't checked SOTT version for accuracy of the time listed).

16. Shockadelica - same as released 12 inch vinyl version

17. Good Love - same as version on Bright Lights, Big City soundtrack from 1988.

18. Forever in My Life - same as SOTT, has some distortion like # 14 above.

19. Sign O' The Times - same as released album version

20. The Cross - same as released, but soncially I hear some crackling, which could be in the mix, or might be some attempt at over enhancing the sound to make it louder?

21. It's Gonna Be A Beautiful Night - same as released version.

22. Adore - same as released, but here Irukandji have subtitled it "Until the End of Time" which I have never seen before. Interesting if Prince actually considered using that subtitle?

Some sources for information (Uptown/Per Nilson's The Vault, for example) have reported that the album ended with Beautiful Night and Adore came immediately before. But honestly it's kind of hard to imagine hearing such a sequence: The Cross and then Adore? It could be, or perhaps Prince changed the sequence a few times before he catually settled in on a final configuration (which is known to have happened). At any rate, here it is: basically everything from Sign of the Times (minus U Got The Look) plus 7 songs that were dropped when Crystal Ball was trimmed from a triple album to a double (and only 2 of those 7 have never been released officialy).

As others have noted, the material here all sounds pretty consistent sound-wise, like it's all from the same source. If indeed this new release is sourced from an original cassette configuration and is not a fan-made attempt to recreate the Crystal Ball project, then therein lies its real value. Whatever sonic shortcomings there may be are more than made up for (in my opinion) in the satisfaction of finally hearing this legendary album project the way it was intended to be heard .

Thank you so much for all of the insight and detail

No need to look for this, imho...

too many songs are "same as version on SOTT"..... wtf...

thedance said:

No need to look for this, imho...

too many songs are "same as version on SOTT"..... wtf...

I think you're missing the point. SOTT was not the album Prince wanted to release. Crystal Ball was and this might be as close to the original vision we will get.

paulludvig said:

thedance said:

No need to look for this, imho...

too many songs are "same as version on SOTT"..... wtf...

I think you're missing the point. SOTT was not the album Prince wanted to release. Crystal Ball was and this might be as close to the original vision we will get.

so goes the story although as with all prince lore i'd take it with a pinch of salt. My personal ideal release would have been Dream Factory and Camille released as two separate albums.

jaawwnn said:

paulludvig said:

I think you're missing the point. SOTT was not the album Prince wanted to release. Crystal Ball was and this might be as close to the original vision we will get.

so goes the story although as with all prince lore i'd take it with a pinch of salt. My personal ideal release would have been Dream Factory and Camille released as two separate albums.

There is no pinch of salt to take as far as we know here, this has been documented seriously by researchers.

fms said:

So I've spent a good part of the last few days listening to this new release and I thought I'd share my impressions of each track here in case anyone was curious about what is different from previous releases and maybe wondering whether or not it's worth getting. My impressions are not based on any technological analysis, only on my appreciation as a fan with 33+ years of experience listening to Prince. Mods, if this needs to be merged with the previous thread, I understand.

1. Rebirth of the Flesh - one of only two tracks here that hasn't been officially released in this form, and I must admit that here it's somewhat of a letdown soncially. Not that the sound isn't pristine (I think it is); but the version on Pure Funk's 30 Years of Unreleased Funk (2008) sounds a little sharper and brighter to my ears. Perhaps it's a slightly different mix. But the plus here is that this version segues into Play in the Sunshine the way it was intended to.

2. Play in the Sunshine - nothing different musically from the released version on SOTT (except for the gunfire effects in the fade-in) but sonically this one has some serious thump to it, making the official SOTT version seem flat and compressed by comparison.

3. Housequake - same as version on SOTT.

4. The Ballad of Dorothy Parker - same as released, although there is some very slight tape hiss apparent here.

5. It - same as released.

6. Starfish and Coffee - same as SOTT version, with alarm clock bell intro (unlike the Dream Factory version which omits it).

7. Slow Love - same musically as SOTT, but as with #2 above, sounds more vibrant than official version.

8. Hot Thing - same as SOTT.

9. Crystal Ball - sounds like the same version as the 1998 official release, which it likely is, since Prince would have wanted to distance himself from Wendy and Lisa's input. Like the 1998 version, this one lacks their "Purple Underground" speech.

10. If I Was Your Girlfriend - lacks intro of SOTT album version ("look at the bargains over here, ladies...", but otherwise musically identical.

11. Rock Hard in a Funky Place - musically the same as official release, but sonically much more vibrant. Hey, how can anything not sound better than that thin, flat official Black Album release from 1994?

12. The Ball - ah, the track that we have been pining for the most (the only other track here that hasn't seen an official release), finally in its full form with a brief intro that's NEVER appeared on any of the circulating bootleg versions. It sounds great, the drums and percussion are way up front and the lead vocal parts are crystal clear. Like Eye No from Lovesexy, this song is quite dense sonically. Hearing it like this in its uncut, pristine form is a revelation, but as with #1 above, seems like a letdown. My suspicion is that (as with Rebirth of the Flesh) previous bootleg versions may have tried to compensate for the less than perfect sound by over e-qing, resulting in higher, brighter highs than we have here. But once you realize that this is possibly from an original source tape, you start hearing the songs anew, as if for the first time, the way they were intended to be heard. And there is a mental satisfaction in that which makes up for any shortcomings in the actual sound quality of the material. Again, maybe there are different mixes, or unmastered versions, who really knows?

13. Joy In Repetition - segues perfectly from The Ball, as was intended for this album. Otherwise, it's the same as the released version on Graffiti Bridge, except that it ends and goes directly, without a pause into...

14. Strange Relationship - same as released version on SOTT. Sounds a little distorted in parts, perhaps it's the mix.

15. I Could Never Take The Place of Your Man - same as version on SOTT (with one instrumental breakdown, unlike the Dream Factory version which has two), but puzzlingly clocks in at 6:21, 10 seconds shorter than the time listed on the official SOTT album (I haven't checked SOTT version for accuracy of the time listed).

16. Shockadelica - same as released 12 inch vinyl version

17. Good Love - same as version on Bright Lights, Big City soundtrack from 1988.

18. Forever in My Life - same as SOTT, has some distortion like # 14 above.

19. Sign O' The Times - same as released album version

20. The Cross - same as released, but soncially I hear some crackling, which could be in the mix, or might be some attempt at over enhancing the sound to make it louder?

21. It's Gonna Be A Beautiful Night - same as released version.

22. Adore - same as released, but here Irukandji have subtitled it "Until the End of Time" which I have never seen before. Interesting if Prince actually considered using that subtitle?

Some sources for information (Uptown/Per Nilson's The Vault, for example) have reported that the album ended with Beautiful Night and Adore came immediately before. But honestly it's kind of hard to imagine hearing such a sequence: The Cross and then Adore? It could be, or perhaps Prince changed the sequence a few times before he catually settled in on a final configuration (which is known to have happened). At any rate, here it is: basically everything from Sign of the Times (minus U Got The Look) plus 7 songs that were dropped when Crystal Ball was trimmed from a triple album to a double (and only 2 of those 7 have never been released officialy).

As others have noted, the material here all sounds pretty consistent sound-wise, like it's all from the same source. If indeed this new release is sourced from an original cassette configuration and is not a fan-made attempt to recreate the Crystal Ball project, then therein lies its real value. Whatever sonic shortcomings there may be are more than made up for (in my opinion) in the satisfaction of finally hearing this legendary album project the way it was intended to be heard .

Brilliant! Thank u!

paulludvig said:

thedance said:

No need to look for this, imho...

too many songs are "same as version on SOTT"..... wtf...

I think you're missing the point. SOTT was not the album Prince wanted to release. Crystal Ball was and this might be as close to the original vision we will get.

Thanks for the info! I can't wait put aside some time and just listen to the whole thing as intended.

thedance said:

Is this a known tracklisting?

If certain tracks are same as SOTT ones, why allow for distortion?

SOTT even has a SHM remaster so plenty to work from.

udo said:

udo said:

If certain tracks are same as SOTT ones, why allow for distortion?

SOTT even has a SHM remaster so plenty to work from.

I think the idea for this release was to have it all be from one source, instead of a compilation from multiple sources. I'm curious as to who provided the source tape.

Milty2 said:

I'm still puzzled by the sequence difference between Adore and Beautiful Night, though, as Princevault still lists the old tracklist from Per Nilsen/Uptown, which I'm pretty sure is accurate. This may mean that the inhouse cassette was either the final config and they missed that tracklist, or that the final config had the 2 songs reversed, in which case this version, while being a priceless document, still ain't the real deal (i.e. the album that P sent to WB for release). I hope we get more info on that later on.

databank said:

I'm still puzzled by the sequence difference between Adore and Beautiful Night, though, as Princevault still lists the old tracklist from Per Nilsen/Uptown, which I'm pretty sure is accurate. This may mean that the inhouse cassette was either the final config and they missed that tracklist, or that the final config had the 2 songs reversed, in which case this version, while being a priceless document, still ain't the real deal (i.e. the album that P sent to WB for release). I hope we get more info on that later on.

?

PrinceVault has the CB album ending with Adore (Until the End of Time)

http://princevault.com/index.php/Album:_Crystal_Ball_1986

udo said:

If certain tracks are same as SOTT ones, why allow for distortion?

SOTT even has a SHM remaster so plenty to work from.

Calling the SHM CD a remaster is a HUGE stretch of the term. It still has no real bass, and still sounds worse than the original vinyl. Most would not be able to tell the difference between the SHM and original cds if they were not told which one was which. I think it sounds a tiny tiny bit better...but the vinyl is still the best way to hear the album. A shame it didn't really sell well..but we know Prince hates remastering...and Warners doesn't seem to care anymore. The remasters boat has sailed.

databank said:

paulludvig said:

databank said:

I'm still puzzled by the sequence difference between Adore and Beautiful Night, though, as Princevault still lists the old tracklist from Per Nilsen/Uptown, which I'm pretty sure is accurate. This may mean that the inhouse cassette was either the final config and they missed that tracklist, or that the final config had the 2 songs reversed, in which case this version, while being a priceless document, still ain't the real deal (i.e. the album that P sent to WB for release). I hope we get more info on that later on.

?

PrinceVault has the CB album ending with Adore (Until the End of Time)

http://princevault.com/index.php/Album:_Crystal_Ball_1986

Yeah, Princevault has this sequence now--I don't know if they changed it after this came up (didn't check for a timeline of changes) but it matches the newly circulating version.

.

As to the CB versus SOTT question... SOTT might actually be stronger "as an album"--this feels somewhat inconsistent, with non-SOTT Camille tracks really sounding odd to me in the new context--but that might just be a matter of always listening to them separately (either as individual tracks or as a Camille collection). I've only listened one time to CB, but as someone who lived and breathed SOTT for a year, it's a bit jarring to have what seem like chunks of SOTT "interrupted" by these intruding (though incredible) tracks.

.

Listening to Dream Factory compilations hasn't had that effect on me. But this is close enough for stretches to the released that even though I believe it probably is the submitted version, it still feels odd. It will take a quite a few listens before that goes away, if it ever does.

EddieC said:

paulludvig said:

?

PrinceVault has the CB album ending with Adore (Until the End of Time)

http://princevault.com/index.php/Album:_Crystal_Ball_1986

Yeah, Princevault has this sequence now--I don't know if they changed it after this came up (didn't check for a timeline of changes) but it matches the newly circulating version.

.

They've just changed it!

databank said:

EddieC said:

Yeah, Princevault has this sequence now--I don't know if they changed it after this came up (didn't check for a timeline of changes) but it matches the newly circulating version.

.

They've just changed it!

Yup. Makes me think this new version is legit.

databank said:

EddieC said:

Yeah, Princevault has this sequence now--I don't know if they changed it after this came up (didn't check for a timeline of changes) but it matches the newly circulating version.

.

They've just changed it!

I re-checked to Pimpsandwich release (which is very nice, but I think this new one sort of makes it obsolete) and they've put Adore at the end, following the presumed tracklist in Uptown/The Vault.

Can't hear "The Cross" followed immediately by "Adore"...that's too much intensity back to back, and different kinds too.

The sound is better than on my official SOTT cd. I'm hearing a lot of details I haven't heard before. What an album!

paulludvig said:

The sound is better than on my official SOTT cd. I'm hearing a lot of details I haven't heard before. What an album!

i thought sound was better too. i prefer the tracklist order of crystal ball to sott also. it as 7 very good songs and you lose one very good song.

It is differnet and better than dream factory for me as he as taken off most of refernece to revolution inspired tracks. All my dreams i think seems more suited to parade .

I also like it better as it does not have them boring interludes and it does not have song dream factory which is a very average song in comparison to the ones he included on crystal ball. They for me would bog it down and slow it down.

Out of his other tracks i consider worthy of being on crystal ball that i have heard. Maybe witness as too much of the revolution on it. Good song though

Train maybe again more of revolution song and maybe thought starfish and coffee is in that vein of catchy little pop song.

Crucial saxophone version. should be on there but unfortunately replaced by adore. it is as good for me.

Feel u up is a catchy song not sure if it is good enough though

U got the look again good enough but maybe later addition.

so when he does 50th anniversary of sign o the times hopefully we can have it in crystal ball order with the following 5 tracks inserted somewhere or as bonus tracks along with bsides extended versions

[Edited 3/17/15 4:18am]

[Edited 3/17/15 4:18am]

master said:

paulludvig said:

The sound is better than on my official SOTT cd. I'm hearing a lot of details I haven't heard before. What an album!

i thought sound was better too. i prefer the tracklist order of crystal ball to sott also. it as 7 very good songs and you lose one very good song.

It is differnet and better than dream factory for me as he as taken off most of refernece to revolution inspired tracks. All my dreams i think seems more suited to parade .

I also like it better as it does not have them boring interludes and it does not have song dream factory which is a very average song in comparison to the ones he included on crystal ball. They for me would bog it down and slow it down.

Out of his other tracks i consider worthy of being on crystal ball that i have heard. Maybe witness as too much of the revolution on it. Good song though

Train maybe again more of revolution song and maybe thought starfish and coffee is in that vein of catchy little pop song.

Crucial saxophone version. should be on there but unfortunately replaced by adore. it is as good for me.

Feel u up is a catchy song not sure if it is good enough though

U got the look again good enough but maybe later addition.

so when he does 50th anniversary of sign o the times hopefully we can have it in crystal ball order with the following 5 tracks inserted somewhere or as bonus tracks along with bsides extended versions

[Edited 3/17/15 4:18am]

[Edited 3/17/15 4:18am]

Irukandji is the same "label" that released this bootleg?

fms said:

databank said:

They've just changed it!

I re-checked to Pimpsandwich release (which is very nice, but I think this new one sort of makes it obsolete) and they've put Adore at the end, following the presumed tracklist in Uptown/The Vault.

Can't hear "The Cross" followed immediately by "Adore"...that's too much intensity back to back, and different kinds too.

I actually think The Cross followed immediately by Adore works well, juxtaposing the spiritual / sexual themes (battle?) which characterised his 80s work.