BartVanHemelen said:

There have been plenty of such. But a PR reissue isn't gonna benefit from a surprise release. Such things need to be supported by a promotional push, e.g. articles in mags like Mojo etc. WBR have seen the result of bad timing and non-promo with the disappointing sales figures of The Hits and Ultimate.

Of course, PR 30 won't be a surprise release. If it was announced today, it wouldn't be released before june. Could you give me some examples of surprise release in the entertainment industry ? Besides some shit like Beyonce or Jay Z, I can't see one. And even those guys were rumored to record a new album, or to shoot music video weeks before.

Prince's new tour in the USA could last till may, and he could go abroad after that. We are really far from a PR rerelease.

RODSERLING said:

BartVanHemelen said:

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I seriously doubt that, since I assume then people working at WBR aren't insane and know fully well how Prince operates.

Are you talking about the people who released AOA and PLEC the same day ?

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That was blatantly Prince's desire. I bet they never cared about AOa/PE at all, it was simply one of the things Prince wanted as part of the contract.

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What was their goal, losing money just for the fun of it ? It's obvious they had at least a slight hope that Prince will promote his craps. They surely didn't sign a contract to see him promote anything else than the 2014 albums.

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You were talking about a PR world tour. Unless the people at WBR were insane, that was never going to happen and I don't see them expecting that. I bet the cost to WBR of AOA and PE wasn't that high, especially not after PE was inserted into that deal. Their goal seems to have been "lock up those master rights" and perhaps get a remaster/deluxe edition program going.

BartVanHemelen said:

RODSERLING said:

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That was blatantly Prince's desire. I bet they never cared about AOa/PE at all, it was simply one of the things Prince wanted as part of the contract.

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What was their goal, losing money just for the fun of it ? It's obvious they had at least a slight hope that Prince will promote his craps. They surely didn't sign a contract to see him promote anything else than the 2014 albums.

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You were talking about a PR world tour. Unless the people at WBR were insane, that was never going to happen and I don't see them expecting that. I bet the cost to WBR of AOA and PE wasn't that high, especially not after PE was inserted into that deal. Their goal seems to have been "lock up those master rights" and perhaps get a remaster/deluxe edition program going.

I see it similar...

WB and the industry know Prince`s behaviour and way of thinking ( more or less)...

Prince will never make a real reunion with the revolution and go on a huge Purple Rain Remaster Tour...Would make him look like an oldies act ...

And both WB and P did not invest that much money into promotion of AOA and PE...so they did not loose money, imo....

I still think it was a good thing to release both albums on the same day and despite not being a huge seller , AOA was still selling some copies and was in the Top ten worldwide...

Maybe Prince did expect it to be bigger ( of course) but i don`t see him that much unsatisfied right now...

For Prince and Warner the new contract is a win win situation and also his new tour will help to sell his at least the classic warner albums which means money for both WB and P...

The question is whether warner will get a PR remaster from Prince...

I think yes...

BartVanHemelen said:

RODSERLING said:

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That was blatantly Prince's desire. I bet they never cared about AOa/PE at all, it was simply one of the things Prince wanted as part of the contract.

.

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You were talking about a PR world tour. Unless the people at WBR were insane, that was never going to happen and I don't see them expecting that. I bet the cost to WBR of AOA and PE wasn't that high, especially not after PE was inserted into that deal. Their goal seems to have been "lock up those master rights" and perhaps get a remaster/deluxe edition program going.

Of course that was Prince's desire. Of course WB never cared about AOA and PLEC. Neither did Prince. Neither did the fans or the general audience, when you look at the sales.

But WB shouldn't have agreed on these terms. They should have released PR 30 one year ago in proof of good faith from Prince, and because it was the most logical thing to do. They could have released AOA and PLEC on digital only, in order to not lose money on unsold shipments. They could have released another album form another artist who could have sold better than AOA and PLEC united. Even when they release the music video from Marz or Another love, it still costs some money, because there is a guy paid for that.

You don't release 2 albums the same day just for fun, you expect some ROI, because you flood record stores with shipments, and because you are a firm who gotta make money.

Ask yourself that question : could have Prince possibly released AOA and PLEC on another label than WB ? The answer is NO. WB was his only option, apart from being digital only or to sell its craps within a pack of yoghourt. Without WB, he wouldn't have released in a physical form PLEC and AOA.

Prince did a huge tour with MUSICOLOGY in 2014, he played the game for about six months. So it was not so far-fetched that Prince do another revival-comeback with a huge tour, with the 30th anniversary in line.

A bit off topic:

Interesting to see that the sales projection for madonna`s rebel heart are 100 000 copies. Not bad, but:

"Only" double of Prince`s first week for AOA but with a lot of promo, some of the hottest producers of the world right now,

a commercial pop/ dance single (living for love), videos, grammy and brit awards performance and

social media presence etc...

RODSERLING said:

But WB shouldn't have agreed on these terms. They should have released PR 30 one year ago in proof of good faith from Prince,

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You cannot rush release something like PR Deluxe.

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They could have released AOA and PLEC on digital only, in order to not lose money on unsold shipments.

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Again: I doubt the economic impact is that big. I wouldn't be surprised if Prince's insistence to also release 3EG had resulted in a contract change that shifted plenty of the costs to him and released WBR from investing in promo.

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Prince did a huge tour with MUSICOLOGY in 2014, he played the game for about six months. So it was not so far-fetched that Prince do another revival-comeback with a huge tour, with the 30th anniversary in line.

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A long time ago, and utterly unlike Prince. WBR would have been idiots to expect such a thing, and I don't see any evidence they ever did.

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I wouldn't be surprised to find out in a couple of years that Prince once again severely screwed himself with this WBR contract and once again shot himself in the foot by failing to cooperate.

linus4000 said:

A bit off topic:

Interesting to see that the sales projection for madonna`s rebel heart are 100 000 copies. Not bad, but:

"Only" double of Prince`s first week for AOA but with a lot of promo, some of the hottest producers of the world right now,

a commercial pop/ dance single (living for love), videos, grammy and brit awards performance and

social media presence etc...

If the projection is correct 100 k is poor (it will be a little bit more) , but you seem to forget that she sells that same amount of her last single in digital sales. And in term of singles sales, Prince is dead on that market. And in the long term, the album will go GOLD, because she will release other singles, music video, and of course a huge tour.

Beside that, she is bigger in Europe. She will probably sell almost 100 k in the UK alone the first week. AOA sold what ? 6000 k ?

BartVanHemelen said:

RODSERLING said:

But WB shouldn't have agreed on these terms. They should have released PR 30 one year ago in proof of good faith from Prince,

.

You cannot rush release something like PR Deluxe.

.

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Again: I doubt the economic impact is that big. I wouldn't be surprised if Prince's insistence to also release 3EG had resulted in a contract change that shifted plenty of the costs to him and released WBR from investing in promo.

.

Prince did a huge tour with MUSICOLOGY in 2014, he played the game for about six months. So it was not so far-fetched that Prince do another revival-comeback with a huge tour, with the 30th anniversary in line.

.

A long time ago, and utterly unlike Prince. WBR would have been idiots to expect such a thing, and I don't see any evidence they ever did.

.

I wouldn't be surprised to find out in a couple of years that Prince once again severely screwed himself with this WBR contract and once again shot himself in the foot by failing to cooperate.

Don't you think WB has other things to do than releasing albums that they don't make money of it ? Why don't release instead something that sells well like, I don't know, PR 30 ? That's the point, a firm must invest in something that sells. Prince had no other choices, like I said before.

Prince and WB surely thought that it would sell 2 times more the first week, especially PLEC which was not even bought by his fanbase. Maybe Prince was disapointed by the initial sales and gave up.

The statement was released on april of 2014, PR30 could have been released on june, or september 2014. Since it was the 30 th anniversary, medias did the job themselves to celebrate the album. That was the ideal moment to release it. No rush at all, just the ideal moment, and hit the road with one huge tour in summer like in 2004. Prince is always touring, it's logical.

Now, of course we are in 2015, and you have to justify the rerelease on the market, and Prince is not involved anymore so it will take more time for sure, if they ever release it in a physical form.

And we are talking about PR, but what about the others 1978/1999 albums from WB era ? If they have the rights for PR, they surely got the rights for the others albums too. They are not making so much money from Prince's albums sales, it would give a huge boost to the entire catalogue. So, of course he shoot himself in the foot. It's more than obvious.

[Edited 3/12/15 5:58am]

I dunno if this can be trusted, but reading this I just felt like "that fucker is never gonna give us remasters and deluxe editions":

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It's almost as if he enjoys—and a lot of his associates told me this as well—he enjoys the idea of buried treasure. He enjoys the fact that no fan can just go on Amazon and buy all his albums. If you really want the complete works of Prince you have to dig and dig and dig and all the fans I've ever met will always say, "You know what? If you keep looking there's always more Prince music out there."

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Dude is insane.

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By the way, in about three weeks it will be one year since Prince re-signed with WBR and we were promised a remastered and expanded Purple Rain. One whole fucking year.

BartVanHemelen said:

By the way, in about three weeks it will be one year since Prince re-signed with WBR and we were promised a remastered and expanded Purple Rain. One whole fucking year.

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BartVanHemelen said:

One whole fucking year.

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So if P were really into a PR reissue, it looks like he might not be so info that anymore.

I now think that this project ain't happening.Prince seemed to be against it from the very beginning.He hates to "look back"

JoshuaWho said:

First of all, it has to be a multiple disc set - purple discs that look like the classic vinyl from 84. In the purple box all covered with the flowery background from the album cover, should be 3 albums: Purple Rain, Ice Cream Castles, and Apollonia 6. There should be some provision for the B sides and remixes as well because this is by far the best era for Prince B-sides - 17 days, Erotic City, God (both versions), Another Lonely Christmas, dance mixes of Lets Go Crazy, I Would Die 4 U. And, of course, some previously unreleased material that was from the project - maybe Wednesday and Fathers Song. But I am sure there is no way Prince would let them out unless they were pristine and complete studio recordings like the "bootlegs" on the Crystal Ball set. With all that, I want hardback book with the story of Purple Rain and lots of rare photos. On another disc, a complete Purple Rain gig - I will take the Syracuse show that we all know and love from the video.

It wouldn't contain ice Cream castles nor Apollonia 6 because Prince didn't get the masters from those back and therefore would lose a monumental share of the retail price to WB, but anyway I don't believe they belong here, I believe they both deserve their own deluxe reissue with bonus tracks.

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A comprehensive rerelease would and should contain:

- The original album

- The b-sides in both edited and long form

- The extended versions from the singles

- All the single edits

- An audio version of the live music videos as well as the 2 TV performances and possibly even the live tracks that were sent to TV stations in order to promote the tour back then.

- 2 CD's of unreleased material, including both alternate versions and totally unreleased tracks.

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The Double Live concert could also be included as a DVD but I think it'd deserve its own rerelease, which could be coupled with the music videos and TV appearances above and an audio version of same show. It could also come in a multi DVD set alongside the legendary August 1983 aftershow, which was pro-shot and is a fan favorite.

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But anyway I don't think we're gonna see this anytime soon, as it seems P and WB have started a new feud, which without doubt will soon become public.

BartVanHemelen said:

I dunno if this can be trusted, but reading this I just felt like "that fucker is never gonna give us remasters and deluxe editions":

.

It's almost as if he enjoys—and a lot of his associates told me this as well—he enjoys the idea of buried treasure. He enjoys the fact that no fan can just go on Amazon and buy all his albums. If you really want the complete works of Prince you have to dig and dig and dig and all the fans I've ever met will always say, "You know what? If you keep looking there's always more Prince music out there."

.

Dude is insane.

IDK, I can imagine an artist having fun thinking of our treasure searches. I mean WE do enjoy them, don't we? Even back in the early days finding everything meant spending hours browsing records in stores until u'd find that rare album or maxi, I don't know how many hours I spent doing that between 91 and 04. Today it's online and it's all for free but just as time consuming even though when u know the right places it's pretty easy to find 90% of what's been released (it's actually A LOT easier today than before the internet). Even if all the official albums and side-projects were out on iTunes and Amazon, there'd still be hundreds of single versions, rare tracks, promo mixes and random songs given to other artists to find.

databank said:

BartVanHemelen said:

I dunno if this can be trusted, but reading this I just felt like "that fucker is never gonna give us remasters and deluxe editions":

.

.

Dude is insane.

IDK, I can imagine an artist having fun thinking of our treasure searches. I mean WE do enjoy them, don't we?

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Nope. Once upon a time there was some thrill to finding a new boot, but these days I'm more like "just fucking release the thing".

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Even back in the early days finding everything meant spending hours browsing records in stores until u'd find that rare album or maxi, I don't know how many hours I spent doing that between 91 and 04.

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Dunno what kind of odd record shops you wnet to, the ones I visited usually had sorted things alphabetically and perhaps by genre. Only time I spent hours was when one had obtained a massive unsorted stock from a shop that had closed. Found a bunch of great stuff for next to nothing, even after the owner had already sifted through the pile to find the valuable items.

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Today it's online and it's all for free but just as time consuming even though when u know the right places it's pretty easy to find 90% of what's been released (it's actually A LOT easier today than before the internet). Even if all the official albums and side-projects were out on iTunes and Amazon, there'd still be hundreds of single versions, rare tracks, promo mixes and random songs given to other artists to find.

.

If it was all official there'd be URIs we could point to. Hell, that's what I would do if I were an artist: maintain a database of all my releases with all associated URIs. Because that way people could purchase my music easily and I WOULD ACTUALLY EARN MONEY.

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This "hide & seek" game is tired and counter-productive.

BartVanHemelen said:

databank said:

Nope. Once upon a time there was some thrill to finding a new boot, but these days I'm more like "just fucking release the thing".

I wasn't even talking boots, just the official stuff.

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Dunno what kind of odd record shops you wnet to, the ones I visited usually had sorted things alphabetically and perhaps by genre. Only time I spent hours was when one had obtained a massive unsorted stock from a shop that had closed. Found a bunch of great stuff for next to nothing, even after the owner had already sifted through the pile to find the valuable items.

French stores. lotsa "one dollar bins", too, and the necessity to browse the whole goddamn alphabet anyway because I was looking for so many things that I never knew what to look for.

Today it's online and it's all for free but just as time consuming even though when u know the right places it's pretty easy to find 90% of what's been released (it's actually A LOT easier today than before the internet). Even if all the official albums and side-projects were out on iTunes and Amazon, there'd still be hundreds of single versions, rare tracks, promo mixes and random songs given to other artists to find.

.

If it was all official there'd be URIs we could point to. Hell, that's what I would do if I were an artist: maintain a database of all my releases with all associated URIs. Because that way people could purchase my music easily and I WOULD ACTUALLY EARN MONEY.

.

This "hide & seek" game is tired and counter-productive.

I agree that money is being lost and that businesswise it's counter productive outside of the hardcore fanbase, but I can understand P find it amusing. Personally I don't have to play hide and seek anymore anyway because I have virtually everything and when something comes out, officially or otherwise, I get the link within 24 hours, but I'm guessing it's fun for the rookies.

databank said:

I agree that money is being lost and that businesswise it's counter productive outside of the hardcore fanbase, but I can understand P find it amusing. Personally I don't have to play hide and seek anymore anyway because I have virtually everything and when something comes out, officially or otherwise, I get the link within 24 hours, but I'm guessing it's fun for the rookies.

There are still rookies around?

Rebeljuice said:

databank said:

There are still rookies around?

Are you still the only one on earth who thinks PR 30 is still planned ?

Or, have you come to the point to acknowledge that, once again, I was right ?

BartVanHemelen said:

I dunno if this can be trusted, but reading this I just felt like "that fucker is never gonna give us remasters and deluxe editions":

.

It's almost as if he enjoys—and a lot of his associates told me this as well—he enjoys the idea of buried treasure. He enjoys the fact that no fan can just go on Amazon and buy all his albums. If you really want the complete works of Prince you have to dig and dig and dig and all the fans I've ever met will always say, "You know what? If you keep looking there's always more Prince music out there."

.

Dude is insane.

.

By the way, in about three weeks it will be one year since Prince re-signed with WBR and we were promised a remastered and expanded Purple Rain. One whole fucking year.

Never read Bart post anything more true. Prince is nuts and he loves the games. He doesn't seem to realise his fan base has grown up and are no longer a bunch of teens with too much time on their hands.