Pentacle said:

Angelsoncrack said:

This thread inspired me to make something today haha.

Before you watch the video, I highly suggest you visit this page to understand what it actually is:

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/thread-simulators

If you can't be arsed visiting the page, the basic idea is that you take basic ass posts that are typical of x forum and pop them into a video. Here is what I made:

http://youtu.be/bRoyHVaHE-0

[Edited 1/31/15 16:27pm]

Very funny, though the pace is a little too fast.

haha yeah, sorry about that. I would of made it in Adobe After Effects but I don't have it on my home computer.

V10LETBLUES said:

Art and cristism go hand in hand. There is no troll about it. All artists knows this. Art is meant to be discussed. People are passionate about art. That's a good thing. It is ok to be critical. It's all subjective. Grow up people.

[Edited 1/31/15 13:00pm]

This is you on another thread:

"To me AOA is JOYLESS. It's production is amatuerish. I'm being objective here."

vinaysfunk said:

I agree with the OP. As for me, even though Prince's music hasn't moved me for a long time, he is still one of my favs forever because of the joy his music brought me in the past. I still listen to the stuff of his that I dig and still appreciate the genius who created that music. If his music of late isn't doing it for me, that doesn't mean someone else isn't being moved by his current output or that "he's lost it".

I think we can all agree that this a place to share opinions, but the manner in which some express their opinion can be so hateful and entitled. If post after post is you whining about Prince's music or career decisions on a Prince fan site, why continue to torture yourself? It's not like Prince gives a damn about your opinion. He'll make the kind of music and decisions that he wants and no amount of bashing and complaining is going to change that.

I don't think the bashing here is as frequent as it was at some point. A few years ago you could hardly read a single thread here without the same bunch of people wanting to make sure nobody disagrees with them that Prince has lost it altogether after some arbitrary album. It's improved a lot in that sense.

I'm trying to start some positive conversations. If you don't want to, that's OK. Just leave me out of whatever it is you're trying to do here.

[Edited 2/2/15 0:40am]

jwar said:

BartVanHemelen said:

Yeah, why should anyone bitch about misleading thread titles, or thread titles that are utterly useless (like "question")?

.

Meanwhile in the real world StackExchange is scoring top marks all over the place for being a most informative cluster of website, most notably StackOverflow. Now how are questions treaded at that place? Oh yeah: stupid ones get downvoted; off-topic ones get reported to admins and closed; badly worded questions get edited... Guess what happens? QUALITY rises to the top.

.

Instead at the Org there's a race to the bottom. Note the Principedia link in the menu: why couldn't anyone be arsed to actually CONTRIBUTE to that?

Sorry, but the few of your comments I've read always seem rude and unproductive. My suggestion, take it or leave it: Find some joy (or something to be thankful for); be able to stay on topic; say something positive or at least read a little more carefully before leaving rude and/or dead-end comments. The great news is: Today, right now is as good a time to start as any. So how about addressing the topic of this thread, which is the relentless Princebashing here? When does criticism cross the line over into bashing?

I'm trying to start some positive conversations. If you don't want to, that's OK. Just leave me out of whatever it is you're trying to do here.

[Edited 2/2/15 0:40am]

When trying to start some positive conversations, it helps when you don't start off by telling others what you are tired of. Instead try talking about what you like and what interests you when it comes to Prince. Certainly there will be people that agree and will engage you and yes, there will be people that disagree with you and engage you too. That's life and this is the Org.

Couldn't agree more Jwar. It's one thing to constructively criticize a certain project, album, song or whatever- seeing merits and/or flaws. But to constantly berate and chide him, or his artwork is just sad.

This is the same one-man tour de force who has given us amazing albums: Lovesexy, 1999, Sign of the Times, 3121, Lotusflower, The Rainbow Children, Art Official Age(to name a few of MY favorites) - and given us songs who speak to my very essence. And concerts that have blown my mind...I've seen him over 40 times, each one it's own special experience. Somehow, Prince has appeared to speak directly to me through his works of art. Who here hasn't felt that?

That's not to say every project or song hits the spot - and there are songs and albums I barely hear beyond the initial release year. But you know he puts every ounce of his body and soul into his craft. Who here can say that? And have for the last 35+ years? And if you have...do you have legions of "fans" who seemingly complain non-stop about you?

He might be thick-skinned - and obviously knows how to deal with scrutiny- but he's also human. What does that mean to you? If you were standing face to face with him right now...would you rake him over the coals or pretend to be his friend?

I've been there and talked to him. He is very kind, welcoming and thankful. And human.

I dont know whether the OP is trying to be ironic or is deliberately trying to start an argument. If a thread is started with confrontation in mind then the general course of the thread will be confrontational. Saying that those that have had negative opinions about Prince need to change their opinions is just starting an argument. Perhaps they want to validate themselves by having all the ass kissers join them in what will turn out as an us vs them thread. Completely pointless to the org and serves no purpose other than a masquerade for like minded people to gang up together.

As to why there is and has been negativity towards Prince is pretty obvious. Prince has done a lot that deserves it. Whether it is business decisions that make no sense or music that is subpar, anyone whose head isnt stuck up his anal passage will say it how they see it. Nothing wrong with that. On the flip side, those with their head stuck well and truly up his anal passage will sing nothing but constant praise for everything from his haircut to his toilet stools.

The majority of fans on this site are balanced in their opinions and say things how they see them. Sometimes critical, sometimes with praise. And there are also the fundamentalists that sit either side of that. You can very quickly see who sits where in the equation and if you filter out the extremist opinions on either side you will find they are the minority, if somewhat vocal. The majority of the site is pretty well balanced.

As for the OP singling out critisism of AOA, I think they have been somewhat blinded by their own blind following of Prince. The fact is AOA has received extremely positive critism from the org from day one. Sure, some have not liked it and those that havent liked it have been very vocal in their dislike. But it is only a handful of people. Just read through the massive AOA thread.

Bart is 100% correct about the setup of the org. It is a very dated format with dated technologies behind it and the moderation is less than stellar. It really is time for a rethink in how topics and discussions are laid out and how to make the topical and most relevant threads float to the top with the nonsensical topics (on both sides of the spectrum) sink. Thats not to say that critisism should be squashed, just irrelevant critisism. In the same vain, pointless praise should also be squashed. That way we would see more valid and topical threads making the "headlines" which would bring a lot more validity to the site and the content within it.

Wouldnt it be nice to have an org where we discuss our likes and dislikes of songs, albums, eras etc so that those threads could become a documentation of Prince's music from a fans perspective? Wouldnt it also be nice if we could have a "Prince does no wrong (aka NPGMC discussion forums)" section, completely disconnected from the analytical forum? Likewise a "Prince has just gone to shit" forum? At least we would be able to discuss what we wanted with likeminded people in our own setting, without disrupting conversations that are trying to talk about something else entirely.

As an example, the album discussion threads and the era discussion threads are great. They attract a lot of opinion one way or the other but stick to the topic at hand and actually reveal a lot of useful information. But they soon disappear from the front pages of the site if a comment hasnt been posted in a while. Meanwhile, especially for a new fan on a mission of discovery, these threads should be constantly alive. Not as a sticky, but in a forum in their own right. And when someone adds something of usefulness, they get an upvote by their fellow orgers, thus promoting the use of relevant information within a topic. With down votes for being pointless to the topic at hand also coming into play.

Anyway, a step in the right direction would be to split the Music and More forum into the Music forum, for music opinions and facts, and The More forum for hair cuts, high heels and make up etc.

I think Prince targetted the wrong fan site back then, he should have targetted the Org and allowed Housequake to continue. It was a much better platform for fans to discover new and interesting things in a balanced way without being fanatical.

jwar said:

So how about addressing the topic of this thread, which is the relentless Princebashing here? When does criticism cross the line over into bashing?

.

Go ask Prince. He started this. All of this "negativity" comes from him: firstly by setting up fans against each other, and also by releasing subpar "lemme earn a quick buck" product.

I am not sure what is so complicated about what the OP is trying to bring to the surface here? It's not that confusing or complex as some of you would have it seem. What is very cleary evident on this site are a few things. The most being a complete amount of disrepect and manners towards fellow posters and Prince in general. Now please let me clear once again, I am no ass kisser of Prince and I completely understand the need for healthy debate and intelligent conversation based on our knowledge and appreciation of this man's music. But one has to be deaf dumb and blind if your telling me that there isn't a very large amount of unhealthy emotion that permeates this site. Almost like poison. What I am talking about is not bringing up not so positive comments about P. I would go so far as to say the negativity doesn''t even make sense. It's as if some posters have lost thier ability to control their own emotions and lash out at just about everything this guy does. So in my eyes it's not about balanced people vs ass kissers. It's as simple as having some proper home training in the art of discussion. Apparently good home training is in short supply in our society, especially when it comes to discussing a talent such as Prince. I respect each and every one's ability to have an opinion. But hatred is unecessary and pointless. It's acutally misguided on a site such as this. If you can't see what I am talking about I just really have nothing to say to you. I am just in shock. Such is the plight of a democracy where we have a right to voice our opinion. I believe the OP is spot on and has a very valid point. Sometimes I will be reading a thread. Full on interesting and enlightening points (both positve and negative)and then all of a sudden I comes across a post that is just plain weird. It's as if that person has their own adgenda and that is hatred. Hatred for just about anything Prince does nowadays all the while stating they have a huge P catalogue so they can back up their awful comments. In closing the most simple and obvious point I can make is this. There are times to say something negative and they are valid, but there is way to say something that doesn't embarress this site and the people that are on it and the poster that makes it. If you can't see that you have no home training in the art of communication!

[Edited 2/3/15 5:22am]

XNY said:

Couldn't agree more Jwar. It's one thing to constructively criticize a certain project, album, song or whatever- seeing merits and/or flaws. But to constantly berate and chide him, or his artwork is just sad.

This is the same one-man tour de force who has given us amazing albums: Lovesexy, 1999, Sign of the Times, 3121, Lotusflower, The Rainbow Children, Art Official Age(to name a few of MY favorites) - and given us songs who speak to my very essence. And concerts that have blown my mind...I've seen him over 40 times, each one it's own special experience. Somehow, Prince has appeared to speak directly to me through his works of art. Who here hasn't felt that?

That's not to say every project or song hits the spot - and there are songs and albums I barely hear beyond the initial release year. But you know he puts every ounce of his body and soul into his craft. Who here can say that? And have for the last 35+ years? And if you have...do you have legions of "fans" who seemingly complain non-stop about you?

He might be thick-skinned - and obviously knows how to deal with scrutiny- but he's also human. What does that mean to you? If you were standing face to face with him right now...would you rake him over the coals or pretend to be his friend?

I've been there and talked to him. He is very kind, welcoming and thankful. And human.

I think you make some really valid points here. When I first got into Prince in 1989 he could have simply stopped then and not produced any more work , I would have had no reason to complain..but he didn't he conitined to produce inetresting work up until the present day. It is amazing what drives him as he may have fallen to addiction or decadence like many artists or even just fallen to the negativity. He continued top perform, write and compose and I don believ that he puts everything into it, one thing taht surely not in dispute is his legendary work ethic, to push himself as hard as he does still to this day is incredibly impressive.

Like you, this does not mean that every song is instantly my favourite or I instantly like it or even like it after that. I can however say that every single song has 'something' in it that I find interesting or enjoyable or even just pleasant.

I think your best point is that Prince is human and whilst we almost make famous stars into detached non-human entities simply because they have offered their work up for sale and have the audacity to publicly perform, they are still humans just like us simply with fame and money. We don't feel we own rich businessmen or famous figures such as newsreaders in this way.

PS Have a great day XNY!

BartVanHemelen said:

jwar said:

So how about addressing the topic of this thread, which is the relentless Princebashing here? When does criticism cross the line over into bashing?

.

Go ask Prince. He started this. All of this "negativity" comes from him: firstly by setting up fans against each other, and also by releasing subpar "lemme earn a quick buck" product.

I have to say that, if nothing else, Bart deserves some award for that fact that he has been a member for 13 years and during that time has posted, on average, just over once per day, some 5329 posts.

BartVanHemelen said:

Meanwhile in the real world StackExchange is scoring top marks all over the place for being a most informative cluster of website, most notably StackOverflow. Now how are questions treaded at that place? Oh yeah: stupid ones get downvoted; off-topic ones get reported to admins and closed; badly worded questions get edited... Guess what happens? QUALITY rises to the top.

Stackoverflow mentioned on the .org.
Now I've seen it all.

But I would like to see that happen. Is there an official webmaster on the .org?
Time to get rid of this ol' forum system...

That is what it is all about on this site and has been for years. People ripping Prince on everything from commercial appeal of his new work ("Prince hasn't had a no.1 hit on the charts since...") to his religion ("Prince was better before JW and he was cursing and singing about sex...") to how he conducts his business ("Prince doesn't do websites, promotion, album releases, social media, online content, copyright protection the way I wan him to...") is a waste of time for me as they are areas that no one here is qualified to speak on with any real intelligence or credibility. Sharing an opinion or theory is one thing. To me, talking with false certainty on those things you couldn't possibly know is another thing - and quite dumb.

This should not be confused with critiquing the work and anything directly associated with Prince that is made accessible to the fanbase ie. the general public. As devoted career-long Prince fan, I have no problem making my issues with the limitations of the likes of Tamar, Johsua, and 3rdeyegirl or the lameness of the Yahoo release party and that knuckleheaded chick who was hosting it. It is almost funny sometimes and it always passes (look at how fast Tamar disappeared after Prince actually took her on the rounds for national TV performances and a concert tour). Even though I was a GCS and Sly Stone fan far before Prince existed as the artist we al know and love, I - like so many Prince fans - got sick of him dominating major chunks of Prince shows in the 90s. Prince covering Sly Stone and GCS songs onstage had gotten out of hand for a while as well. All that said, I never bashed Prince because I love him and his work. I dont love every move but, overall, what he has done has always been better than everything else out there.

Nah, I'm not tired of it. Prince has gone out of his way to piss off and frustrate his fanbase. Some of it is not entirely his fault (Youtube, for ex), but plenty of other things are. And it's not like Prince himself doesn't talk shit about us and The Revolution, Lenny Kravitz, and others...................