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Thread started 11/28/14 7:18am

KingSausage

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Did Prince's Focus on 3EG & PE Kill AOA?

Now that it appears Prince is finished with the two new albums, there's no tour and no real videos, and they've both dropped from the charts, I think we can start doing some reflecting. I think AOA is one of his strongest efforts since his classic era. To me it was his best since TGE. But Plectrumelectrum was weak as shit. Prince put all of his focus on 3EG and Plectrumelectrum. He could have focused on AOA. For example, the SNL appearance was mostly 3EG focused. The Yahoo live shitstream was too. Could AOA have been a success if it had been the only new album and Prince actually gave it his focus (for what that's worth...)? Did he waste an opportunity to maximize the appeal of AOA by spending too much time and effort on PLECTRUMELECTRUM and 3EG?
"Drop that stereo before I blow your Goddamn nuts off, asshole!"
-Eugene Tackleberry
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Reply #1 posted 11/28/14 7:23am

feeluupp

The 3rd Eye Girl era was over before Plectrum was released. Prince wanted to release Plectrum since 2012...

3rd Eye Girl were touring with Prince for over 2 years already playing songs from the Plec album and the AOA album such as The Breakdown before the album was even announced.

Breakfast Can Wait was released over a year ago as a single...

Plectrum is not a good album. Another Love is fantstic, but the rest is just bland and not up to Prince's standards. Plectrum is his 2nd lowest selling album of all time, regardless what year we are in and if the industry is in a bad slump or not.

AOA is an average album. It's not strong, it's not good, it's not bad, but as an album it flows together nicely. However something is seriously missing off that album to make it something worth the 4 years wait.

It seems like Prince wanted to get these projects out at least 2 years ago and he has already moved on. Remember during the Yahoo Live stream it looks like he already had 2 more albums almost finished, and was sharing songs from those albums and really didn't care anymore about AOA and PE.

The SNL performance imo was the nail in the coffin for these two albums, great performance but that was the end we will be hearing from those 2 albums.

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Reply #2 posted 11/28/14 7:46am

RODSERLING

Of course. I talked about this one month before the double release, when most people here thought it was a smart move commercially speaking. No need to be Sherlock Holmes to know that when you're releasing two albums the same day, they' re cannibalizing themselves. WB chose obviously to make promotion for AOA, and Prince chose obviously to make promotion for PE and to sabotage the poor efforts of WB, just for the fun of it. Isn't it funny ?
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Reply #3 posted 11/28/14 8:21am

snakesineveryc
olor

Not to answer a question with a question, but here's a question: what did he leave on the table with these albums? They were sufficiently promoted that the people most likely to buy both albums knew about them, so what was left was really convincing the uninitiated that there was something on these records for them.

After the initial splash of a record, convincing potential buyers to jump on is down to one of two mechanisms - manufacture a hit, or get down to the retail business of getting the music in front of people (which, if it works, can lead to the former). That sort of hard sell is something I can't see Prince ever doing again - he makes too much money as a live performer, and has shown again and again that, while he is clearly interested in making money, he isn't actually greedy in the way that would make him willing to do the work necessary to make ALL the money he can on everything - hence the lack of licensing his songs, the lack of presence on YouTube, etc. He wants to be rich, but it is just as important to him that he is made rich doing it his way.

So for AOA and PE, I expect he did what he wanted to do. He made the records he wanted to make, and got the word out. As long as he got his advance from WB, I expect he did just fine. Focus on 3EG and PE didn't/ won't kill AOA, because even if you take those elements out of the equation, AOA is not the sort of album that was going to easily draw in the non-Prince adherent, and he certainly wouldn't have spent a whole bunch of extra time changing that circumstance regardless of the other things on his plate, because the back-end payoff was never going to be worth working any harder at it.

AOA is a boutique record by a boutique artist, and he was never going to go door to door to change its fate.
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Reply #4 posted 11/28/14 8:55am

SuperSoulFight
er

RODSERLING said:

Of course. I talked about this one month before the double release, when most people here thought it was a smart move commercially speaking.
No need to be Sherlock Holmes to know that when you're releasing two albums the same day, they' re cannibalizing themselves.
WB chose obviously to make promotion for AOA, and Prince chose obviously to make promotion for PE and to sabotage the poor efforts of WB, just for the fun of it.
Isn't it funny ?

Sherlock Holmes' smarter brother Puffy would have told Prince it would've been better to release them as a package, like Lotusflower. And in response to Sausage's question: maybe the 3EG stuff is simply better suited for live performances. And it's easier to create a hype with a brand new band of sexy women than with just another solo album. But yes, it does seem these albums are old news already. Doesn't this remind y'all of the TAFKAP/Gold era?
[Edited 11/28/14 8:57am]
[Edited 11/28/14 9:05am]
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Reply #5 posted 11/28/14 9:05am

wilsoqp

Prince is a Shrewd Business Man his whole Agenda was to get his Master Recording's Back! Financially Prince is set. He could really careless about about Everything else.....
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Reply #6 posted 11/28/14 10:10am

OperatingTheta
n

I agree that AOA is the strongest of the two albums and still consider it one of Prince's best albums since the 80s. While it's true Prince has focused on PE, AOA has still sold considerably more and has been better received.

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Reply #7 posted 11/28/14 10:42am

Shockedelicus

I think AOA killed AOA. It's a great record to Prince fans, but it's not really that appealing outside of us. To most people, it sounds like normal everyday overproduced R&B. Some really good songs, sure, but it doesn't offer anything new.

That being said, I think squishing PE and AOA into one R&B/rock album (a la 3121) or not releasing PE at all would have been better. He promoted most of the double-release with crappy, flaccid garage rock, rather than the more enjoyable pop-oriented stuff. PE sounds like Prince holding back for an hour.

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Reply #8 posted 11/28/14 12:28pm

luvsexy4all

once again ...with his masters in tow...he can do ANYTHING he wants

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Reply #9 posted 11/28/14 1:54pm

EvilAngel

Shockedelicus said:

I think AOA killed AOA. It's a great record to Prince fans, but it's not really that appealing outside of us. To most people, it sounds like normal everyday overproduced R&B. Some really good songs, sure, but it doesn't offer anything new.

That being said, I think squishing PE and AOA into one R&B/rock album (a la 3121) or not releasing PE at all would have been better. He promoted most of the double-release with crappy, flaccid garage rock, rather than the more enjoyable pop-oriented stuff. PE sounds like Prince holding back for an hour.

Exactly, it's just more of the same only crappier. Most of AOA sounds very outdated too. You could easily fool people by saying this album has been in the vault for 20 years and he finally decided to release it.

One thing that has bothered me for the past decade or so is that I can't relate to this guy anymore. I hate when he's bragging, his religious beliefs are strange, his commentary on modern society silly and make him sound like this old guy who can't deal with change, his mushy songs make me want to throw up. Most of his songs are empty, fake...basically he still wants to fuck that hot chick, party and dance (preferably to his own lame ass funky music). Hell the only time he's convincing is when he's singing about wanting to bone some girl half his age. That's sad.

It's funny he claims he doesn't look back, yet he doesn't seem to be moving forward either. Dude is stuck in the past but he doesn't even realize.

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Reply #10 posted 11/28/14 2:08pm

toejam

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Great question.

I think Art Official Age is mostly from 2011 when Andy Allo was part of the Paisley family. So I think to Prince it's probably not as fresh to him compared to where he is now with 3rdEyeGirl.

But to us outsider observers, I think most are in agreement that Art Official Age is the stronger and more cohesive album. So yeah, as much as I like 3rdEyeGirl and Rectuminspection Plectrumelectrum, it would have been nice to see him focus more on promoting Art Official Age.

.

[Edited 11/28/14 14:11pm]

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Reply #11 posted 11/28/14 2:14pm

breakdown2k14

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Well hasn't AOA sold more than plectrum?
There's Joy in repetition
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Reply #12 posted 11/28/14 2:21pm

feeluupp

Personally I think both of these albums are old, at least 2-3 years old he just couldn't find a proper deal to distribute them, hence the "recording rehab" statement he made on The Lopez tonight show early 2012.

Plectrum has been floating around since early 2012, same as AOA along songs we heard years ago like Breakfast Can Wait, The Breakdown, etc...

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Reply #13 posted 11/28/14 3:56pm

thisisreece

feeluupp said:

Personally I think both of these albums are old, at least 2-3 years old he just couldn't find a proper deal to distribute them, hence the "recording rehab" statement he made on The Lopez tonight show early 2012.

Plectrum has been floating around since early 2012, same as AOA along songs we heard years ago like Breakfast Can Wait, The Breakdown, etc...

Probably. I wonder if 3rdeyegirl recorded an album now, whether there would be a drastic change in quality.

Hundalasiliah!
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Reply #14 posted 11/28/14 4:32pm

MIRvmn

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feeluupp said:

Personally I think both of these albums are old, at least 2-3 years old he just couldn't find a proper deal to distribute them, hence the "recording rehab" statement he made on The Lopez tonight show early 2012.



Plectrum has been floating around since early 2012, same as AOA along songs we heard years ago like Breakfast Can Wait, The Breakdown, etc...


yes I also think both albums are a few years old. It would have been nice if he had released them together along with a 3rd disc with newer material (Revelation,X's-face) as a 3 disc set or replace a few of the songs on AOA we already heard in 2013 (BCW, The breakdown and What it feels like) with new ones. I actually skip The breakdown on AOA most of the time cuz I had it on repeat alot before the album was finally released. Plec should have been a live album cuz I don't think 3EG works well in the studio
[Edited 11/28/14 16:38pm]
Welcome 2 The Dawn
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Reply #15 posted 11/28/14 5:35pm

funksterr

snakesineverycolor said:

Not to answer a question with a question, but here's a question: what did he leave on the table with these albums? They were sufficiently promoted that the people most likely to buy both albums knew about them, so what was left was really convincing the uninitiated that there was something on these records for them. After the initial splash of a record, convincing potential buyers to jump on is down to one of two mechanisms - manufacture a hit, or get down to the retail business of getting the music in front of people (which, if it works, can lead to the former). That sort of hard sell is something I can't see Prince ever doing again - he makes too much money as a live performer, and has shown again and again that, while he is clearly interested in making money, he isn't actually greedy in the way that would make him willing to do the work necessary to make ALL the money he can on everything - hence the lack of licensing his songs, the lack of presence on YouTube, etc. He wants to be rich, but it is just as important to him that he is made rich doing it his way. So for AOA and PE, I expect he did what he wanted to do. He made the records he wanted to make, and got the word out. As long as he got his advance from WB, I expect he did just fine. Focus on 3EG and PE didn't/ won't kill AOA, because even if you take those elements out of the equation, AOA is not the sort of album that was going to easily draw in the non-Prince adherent, and he certainly wouldn't have spent a whole bunch of extra time changing that circumstance regardless of the other things on his plate, because the back-end payoff was never going to be worth working any harder at it. AOA is a boutique record by a boutique artist, and he was never going to go door to door to change its fate.

Exactly. That's why I don't like the record, even though I can appreciate that there are a lot of strong aspects to it. I think he needed to comeback with strong pop songs, not a grouchy meditation cd.

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Reply #16 posted 11/28/14 5:48pm

TwiliteKid

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feeluupp said:

Personally I think both of these albums are old, at least 2-3 years old he just couldn't find a proper deal to distribute them, hence the "recording rehab" statement he made on The Lopez tonight show early 2012.



Plectrum has been floating around since early 2012, same as AOA along songs we heard years ago like Breakfast Can Wait, The Breakdown, etc...



Nonsense. Prince didn't even meet Donna until late 2012. She had a version called the Elektra Suite, but he had nothing to do with it. BCW and The Breakdown were first heard in 2013, hardly ago. We also know that he didn't record with Lianne until earlier this year.

Some of this material may date from 2012, but the majority of the albums are more recent than that.
[Edited 11/28/14 17:51pm]
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Reply #17 posted 11/28/14 6:06pm

SoulAlive

I don't think it's a good idea to release two new,separate albums on the same day.It's hard enough for an artist to promote and sell one album in these times,much less two.PE should have been released last year...maybe as a 'special release' on Prince's official website or FB page.That would have freed Prince to focus only on AOA this year and give it his full attention.Releasing the two albums at the same time meant that both albums wouldn't reach their full potential (saleswise).This is the kinda stuff that Warners tried to warn Prince back in the day lol but of course,he never listens.

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Reply #18 posted 11/29/14 5:38am

warning2all

2014 has shown

The market has dried up and there isn't public demand for any new material, much less protégée releases.

He's a live nostalgia act now. Sales tell the tale.


Time for the remasters
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Reply #19 posted 11/29/14 5:41am

Pentacle

luvsexy4all said:

once again ...with his masters in tow...he can do ANYTHING he wants



But he won't do anything unless something makes him, i.e. Warner.

Stop the Prince Apologists ™
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Reply #20 posted 11/29/14 6:01am

feeluupp

warning2all said:

2014 has shown The market has dried up and there isn't public demand for any new material, much less protégée releases. He's a live nostalgia act now. Sales tell the tale. Time for the remasters

It's sad but true... It's not just sales, but the whole shift of the music industry and Prince is just miles and miles behind it now. Before he used to set the trends and innovate the music industry, now he is out of touch and out dated dare to say.

His last commercial hit was in 2004 with Musicology with total sales of 3m world wide. Since then... He's had a modest hit with 3121, Planet Earth, LotusFlow3r and 20Ten did nothing for his career.

All this time past, you still can't find anything on YouTube, streaming/ iTunes is now the predominant method of music...

Ten years later since Musicology, there is no way for the next generation to know who he is especially from his YouTube abscence... I'm scared to say but in a couple more years will Prince's albums even gain any commercial value especially since streaming counts as sales now...

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Reply #21 posted 11/29/14 7:35am

Aerogram

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It definitely overshadowed the masterful accomplishment that Art Official Age really is.

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Reply #22 posted 11/29/14 8:05am

vainandy

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Maybe he remembered his past statements about "real music by real musicians" and realized how ridiculous it looks for someone who has made those type of statements to release a sellout album like "Fart Official Age" that sounds like he's copying everyone else that he's been talking against. Hell, let that disgrace of an album die down and hopefully he'll get back on the right track with the next album. Maybe he can get little Bruno Mars to teach him how to throwdown again. evillol

.

.

.

[Edited 11/29/14 8:10am]

Andy is a four letter word.
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Reply #23 posted 11/29/14 10:42am

2020

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The org is so full of people who think they have all the answers

Did PE kill AOA not at all...if it were just AOA he released it would have had the same results

New sounds, setting trends WTF? No man or woman who is 50+ is going to be doing either of these things and to think otherwise is just ignorance

And finally copying everyone else...hardly. AOA is Prince being...Prince. His sound, his style and his vision. AOA is a huge success as a result. Anyone else who thinks it aint worthy doesnt have a clue about Prince and his music.

Always has been always will be...

The greatest live performer of our times was is and always will be Prince.

Remember there is only one destination and that place is U
All of it. Everything. Is U.
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Reply #24 posted 11/29/14 11:12am

Noodled24

Talk about a loaded question... I don't understand the negativity towards PlectrumElectrum. It's a great album. Prince is a mercurial little chap and for someone who rarely puts much effort into promoting his own albums - looking back it's easy to see he was never going to be able to carry both albums on his shoulders. In that sense it could be why he did little to no promotion for AOA. AOA has a contemporary sound but there isn't anything on there that has an instant commercial sound (unlike xcess space/the Rita Ora banger) AOA was never going to be a huge commercial success. The best songs on the album have a melancholy feel to them. AOA has performed about as well as can be expected on the charts. I'm not sure how it was "killed"
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Reply #25 posted 11/29/14 12:17pm

7teenz

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What everyone seems to be missing is that for him it's about having a list of firsts. Period. Regardless of commercial success his idea of success is being the first artist to do....That is why he doesn't care about chart positions and sales. He would rather be the first artist to sell more tickets for his Essence show-more then Beyonce. He is arrogant and wants to keep putting feathers in his cap. He was the first artist to have a number one movie, soundtrack, and single at the same time. That's what he get's off on. Sure if the music sold more that would be gravy, but it is not his goal. That is why he does these stunts such as perform three different show with three different bands in one night. You all will drive yourselves crazy trying to figure out why he sucks at promoting his work. It's not his job. His job is to be able to have a list of firsts rattled off when he receives some sort of lifetime achievement award. He doesn't care that the Cd's have fallen down or off the charts. He wants to brag that he had a number one rock and r&b album at the same time. 3121 was just as successful even if it was only number one for one week. He can still say that he has x amount of number one cds. He's not that difficult to figure out and neither are his actions. They are all calculated.

IF LOVE WAS A DRUG WOULD YOU OVERDOSE?
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Reply #26 posted 11/29/14 12:47pm

nosajd

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I think if the 3EG material was stronger then AOA would have been a bigger success as would PE. So I guess, in a sense, yes.

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Reply #27 posted 11/29/14 5:43pm

Se7en

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I kind of think that Prince couldn't release PE without AOA. He could not share that much attention with 3EG, especially after 4 years since the last album. Part of him was screaming "hey look at me too".

Nobody outside of die-hard fans cares about (or really follows) 3EG. Even if the album was amazing (which it isn't), it still comes across as a side project like solo NPG albums.

AOA, on the other hand, is a Prince album. It joins a storied discography and will sell more just because it's a Prince album.

To answer the question directly though: I don't think focus was really placed on either project after they were released.
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Reply #28 posted 11/30/14 1:55pm

avasdad

no...the music being weak killed both albums....sad but true...

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Reply #29 posted 11/30/14 2:21pm

Noodled24

Se7en said:

To answer the question directly though: I don't think focus was really placed on either project after they were released.

Thats true, although more songs from PlectrumElectrum have been played live, and more frequently than anything on AOA. That said AOA doesn't strike me as an album that would translate well live.

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