SoulAlive said:

Just for fun,I recently visited a Mariah fansite too.Her fans are PISSED right now They're having a breakdown over her new flop album.I gotta admit,it's kinda entertaining to see them behave this way.I can't believe how so many fans get bent out of shape when one of their favorite artists have a flop album,lol.

Identity said:

I visited a Mariah Carey fan site recently where her hardcore fans/lambs were ripping her to shreds over the lack of promotion behind her new flop album and her choice of a manager.

LOL I give up xDD

U CAN GO EAT IT PRINCE!! (JK I <3 U IF UR READING THIS)

I can say I can't wait to hear PE. Its gonna be good; but I'm not in a rush to hear it though.

Lets give our Purple One sometime.

If he released it now and DIDN'T take his time. Yall would be losing your tits over lack of quality.

My hunny poo just can't win.

Militant said:

Can I just say, to the people that are on the same page with me regarding this : databank, Stymie, Sara, Rodeo........

When you see a post attacking/flaming Prince or an associate of his, can you guys please report the post? I can't be everywhere at once, but when stuff gets reported, we mods get emailed straight away and it can be dealt with.

I will start issuing strikes to these people, and bans if the behaviour continues. Maybe it's not in the rules, maybe it hasn't been addressed properly in the past, but whatever it is, it's gotten seriously out of hand, and it seems that all the level headed members of the board agree with me that it's simply unacceptable.

Fair enough

For the records and before some people start accusing u of trying to make this website a "fam" site of worshipping idiots, I'll say that the way I understand it, constructive criticism no matter how harsh is allowed, insults are not

Being yourself a professional musician, therefore "famous" to a certain extent (at least more exposed than most people here), I'm sure u could add an interesting perspective to the debate about famous people not being human enough anymore to deserve the same amount of respect anyone else does

I myself explained many times how I've enjoyed a certain amount of local celebrity in my home city as a writer, musician, performer and cultural activist when I was younger, how I wasn't ready for it and how the negative backlash, rumors, gossip and insults coming from people I'd never spoke with in my entire life almost destroyed me back then and led me to sabotage my own career to a certain extent to escape all this. I wish I had been stronger but what's done is done

SoulAlive said:

I get what you're saying I didn't say that celebrities don't deserve "respect".They certainly do.

but,when a person becomes famous,they lose their privacy.People are gonna comment on them,good or bad.It might be unfair,but famous people can't have it both ways.They want fame,so they must deal with everything that comes with it.I say,as long as people are talking about you at all,you're doing something right.When they stop talking about you,that's when your fame is over

I gotcha. My only dilemma concerns the fact that becoming famous can happen to anybody. Additionally, even people who actively pursue fame aren't necessarily guaranteed to achieve it at any level (let alone Prince's). If they don't, they are - again, not through action or inaction or their part, but rather by sheer luck - immune from the same level of hyper-criticisms often leveled at celebrities of Prince magnitude.

In a nutshell, I don't think any individual should be immune to criticism or even rejection to some extent. However, I don't believe they should be expected to be uber-vilified simply because they've become famous - an act which, more often than not, happens by accident.

Thanks for taking the time, SoulAlive!

[Edited 7/14/14 22:51pm]

hopefularranger said:

SoulAlive said:

I get what you're saying I didn't say that celebrities don't deserve "respect".They certainly do.

but,when a person becomes famous,they lose their privacy.People are gonna comment on them,good or bad.It might be unfair,but famous people can't have it both ways.They want fame,so they must deal with everything that comes with it.I say,as long as people are talking about you at all,you're doing something right.When they stop talking about you,that's when your fame is over

I gotcha. My only dilemma concerns the fact that becoming famous can happen to anybody. Additionally, even people who actively pursue fame aren't necessarily guaranteed to achieve it at any level (let alone Prince's). If they don't, they are - again, not through action or inaction or their part, but rather by sheer luck - immune from the same level of hyper-criticisms often leveled at celebrities of Prince magnitude.

In a nutshell, I don't think any individual should be immune to criticism or even rejection to some extent. However, I don't believe they should be expected to be uber-vilified simply because they've become famous - an act which, more often than not, happens by accident.

Thanks for taking the time, SoulAlive!

[Edited 7/14/14 22:51pm]

Once again not everyone who became famous wanted it in the first place. How do u deal with the wish to be a successful solo artist (i.e. it's your job, u do it well and get good money for doing it) without becoming famous as a side effect? U don't. U can't. I don't know any banker, teacher or hairdresser who became famous just because they are really good at what they do, they just don't get famous period. But artists do period. Basically the only way to avoid being famous as a solo artist would be to sabotage your own career and lose a great deal of money doing so because u don't want to be famous as a side effect of being successful, making sure you don't sell too many records and concert tickets and just get enough money to make a living without getting too much fame. Who's gonna do that? How many hairdressers, teachers, chefs or plain businessmen do you know who told you "how u know I make sure to sabotage my own work to a certain extant and lose a great deal of money in the process, it sucks but I have to do this in order to avoid celebrity?"? U don't. They don't face this problem. Artists do. Don't go and blame them for it on top of it all

[Edited 7/14/14 23:13pm]

databank said:

Once again not everyone who became famous wanted it in the first place. How do u deal with the wish to be a successful solo artist (i.e. it's your job, u do it well and get good money for doing it) without becoming famous as a side effect? U don't. U can't. I don't know any banker, teacher or hairdresser who became famous just because they are really good at what they do, they just don't get famous period. But artists do period. Basically the only way to avoid being famous as a solo artist would be to sabotage your own career and lose a great deal of money doing so because u don't want to be famous as a side effect of being successful, making sure you don't sell too many records and concert tickets and just get enough money to make a living without getting too much fame. Who's gonna do that? How many hairdressers, teachers, chefs or plain businessmen do you know who told you "how u know I make sure to sabotage my own work to a certain extant and lose a great deal of money in the process, it sucks but I have to do this in order to avoid celebrity?"? U don't. They don't face this problem. Artists do. Don't go and blame them for it on top of it all

[Edited 7/14/14 23:13pm]

I realize you're not looking to debate this, but there are a number of points in your post I would characterize as factually incorrect. For example, the majority of artists (in whatever media) that currently exist in the world today are NOT famous. Most of them never will be. Fame is not a qualifier, and they do not cease to be artists because they don't become known. Those who are able to sustain a living based on their creative talent, I would argue, are actually professional entertainers. One need not make their "art" their profession in order to be considered an artist. A job is a job; a passion is a passion. They are not mutually exclusive. Additionally, there are many more working professional NON-FAMOUS artists-cum-entertainers than there are superstar ones.

Furthermore, I'm sure you've also realized that in today's world, bankers, teachers and hairdressers have as much chance at becoming famous as anyone else. One minute, a chef is toiling away in obscurity in a restaurant down south; the next, she's Paula Deen (who is now both famous and infamous). One minute, you're a duck hunter with neither teeth nor money with which to buy any; the next, you're the star of your own hit TV show on A&E. Fame is a matter of luck, not skill. They give platinum plaques to some characteristically untalented - yet extremely lucky - entertainers. One only needs a winning ticket to hit the lottery.

As far as "blaming the artist for their issues with fame", I did just the opposite; I objected to the notion that they should be castigated because they happen to become famous. I've laid out the foundation for my assertions, and perhaps without realizing it, you've actually agreed with me.

[Edited 7/14/14 23:44pm]

My opinion on the subject is..we're real Prince fans. Strange reply? Allow me 2 xplain. Prince's music is about FREEDOM, and Being Your Own Person. That's exactly what we're doing, when we critize some of the moves Prince tends to make. Let's face it...Prince has made some pretty bad/stupid moves, that angered and alienated a lot of his remaining fans. I don't feel the need to mention them because others here has already done so brilliantly.

Just because some of us choose to express some anger or displeasure, doesn't mean they're just "trolling" or "hating" on Prince! It just means they're being honest. Sometimes expressing some "hard truths", for those we love, is helpful and needed. We want Prince to succeed (again). We want him to return to his reign of dominace he had during the 80's. Wishful thinking? Perhaps, but he definitely has the talent to achieve it....unfortunately his ego and lack of structure, tends to be his worse enemy.

We're NOT like Justin Bieber fans, who lierally worship every-single-thing he does! His "Belibers defend even all of his blantant screw ups, including when he called a young female fan a "beached whale", and she end up commiting suicide. They blew up twitter smearing a deceased young girl. That sickened me greatly! The day this site become mindless drones like "Belibers", will be the day I leave this site for good! So don't take it personal, when you read of other expressing their disappointments about Prince.

My 2 cents on the subject.

[Edited 7/15/14 0:20am]

hopefularranger said:

databank said:

[Edited 7/14/14 23:13pm]

I realize you're not looking to debate this, but there are a number of points in your post I would characterize as factually incorrect. For example, the majority of artists (in whatever media) that currently exist in the world today are NOT famous. Most of them never will be. Fame is not a qualifier, and they do not cease to be artists because they don't become known. Those who are able to sustain a living based on their creative talent, I would argue, are actually professional entertainers. One need not make their "art" their profession in order to be considered an artist. A job is a job; a passion is a passion. They are not mutually exclusive. Additionally, there are many more working professional NON-FAMOUS artists-cum-entertainers than there are superstar ones.

Furthermore, I'm sure you've also realized that in today's world, bankers, teachers and hairdressers have as much chance at becoming famous as anyone else. One minute, a chef is toiling away in obscurity in a restaurant down south; the next, she's Paula Deen (who is now both famous and infamous). One minute, you're a duck hunter with neither teeth nor money with which to buy any; the next, you're the star of your own hit TV show on A&E. Fame is a matter of luck, not skill. They give platinum plaques to some characteristically untalented - yet extremely lucky - entertainers. One only needs a winning ticket to hit the lottery.

As far as "blaming the artist for their issues with fame", I did just the opposite; I objected to the notion that they should be castigated because they happen to become famous. I've laid out the foundation for my assertions, and perhaps without realizing it, you've actually agreed with me.

[Edited 7/14/14 23:44pm]

The majority of artists who pursue a solo career (i.e. not session musicians for example) are not famous of course, but the majority of those who are extremely successful (i.e. really rich) are. + there are degrees in celebrity: most "smaller" solo acts are famous only in their city or state or area, they're not world or even national celebrities but local medias speak of them and local people know them and bitch just the same (believe me, I've been there).

You made a good point with real TV making everyone and their cousin famous, it's kind of new but it's real indeed. Still whoever is famous no matter the reason deserves the same respect as the unknown. + it doesn't tend to be so systematic for non-artists, though, I mean a hairdresser or a chef can end-up having their fashion or cooking show on national TV but being a hairdresser or a chef doesn't imply enjoying exposure (even on a small scale) per se, while being a solo act does.

Anyway I think real TV is one of the most terrible things to have happened in recent history. The damages it causes intellectually speaking are collossal, but this is yet another debate ^^

Anyway as you pointed out this is not really this thread's point

ThomasBjj said:

I also don't think that I post much negativity about Prince. That said... Prince does a lot to provoke negative reaction. Off the top of my head....

Nemerous announced and promoted projects... then cancelled/abandoned.

Crystal Ball cd set pre-order... nuff said

Ripped off by 1-800-New-funk mail order

NPGMC purchases expired DRM

NPGMC club promised cds... botched

LotusFlow3r web site subscription ripoff

Lawsuits against fan sites & Uptown magazine

Lawsuits against fans

Plectrum Electrum... coming soon... for two years

other fan disappointments too numerous to list

I'm a big fan, but he totally deserves most of the criticism he gets.

Muting covers of his songs done by other people on youtube! Even causing their channel to be ban!

[Edited 7/15/14 23:24pm]

RodeoSchro said:

There's one guy - BartVanHemelen - that has some personal issue with Prince

.

Oh look, making shit up again. What a surprise.

Militant said:

djThunderfunk said:

Not sure what you mean by that.

Would you like no "negative" opinions to be allowed?

Or, would you shut people down who are engaged in "spirited" debate?

I don't know. Your statement worries me. If this site becomes as sterile as the NPGMC forums it will be usefull only to syncophants who think every sound outta Prince is a "masterpiece".

What "changes" do you have in mind?

There's a lot of stuff that actually isn't either debate or valid criticism, but unwarranted personal flame attacks towards Prince and his bandmembers. I personally find that unacceptable. Frankly, we've lost dozens of great posters because of it. I'm not down with that. I've spoken to several people who would come back if that atmosphere changed.

I'm also not down with nonsensical threads seeking to decry music/albums we haven't even heard. I'll be locking those sorts of threads. People attacking Plectrum just because Prince hasn't released it yet, like he owes it to us. People shitting on the Purple Rain remaster because we haven't had an update on it. It's total nonsense.

i agree, and it really is too bad.

BartVanHemelen said:

RodeoSchro said:

There's one guy - BartVanHemelen - that has some personal issue with Prince

.

Oh look, making shit up again. What a surprise.

Are you saying there are people BESIDES you that have a personal issue with Prince?

I already mentioned that Manuela posts here.

RodeoSchro said:

Anotherlova4Nessa said:

RodeoSchro said:

Are you saying there are people BESIDES you that have a personal issue with Prince?

I already mentioned that Manuela posts here.

b ^^^ OMG!!!! HAHAHA STOP!!! I dont have a problem with him @ all. And I hope no one else does. Which i know is FALSE hope. U had me on the Manuela part. I immediatly thought of Mayte and her having lunch. XD

Yeah, but you're new here. It won't take you long to get up to speed - about a month of Bart's posting "He hasn't done anything that isn't crap since 1989!!!!!!! NOTICE ME, PRINCE!!!!!!!!!" ought to do it.

SoulAlive said:

hopefularranger said:

This is an interesting topic. It presents a question that I believe, as time as progressed, has become very tricky to answer.

Prince is an artist (that is, a creative person whose primary motive is self-expression). As it happens, he has chosen to make his passion the medium for his profession, which is "entertainer". Notice I didn't say that his profession is "artist". An artist does not have to make his/her art their profession. They can get any job they want to maintain their lifestyle; the fact that they drive a bus for a living doesn't make their art less credible. If Prince's "art" didn't entertain anyone, he'd have to seek out an alternate means of employment. On the other hand, I personally know plenty of professional entertainers who are not famous at all. Would you say there is a different set of rules for them because - through no action or inaction on their part - they did not become famous?

As a side effect of his job (again, professional entertainer), Prince has become famous - something which, for all we know, he may not have exactly intended. I'm not suggesting that he did not wish to become known, but it's difficult to imagine anyone (but especially a personality like Prince) longing for the day in which he could not walk down the street without being mobbed, wear a particular pair of pants without being ridiculed, or release a new album without being encouraged to give up. As an excuse to perpetuate this very behavior, the public (including us "fans") have rationalized that he's famous so that's the way it goes. All bets are off because he drew the short straw and lost his right to respect and/or privacy.

Fame, in/of itself, is interesting. After all, anyone can become famous (particularly these days when it's as easy to end up on the homepage of Wonderwall.com as it is to accidently step in a pile of dog shit on the curb). For some, fame is their sole motivation for action, and their pursuit of it causes them to do things Prince has never done or (at the risk of projecting personal thought) presumably would even dream of doing. All this leads me to think that our collective rationale for dimissing any notions of empathy for someone in his position may be more than a bit flawed.

Sorry for my longwindedness. The concept of respect/privacy for the notorious is fascinating to me is all.

I get what you're saying I didn't say that celebrities don't deserve "respect".They certainly do.

but,when a person becomes famous,they lose their privacy.People are gonna comment on them,good or bad.It might be unfair,but famous people can't have it both ways.They want fame,so they must deal with everything that comes with it.I say,as long as people are talking about you at all,you're doing something right.When they stop talking about you,that's when your fame is over

.

You want fame? Well, fame costs. And right here is where you start paying. In sweat!

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

RodeoSchro said:

Anotherlova4Nessa said:

RodeoSchro said: b ^^^ OMG!!!! HAHAHA STOP!!! I dont have a problem with him @ all. And I hope no one else does. Which i know is FALSE hope. U had me on the Manuela part. I immediatly thought of Mayte and her having lunch. XD

Yeah, but you're new here. It won't take you long to get up to speed - about a month of Bart's posting "He hasn't done anything that isn't crap since 1989!!!!!!! NOTICE ME, PRINCE!!!!!!!!!" ought to do it.

Haha ^^^

Your nice. Finally somebody nice!

Lol. whoever this Bart person they are sure throwing shade on him.

Of course I would LOOOOOVEEEE is Prince talked to me.

My brother talked to Prince before. And he says hes nice and really sweet.

So all this ''prince controlling'' stuff must be a thing of the past.

I didn't hear a thing bad about Prince from my brother. I'm going to be seeing him in concert in Sept.

I wonder If I meet him will he smell like Lavender.

I always pictured him to smell like Elizabeth Taylors White Diamond or Mary J Blidges Perfume.

LMAO.

jasminejoey said:

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

Anotherlova4Nessa said:

RodeoSchro said:

Yeah, but you're new here. It won't take you long to get up to speed - about a month of Bart's posting "He hasn't done anything that isn't crap since 1989!!!!!!! NOTICE ME, PRINCE!!!!!!!!!" ought to do it.

Haha ^^^

Your nice. Finally somebody nice!

Lol. whoever this Bart person they are sure throwing shade on him.

Of course I would LOOOOOVEEEE is Prince talked to me.

My brother talked to Prince before. And he says hes nice and really sweet.

So all this ''prince controlling'' stuff must be a thing of the past.

I didn't hear a thing bad about Prince from my brother. I'm going to be seeing him in concert in Sept.

I wonder If I meet him will he smell like Lavender.

I always pictured him to smell like Elizabeth Taylors White Diamond or Mary J Blidges Perfume.

LMAO.

Where will you be seeing Prince in September?

RodeoSchro said:

jasminejoey said:

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

No, I'm not talking about mistakes. He's human and frankly I'm pretty tolerant. But most people don't like to be manipulated, and Prince habitually manipulates his fans. Hey, I love the man and his music but it gets irksome.

jasminejoey said:

RodeoSchro said:

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

No, I'm not talking about mistakes. He's human and frankly I'm pretty tolerant. But most people don't like to be manipulated, and Prince habitually manipulates his fans. Hey, I love the man and his music but it gets irksome.

I get where you're coming from. I strongly urge you to follow The RodeoSchro Prince Creed, which is:

Enjoy what you have. Find stuff you don't have. Anticipate nothing. Be pleasantly surprised when new music is available.

If you adopt my credo, you will never be disappointed, frustrated or anything except entertained by Prince's music.

RodeoSchro said:

jasminejoey said:

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

U know personally?

databank said:

RodeoSchro said:

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

U know personally?

Not personally. I got to sing with him once, and he was cool. But my (then) 8-year-old daughter got to sing with him twice on the "Musicology" tour. Prince and everyone associated with him (band, security, etc.) could not have been nicer to my daughter. They showered her with gifts, including John Blackwell personally taking a cymbol off his kit, getting everyone in the NPG to sign it (not Prince, though), and giving it to my daughter.

Candy Dulfer and Maceo Parker were also awesome. But Prince was just so nice. My daughter sang "Life O' the Party" with him in San Antonio in June 2004. Two months later in Houston, Candy saw my daughter in the crowd and had security put her onstage.

Prince remembered her and let her sing "Life O' the Party" again. Then they danced around for awhile before Prince sat her down at one end of the stage, where they dueted on the same microphone to the bridge in "Take Me With U".

He'll always be aces, straights and flushes in my book.

jasminejoey said:

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

Indeed. He has an antagonistic relationship with his core fan base for well over a decade. He has inexplicably destroyed informative websites like Housequake and attacked fanzines like Uptown with ruthless zeal.

Prince isn't a fan-friendly artist, let's be honest.

Identity said:

jasminejoey said:

He does treat his fans badly. That's undeniable.

Indeed. He has an antagonistic relationship with his core fan base for well over a decade. He has inexplicably destroyed informative websites like Housequake and attacked fanzines like Uptown with ruthless zeal.

Prince isn't a fan-friendly artist, let's be honest.

I agree.

When I met Prince, he was nothing but gracious.

But the fact is, he's human.

I think, for all of us, there are people that would say we are not nice people based upon their experiences with us. That's part of being human.

I don't think it's "undeniable" to say he treats his fans badly as if that's a fact. It's really not. It's a subjective opinion and not everyone agrees with it.

Militant said:

When I met Prince, he was nothing but gracious.

But the fact is, he's human.

I think, for all of us, there are people that would say we are not nice people based upon their experiences with us. That's part of being human.

I don't think it's "undeniable" to say he treats his fans badly as if that's a fact. It's really not. It's a subjective opinion and not everyone agrees with it.

This is what I've been talking about!!

seriously!

Where are the practical answers like these?!

Yes, I do enjoy reading peoples opinons; but at the end of the day ALOT of people here know good and well that If Prince showed up to there door they would be weeping with the best of em.

Yall don't fool me. xD

I hadn't MET Prince; but my brother has spoke with him.

He says that he is very withdrawn, yet he is really sweet.

He asks alot of questions. (Personal sometimes)

He is SERIOUS about music And thats it.

He is nice.

jasminejoey said:

RodeoSchro said:

He's always treated me and my family great. But everyone is human and everyone makes mistakes so if he made one with you, sorry for your bad experience.

Prince habitually manipulates his fans.

Does he? I guess this could possibly be a perception issue because I've been a fan for over 20 years and I don't feel manipulated and never have. Ive been disappointed with purchases and service from his people but never felt manipulated.

But then again I also don't approach anyone, musician or not, feeling that they owe me anything. Business is business and music is Prince's business. Its my decision whether I decide to give something my attention or give someone my money.

I've had encounters with Prince on 3 separate occasions and each time, he was nice. He even gave me pizza once.

Wow what If Prince gave ME pizza?

I wonder what his snack prefernces are.

I notice he likes ALOT of Pepper/ seasonings

I HATE Pepper. -.-

I like salt way more. (Especially lately)

I can't eat alot of sugar anymore. It makes me feel ''slow''.

xD