databank said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

databank said:

Nonsense. You have no idea of the shit we have to go thru. You have no idea how critical we are between ourselves when we show our respective works to each other. You have no idea how many years it takes for one of us to be able to hear criticism from just the first jerk passing by and NOT think "Jeez, he's right, my work sucks, no one will ever like it". Why do you think so many of us are alcoholics or drug addicts in the first place? Listen to Elizabeth Gilbert's conference on the creative process on YT and see how doubt and fear of failure, whether artistic, critical and economical eats most of us alive. It's not just me sayting it.

As she says more or less: "When I was younger people kept asking me 'aren't you afraid that you're gonna fail as being a writer, that no one's gonna give shit about your books'. My father was an electric engineers and no one ever asked him 'aren't you afraid of being an electric engineer? Aren't you afraid that you're gonna fail at being an electric engineer?' Why so much pressure on us and by both others and ourselves?".

That's the whole point: you non-artists see only the glitters and glory of the very few who make it and you're just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom but you keep forgetting not only about the sacrifices and the thousands who don't make it, but also about how fragile most of us are. Many high profile artists, despite their fame and money, are still full of doubts and very vulnerable to criticism. Look at how George Lucas, creator of the most sucessful and acclaimed franchise of all times for chrissakes, was nonetheless hurt by fans' criticisms to the point that he decided to retire.

So yeah sure anyone can say "I don't like that album" and either have the honesty to say "that's just me" or make a constructive criticism with solid arguments.

What makes me sick is:

1/ those people who basically don't know shit about music who come and say "this sucks" just because they don't like it, and because they can't stand the whole world not feeling the same, go on creating threads with titles such as "let's face it..." to try and convince people that their opinion is supreme and that whoever think otherwise is delusional.

2/ those people who just condemn an artist and his work as a whole. Saying you didn't like the last album is one thing, going on saying that basically an artist is washed-up, uninspired, haven't released a single decent song in 20 years... This is so mean, so judgmental.

I think Prince isn't too vulnerable to that anymore but when i think of the horrors I've read here about Andy Allo for example, a young woman, at the beginning of a career that may still be either a success or a failure. It wasn't "I didn't like the album but good luck to her, she's talented nonetheless", it was "that talentless bitch would be better making porn movies than boring us to death with her soulless songs, her stupid lyrics and her atrocious voice". I can't imagine how she must have felt reading this.

Shame on you people. SHAME ON YOU!

Total validation of my point. You're totally self-consumed by your own deluded sense of importance. Musicians are a load of pretentious arseholes whose egos have been wanked so much they have the audacity to play to an audience and then bruise like falling apples when everybody doesn't salivate over them. I know. I've drummed for enough of them over the years.

Lucky me I'm not a musician (anymore). Does this work for writers, too?

databank said:

funkomatic said:

Next to the "Don't you ever dare to say anything negative about my untouchable idol, he's still the best and ever will be!" sticky...

These are less frequent but the "Prince is the greatest musician of all times" or "Prince is the most prolific musician of all times" irritate me just as much, for they show the lack of musical culture of their OP's

SuperSoulFighter said:

Thanx for your posts, databank. Yeah, I know what an artist is going through. I'm one of those thousands who didn't make it! Not yet anyway. And you'll never catch me saying "Prince sucks and if you disagree, you're stupid!" I'm getting tired of that too which is why I decided to go in semi-org-retirement. But I have to hand it to you, you created on of the few threads on GD that actually is interesting! [Edited 11/3/13 4:49am] [Edited 11/3/13 5:02am]

Stay with us, though, there are still plenty of interesting threads about P's music here

robertgeorgeakabob said:

databank said:

Lucky me I'm not a musician (anymore). Does this work for writers, too?

They're worse!! Lol In all seriousness, there is a difference between objectivity and subjectivity. To rate Prince as a supremely creative musician/writer is objective...he is, it's provable. However, judging the end product is subjective. If somebody says they hate something then you can't really argue with that conclusion. You can question how they reached it but ultimately you can't deny it. It's that artist/audience symbiotic relationship that defines it as art and not a meer consumer commodity.

I don't deny people's tastes but they often deny them themselves when they start the threads by "let's face it...", + if you listen to some of them Prince isn't a supremely creative musician, he's just a guy who had talent for 10 years because of Jesse Johnson, Wendy & Lisa

Denying that what was created after 1988 has a lot of qualities is plain denial. Or to put it in a different way even if Prince's artistic peak was between 1980 and 1988 it doesn't mean that what followed has zero value as stated by some. The music that came during the last 25 years has been full of interesting moments even if it didn't always show the rage of the early years or if it wasn't as groundbreaking in the context of its musical environment.

The funny thing, I come to realize it more and more because I listen to more and more music by more and more artists is that the pattern is more or less the same for every artist anyway: they produce some groundbreaking, crazy stuff at first, and experiment with many styles as well, then they get more comfortable and kind of keep doing more or less the same thing for the rest of their careers. Nonetheless I find qualities associated with maturities in their later works that most people deny. There are many interesting things in Prince's music after 1988 that were NOT there earlier. The same can be said about almost anyone: George Clinton, Bowie, Sakamoto... I find many qualities in their later works that weren't in their "classic" albums, even though these were somewhat wilder and more innovative. But (sorry for being pretencious again) that's also my privilege as a creator: I get more interested in the creative process than in the result, and I learned to try and define the interesting aspects of a piece of art beyond my personnal tastes. There are even works of art that I don't "like" but that I nonetheless find really interesting and of value. Most people just "consume" art and don't go past their immediate feelings regarding a specific piece of art. That's a pity. People spit on Emancipation or NEWS but when you look at these records from an artistic perspective they're extremely rich, complex, they tell stories and their creation required an infinite quantity of skills and inspiration from the part of Prince and the other musicians involved. Not everyone can record albums like these. But people will just listen to them once or twice, not pay attention to details and say that since they don't like them it has to mean they're crap. They can't even tell the difference in quality between a Ke$ha song and East. How sad if you ask me

databank said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

databank said:

I don't deny people's tastes but they often deny them themselves when they start the threads by "let's face it...", + if you listen to some of them Prince isn't a supremely creative musician, he's just a guy who had talent for 10 years because of Jesse Johnson, Wendy & Lisa

Denying that what was created after 1988 has a lot of qualities is plain denial. Or to put it in a different way even if Prince's artistic peak was between 1980 and 1988 it doesn't mean that what followed has zero value as stated by some. The music that came during the last 25 years has been full of interesting moments even if it didn't always show the rage of the early years or if it wasn't as groundbreaking in the context of its musical environment.

The funny thing, I come to realize it more and more because I listen to more and more music by more and more artists is that the pattern is more or less the same for every artist anyway: they produce some groundbreaking, crazy stuff at first, and experiment with many styles as well, then they get more comfortable and kind of keep doing more or less the same thing for the rest of their careers. Nonetheless I find qualities associated with maturities in their later works that most people deny. There are many interesting things in Prince's music after 1988 that were NOT there earlier. The same can be said about almost anyone: George Clinton, Bowie, Sakamoto... I find many qualities in their later works that weren't in their "classic" albums, even though these were somewhat wilder and more innovative. But (sorry for being pretencious again) that's also my privilege as a creator: I get more interested in the creative process than in the result, and I learned to try and define the interesting aspects of a piece of art beyond my personnal tastes. There are even works of art that I don't "like" but that I nonetheless find really interesting and of value. Most people just "consume" art and don't go past their immediate feelings regarding a specific piece of art. That's a pity. People spit on Emancipation or NEWS but when you look at these records from an artistic perspective they're extremely rich, complex, they tell stories and their creation required an infinite quantity of skills and inspiration from the part of Prince and the other musicians involved. Not everyone can record albums like these. But people will just listen to them once or twice, not pay attention to details and say that since they don't like them it has to mean they're crap. They can't even tell the difference in quality between a Ke$ha song and East. How sad if you ask me

A good read. I hold his 80-88 work in the highest esteem, obviously, but you'll never read me writing off all his following work. It's schizophrenic, all over the place, yet interesting, the symbol album is a fine piece of car crash music, Come is a fine album, Gold Experience has some stellar Prince manic moments. I never did get all the flak for Emancipation, Rainbow Children is divisive (which is a good thing). The threads that infuriate me the most recently have been the Robin Thicke etc. comparisons. I totally concur about the true innovators having a golden period that can never be replicated. However, with some honest self appraisal I think Prince could still experience a renaissance, not in popularity, but in terms of critical reaction. Bowie's recent albums bear testimony to that. I see Prince progressively treading the path of 'entertainment' and I just wish he'd delve a bit more profoundly into music. He's welcome round my bit for a smoke and I'll help him rediscover the spirit of Miles Davis, some kind of green, then Some Kind Of Blue. I guarantee you his next album would be deeper.

You are a reasonable fellow. Not everyone here is

The Robin Thicke comparison was gross, I remember that thread and I fought on your side there

Thing is that in the musical press I think critics have been good again since 2001, haven't they? And the general public also holds Prince in esteem as well, and will probably enjoy the 2000's or even 90's album more than the 80's albums because in a way they're more accessible and sound more contemporary. Most of my friends will receive any post WB Prince album in a very friendly way. It seems to me the only group of people who's complaining about P's recent body of work is the fanbase

I'd love P to go and have a joint with you over a couple of Miles (no pun intended ) records but look at what happened when he released these few weird 3rdEyeGirl jazz rock instrumentals: the fans flamed. Prince's audience, for the most part, is only used to mainstream pop, rock and funk. These people don't like when he experiments because it's too sphisticated for their understanding of music (some people here went as far as to say that Prince instrumental albums shouldn't count as albums because in the absolute only vocal albums are "real albums", i.e. only vocal music is "real music" ). Then there's a small group of jazz afficionados and usually if Prince experiment they will complain because it's... not sophisticated enough ("Prince can't play real jazz", "It sucks compared to Bitches Brew", etc.). This beats me really

I'm somewhere in the middle: I dig jazz, I dig pop, rock and funk, I dig expermental shits such as improvised music, ambient, contemporary, electronica and stuff. When Prince goes out of his usual vocabulary I find it very enjoyable because I have such an intimate understanding of his musical vocabulary that it's pure pelasure hearing him exploring other things when he does (and he doesn't do it often). I'm like: "Wow, he went there! He never goes there usually! Cool !". The first time I heard the first few minutes of East I was in schock: this sounded like a lot of stuff I was listening to but SO not like Prince. I loved the stuff immediately, not only because it was really solid stuff (and it is) but also because it was really unexpected.

(Being on Prince.org) hasn't changed my opinion of Prince, cuz 95% of my opinions about Prince concerned his music, not him...but it has had an effect on how much I enjoy being a fan...I think I enjoyed being a fan far more before joining P.org than I have afterwards...

Before, I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that was pretty much my Prince world before, listening to his latest and wondering what his next will be...I didn't expose myself to a continuous flow of gossip and rumors and innuendo or fake reports about upcoming albums and fake tracklists...I didn't bother to scrutinize the man's every move, and nobody else I knew did, either...I wasn't hearing over and over as to why I should be thinking of Prince as a selfish, egotistical, fanatically religious prick...I didn't think of myself as being part of a "cult"...and I damn sure was never accused of being an asskisser.

I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that's it...and in retrospect, that was enough...

I came to P.org because I wanted to learn about new CDs and concerts and get some inside scoop on upcoming releases...I stayed(and continue to) because I've enjoyed a lot of the discussions I've been in, as well as some good friends I've made while being here...that, along with the occasional news about upcoming CDs and concerts...I still want those...

But being on P.org as much as I have been has diluted the excitement from being a Prince fan...

my take on it is more along the lines that when it comes to being a fan of anyone or anything, it really isn't necessary to be "exposed" to opposite views, and definitely is not necessary to have them forced upon you...it's all a matter of taste...and I hardly doubt I'll be better of if while eating my favorite meal at a restaurant, I'm constantly being told by others at my table how nasty tasting my food really is, and that I need to "wake up" and realize it lol...

I guess, in my opinion, that everyone here has been a "fam"-type at some point in their life when it comes to Prince...we've all had some point during Prince's career where we felt he was the baddest mf around, who's albums and singles and tours were better than all of his peers...in the "real" world, if someone notices a Prince CD on my desk here at work or hears Prince playing from my car stereo, and then excitedly says "I love Prince!!", it never occurs to me that they would be better off with their enthusiasm diluted by me insisting that the song they're excited about is "embarassing" and "the worst thing he's ever done"...I simply smile and laugh a little, and then think to myself "Yeah, I know what it's like to be so excited about Prince...I've been there myself".

And just so you know...I wrote all of the above (minus one or two tweaks) 11 years ago, in 2002 lol...The more things change, as they say.

^

Beautiful statement

Byron said:

(Being on Prince.org) hasn't changed my opinion of Prince, cuz 95% of my opinions about Prince concerned his music, not him...but it has had an effect on how much I enjoy being a fan...I think I enjoyed being a fan far more before joining P.org than I have afterwards...

Before, I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that was pretty much my Prince world before, listening to his latest and wondering what his next will be...I didn't expose myself to a continuous flow of gossip and rumors and innuendo or fake reports about upcoming albums and fake tracklists...I didn't bother to scrutinize the man's every move, and nobody else I knew did, either...I wasn't hearing over and over as to why I should be thinking of Prince as a selfish, egotistical, fanatically religious prick...I didn't think of myself as being part of a "cult"...and I damn sure was never accused of being an asskisser.

I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that's it...and in retrospect, that was enough...

I came to P.org because I wanted to learn about new CDs and concerts and get some inside scoop on upcoming releases...I stayed(and continue to) because I've enjoyed a lot of the discussions I've been in, as well as some good friends I've made while being here...that, along with the occasional news about upcoming CDs and concerts...I still want those...

But being on P.org as much as I have been has diluted the excitement from being a Prince fan...

my take on it is more along the lines that when it comes to being a fan of anyone or anything, it really isn't necessary to be "exposed" to opposite views, and definitely is not necessary to have them forced upon you...it's all a matter of taste...and I hardly doubt I'll be better of if while eating my favorite meal at a restaurant, I'm constantly being told by others at my table how nasty tasting my food really is, and that I need to "wake up" and realize it lol...

I guess, in my opinion, that everyone here has been a "fam"-type at some point in their life when it comes to Prince...we've all had some point during Prince's career where we felt he was the baddest mf around, who's albums and singles and tours were better than all of his peers...in the "real" world, if someone notices a Prince CD on my desk here at work or hears Prince playing from my car stereo, and then excitedly says "I love Prince!!", it never occurs to me that they would be better off with their enthusiasm diluted by me insisting that the song they're excited about is "embarassing" and "the worst thing he's ever done"...I simply smile and laugh a little, and then think to myself "Yeah, I know what it's like to be so excited about Prince...I've been there myself".

And just so you know...I wrote all of the above (minus one or two tweaks) 11 years ago, in 2002 lol...The more things change, as they say.

Bullshit! Different opinions make you "actually" think about your choices. One of the most important things in life, I'd say.

Byron said:

(Being on Prince.org) hasn't changed my opinion of Prince, cuz 95% of my opinions about Prince concerned his music, not him...but it has had an effect on how much I enjoy being a fan...I think I enjoyed being a fan far more before joining P.org than I have afterwards...

Before, I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that was pretty much my Prince world before, listening to his latest and wondering what his next will be...I didn't expose myself to a continuous flow of gossip and rumors and innuendo or fake reports about upcoming albums and fake tracklists...I didn't bother to scrutinize the man's every move, and nobody else I knew did, either...I wasn't hearing over and over as to why I should be thinking of Prince as a selfish, egotistical, fanatically religious prick...I didn't think of myself as being part of a "cult"...and I damn sure was never accused of being an asskisser.

I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that's it...and in retrospect, that was enough...

I came to P.org because I wanted to learn about new CDs and concerts and get some inside scoop on upcoming releases...I stayed(and continue to) because I've enjoyed a lot of the discussions I've been in, as well as some good friends I've made while being here...that, along with the occasional news about upcoming CDs and concerts...I still want those...

But being on P.org as much as I have been has diluted the excitement from being a Prince fan...

my take on it is more along the lines that when it comes to being a fan of anyone or anything, it really isn't necessary to be "exposed" to opposite views, and definitely is not necessary to have them forced upon you...it's all a matter of taste...and I hardly doubt I'll be better of if while eating my favorite meal at a restaurant, I'm constantly being told by others at my table how nasty tasting my food really is, and that I need to "wake up" and realize it lol...

I guess, in my opinion, that everyone here has been a "fam"-type at some point in their life when it comes to Prince...we've all had some point during Prince's career where we felt he was the baddest mf around, who's albums and singles and tours were better than all of his peers...in the "real" world, if someone notices a Prince CD on my desk here at work or hears Prince playing from my car stereo, and then excitedly says "I love Prince!!", it never occurs to me that they would be better off with their enthusiasm diluted by me insisting that the song they're excited about is "embarassing" and "the worst thing he's ever done"...I simply smile and laugh a little, and then think to myself "Yeah, I know what it's like to be so excited about Prince...I've been there myself".

And just so you know...I wrote all of the above (minus one or two tweaks) 11 years ago, in 2002 lol...The more things change, as they say.

Perfect post.

brookinz said:

Javi said:

Frankly, I can't understand the angry and disrespectful answers these kind of threads get. It's just fans expressing his view on the evolution of Prince's music, that's all. Why the anger? No need to answer, anyway...

The problem many of us have over this is how non-productive, un-informative, and horribly repetitive the complaining is. Think of it this way....if I was to ask the forum when/where Prince recorded the live portions of the Purple Rain soundtrack, I would promptly receive a link to a previous thread on the Org discussing this along with a derisive comment about why am I repeating something already discussed. That's how I and many others feel about the incessant "Prince is over with" discussions that are brought up.

That's fair enough. But what I don't get is: if these threads really annoy you, why don't ignore them and that's it? Don't read them and go directly to the threads that you're interested in. I find it very simple. Maybe it's just that I've never made derisive comments here: I read the threads that interest me and ignore the others. No need to say someone is ridiculous, stupid or whatever.

Javi said:

funkomatic said:

Byron said:

(Being on Prince.org) hasn't changed my opinion of Prince, cuz 95% of my opinions about Prince concerned his music, not him...but it has had an effect on how much I enjoy being a fan...I think I enjoyed being a fan far more before joining P.org than I have afterwards...

Before, I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that was pretty much my Prince world before, listening to his latest and wondering what his next will be...I didn't expose myself to a continuous flow of gossip and rumors and innuendo or fake reports about upcoming albums and fake tracklists...I didn't bother to scrutinize the man's every move, and nobody else I knew did, either...I wasn't hearing over and over as to why I should be thinking of Prince as a selfish, egotistical, fanatically religious prick...I didn't think of myself as being part of a "cult"...and I damn sure was never accused of being an asskisser.

I just bought the CDs and by chance caught an occasional article or interview in a magazine or newspaper...that's it...and in retrospect, that was enough...

I came to P.org because I wanted to learn about new CDs and concerts and get some inside scoop on upcoming releases...I stayed(and continue to) because I've enjoyed a lot of the discussions I've been in, as well as some good friends I've made while being here...that, along with the occasional news about upcoming CDs and concerts...I still want those...

But being on P.org as much as I have been has diluted the excitement from being a Prince fan...

my take on it is more along the lines that when it comes to being a fan of anyone or anything, it really isn't necessary to be "exposed" to opposite views, and definitely is not necessary to have them forced upon you...it's all a matter of taste...and I hardly doubt I'll be better of if while eating my favorite meal at a restaurant, I'm constantly being told by others at my table how nasty tasting my food really is, and that I need to "wake up" and realize it lol...

I guess, in my opinion, that everyone here has been a "fam"-type at some point in their life when it comes to Prince...we've all had some point during Prince's career where we felt he was the baddest mf around, who's albums and singles and tours were better than all of his peers...in the "real" world, if someone notices a Prince CD on my desk here at work or hears Prince playing from my car stereo, and then excitedly says "I love Prince!!", it never occurs to me that they would be better off with their enthusiasm diluted by me insisting that the song they're excited about is "embarassing" and "the worst thing he's ever done"...I simply smile and laugh a little, and then think to myself "Yeah, I know what it's like to be so excited about Prince...I've been there myself".

And just so you know...I wrote all of the above (minus one or two tweaks) 11 years ago, in 2002 lol...The more things change, as they say.

Bullshit! Different opinions make you "actually" think about your choices. One of the most important things in life, I'd say.

No amount of different opinions is gonna make me like asparagus more (or less). Trust me, your opinion isn't that valuable to others.

Mmmmmmmm - I love asparagus!!!!!!!!

databank said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

databank said: Could you sound any more pompous? Oh, I'm an artist, just like Prince, you non-artist types don't have the right to comment.. Purlease! Everybody knows that 'artists' are self consumed ego strokers that are incapable of self criticism.

That's the whole point: you non-artists see only the glitters and glory of the very few who make it and you're just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom

Sorry, databank, but this is just delirious. Why should I or anybody be jealous of the artists' lifestyle? Why do you think your lifestyle is better than mine or than anybody's? You don't know me, you don't know most of the people who write here... This is one of the most outrageous things I've read on the .org. I can see the point in some of the things you've said on this thread, but you've lost it here.

[Edited 11/4/13 6:02am]

Javi said:

databank said:

That's the whole point: you non-artists see only the glitters and glory of the very few who make it and you're just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom

Sorry, databank, but this is just delirious. Why should I or anybody be jealous of the artists' lifestyle? Why do you think your lifestyle is better than mine or than anybody's? You don't know me, you don't know most of the people who write here... This is one of the most outrageous things I've read on the .org. I can see the point in some of the things you've said on this thread, but you've lost it here.

Agree.

I'm very happy that Prince travels around, so I was so fortunate to see him perform in my town.

It's great that artists love that life style of being on the road with a group of people.

My ideal life would be to be together with a man who loves to invest his time in family life with me. So we can have kids, spend time with them and have a ball together.

That would be my ideal lifestyle. And I'm very happy that is not Prince his ideal lifestyle.

it's people who actually listen to his music (haters) vs. people who just think he's cute (groupies)

op is obviously a groupie .. we can both exist on the org .. the haters just get sick of the groupies acting like poop is pure gold .. haters like to have real discussions about the actual music that is coming out of prince butt .. even if it sucks haters like to discuss it .. then the groupies get all offended because they don't want their little prince they posted all over their wall to cry

groupies have their 'post a pic' threads and their .. 'oh he looked so cute in the new video' thread .. so haters can have their 'what the hell happened to the prince that could write a song" thread

oh and nobody is jealous of prince and his obsession with make up and high heels lifestyle .. haters just think he should spend more time on the music and less plucking his stupid eyebrows and sipping from chocolate glasses and all the other dumb shit he finds far more important than writing an actual song anybody wants to hear after the first cringe inducing listen

[Edited 11/4/13 6:26am]

Well, first of all, there isn't "an artist's lifestyle". Paddy McAloon and Keith Richards are both pop-rock artists, and their lifestyles couldn't differ more.

---

And, secondly, people claiming to know so much about "freedom" should at least know that freedom lies in following your own values and beliefs wherever they may lead you, and in making your own decisions about the problems at the core of life. Therefore, there doesn't exist a lifestyle that's the best for all people. On the contrary, each person must get to know which pattern of life suits him/her better. Frankly, I'd give at least one of my two hands for continuing with my life, so the offer of "an artist's lifestyle" was kind enough, but I am fine as I am, thanks a lot.

[Edited 11/4/13 6:41am]

Javi said:

databank said:

That's the whole point: you non-artists see only the glitters and glory of the very few who make it and you're just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom

Sorry, databank, but this is just delirious. Why should I or anybody be jealous of the artists' lifestyle? Why do you think your lifestyle is better than mine or than anybody's? You don't know me, you don't know most of the people who write here... This is one of the most outrageous things I've read on the .org. I can see the point in some of the things you've said on this thread, but you've lost it here.

[Edited 11/4/13 6:02am]

I meet a lot of people who aren't artists. They have a 9 to 5, they go to bed early and get up early, they can't take more than their legal holidays, they have to keep a respectable and serious attitude and follow a certain dresscode, they have a boss, they have a small group of friends, they have a boring job, people don't notice them or what they do.

Then we speak and even though I really try NOT to be braggin' about it, they see my life like this: never had a 9 to 5, can take a holiday any time I want and for as long as I want as long as I can afford it, can work all night and sleep all day, meet loads of people all the time, can be freakish as I want and dress the way I want because no one around me really cares, don't have a boss, have a very creative and interesting job, people will usually notice me and what I do.

I can guarantee that many of these people forget about all the disadvantages of an artist's lifestyle and how unprofitable a job it is, and usually tell me "how lucky you are, God I soooo wish I had a life like yours". I didn't make it up, it happened to me dozens, if not hundreds of time. It even ended-up being embarrassing in a few relationships I had with non-artists because the girls felt like they were dating a movie star and it was so gross and embarrassing how they would make my routine a glorious glamorous existence when actually there really was nothing glamorous or glorious about it at all, save maybe a certain amount of freedom.

So no, I'm not losing it, I tell what I see

TrevorAyer said:

it's people who actually listen to his music (haters) vs. people who just think he's cute (groupies)

op is obviously a groupie ..

[Edited 11/4/13 6:26am]

Oh give me a break Trevor, u're pathetic here. U've been here long enough to know that if someone listens to the music and is into technicalities here it's me, so don't make a fool of yourself in front of everyone

[Edited 11/4/13 9:58am]

dJJ said:

Javi said:

Sorry, databank, but this is just delirious. Why should I or anybody be jealous of the artists' lifestyle? Why do you think your lifestyle is better than mine or than anybody's? You don't know me, you don't know most of the people who write here... This is one of the most outrageous things I've read on the .org. I can see the point in some of the things you've said on this thread, but you've lost it here.

Agree.

I'm very happy that Prince travels around, so I was so fortunate to see him perform in my town.

It's great that artists love that life style of being on the road with a group of people.

My ideal life would be to be together with a man who loves to invest his time in family life with me. So we can have kids, spend time with them and have a ball together.

That would be my ideal lifestyle. And I'm very happy that is not Prince his ideal lifestyle.

God bless u

Javi said:

Well, first of all, there isn't "an artist's lifestyle". Paddy McAloon and Keith Richards are both pop-rock artists, and their lifestyles couldn't differ more.

---

And, secondly, people claiming to know so much about "freedom" should at least know that freedom lies in following your own values and beliefs wherever they may lead you, and in making your own decisions about the problems at the core of life. Therefore, there doesn't exist a lifestyle that's the best for all people. On the contrary, each person must get to know which pattern of life suits him/her better. Frankly, I'd give at least one of my two hands for continuing with my life, so the offer of "an artist's lifestyle" was kind enough, but I am fine as I am, thanks a lot.

[Edited 11/4/13 6:41am]

I really didn't offer you anything in the first place

Is Prince a hamburger or a pancake?

*

"Hey Dude, I flipped him over and now he's done."

databank said:

Javi said:

Sorry, databank, but this is just delirious. Why should I or anybody be jealous of the artists' lifestyle? Why do you think your lifestyle is better than mine or than anybody's? You don't know me, you don't know most of the people who write here... This is one of the most outrageous things I've read on the .org. I can see the point in some of the things you've said on this thread, but you've lost it here.

[Edited 11/4/13 6:02am]

I meet a lot of people who aren't artists. They have a 9 to 5, they go to bed early and get up early, they can't take more than their legal holidays, they have to keep a respectable and serious attitude and follow a certain dresscode, they have a boss, they have a small group of friends, they have a boring job, people don't notice them or what they do.

Then we speak and even though I really try NOT to be braggin' about it, they see my life like this: never had a 9 to 5, can take a holiday any time I want and for as long as I want as long as I can afford it, can work all night and sleep all day, meet loads of people all the time, can be freakish as I want and dress the way I want because no one around me really cares, don't have a boss, have a very creative and interesting job, people will usually notice me and what I do.

I can guarantee that many of these people forget about all the disadvantages of an artist's lifestyle and how unprofitable a job it is, and usually tell me "how lucky you are, God I soooo wish I had a life like yours". I didn't make it up, it happened to me dozens, if not hundreds of time. It even ended-up being embarrassing in a few relationships I had with non-artists because the girls felt like they were dating a movie star and it was so gross and embarrassing how they would make my routine a glorious glamorous existence when actually there really was nothing glamorous or glorious about it at all, save maybe a certain amount of freedom.

So no, I'm not losing it, I tell what I see

Regardless of the attitude of the people you meet, you're wrong in making assumptions. You cannot assume that all the people envy the lifestyle of an artist just because you know people who actually do. By the way, it's very human to envy what one doesn't have and to underestimate what one has. And saying in a public forum, as you've done, that, and I quote, "you non-artists (...) are just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom" is simply a haughty assumption about the people on this forum. Haughty and, at least in several cases, wrong.

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You talk a lot about "freedom". Well, in my book freedom, like I said previously, lies in following your own values and beliefs wherever they may lead you, and in making your own decisions about the problems at the core of life. To put it in other words: freedom is DIVERSITY. Your shit is my gold and my gold is your shit. That's freedom, man. So it's completely wrong to assume that YOUR gold (an artist's lifestyle) is also MY gold and EVERYBODY's gold. Sorry, but that's a wrong understanding of freedom.

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As for the pains and difficulties of being an artist, I have the deepest of respects for them and therefore for the likes of you. I love music and literature, so I have a huge respect for artists and for the problems that creating something implies. I'm not an "artist" myself, but I have written a book and I continue publishing, and I've certainly had my problems. So, what I'd conclude is: keep creating if you have the gift to do so, but don't be so arrogant regarding lifestyles and other collateral aspects of artistry. At the end of the day, it's the song, not the singer.

[Edited 11/4/13 13:41pm]

[Edited 11/4/13 14:09pm]

Javi said:

databank said:

I meet a lot of people who aren't artists. They have a 9 to 5, they go to bed early and get up early, they can't take more than their legal holidays, they have to keep a respectable and serious attitude and follow a certain dresscode, they have a boss, they have a small group of friends, they have a boring job, people don't notice them or what they do.

Then we speak and even though I really try NOT to be braggin' about it, they see my life like this: never had a 9 to 5, can take a holiday any time I want and for as long as I want as long as I can afford it, can work all night and sleep all day, meet loads of people all the time, can be freakish as I want and dress the way I want because no one around me really cares, don't have a boss, have a very creative and interesting job, people will usually notice me and what I do.

I can guarantee that many of these people forget about all the disadvantages of an artist's lifestyle and how unprofitable a job it is, and usually tell me "how lucky you are, God I soooo wish I had a life like yours". I didn't make it up, it happened to me dozens, if not hundreds of time. It even ended-up being embarrassing in a few relationships I had with non-artists because the girls felt like they were dating a movie star and it was so gross and embarrassing how they would make my routine a glorious glamorous existence when actually there really was nothing glamorous or glorious about it at all, save maybe a certain amount of freedom.

So no, I'm not losing it, I tell what I see

Regardless of the attitude of the people you meet, you're wrong in making assumptions. You cannot assume that all the people envy the lifestyle of an artist just because you know people who actually do. By the way, it's very human to envy what one doesn't have and to underestimate what one has. And saying in a public forum, as you've done, that, and I quote, "you non-artists (...) are just plain jealous of our lifestyle and freedom" is simply a haughty assumption about the people on this forum. Haughty and, at least in several cases, wrong.

-----

You talk a lot about "freedom". Well, in my book freedom, like I said previously, lies in following your own values and beliefs wherever they may lead you, and in making your own decisions about the problems at the core of life. To put it in other words: freedom is DIVERSITY. Your shit is my gold and my gold is your shit. That's freedom, man. So it's completely wrong to assume that YOUR gold (an artist's lifestyle) is also MY gold and EVERYBODY's gold. Sorry, but that's a wrong understanding of freedom.

-----

As for the pains and difficulties of being an artist, I have the deepest of respects for them and therefore for the likes of you. I love music and literature, so I have a huge respect for artists and for the problems that creating something implies. I'm not an "artist" myself, but I have written a book and I continue publishing, and I've certainly had my problems. So, what I'd conclude is: keep creating if you have the gift to do so, but don't be so arrogant regarding lifestyles and other collateral aspects of artistry. At the end of the day, it's the song, not the singer.

[Edited 11/4/13 13:41pm]

[Edited 11/4/13 14:09pm]

You make a lot of good points, I've got nothing to say against anything u say here