Dear .Org,

I was just wondering if the more knowledgeable and connected among you - in terms of hardcore inner bootleg circles - can provide vaid information re: what songs/versions/albums may be amongst the inner circles/lone person, but has not yet been made available to listen to for the general collector?

I imagine, some examples might be the Flesh sessions, the Lovesexy 12 inch extended versions, Adonis and Batsheeba, Cosmic Day, the original Gold album, the original Rave albums both from 1988 and 1999 etc etc

It would be useful to at least know/document what is effectively out there, but not available for hearing, due to closed bootleg circles or gentleman agreements to ensure confidentiality.

This is just my theory

You know that book from 2004 called "The Vault" ? and I'm sure you are aware of that Vault website

They both have a lot of information on some tracks. What they sound like, etc
The Vault book even gave the duration of some tracks that are not in circulation.

How do they know all this stuff? Because they have heard it

They say there is stuff out there not even talked about

there is a recording of prince taking a shit in a toilet, which is the original demo for the 20ten album

mushmackalenta said:

The full Flesh album is in the hands of a select few. It came very close to being shared fairly recently, only the one track was widely shared.

I'm still bummed about that. I was so excited when that track surfaced--not because I actually expect to like the Flesh tracks, just that I want to finally hear them, assuming they kind of act as a rough draft for what came later instrumentally.

Of course, that might not really be the case.

I'll probably never know.

I have heard that the select few have soundboard recordings from every concert in 2002: the One Nite Alone tour and dozens of aftershows and the Celebration shows. mouth watering to think of.

Shane

[Edited 9/2/13 21:01pm]

You forgot to mention the Trojan Horse BluRay.

mushmackalenta said:

The full Flesh album is in the hands of a select few. It came very close to being shared fairly recently, only the one track was widely shared.

It's a pity. From what I understand one or 2 people from these circles wanted to share more shit and started to leak these tracks (the ones we got last year, including the one from The Flesh) then got their asses kicked so hard by the others that they decided to stop. A real pity

I SO don't want to die before hearing The Flesh!!!

AhPook said:

They drop a gem every few years as a big fuck you just to remind us that they have the good stuff.

Just mr P used to do.

friend2001 said:

I have heard that the select few have soundboard recordings from every concert in 2002: the One Nite Alone tour and dozens of aftershows and the Celebration shows. mouth watering to think of.

Shane

[Edited 9/2/13 21:01pm]

I don't know about this, but there are at least some soundboards from Celebration. Or at least audience recordings that may as well be soudboard. From the small portion I heard, they sound better than that massive Xenophobia boot dump from some years ago. Now that I think about it, I may also have heard some of the recordings that eventually became part of the One Nite Alone...Live! boxset. It was so long ago, I can't be sure though.

I wouldn't necessarily consider these songs to be in Bootleg circles (Since a bootlegger would have put them out) but I would say in the hands of serious collectors who had some excellent connections to people that were around Prince in some way. If say Alan Ledds had unreleased songs and alt. versions you wouldn't really consider him to be a bootlegger.There's numerous reasons why some of these tracks haven't surfaced but mainly to protect the person who originally had the tracks since they were doing the collector a solid and some of the tracks could be traced back to the person who had it(especially since if it was on a WB X-reference cassette .

Heres a short but not complete list of tracks that I have listened to that are in collectors hands.

- Housequake #1- A raw demo mix with a different vocal take and different production. This could possibly be the version that was placed on the Camille album. Not to be confused with the Razorback remix.

-Lovesexy Commericial #1 & #2- these are 2 and a half minute tracks that are kinda protypes of the "Shake(the Boom mix)", "2 Whom it May Concern", and "Free the music". The music is totally original and has a very hypnotic groove which sounds somewhere in between a "Positivity" and "Dopeamine Rush Suite" along with the "Water Coda" ending vibe kinda groove. Prince speaks in a low voiced tone the album and song titles and also some lyrics. Theres also samples from the songs as well. The difference in the 2 versions is really what Prince says. The music track is the same. Really Great for what they are.

-Paris 17984530, Uncle Sam & the Halls of Desire- The guide tracks for the songs that appeared on the Tevin Campbell "I'm Ready" album. The backing tracks are the same but with Prince's vocal. "Uncle Sam" has a really good heartfelt delivery.

-We March #1- This has a completly different backing track which is essentially "Free The Music". The vocals are also different but the lyrics are the same.

-Standing at the Altar-Same backing track but with Prince's vocals.

- Bloody Mouth- An utempo track that shares alot in common with "Alphabet St." since there are at least three parts sampled from the track that wound up in 'Alphabet St."(The "put your love down baby" part) "Im gonna hit U in your Bloody Mouth"

-Pink Cashmere #2- Same as one but with a rawer sounding guitar solo and the "Water Coda" from the end of "Positivity" and the "Grafitti Bridge" album.

There's more that I will post about later.

Peace

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

[Edited 9/4/13 13:23pm]

BigChick said:

I wouldn't necessarily consider these songs to be in Bootleg circles (Since a bootlegger would have put them out) but I would say in the hands of serious collectors who had some excellent connections to people that were around Prince in some way. If say Alan Ledds had unreleased songs and alt. versions you wouldn't really consider him to be a bootlegger.There's numerous reasons why some of these tracks haven't surfaced but mainly to protect the person who originally had the tracks since they were doing the collector a solid and some of the tracks could be traced back to the person who had it(especially since if it was on a WB X-reference cassette .

Heres a short but not complete list of tracks that I have listened to that are in collectors hands.

- Housequake #1- A raw demo mix with a different vocal take and different production. This could possibly be the version that was placed on the Camille album. Not to be confused with the Razorback remix.

-Lovesexy Commericial #1 & #2- these are 2 and a half minute tracks that are kinda protypes of the "Shake(the Boom mix)", "2 Whom it May Concern", and "Free the music". The music is totally original and has a very hypnotic groove which sounds somewhere in between a "Positivity" and "Dopeamine Rush Suite" along with the "Water Coda" ending vibe kinda groove. Prince speaks in a low voiced tone the album and song titles and also some lyrics. Theres also samples from the songs as well. The difference in the 2 versions is really what Prince says. The music track is the same. Really Great for what they are.

-Paris 17984530, Uncle Sam & the Halls of Desire- The guide tracks for the songs that appeared on the Tevin Campbell "I'm Ready" album. The backing tracks are the same but with Prince's vocal. "Uncle Sam" has a really good heartfelt delivery.

-We March #1- This has a completly different backing track which is essentially "Free The Music". The vocals are also different but the lyrics are the same.

-Standing at the Altar-Same backing track but with Prince's vocals.

- Bloody Mouth- An utempo track that shares alot in common with "Alphabet St." since there are at least three parts sampled from the track that wound up in 'Alphabet St."(The "put your love down baby" part) "Im gonna hit U in your Bloody Mouth"

-Pink Cashmere #2- Same as one but with a rawer sounding guitar solo and the "Water Coda" from the end of "Positivity" and the "Grafitti Bridge" album.

There's more that I will post about later.

Peace

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

[Edited 9/4/13 13:23pm]

Now, THAT is what I am talking about. THANK YOU, Big Chick. This is exactly the kind of priceless info. that is scattered about in rare, but various, threads. It's just a shame it's not consolidated somewhere, and then continually updated with new/other/different info. We March sounds kinda groovy with the Free the Music backing track and the Lovesexy Commercials sound out of the world! What is Shake (the boom mix) referring to? I couldn't quite get Will Smith out of my head.

Sp

Now, THAT is what I am talking about. THANK YOU, Big Chick. This is exactly the kind of priceless info. that is scattered about in rare, but various, threads. It's just a shame it's not consolidated somewhere, and then continually updated with new/other/different info. We March sounds kinda groovy with the Free the Music backing track and the Lovesexy Commercials sound out of the world! What is Shake (the boom mix) referring to? I couldn't quite get Will Smith out of my head.

"Shake(The boom mix)" is on the 12" and the cd maxi single for the Time's "Shake" single from "Grafitti Bridge" album and is very similar in concept to "Free The Music". Check it out. It's not like the best track ever but at least for the curiousity its cool. Keep up the Positivite vibes Otter and good questions. If I am assasinated soon. It's all your fault. You dont want blood on your wet fur now Spirit Otter do you.

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

unique said:

there is a recording of prince taking a shit in a toilet, which is the original demo for the 20ten album

Imagine if the deluxe version of the album had been actually been released, it might've appeared. All those groans, sploshes and fart sounds. It would surely be the new Wally.

BigChick said:

Sp

Now, THAT is what I am talking about. THANK YOU, Big Chick. This is exactly the kind of priceless info. that is scattered about in rare, but various, threads. It's just a shame it's not consolidated somewhere, and then continually updated with new/other/different info. We March sounds kinda groovy with the Free the Music backing track and the Lovesexy Commercials sound out of the world! What is Shake (the boom mix) referring to? I couldn't quite get Will Smith out of my head.

"Shake(The boom mix)" is on the 12" and the cd maxi single for the Time's "Shake" single from "Grafitti Bridge" album and is very similar in concept to "Free The Music". Check it out. It's not like the best track ever but at least for the curiousity its cool. Keep up the Positivite vibes Otter and good questions. If I am assasinated soon. It's all your fault. You dont want blood on your wet fur now Spirit Otter do you.

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

I will rally around the Otters to protect you, although you were "Security Ensuring Thee..."?!

Are there any things you might particularly want to be shared or to hear yourself?

P.S. I will track down the Shake 12". I don't even recall that being released. From that era, I particularly enjoyed the Corporate World - A New Approach release, which had stellar earlier incarnations/versions of Murph Drag, Nine Lives, Donald Trump, Databank and My Summertime Thang, to name but a few. It makes for the listening experience of the eventually released Graffiti Bridge far more understandable and I, for one, became more appreciative of its final execution (whilst still thoroughly enjoying many of the outtakes).

SpiritOtter said:

I will rally around the Otters to protect you, although you were "Security Ensuring Thee..."?!

Are there any things you might particularly want to be shared or to hear yourself?

P.S. I will track down the Shake 12". I don't even recall that being released. From that era, I particularly enjoyed the Corporate World - A New Approach release, which had stellar earlier incarnations/versions of Murph Drag, Nine Lives, Donald Trump, Databank and My Summertime Thang, to name but a few. It makes for the listening experience of the eventually released Graffiti Bridge far more understandable and I, for one, became more appreciative of its final execution (whilst still thoroughly enjoying many of the outtakes).

Out of all the tracks I mentioned the "Lovesexy Commericials" I would love to hear again. The music was great and if it was worked on as a song would've been great. Like I said it's very chill and hypnotic sounding. Much better than the "The Line #2" and say the "Eye No" remix which does sound like a lovesexy tracks but too overproduced. "The Line" #1 is darker and a coveys more of a mysterious vibe. My Security Ensuring Thee more or less comes into effect when I'm guarding the $10 plates of spaghetti.

Peace

Big Chick

BigChick said:

SpiritOtter said:

I will rally around the Otters to protect you, although you were "Security Ensuring Thee..."?!

Are there any things you might particularly want to be shared or to hear yourself?

P.S. I will track down the Shake 12". I don't even recall that being released. From that era, I particularly enjoyed the Corporate World - A New Approach release, which had stellar earlier incarnations/versions of Murph Drag, Nine Lives, Donald Trump, Databank and My Summertime Thang, to name but a few. It makes for the listening experience of the eventually released Graffiti Bridge far more understandable and I, for one, became more appreciative of its final execution (whilst still thoroughly enjoying many of the outtakes).

Out of all the tracks I mentioned the "Lovesexy Commericials" I would love to hear again. The music was great and if it was worked on as a song would've been great. Like I said it's very chill and hypnotic sounding. Much better than the "The Line #2" and say the "Eye No" remix which does sound like a lovesexy tracks but too overproduced. "The Line" #1 is darker and a coveys more of a mysterious vibe. My Security Ensuring Thee more or less comes into effect when I'm guarding the $10 plates of spaghetti.

Peace

Big Chick

As a particular favourite era of mine (Lovesexy), those commercials as well as your descriptions do sound delightful. I have found the Shake 12 inch and I have to say, I quite like the Boom mix. As you say, an early precursor to those ad type jingles showcasing an album, but interesting nonetheless. It would appear unlike others, I actually really enjoyed 2 Whom It May Concern. I must revisit the Line #2. I agree, I quite enjoyed the sparser, darker, version of the two. Was the Eye No remix ever released in common bootleg circles? It's not ringing any bells.

By the way, as I am listening to the 12 inch, the Shake (Battle mix) is deliciously groovy!

SpiritOtter said:

BigChick said:

Out of all the tracks I mentioned the "Lovesexy Commericials" I would love to hear again. The music was great and if it was worked on as a song would've been great. Like I said it's very chill and hypnotic sounding. Much better than the "The Line #2" and say the "Eye No" remix which does sound like a lovesexy tracks but too overproduced. "The Line" #1 is darker and a coveys more of a mysterious vibe. My Security Ensuring Thee more or less comes into effect when I'm guarding the $10 plates of spaghetti.

Peace

Big Chick

As a particular favourite era of mine (Lovesexy), those commercials as well as your descriptions do sound delightful. I have found the Shake 12 inch and I have to say, I quite like the Boom mix. As you say, an early precursor to those ad type jingles showcasing an album, but interesting nonetheless. It would appear unlike others, I actually really enjoyed 2 Whom It May Concern. I must revisit the Line #2. I agree, I quite enjoyed the sparser, darker, version of the two. Was the Eye No remix ever released in common bootleg circles? It's not ringing any bells.

I believe it first appeared on the Work set from 2001. The quality whoever is not that clean but none of the less interesting for what it is. An interesting remix but I felt it was a tad bit overproduced and busy. Glad your enjoying the "Shake " remixes. See you learn something everyday.

Big Chick

AhPook said:

To me this is the most intriguing post on the .org right now. I find the notion that there's a small group of collectors hoarding their loot completely fascinating. They drop a gem every few years as a big fuck you just to remind us that they have the good stuff.

Don't feel so bad - we (the public) DO have all the good stuff. Or at least, 99% of it.

There are surely good songs in Prince's unreleased catalogue but you will find that 99% of his best songs have already been released. Mostly officially, but some only through bootlegs.

RodeoSchro said:

BigChick said:

TwiliteKid said:

BigChick said:

I wouldn't necessarily consider these songs to be in Bootleg circles (Since a bootlegger would have put them out) but I would say in the hands of serious collectors who had some excellent connections to people that were around Prince in some way. If say Alan Ledds had unreleased songs and alt. versions you wouldn't really consider him to be a bootlegger.There's numerous reasons why some of these tracks haven't surfaced but mainly to protect the person who originally had the tracks since they were doing the collector a solid and some of the tracks could be traced back to the person who had it(especially since if it was on a WB X-reference cassette .

Heres a short but not complete list of tracks that I have listened to that are in collectors hands.

- Housequake #1- A raw demo mix with a different vocal take and different production. This could possibly be the version that was placed on the Camille album. Not to be confused with the Razorback remix.

-Lovesexy Commericial #1 & #2- these are 2 and a half minute tracks that are kinda protypes of the "Shake(the Boom mix)", "2 Whom it May Concern", and "Free the music". The music is totally original and has a very hypnotic groove which sounds somewhere in between a "Positivity" and "Dopeamine Rush Suite" along with the "Water Coda" ending vibe kinda groove. Prince speaks in a low voiced tone the album and song titles and also some lyrics. Theres also samples from the songs as well. The difference in the 2 versions is really what Prince says. The music track is the same. Really Great for what they are.

-Paris 17984530, Uncle Sam & the Halls of Desire- The guide tracks for the songs that appeared on the Tevin Campbell "I'm Ready" album. The backing tracks are the same but with Prince's vocal. "Uncle Sam" has a really good heartfelt delivery.

-We March #1- This has a completly different backing track which is essentially "Free The Music". The vocals are also different but the lyrics are the same.

-Standing at the Altar-Same backing track but with Prince's vocals.

- Bloody Mouth- An utempo track that shares alot in common with "Alphabet St." since there are at least three parts sampled from the track that wound up in 'Alphabet St."(The "put your love down baby" part) "Im gonna hit U in your Bloody Mouth"

-Pink Cashmere #2- Same as one but with a rawer sounding guitar solo and the "Water Coda" from the end of "Positivity" and the "Grafitti Bridge" album.

There's more that I will post about later.

Peace

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

[Edited 9/4/13 13:23pm]

Interesting to hear that Bloody Mouth was sampled on Alphabet St! Are you still in contact with this collector, by any chance?

Unfortuanetly not. He lost interest and kind of retired from the scene and sold what he had at a premium to a privat collector.

BigChick said:

TwiliteKid said:

BigChick said: Interesting to hear that Bloody Mouth was sampled on Alphabet St! Are you still in contact with this collector, by any chance?

Unfortuanetly not. He lost interest and kind of retired from the scene and sold what he had at a premium to a private collector.

Cool stuff

BigChick said:

- Housequake #1

-Lovesexy Commericial #1 & #2

-Paris 17984530, Uncle Sam & the Halls of Desire-

-We March #1-

-Standing at the Altar-

- Bloody Mouth-

-Pink Cashmere #

BigChick said:

I wouldn't necessarily consider these songs to be in Bootleg circles (Since a bootlegger would have put them out) but I would say in the hands of serious collectors who had some excellent connections to people that were around Prince in some way. If say Alan Ledds had unreleased songs and alt. versions you wouldn't really consider him to be a bootlegger.There's numerous reasons why some of these tracks haven't surfaced but mainly to protect the person who originally had the tracks since they were doing the collector a solid and some of the tracks could be traced back to the person who had it(especially since if it was on a WB X-reference cassette .

Heres a short but not complete list of tracks that I have listened to that are in collectors hands.

- Housequake #1- A raw demo mix with a different vocal take and different production. This could possibly be the version that was placed on the Camille album. Not to be confused with the Razorback remix.

-Lovesexy Commericial #1 & #2- these are 2 and a half minute tracks that are kinda protypes of the "Shake(the Boom mix)", "2 Whom it May Concern", and "Free the music". The music is totally original and has a very hypnotic groove which sounds somewhere in between a "Positivity" and "Dopeamine Rush Suite" along with the "Water Coda" ending vibe kinda groove. Prince speaks in a low voiced tone the album and song titles and also some lyrics. Theres also samples from the songs as well. The difference in the 2 versions is really what Prince says. The music track is the same. Really Great for what they are.

-Paris 17984530, Uncle Sam & the Halls of Desire- The guide tracks for the songs that appeared on the Tevin Campbell "I'm Ready" album. The backing tracks are the same but with Prince's vocal. "Uncle Sam" has a really good heartfelt delivery.

-We March #1- This has a completly different backing track which is essentially "Free The Music". The vocals are also different but the lyrics are the same.

-Standing at the Altar-Same backing track but with Prince's vocals.

- Bloody Mouth- An utempo track that shares alot in common with "Alphabet St." since there are at least three parts sampled from the track that wound up in 'Alphabet St."(The "put your love down baby" part) "Im gonna hit U in your Bloody Mouth"

-Pink Cashmere #2- Same as one but with a rawer sounding guitar solo and the "Water Coda" from the end of "Positivity" and the "Grafitti Bridge" album.

There's more that I will post about later.

Peace

Big Chick

"Security Ensuring Thee"

[Edited 9/4/13 13:23pm]

Wow! Cool! Thanks 4 sharing that, these r precious in4mations

BigChick said:

BigChick said:

Unfortuanetly not. He lost interest and kind of retired from the scene and sold what he had at a premium to a private collector.

I'd love to know how much a "premium" is!

TwiliteKid said:

RodeoSchro said:

Don't feel so bad - we (the public) DO have all the good stuff. Or at least, 99% of it.

There are surely good songs in Prince's unreleased catalogue but you will find that 99% of his best songs have already been released. Mostly officially, but some only through bootlegs.

How can you know that? Didn't any of the recently surfaced outtakes do it for you?

Well, I guess I can know it the same way that someone else "knows" that they haven't heard all the best Prince music because it's not been released. How can they know how good it is if they've never heard it? The unreleased stuff might all have the allure of "Jughead", LOL.

But in my case, I have hundreds of songs, and dozens of hours, of the best music I've ever heard. If I never heard another new Prince song (whether new or newly-released), I'd be satsified. Not happy per se, but satisfied with what I have.

I did like "Lust U Always" a lot. But it's probably not one of my top 50 - 100 Prince songs ever.