I generally find Pitchfork to be full of crap and I almost never agree with their reviews. Those writers are so ridiculous, in fact, that I don't even bother with Pitchfork.

Everytime I check out prince.org I see constant glowing praise for LotusFlower. This also boggles my mind. It's such an unimportant album to me that I never really gave all the praise a second thought. It was annoying to see it pop up so often, but I didn't really care. This morning as I was lurking through prince.org as I usually do, however, something changed when I came across the millionth mention of how great LotusFlower is in the middle of a thread having nothing to do with that so-called classic. I decided to see what non-prince.org folks thought of the release. I found that not only did the general critical community seem to agree with me, but to my great surprise pitchfork also agreed. I never thought I'd agree with a pitchfork review, but I found that if I'd written the review I'd probably have written something very similar.

Here's the review: http://pitchfork.com/revi...lbum-13903

All the usual disclaimers apply about art being subjective and any feelings about art being strictly the opinion of the viewer as a common agreed-upon standard in art is, by nature, quite impossible.

Just because you agree with a review doesn't make it true. Or does it? Case in point:

New Musical Express
April 12, 1986

Sometimes it pisses down in April

I TOOK 'Kiss' as a signal that we were being ushered back into the compressed, airtight funkworld of 'Dirty Mind'. Didn't flip over the song itself - slick metronome sexgospel - but what a relief to hear that funky, flecked, flicking guitar again.

It turns out we're not going back to that springy, spunky sound after all - 'Kiss' is on its own as a throwback to 'Head' and 'Party Up' and 'Do It All Night'. Not that Prince doesn't still have a filthy little mind, of course, just that these days he doesn't speak it quite so economically. It's all mixed he doesn't really know how to express, and that's become a drag.

A few things have changed since 'Around The World In A Day', it's true. For starters, there are no printed lyrics, so i don't have to pretend to have given his twee and icky poems my most careful consideration. Then for seconds there's no purple or paisley stuff on the sleeve - just plain ol' black and white narcissim (another throwback to 'Dirty Mind'). Most important, Prince isn't being such a sourpuss primadonna anymore. There I was thinking the little mulatto Amadeus was on the edge of a breakdown and suddenly he's all happy and relaxed and flirty in the 'Kiss' video.

Trouble is, i actually think 'Around The World In A Day' was the better record. For all its neo-psychedelic silliness it had three great songs, which is about three more than 'Parade' has - nothing here as witty as 'Pop Life', as mournful as 'America', or as anguished as 'Condition Of The Heart'. The worst thing about Prince's "maturity', if we can call it that, is that he has given up writing great songs - songs like 'When You Were Mine' - as a matter of course. I mean, if he can find time to bestow a morsel like 'Manic Monday' on four desperate California chicks who will probably never have another hit record in their lives, surely he could craft the odd decent tune for himself.

Prince, instead of writing simple, succinct, sexy songs, is always trying to save the world, which means that he is never content with anything but grandiose 'Sgt Pepper' albums where all the songs run into each onther and vast orchestras make a lot of superfluous noise. He is a master architect of sound but he will show off and spoil it all. His Rundgren-esque technosoup of Sly and Stevie Wonder is beginning to get very predictable.

The LP opens with 'Christopher Tracy's Parade', a typical fanfare for his highness 'Disneyland soundscape and pretty much a follow-through from the ambience of 'Paisley Park'. Who this tracy fellow is I don't know, though going by the closing elegy of 'Sometimes It Snows In April', I would guess that he is a deceased pal of the Minneapolitan midget's.

'New Position' follows with steel drums, a hard pop-funk beat, and yer basic lewd double entendre. Guitarist Wendy picks up for the strange, brief interlude of 'I Wonder U' (performances seem more democratically delegated this time around: P. isn't being such a spoilt-brat autocrat in his studio playpen) which slides swiftly into 'Under The Cherry Moon', title track of the unpromising-sounding flick for which this LP purports to be a soundtrack. I have seen many moons in my time, but never a cherry moon - how about you ? The song is a kind of kurt Weill lullaby co-authored by (Prince Sr ?) John L. Nelson.

Next up, 'Girls And Boys' is an adolescent 'Lady Marmalade' replete with "sauce" French bits and set to the beat of 'Take Me With U'. 'Life Can Be So Nice' bypasses me completely - a highspirited mess - before 'Venus De Milo' trails away at Side One's end as a slight sliver of mood-muzak, grand piano plus sweeping strings and reeds.

Flip the disc and we're straight back into Prince's booming sytnh beat on 'Mountains', which is a pounding Stevie Wonder/ Earth Wind And Fire epic. The Jazzy, smoochy 'Do U Lie ?' is a pleasant and slinky respite from such pomp.

'Kiss' then takes its isolated place in the remorseless parade of overdone semi-ideas, followed by the melodically beguiling 'Anotherloverholenyohead' (yes, it is a stupid title, isn't it). Finally, the showpiece ballad, 'Sometimes It Snows In April' (an even worse title) ends the record on a folksy acoustic noteand mourns the aforesaid departed Tracy. I feel that Prince is, on the whole, best at this most sentimental and foppishly despolate, but this is appalling kitsch and doesn't work at all.

I dunno. Is it possible, or even advisable, to take Prince seriously ? Do I have to watch Dynasty to have an attitude ? I find this record laboured and trite and self-satisfied and won't be listening to it again.

-- Barney Hoskyns

thanks to prince-in-print

I couldn't say I agree with everything, I think the author overlooked a lot of the great stuff on the title disc, but what a familiar feeling this is.....

Like many who came of age when each new Prince album expanded our conception of pop, I've already struggled through plenty of self-cannibalized sketches and ever-more-mawkish ballads and unsuccessful experiments to locate the canon-worthy songs lurking in his decade-plus of hubristic over-production. I know a jumble of decent tunes, lackluster jams, and outright dreck invariably awaits on any Tuesday morning bearing a new Prince album.

.

.

.

.

Oh and....

Bria Valente, who should at least be happy she's been able to piggyback her way to bad reviews in national publications, rather than languishing in the promo bin purgatory to which she'd be consigned if her producer was a cousin with a copy of Pro Tools.

I would almost agree with this part, becasue I think it is both crass and delusional.

If Lotusflow3r is generic and too-reverential modern day muso Prince, then MPLSound is either crass or delusional.

"The only memorable hook is Crimson and Clover"...what the fuck ever...lol. Lotusflow3r (THE TITLE ALBUM ONLY) is one of the best things he has ever produced.

I gave it a positive review after attending a listening party, but never spent the $12 at Target to pick it up.

Best I can remember, it's an attractive sounding record with some moments of really gelling - Colonized Mind in particular. The songs aren't great but the performances are generally good. I think "inessential" is probably right.

My summary was "MPLSound is the one you dance to in the club, Lotusflow3r is the one you listen to when you're back home from the club ready to kick it, and Elixer is the one you put on when it's time to go to bed but the stragglers won't leave."

skywalker said:

Just because you agree with a review doesn't make it true. Or does it? Case in point:

New Musical Express
April 12, 1986

Sometimes it pisses down in April

I TOOK 'Kiss' as a signal that we were being ushered back into the compressed, airtight funkworld of 'Dirty Mind'. Didn't flip over the song itself - slick metronome sexgospel - but what a relief to hear that funky, flecked, flicking guitar again.

It turns out we're not going back to that springy, spunky sound after all - 'Kiss' is on its own as a throwback to 'Head' and 'Party Up' and 'Do It All Night'. Not that Prince doesn't still have a filthy little mind, of course, just that these days he doesn't speak it quite so economically. It's all mixed he doesn't really know how to express, and that's become a drag.

A few things have changed since 'Around The World In A Day', it's true. For starters, there are no printed lyrics, so i don't have to pretend to have given his twee and icky poems my most careful consideration. Then for seconds there's no purple or paisley stuff on the sleeve - just plain ol' black and white narcissim (another throwback to 'Dirty Mind'). Most important, Prince isn't being such a sourpuss primadonna anymore. There I was thinking the little mulatto Amadeus was on the edge of a breakdown and suddenly he's all happy and relaxed and flirty in the 'Kiss' video.

Trouble is, i actually think 'Around The World In A Day' was the better record. For all its neo-psychedelic silliness it had three great songs, which is about three more than 'Parade' has - nothing here as witty as 'Pop Life', as mournful as 'America', or as anguished as 'Condition Of The Heart'. The worst thing about Prince's "maturity', if we can call it that, is that he has given up writing great songs - songs like 'When You Were Mine' - as a matter of course. I mean, if he can find time to bestow a morsel like 'Manic Monday' on four desperate California chicks who will probably never have another hit record in their lives, surely he could craft the odd decent tune for himself.

Prince, instead of writing simple, succinct, sexy songs, is always trying to save the world, which means that he is never content with anything but grandiose 'Sgt Pepper' albums where all the songs run into each onther and vast orchestras make a lot of superfluous noise. He is a master architect of sound but he will show off and spoil it all. His Rundgren-esque technosoup of Sly and Stevie Wonder is beginning to get very predictable.

The LP opens with 'Christopher Tracy's Parade', a typical fanfare for his highness 'Disneyland soundscape and pretty much a follow-through from the ambience of 'Paisley Park'. Who this tracy fellow is I don't know, though going by the closing elegy of 'Sometimes It Snows In April', I would guess that he is a deceased pal of the Minneapolitan midget's.

'New Position' follows with steel drums, a hard pop-funk beat, and yer basic lewd double entendre. Guitarist Wendy picks up for the strange, brief interlude of 'I Wonder U' (performances seem more democratically delegated this time around: P. isn't being such a spoilt-brat autocrat in his studio playpen) which slides swiftly into 'Under The Cherry Moon', title track of the unpromising-sounding flick for which this LP purports to be a soundtrack. I have seen many moons in my time, but never a cherry moon - how about you ? The song is a kind of kurt Weill lullaby co-authored by (Prince Sr ?) John L. Nelson.

Next up, 'Girls And Boys' is an adolescent 'Lady Marmalade' replete with "sauce" French bits and set to the beat of 'Take Me With U'. 'Life Can Be So Nice' bypasses me completely - a highspirited mess - before 'Venus De Milo' trails away at Side One's end as a slight sliver of mood-muzak, grand piano plus sweeping strings and reeds.

Flip the disc and we're straight back into Prince's booming sytnh beat on 'Mountains', which is a pounding Stevie Wonder/ Earth Wind And Fire epic. The Jazzy, smoochy 'Do U Lie ?' is a pleasant and slinky respite from such pomp.

'Kiss' then takes its isolated place in the remorseless parade of overdone semi-ideas, followed by the melodically beguiling 'Anotherloverholenyohead' (yes, it is a stupid title, isn't it). Finally, the showpiece ballad, 'Sometimes It Snows In April' (an even worse title) ends the record on a folksy acoustic noteand mourns the aforesaid departed Tracy. I feel that Prince is, on the whole, best at this most sentimental and foppishly despolate, but this is appalling kitsch and doesn't work at all.

I dunno. Is it possible, or even advisable, to take Prince seriously ? Do I have to watch Dynasty to have an attitude ? I find this record laboured and trite and self-satisfied and won't be listening to it again.

-- Barney Hoskyns

thanks to prince-in-print

I didn't say it was accurate as evidenced by the disclaimer in my last few lines of text. I believe every word of the disclaimer, too. Thank you very much.

steakfinger said:

I didn't say it was accurate as evidenced by the disclaimer in my last few lines of text. I believe every word of the disclaimer, too. Thank you very much.

So why bother posting in the first place? What kind of response were you looking for?

I posted a Parade review that I am sure someone else agrees with. What do you make of it?

Is Barney Hoskyns still living? want to send him HATE mail

thanks2joniandu said:

Is Barney Hoskyns still living? want to send him HATE mail

your kidding ?

please tell me you are...barney hoskyns is an incredible journalist whom has written a book on prince

just cos he didnt initially like parade almost thirty years ago you want to send him hate mail??

your either joking or a teenager?

http://www.guardian.co.uk...popandrock

http://music.yahoo.com/bl...-want.html

http://www.bylarm.no/eng/seminars/341

thanks2joniandu said:

Is Barney Hoskyns still living? want to send him HATE mail

Barney Hoskyns is a veteran UK music journalist and the author of several classic music histories and biographies, including his love letters to the West Coast, “Waiting For The Sun” and “Hotel California”, “Across The Great Divide: The Band”, and “Lowside of the Road: Tom Waits”. He’s just published “Trampled Under Foot”, a magisterial oral history of Led Zeppelin. In the early 2000s he set up rocksbackpages.com, an online library of collected music journalism from a massive range of UK and US publications, dating back to the dawn of pop to the present day – the first of its kind, and an invaluable resource for journalists, researchers and music fans. His writing has appeared in dozens of UK and US magazine and newspapers (NME, Melody Maker, Mojo, Uncut, Harpers Bazaar, Rolling Stone, etc), and he regularly appears on British TV and radio as a cultural commentator.

skywalker said:

Just because you agree with a review doesn't make it true. Or does it? Case in point:

New Musical Express
April 12, 1986

Sometimes it pisses down in April

I TOOK 'Kiss' as a signal that we were being ushered back into the compressed, airtight funkworld of 'Dirty Mind'. Didn't flip over the song itself - slick metronome sexgospel - but what a relief to hear that funky, flecked, flicking guitar again.

It turns out we're not going back to that springy, spunky sound after all - 'Kiss' is on its own as a throwback to 'Head' and 'Party Up' and 'Do It All Night'. Not that Prince doesn't still have a filthy little mind, of course, just that these days he doesn't speak it quite so economically. It's all mixed he doesn't really know how to express, and that's become a drag.

A few things have changed since 'Around The World In A Day', it's true. For starters, there are no printed lyrics, so i don't have to pretend to have given his twee and icky poems my most careful consideration. Then for seconds there's no purple or paisley stuff on the sleeve - just plain ol' black and white narcissim (another throwback to 'Dirty Mind'). Most important, Prince isn't being such a sourpuss primadonna anymore. There I was thinking the little mulatto Amadeus was on the edge of a breakdown and suddenly he's all happy and relaxed and flirty in the 'Kiss' video.

Trouble is, i actually think 'Around The World In A Day' was the better record. For all its neo-psychedelic silliness it had three great songs, which is about three more than 'Parade' has - nothing here as witty as 'Pop Life', as mournful as 'America', or as anguished as 'Condition Of The Heart'. The worst thing about Prince's "maturity', if we can call it that, is that he has given up writing great songs - songs like 'When You Were Mine' - as a matter of course. I mean, if he can find time to bestow a morsel like 'Manic Monday' on four desperate California chicks who will probably never have another hit record in their lives, surely he could craft the odd decent tune for himself.

Prince, instead of writing simple, succinct, sexy songs, is always trying to save the world, which means that he is never content with anything but grandiose 'Sgt Pepper' albums where all the songs run into each onther and vast orchestras make a lot of superfluous noise. He is a master architect of sound but he will show off and spoil it all. His Rundgren-esque technosoup of Sly and Stevie Wonder is beginning to get very predictable.

The LP opens with 'Christopher Tracy's Parade', a typical fanfare for his highness 'Disneyland soundscape and pretty much a follow-through from the ambience of 'Paisley Park'. Who this tracy fellow is I don't know, though going by the closing elegy of 'Sometimes It Snows In April', I would guess that he is a deceased pal of the Minneapolitan midget's.

'New Position' follows with steel drums, a hard pop-funk beat, and yer basic lewd double entendre. Guitarist Wendy picks up for the strange, brief interlude of 'I Wonder U' (performances seem more democratically delegated this time around: P. isn't being such a spoilt-brat autocrat in his studio playpen) which slides swiftly into 'Under The Cherry Moon', title track of the unpromising-sounding flick for which this LP purports to be a soundtrack. I have seen many moons in my time, but never a cherry moon - how about you ? The song is a kind of kurt Weill lullaby co-authored by (Prince Sr ?) John L. Nelson.

Next up, 'Girls And Boys' is an adolescent 'Lady Marmalade' replete with "sauce" French bits and set to the beat of 'Take Me With U'. 'Life Can Be So Nice' bypasses me completely - a highspirited mess - before 'Venus De Milo' trails away at Side One's end as a slight sliver of mood-muzak, grand piano plus sweeping strings and reeds.

Flip the disc and we're straight back into Prince's booming sytnh beat on 'Mountains', which is a pounding Stevie Wonder/ Earth Wind And Fire epic. The Jazzy, smoochy 'Do U Lie ?' is a pleasant and slinky respite from such pomp.

'Kiss' then takes its isolated place in the remorseless parade of overdone semi-ideas, followed by the melodically beguiling 'Anotherloverholenyohead' (yes, it is a stupid title, isn't it). Finally, the showpiece ballad, 'Sometimes It Snows In April' (an even worse title) ends the record on a folksy acoustic noteand mourns the aforesaid departed Tracy. I feel that Prince is, on the whole, best at this most sentimental and foppishly despolate, but this is appalling kitsch and doesn't work at all.

I dunno. Is it possible, or even advisable, to take Prince seriously ? Do I have to watch Dynasty to have an attitude ? I find this record laboured and trite and self-satisfied and won't be listening to it again.

-- Barney Hoskyns

thanks to prince-in-print

I fumed while reading this review. I just bought the vinyl for this album today for 2.99. side two is genius and idk how this guy didn't hear it. side one though i think he might have a point minus boys and girls. ATWIAD is a better album. its got a 4.5 out of five stars(parade) on allmusic which i think is a bit high while ATWIAd got 3. I think both ratings need to be switched and add parade to a 3.5.

True people on here do glow at lotus flower perphaps a little too much. Colonized mind, Dreamer, and Crimson and Clover are fantastic though no arguing. THe rest is pick and choose and at the worst tolerable. Compare it to planet earth this is a genius album. MPLS is horrible. Lotus is no classic. and i believe a 3-3.5 stars is in order for the album. Im going with 3.

I agree with some of the comments in that Parade review That album sounds rushed and unfocused at times.Even Prince agreed.He later admitted that he "recorded it too soon after 'Around The World In A Day' and I didn't have enough great songs ready.I'm not gonna make that same mistake again".

skywalker said:

Just because you agree with a review doesn't make it true. Or does it? Case in point:

New Musical Express
April 12, 1986

Sometimes it pisses down in April

I TOOK 'Kiss' as a signal that we were being ushered back into the compressed, airtight funkworld of 'Dirty Mind'. Didn't flip over the song itself - slick metronome sexgospel - but what a relief to hear that funky, flecked, flicking guitar again.

It turns out we're not going back to that springy, spunky sound after all - 'Kiss' is on its own as a throwback to 'Head' and 'Party Up' and 'Do It All Night'. Not that Prince doesn't still have a filthy little mind, of course, just that these days he doesn't speak it quite so economically. It's all mixed he doesn't really know how to express, and that's become a drag.

A few things have changed since 'Around The World In A Day', it's true. For starters, there are no printed lyrics, so i don't have to pretend to have given his twee and icky poems my most careful consideration. Then for seconds there's no purple or paisley stuff on the sleeve - just plain ol' black and white narcissim (another throwback to 'Dirty Mind'). Most important, Prince isn't being such a sourpuss primadonna anymore. There I was thinking the little mulatto Amadeus was on the edge of a breakdown and suddenly he's all happy and relaxed and flirty in the 'Kiss' video.

Trouble is, i actually think 'Around The World In A Day' was the better record. For all its neo-psychedelic silliness it had three great songs, which is about three more than 'Parade' has - nothing here as witty as 'Pop Life', as mournful as 'America', or as anguished as 'Condition Of The Heart'. The worst thing about Prince's "maturity', if we can call it that, is that he has given up writing great songs - songs like 'When You Were Mine' - as a matter of course. I mean, if he can find time to bestow a morsel like 'Manic Monday' on four desperate California chicks who will probably never have another hit record in their lives, surely he could craft the odd decent tune for himself.

Prince, instead of writing simple, succinct, sexy songs, is always trying to save the world, which means that he is never content with anything but grandiose 'Sgt Pepper' albums where all the songs run into each onther and vast orchestras make a lot of superfluous noise. He is a master architect of sound but he will show off and spoil it all. His Rundgren-esque technosoup of Sly and Stevie Wonder is beginning to get very predictable.

The LP opens with 'Christopher Tracy's Parade', a typical fanfare for his highness 'Disneyland soundscape and pretty much a follow-through from the ambience of 'Paisley Park'. Who this tracy fellow is I don't know, though going by the closing elegy of 'Sometimes It Snows In April', I would guess that he is a deceased pal of the Minneapolitan midget's.

'New Position' follows with steel drums, a hard pop-funk beat, and yer basic lewd double entendre. Guitarist Wendy picks up for the strange, brief interlude of 'I Wonder U' (performances seem more democratically delegated this time around: P. isn't being such a spoilt-brat autocrat in his studio playpen) which slides swiftly into 'Under The Cherry Moon', title track of the unpromising-sounding flick for which this LP purports to be a soundtrack. I have seen many moons in my time, but never a cherry moon - how about you ? The song is a kind of kurt Weill lullaby co-authored by (Prince Sr ?) John L. Nelson.

Next up, 'Girls And Boys' is an adolescent 'Lady Marmalade' replete with "sauce" French bits and set to the beat of 'Take Me With U'. 'Life Can Be So Nice' bypasses me completely - a highspirited mess - before 'Venus De Milo' trails away at Side One's end as a slight sliver of mood-muzak, grand piano plus sweeping strings and reeds.

Flip the disc and we're straight back into Prince's booming sytnh beat on 'Mountains', which is a pounding Stevie Wonder/ Earth Wind And Fire epic. The Jazzy, smoochy 'Do U Lie ?' is a pleasant and slinky respite from such pomp.

'Kiss' then takes its isolated place in the remorseless parade of overdone semi-ideas, followed by the melodically beguiling 'Anotherloverholenyohead' (yes, it is a stupid title, isn't it). Finally, the showpiece ballad, 'Sometimes It Snows In April' (an even worse title) ends the record on a folksy acoustic noteand mourns the aforesaid departed Tracy. I feel that Prince is, on the whole, best at this most sentimental and foppishly despolate, but this is appalling kitsch and doesn't work at all.

I dunno. Is it possible, or even advisable, to take Prince seriously ? Do I have to watch Dynasty to have an attitude ? I find this record laboured and trite and self-satisfied and won't be listening to it again.

-- Barney Hoskyns

thanks to prince-in-print

This is interesting. I disagree with the reviewer. But interesting nevertheless.

SoulAlive said:

I agree with some of the comments in that Parade review That album sounds rushed and unfocused at times.Even Prince agreed.He later admitted that he "recorded it too soon after 'Around The World In A Day' and I didn't have enough great songs ready.I'm not gonna make that same mistake again".

which is a MAD statement for Prince to make at any point about his 80's output.

[Edited 4/29/13 9:09am]

jaawwnn said:

SoulAlive said:

I agree with some of the comments in that Parade review That album sounds rushed and unfocused at times.Even Prince agreed.He later admitted that he "recorded it too soon after 'Around The World In A Day' and I didn't have enough great songs ready.I'm not gonna make that same mistake again".

which is a MAD statement for Prince to make at any point about his 80's output.

[Edited 4/29/13 9:09am]

That's why I like the review. Although I don't agree with it, it illustrates the point that we here at prince.org often view the 80's with purple tinted glasses. He wasn't untouchable.

*

By in large, the masses were kind of "over" Prince after Purple Rain. With the exception of "kiss," Most everything associated with Under the Cherry Moon suffered from how hard of a flop that movie was. Again, the music is great, but a lot of folks (even hardcore oldschool Prince fans) just didn't "get it".

*

You'd be amazed how many people kinda lost interest in Prince post 1984/85 and only picked back up when Batman hit.

[Edited 4/29/13 11:06am]

skywalker said:

steakfinger said:

I didn't say it was accurate as evidenced by the disclaimer in my last few lines of text. I believe every word of the disclaimer, too. Thank you very much.

So why bother posting in the first place? What kind of response were you looking for?

I posted a Parade review that I am sure someone else agrees with. What do you make of it?

*

Maybe it's my lying eyes that are bothering me, but isn't the world "accurate" in the title of the thread? Or, does accurate just mean he's just glad that someone agrees with him?

skywalker said:

jaawwnn said:

which is a MAD statement for Prince to make at any point about his 80's output.

[Edited 4/29/13 9:09am]

That's why I like the review. Although I don't agree with it, it illustrates the point that we here at prince.org often view the 80's with purple tinted glasses. He wasn't untouchable.

*

By in large, the masses were kind of "over" Prince after Purple Rain. With the exception of "kiss," Most everything associated with Under the Cherry Moon suffered from how hard of a flop that movie was. Again, the music is great, but a lot of folks (even hardcore oldschool Prince fans) just didn't "get it".

*

You'd be amazed how many people kinda lost interest in Prince post 1984/85 and only picked back up when Batman hit.

[Edited 4/29/13 11:06am]

*

Skywalker, you are dead-on again with all three points. By the end of ATWIAD and Parade/UTCM, the number of public Prince fans was almost back to the number during the Dirty Mind era. Though I would add that SOTT reclaimed some mass popularity until "If I Was Your Girlfriend" was released; then Lovesexy sent the casual fan running for the safe confines of Top 40. In fact, I remember either Ebony or Jet or maybe Right On or Black Beat calling the Lovesexy Tour a "last ditch effort" to save Prince's dying career.

1725topp said:

skywalker said:

That's why I like the review. Although I don't agree with it, it illustrates the point that we here at prince.org often view the 80's with purple tinted glasses. He wasn't untouchable.

*

By in large, the masses were kind of "over" Prince after Purple Rain. With the exception of "kiss," Most everything associated with Under the Cherry Moon suffered from how hard of a flop that movie was. Again, the music is great, but a lot of folks (even hardcore oldschool Prince fans) just didn't "get it".

*

You'd be amazed how many people kinda lost interest in Prince post 1984/85 and only picked back up when Batman hit.

[Edited 4/29/13 11:06am]

*

Skywalker, you are dead-on again with all three points. By the end of ATWIAD and Parade/UTCM, the number of public Prince fans was almost back to the number during the Dirty Mind era. Though I would add that SOTT reclaimed some mass popularity until "If I Was Your Girlfriend" was released; then Lovesexy sent the casual fan running for the safe confines of Top 40. In fact, I remember either Ebony or Jet or maybe Right On or Black Beat calling the Lovesexy Tour a "last ditch effort" to save Prince's dying career.

Agreed. I think this is why he started making more conventional (for Prince) sounding music from 1990 onwards.

[Edited 4/29/13 11:48am]

SoulAlive said:

I agree with some of the comments in that Parade review That album sounds rushed and unfocused at times.Even Prince agreed.He later admitted that he "recorded it too soon after 'Around The World In A Day' and I didn't have enough great songs ready.I'm not gonna make that same mistake again".

I think Prince was full of it there and just trying to cover his ass over a disappointing chart run.

jtfolden said:

SoulAlive said:

I agree with some of the comments in that Parade review That album sounds rushed and unfocused at times.Even Prince agreed.He later admitted that he "recorded it too soon after 'Around The World In A Day' and I didn't have enough great songs ready.I'm not gonna make that same mistake again".

I think Prince was full of it there and just trying to cover his ass over a disappointing chart run.

And the disaster that was UTCM's performance.

1725topp said:

skywalker said:

So why bother posting in the first place? What kind of response were you looking for?

I posted a Parade review that I am sure someone else agrees with. What do you make of it?

*

Maybe it's my lying eyes that are bothering me, but isn't the world "accurate" in the title of the thread? Or, does accurate just mean he's just glad that someone agrees with him?

and the word accurate is followed by (IMO) which was followed by my post in which I proclaimed that art is subjective and my opinion is that only. IN MY OPINION the review expresses many things I felt about the album. In my opinion the review is accurate, but opinion is not fact. That's why I put the disclaimer at the end of my original post. No record review can be accurate in terms of absolutes if it deals with subjective things. A review can only be accurate if it mentions nothing but facts, (of which quality is not). Examples would be:

"This album comtains drums, bass, guitar, keyboards and vocals."

That is the only accurate review possible of Lotusflow3r.

[Edited 5/1/13 9:05am]

steakfinger said:

1725topp said:

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Maybe it's my lying eyes that are bothering me, but isn't the world "accurate" in the title of the thread? Or, does accurate just mean he's just glad that someone agrees with him?

and the word accurate is followed by (IMO) which was followed by my post in which I proclaimed that art is subjective and my opinion is that only. IN MY OPINION the review expresses many things I felt about the album. In my opinion the review is accurate, but opinion is not fact. That's why I put the disclaimer at the end of my original post. No record review can be accurate in terms of absolutes if it deals with subjective things. A review can only be accurate if it mentions nothing but facts, (of which quality is not). Examples would be:

"This album comtains drums, bass, guitar, keyboards and vocals."

That is the only accurate review possible of Lotusflow3r.

[Edited 5/1/13 9:05am]

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So, now you are correcting us for your "flawed" use of a term? You used the term "accurate" as to infer that somehow your "opinion" of Lotusflow3r is more valid than those who like it. That is the only reason for using "accurate." If that was not the case, you could have simply titled your thread, "A Review of LotusFlow3r with which I Agree" or "A Review of Lotusflow3r that Makes Good Points," but you didn't title it that because it seems that it was your desire, based on the "word" that you used, to post a review that seemingly "proved" that your "opinion" of Lotusflow3r is, again, more valid, which is affirmed by you stating how "annoyed" you are that so many people like and discuss Lotusflow3r regularly. What's funny is that you then try to cover your tracks by saying, "But I didn't really care" that so many people like/discuss it regularly. If that's so, if you don't care how many people like it, then why post an article that discusses how bad the album is with the heading, an "Accurate...Review"? Clearly, you cared enough to post an article that you think refutes the posts of those who like Lotusflow3r. Notice how I'm basing my response exclusively on your words? (Trust me, playa, I can do this word/terminology thing all day.) So, don't try to blame us for your "flawed" use of a term or because your "connotation" or "inference" has been peeped. (Oh, by the way, “peeped” means recognized, realized, or discovered, just in case you ain’t from da hood.) And as for the notion that "A review can only be accurate if it mentions nothing but facts, (of which quality is not). Examples would be: 'This album comtains drums, bass, guitar, keyboards and vocals,'" I would give you a lesson in Derrida's notion of Deconstruction or even Saussure’s notion of Structuralism with an emphasis on sign and signifier, but it would be a waste of time since you don't seem to be honest regarding what your words reveal about your intent. So, I'll just let you backtrack or moonwalk from your initial position since clearly you are realizing that most people understand what you were asserting or inferring with the use of the world "accurate". Finally, most of us don't care if you like Lotusflow3r or not. It's just funny that once Skywalker peeped your game, you began tap dancing and moonwalking like a thief with his hand caught in the cookie jar.

Funny thing is that, despite the review of Parade published by this NME journalist, the album was chosen record of the year by the same publication in 1986. In fact, it's the only Prince album that was chosen record of the year by the NME, if I'm not mistaken.

skywalker said:

jaawwnn said:

which is a MAD statement for Prince to make at any point about his 80's output.

[Edited 4/29/13 9:09am]

That's why I like the review. Although I don't agree with it, it illustrates the point that we here at prince.org often view the 80's with purple tinted glasses. He wasn't untouchable.

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By in large, the masses were kind of "over" Prince after Purple Rain. With the exception of "kiss," Most everything associated with Under the Cherry Moon suffered from how hard of a flop that movie was. Again, the music is great, but a lot of folks (even hardcore oldschool Prince fans) just didn't "get it".

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You'd be amazed how many people kinda lost interest in Prince post 1984/85 and only picked back up when Batman hit.

[Edited 4/29/13 11:06am]

Well what i've noticed with most people (myself included) is that when they first get into Prince what they want to hear is the classic Prince sound of Controversy -> 1999 -> Purple Rain. The last thing a person wants is to be given a copy of Parade and told this is his best album and oh by the way it sounds nothing like what you were wanting or expecting. It takes a while before you get to appreciate, or want to apprecaite, what he was going for with Parade, mainly due to the speed at which he was working and evolving.

As far as i'm concerned Price's music was fairly untouchable in the 80's. It doesn't mean he couldn't make bad films, steal other peoples riffs/songs and generally cause all sorts of havoc with the personal life of anyone he went near. The sheer volume of consistently brilliant music he was making makes a statement like that laughable to me. He had more than enough great songs ready.

Anyway no idea if I just agreed or disagreed with you there!