8up said:

Websters defines classic as, "serving as a standard of excellence." So, I would have to not include Batman in this definition. 1979-1987 would apply. Although we all love "Lovesexy" but it's really only Prince fans that do. Musicology was good, but really it was only because he gave away the album at the shows for free (that's how I got copy) and the Rock 'N Roll Hall of Fame performance gave him huge momentum to drive up album sales, not to mention the big tour. I don't really think the album itself is much better PE, or 20ten and surely not better than 3121, but the hype was huge.

He's getting old and the potential for him being the future is minimum so we have to stop thinking that he's gonna be huge again because outside of us, no one really cares. I just wish he'd get his management together so he could just sit back and make music instead of worrying about all the little details like money and lawsuits and crap.

I don't trust Webster as far as I can throw him. That is prescriptive language, not descriptive. There is nothing 'classic' about haveing beer bottles thrown at you as an opening act! Perserverance through hard times, sure. Thats why 1982 is a better year, he was a real PRO by then. Batman (the comic) is a part of Americana, he is like a sacred totem. Participating in the soundtrack with Elfman and Burton...this is like a time capsule or something 1987 cuts it too short, 1989 demmonstrated a historical place of acceptance and lacks the "sell out" stigma of D&P...

violectrica said:

8up said:

Websters defines classic as, "serving as a standard of excellence." So, I would have to not include Batman in this definition. 1979-1987 would apply. Although we all love "Lovesexy" but it's really only Prince fans that do. Musicology was good, but really it was only because he gave away the album at the shows for free (that's how I got copy) and the Rock 'N Roll Hall of Fame performance gave him huge momentum to drive up album sales, not to mention the big tour. I don't really think the album itself is much better PE, or 20ten and surely not better than 3121, but the hype was huge.

He's getting old and the potential for him being the future is minimum so we have to stop thinking that he's gonna be huge again because outside of us, no one really cares. I just wish he'd get his management together so he could just sit back and make music instead of worrying about all the little details like money and lawsuits and crap.

I don't trust Webster as far as I can throw him. That is prescriptive language, not descriptive. There is nothing 'classic' about haveing beer bottles thrown at you as an opening act! Perserverance through hard times, sure. Thats why 1982 is a better year, he was a real PRO by then. Batman (the comic) is a part of Americana, he is like a sacred totem. Participating in the soundtrack with Elfman and Burton...this is like a time capsule or something 1987 cuts it too short, 1989 demmonstrated a historical place of acceptance and lacks the "sell out" stigma of D&P...

Perserverance? He ran off the stage within seconds and got into his car and went back to MPLS. Dez had to talk him into going back, then he ran off again! You think Batman is a time capsule for some kind of consumate sound of the time? Wrong. It was a farce and a distaction from his worries at the time. Yes, Batdance must have taken him lots of time, but so did my taxes before Turbo Tax showed up. I appreciate your intelligence and your dignity, but I do not agree with you that Batman is classic.

Just read your post again, and maybe you're saying that 1981 is not classic. Is that right? So you think Batman is classic, but not Dirty Mind? wow.

[Edited 4/25/13 1:03am]

Prince fans are funny.

If you look around prince.org, there are constant attempts to quantify/qualify Prince's music into neat little perfectly wrapped up boxes. To me, Prince's music has been a huge messy spectrum of styles and colors...just like his fanbase. Yet, here we are trying to make our personal tastes/opinions THE NORM for everyone.

Personally, there are songs on 20ten that I like better than some of the songs on Parade or Dirty Mind. So, although I can easily get with the idea that Prince in the 80's is "classic" Prince, it's just a made up label that serves me no real purpose other than to bicker and hug with people here at prince.org

8up said:

violectrica said:

I don't trust Webster as far as I can throw him. That is prescriptive language, not descriptive. There is nothing 'classic' about haveing beer bottles thrown at you as an opening act! Perserverance through hard times, sure. Thats why 1982 is a better year, he was a real PRO by then. Batman (the comic) is a part of Americana, he is like a sacred totem. Participating in the soundtrack with Elfman and Burton...this is like a time capsule or something 1987 cuts it too short, 1989 demmonstrated a historical place of acceptance and lacks the "sell out" stigma of D&P...

Perserverance? He ran off the stage within seconds and got into his car and went back to MPLS. Dez had to talk him into going back, then he ran off again! You think Batman is a time capsule for some kind of consumate sound of the time? Wrong. It was a farce and a distaction from his worries at the time. Yes, Batdance must have taken him lots of time, but so did my taxes before Turbo Tax showed up. I appreciate your intelligence and your dignity, but I do not agree with you that Batman is classic.

Just read your post again, and maybe you're saying that 1981 is not classic. Is that right? So you think Batman is classic, but not Dirty Mind? wow.

[Edited 4/25/13 1:03am]

This is my fault. I do not own that one only heard songs from it individually. Oops. All the ones before and after it though I own. Don't know why I accidently ended up without it....

skywalker said:

Prince fans are funny.

If you look around prince.org, there are constant attempts to quantify/qualify Prince's music into neat little perfectly wrapped up boxes. To me, Prince's music has been a huge messy spectrum of styles and colors...just like his fanbase. Yet, here we are trying to make our personal tastes/opinions THE NORM for everyone.

Personally, there are songs on 20ten that I like better than some of the songs on Parade or Dirty Mind. So, although I can easily get with the idea that Prince in the 80's is "classic" Prince, it's just a made up label that serves me no real purpose other than to bicker and hug with people here at prince.org

lol I hear what you're saying

♥

But it's not about liking this song over that song.

♥

something Prince created today, just cannot be considered 'Classic'

Just by definition of the word, 3rd Eye Girl shows can't be considered 'Classic' (vs Act II)

This is definately an 'era' in the making: 3rd Eye Girl, all female band, no keyboards/synth/piano

But it just doesn't qualify as being a 'classic' era

♥

I don't really know what the age of something has to be to be considered 'classic' but I'm thinking older than 5-10 years. Personally I think anything from 1977-2004/5 to be considered.

♥

Another example: 20Ten(album)/era vs Around the World in a Day(album)/era can you actually judge 20Ten as an era and then compare it/weigh it against say Around the World in a Day or even Come?

♥

I would also think an era has to be judged on the album/creative output, videos/ concerts/shows, pop culture buzz or controversy outfits/the look, it's interconnections etc

But I just don't think most stuff done in the last 5-10 years can be considered "classic" Prince eras yet

clas·sic

/ˈklæsɪk/ Show Spelled [klas-ik] Show IPA

paisleypark4 said:

herb4 said:

What? Most of his funkiest stuff was from the 90's.

Wasnt nothing like

The Work

Dance 4 Me

Lavaux

Everlasting Now

Breakfast Can WAit

No Candy 4 U

Valentina

Black Sweat

Lolita

Get On The Boat

1+1+1=3

Chelsea Rogers

or even Y Should I Do That When I Can Do This

in the 90s child

Face Down

My Name is Prince

Gett Off

Days of Wild

Sexy MF

Return of the Bump Squad

Big Fun

The Exodus Has Begun

The Max

Now

Billy Jack Bitch

Calhoun Square

P Control

18 & Over

Get Wild

Let It Go

Come

Daddy Pop

Come On

We Can Funk

You said there was no funk in the 90's. Not true.

It seems overall (so far) most do consider some combination of 1978-1989 as the Classic Era

OldFriends4Sale said:

It seems overall (so far) most do consider some combination of 1978-1989 as the Classic Era

Trouble is, it's not really an "era". It's a decade with a bunch of eras in between.

Within these are actualy eras with different styles/looks/moods/tones/sounds. The Parade Era is not the same as The Dirty Mind era. So, can these all be "classic" eras? If so, is the Diamonds and Pearls era not classic? Is the time period that Prince was not it's own era?

[Edited 4/26/13 7:56am]

skywalker said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It seems overall (so far) most do consider some combination of 1978-1989 as the Classic Era

Trouble is, it's not really an "era". It's a decade with a bunch of eras in between.

Within these are actualy eras with different styles/looks/moods/tones/sounds. The Parade Era is not the same as The Dirty Mind era. So, can these all be "classic" eras? If so, is the Diamonds and Pearls era not classic? Is the time period that Prince was not it's own era?

Yes.

No.

Fonkyman said:

skywalker said:

Trouble is, it's not really an "era". It's a decade with a bunch of eras in between.

Within these are actualy eras with different styles/looks/moods/tones/sounds. The Parade Era is not the same as The Dirty Mind era. So, can these all be "classic" eras? If so, is the Diamonds and Pearls era not classic? Is the time period that Prince was not it's own era?

Yes.

No.

Yet, there is a very strong argument to be made that, in the grand scheme things , Prince's Diamonds and Pearls era had far more cultural impact than, for example, the Parade era or the Lovesexy era. Obviously, Prince fans may feel different levels of love...but Diamonds and Pearls era Prince is one of the Prince eras that springs to many people's minds after the Purple Rain era. So again, what makes an era "classic"? And do fans decide, or the rest of the world?

[Edited 4/26/13 11:37am]

[Edited 4/26/13 11:43am]

skywalker said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It seems overall (so far) most do consider some combination of 1978-1989 as the Classic Era

Trouble is, it's not really an "era". It's a decade with a bunch of eras in between.

Within these are actualy eras with different styles/looks/moods/tones/sounds. The Parade Era is not the same as The Dirty Mind era. So, can these all be "classic" eras? If so, is the Diamonds and Pearls era not classic? Is the time period that Prince was not it's own era?

[Edited 4/26/13 7:56am]

That's true

A Decade of Era's 1980s 1990s 2000s

*

I would say yes,

1 reason is that overall the people(band members/engineers/managers) from For U - Lovesexy were a part of the same eras, give or take

*

If you think about it, the direction, the 'ideal', the vision was very similar Uptown Erotic City Paisley Park, it all had some kind of interconnectedness, after that period it all changed and the focus vision (bandmembers) etc changed, the scene was just different.

*

I looked back over the OP and they used the term 'Golden Age'

I still see that 198-1989 period as a very foundational period, extremely defining, even if Prince tried to break away from it, it will forever define him. "In a GOOD way"

OldFriends4Sale said:

skywalker said:

Trouble is, it's not really an "era". It's a decade with a bunch of eras in between.

Within these are actualy eras with different styles/looks/moods/tones/sounds. The Parade Era is not the same as The Dirty Mind era. So, can these all be "classic" eras? If so, is the Diamonds and Pearls era not classic? Is the time period that Prince was not it's own era?

[Edited 4/26/13 7:56am]

That's true

A Decade of Era's 1980s 1990s 2000s

*

I would say yes,

1 reason is that overall the people(band members/engineers/managers) from For U - Lovesexy were a part of the same eras, give or take

Were the people the same? Seems to me that he had different managers and band members and engineers all throughout the years 1978-1989. Right?

*

If you think about it, the direction, the 'ideal', the vision was very similar Uptown Erotic City Paisley Park, it all had some kind of interconnectedness, after that period it all changed and the focus vision (bandmembers) etc changed, the scene was just different.

I hear you, but the same purple utopia found in "uptown" "Erotic city" "Paisley Park" still carried on in Lovesexy's theme of "glam Slam" "New power generation." In turn, both of these themes extended way into the 90's as did newer versions of the very same theme. "Rainbow Children" anyone? The purple utopian ideas/ideal can be found all Prince's post 80's albums.

*

I looked back over the OP and they used the term 'Golden Age'

I still see that 198-1989 period as a very foundational period, extremely defining, even if Prince tried to break away from it, it will forever define him. "In a GOOD way"

To me, a decade is much too long to be foundational. Prince 1978-1988 is a lifetime/career for most. I think Prince's foundational period was cemented and over the minute "little Red corvette" hit the world.

[Edited 4/26/13 11:52am]

Batman is musically too unremarkable to be included!

Were the people the same? Seems to me that he had different managers and band members and engineers all throughout the years 1978-1989. Right?

♥

I did say 'give or take'

from the beginning he had Bobby Z(before 4U) Matt Fink Dez all the way up to 1999, Lisa Coleman from Dirty Mind up to Parade/Dream Factory, Jill Jones & Wendy Melvoin were in the camp to various degrees and knew Prince from Dirty Mind onward, Sheila E. Susannah from the PR era to the Parade era

Susan Rogers, Coke Johnson, Alan Leeds

What I mean is the majority of the people in that time period were interconnected, the SOTT/Lovesexy band was mostly the Parade extended Revolution, + Sheila E & Levi were a protege band from the PR period who performed live and studio with Prince & Prince and the Revolution regularly, Boni came on in 1986 for Sheila E, Cat was the only real new person to the camp.

*

If you think about it, the direction, the 'ideal', the vision was very similar Uptown Erotic City Paisley Park, it all had some kind of interconnectedness, after that period it all changed and the focus vision (bandmembers) etc changed, the scene was just different.

I hear you, but the same purple utopia found in "uptown" "Erotic city" "Paisley Park" still carried on in Lovesexy's theme of "glam Slam" "New power generation." In turn, both of these themes extended way into the 90's as did newer versions of the very same theme. "Rainbow Children" anyone? The purple utopian ideas/ideal can be found all Prince's post 80's albums.

♥

I'm not leaving SOTT/Lovesexy out, I'm saying that Uptown/EroticCity/Paisley Park vision was defining of that whole period. I'm not talking about the albums those songs were released with but the vibe of that period was reflected by those... Even before 'Uptown' was released Prince was expressing that in his albums and shows. In an interview he said something to the degree of Paisley Park being an idea he wanted to express years before.

*

I looked back over the OP and they used the term 'Golden Age'

I still see that 198-1989 period as a very foundational period, extremely defining, even if Prince tried to break away from it, it will forever define him. "In a GOOD way"

To me, a decade is much too long to be foundational. Prince 1978-1988 is a lifetime/career for most. I think Prince's foundational period was cemented and over the minute "little Red corvette" hit the world.

♥

It is a lifetime career for most, but most didn't put out an album every year for their whole career lol

Foundational in that what he did on those albums are definate Prince sounds "Purple Music", that is the only period I can listen to his music and say this is Prince's Sound. From 1999, Parade, Lovesexy there is something about the styles and music that says "Prince"

Little Red Corvette was just really putting him on the map in a large scale, so I wouldn't say it was cemented. When in a large way Purple Rain is the cementing affect. Little Red Corvette also didn't fuel the direction his music took into ATWIAD Parade or even SOTT, yet you can hear those previous albums sound throught ATWIAD Parade SOTT

If you listen to Tick Tick Bang, you hear the same kind of wildness in Sexuality, Darling Nikki and Tamborine

If you listen to 'That Girl Thang' & Tangerine, you hear Leaving 4 NY When 2 R in Love How Come U Don't Call Me Anymore, When We're Dancing Close & Slow,

♥

I'm not saying I'm totally correct on everything, because it's really the usage of Classic, Golden Age of prince Decade / Era etc that we have to figure out

Each album overall has it's own Era some short some long,

some crossover into another,

but to me that 1980s (decade) is very interconnected.

the 1990's(decade) can be split in 2 -Nude Tour - Come/Torah Torah/Gold and then Chaos & Disorder / Emancipation- Rave

(Graffiti Bridge even though it has some kind of 1988/89 Lovesexy influence seem to stand on its own somehow)

2000s from ONA- Planet Earth seems to have a very similar look and feel throught

skywalker said:

Fonkyman said:

Yes.

No.

Yet, there is a very strong argument to be made that, in the grand scheme things , Prince's Diamonds and Pearls era had far more cultural impact than, for example, the Parade era or the Lovesexy era. Obviously, Prince fans may feel different levels of love...but Diamonds and Pearls era Prince is one of the Prince eras that springs to many people's minds after the Purple Rain era. So again, what makes an era "classic"? And do fans decide, or the rest of the world?

♥

Fans decide

Because we are looking at the whole body of his work, and the rest of the world for various reasons would not be familiar with a lot. Like how many would know about 20Ten or ONA or some obscure internet releases etc

♥

Parade music influenced a lot of music that followed, I don't think Diamonds & Pearls did. Even a lot of 'famous' musicians know the creative diversity of Parade vs Diamonds & Peals

Forget the fancy dictionary definitions of "classic"... When it comes to Prince's music, everyone's idea of "classic" is going to be different.

For me, Prince is inexorably tied to amazing periods of my life, times that were crucial in defining who I am now as an adult.

"Purple Rain" came out the summer before I went to college. Although it was everywhere, I wasn't yet a fan, believe it or not. It wasn't until "Siign 'O' The Times" was released, and an ex-friend sat me down and made me *listen". I was hooked.

It wasn't until "Graffiti Bridge" came out that I realized how much Prince's music had changed, and how my own tastes had veered off in another direction. I stayed plugged in over the years, experiencing surprising highs ("The Gold Experience") and crushing lows ("The Rainbow Children").

It was after "3121" that I decided I'd had enough, that Prince wasn't speaking to me or appealing to me anymore. That was the last album I bought. Since then, I've enjoyed the Org here as a place to find out about boots and old concerts.

So, after all that rambling, to me, his "classic" stuff is from 1980's "Dirty Mind" to 1989's "Batman". Yes, "Batman". Like I said, Prince was jumbled up in all that was going on in my life, and the release of the "Batman" movie was a huge deal to me and my friends.

And when you include all the unreleased stuff from that stretch of time, also, you've got an amazing well of tunes to draw from.

Regardless of whether or not I ever like another new song he's recorded, Prince has added to my life immeasurably, and I'll always appreciate that.

OldFriends4Sale said:

♥

I did say 'give or take'

from the beginning he had Bobby Z(before 4U) Matt Fink Dez all the way up to 1999, Lisa Coleman from Dirty Mind up to Parade/Dream Factory, Jill Jones & Wendy Melvoin were in the camp to various degrees and knew Prince from Dirty Mind onward, Sheila E. Susannah from the PR era to the Parade era

Susan Rogers, Coke Johnson, Alan Leeds

What I mean is the majority of the people in that time period were interconnected, the SOTT/Lovesexy band was mostly the Parade extended Revolution, + Sheila E & Levi were a protege band from the PR period who performed live and studio with Prince & Prince and the Revolution regularly, Boni came on in 1986 for Sheila E, Cat was the only real new person to the camp.

You could connect the dots from band members from 1989 all the way to now in a similar manner. Right? Let's be honest Prince's band from 1980 was an entirely different band than 1988 save for Dr Fink.

♥

I'm not leaving SOTT/Lovesexy out, I'm saying that Uptown/EroticCity/Paisley Park vision was defining of that whole period. I'm not talking about the albums those songs were released with but the vibe of that period was reflected by those... Even before 'Uptown' was released Prince was expressing that in his albums and shows. In an interview he said something to the degree of Paisley Park being an idea he wanted to express years before.

To me, the vibe was because it was the 80's and a certain era, more than it was Prince's own personal message. Honestly, there is a HUGE dichotomy in Prince's message from Dirty Mind to Lovesexy. Namely, GOD over SEX. Toure's book is all about this. I would suggest that the biggest shift of Prince's message happened in the 80's, not the 90's or afterwards.

It is a lifetime career for most, but most didn't put out an album every year for their whole career lol

Foundational in that what he did on those albums are definate Prince sounds "Purple Music", that is the only period I can listen to his music and say this is Prince's Sound. From 1999, Parade, Lovesexy there is something about the styles and music that says "Prince"

Little Red Corvette was just really putting him on the map in a large scale, so I wouldn't say it was cemented. When in a large way Purple Rain is the cementing affect.

I'll give you that Purple Rain cemented the foundation. However, his trademark sound drastically was changed/reduced after 1984. Not to say it was bad, just that fans of 1999 weren't guaranteed to love everything from 1985 onwards. It was different. Still Prince, but not foundational.

Little Red Corvette also didn't fuel the direction his music took into ATWIAD Parade or even SOTT, yet you can hear those previous albums sound throught ATWIAD Parade SOTT

If you listen to Tick Tick Bang, you hear the same kind of wildness in Sexuality, Darling Nikki and Tamborine

If you listen to 'That Girl Thang' & Tangerine, you hear Leaving 4 NY When 2 R in Love How Come U Don't Call Me Anymore, When We're Dancing Close & Slow,

♥

I'm not saying I'm totally correct on everything, because it's really the usage of Classic, Golden Age of prince Decade / Era etc that we have to figure out

Each album overall has it's own Era some short some long,

some crossover into another,

but to me that 1980s (decade) is very interconnected.

the 1990's(decade) can be split in 2 -Nude Tour - Come/Torah Torah/Gold and then Chaos & Disorder / Emancipation- Rave

(Graffiti Bridge even though it has some kind of 1988/89 Lovesexy influence seem to stand on its own somehow)

2000s from ONA- Planet Earth seems to have a very similar look and feel throught

I hear you. For me, the 80's is just as segmented as you are suggesting the 90's were. There was definitely a pre Wendy and Lisa Prince. And a post Wendy and Lisa Prince. All with in that 1978-1988/9 era. The sounds/styles/messages were not all seamlessly connected.

[Edited 4/26/13 17:30pm]

OldFriends4Sale said:

skywalker said:

Yet, there is a very strong argument to be made that, in the grand scheme things , Prince's Diamonds and Pearls era had far more cultural impact than, for example, the Parade era or the Lovesexy era. Obviously, Prince fans may feel different levels of love...but Diamonds and Pearls era Prince is one of the Prince eras that springs to many people's minds after the Purple Rain era. So again, what makes an era "classic"? And do fans decide, or the rest of the world?

♥

Fans decide

Because we are looking at the whole body of his work, and the rest of the world for various reasons would not be familiar with a lot. Like how many would know about 20Ten or ONA or some obscure internet releases etc

Is this how it is for other musicians? Do Bob Dylan or James Brown or Michael Jackson or Madonna or U2 fans define/decide "classic" eras? To me, that's some bullshit for Rollingstone and other music snobs.

♥

Parade music influenced a lot of music that followed, I don't think Diamonds & Pearls did. Even a lot of 'famous' musicians know the creative diversity of Parade vs Diamonds & Peals

1. How did Parade influence ?(not saying I disagree, just want examples).

2. Does creative diversity=classic era? Meaning, I don't care if ?uestlove digs Parade more than Diamonds and Pearls, Diamonds and Pearls impacted pop culture waaaaaay more than Under the Cherry Moon. Sad as that may make old Prince fans to hear.

I hope this 'fun' topic does turn disrespectful

snobs and old fans? like there are no young and new fans of UTCM...

skywalker said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Is this how it is for other musicians? Do Bob Dylan or James Brown or Michael Jackson or Madonna or U2 fans define/decide "classic" eras? To me, that's some bullshit for Rollingstone and other music snobs.

♥

Parade music influenced a lot of music that followed, I don't think Diamonds & Pearls did. Even a lot of 'famous' musicians know the creative diversity of Parade vs Diamonds & Peals

1. How did Parade influence ?(not saying I disagree, just want examples).

2. Does creative diversity=classic era? Meaning, I don't care if ?uestlove digs Parade more than Diamonds and Pearls, Diamonds and Pearls impacted pop culture waaaaaay more than Under the Cherry Moon. Sad as that may make old Prince fans to hear.

skywalker * You could connect the dots from band members from 1989 all the way to now in a similar manner. Right? Let's be honest Prince's band from 1980 was an entirely different band than 1988 save for Dr Fink.

♥

If those band members are band members all the way to now, then yes. But what band members in 1989 are band members in 2013? Even Dr Fink talked about how different he felt compared to all the new ones in 1990 and how he knew it was a differen vibe, of course after the Nude tour he was done.

Now whatever Prince's direction was in the 1990s and 2000s and the band members place in the camp would tell how things go. I personally don't think members/proteges were the same in the 1990s vs the 1980s.

Eric Leeds, Mico Weaver were in the camp since 1983, Wally Safford Gregory Brooks were Prince bodyguards, Atlanta Bliss was a part of the 1986 Revolution

I don't think I said all these people were the same band, I said they were all a part of the same period in where that vision Prince had was being displayed. From 1984-1986 everyone in the SOTT band (except 4 Cat) was jamming together, A Love Bizarre video, America(1985 PR tour) I Would Die 4 U, Baby I'm A Star, Kiss and some other Parade tour closeouts, Sheila E band opening for Prince & the Revolution for Purple Rain and at time Parade.

skywalker * To me, the vibe was because it was the 80's and a certain era, more than it was Prince's own personal message. Honestly, there is a HUGE dichotomy in Prince's message from Dirty Mind to Lovesexy. Namely, GOD over SEX. Toure's book is all about this. I would suggest that the biggest shift of Prince's message happened in the 80's, not the 90's or afterwards.

♥

Had to be more than just the 1980s. Of course the times influence what will happen to degrees. I mean I think the 1980s was the last decade a person could be a Super Star of the callibur of Prince, Michael Jackson and some others, for various reasons. But following Prince's music and how he began formulating his life early on will show you the beginnings of those utopian concepts. Like the message on the PR promo: Befoe He Created the Music He Lived Every Bit of It

Of course there will be differences, He's developing things, getting new ideas to add on to what was. I really don't see how God trumped Sex with Prince (looking at D&P - Come I don't see it) Parade had nothing that I can recall that showed any kind of religious shadow, and even Sex wasn't so upfront. SOTT all he had was the Cross, but that's all a different discussion.

skywalker *

I'll give you that Purple Rain cemented the foundation. However, his trademark sound drastically was changed/reduced after 1984. Not to say it was bad, just that fans of 1999 weren't guaranteed to love everything from 1985 onwards. It was different. Still Prince, but not foundational.

♥

Yes, the heavy "Minneapolis Sound" did change drastically, but I hear PR all over ATWIAD I can point out all kinds of sound on SOTT & Lovesexy that I hear throught the earlier albums. That's a discussion that would be good in its own thread, because I can go all the way up to 20Ten even some of these new songs I heard and bought that touch on stuff from Prince or ATWIAD or Parade.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I hope this 'fun' topic does not turn disrespectful

snobs and old fans? like there are no young and new fans of UTCM...

Sorry. No disrespect. Playing it loose with language.

OldFriends4Sale said:

♥

If those band members are band members all the way to now, then yes. But what band members in 1989 are band members in 2013? Even Dr Fink talked about how different he felt compared to all the new ones in 1990 and how he knew it was a differen vibe, of course after the Nude tour he was done.

Now whatever Prince's direction was in the 1990s and 2000s and the band members place in the camp would tell how things go. I personally don't think members/proteges were the same in the 1990s vs the 1980s.

Eric Leeds, Mico Weaver were in the camp since 1983, Wally Safford Gregory Brooks were Prince bodyguards, Atlanta Bliss was a part of the 1986 Revolution

I don't think I said all these people were the same band, I said they were all a part of the same period in where that vision Prince had was being displayed. From 1984-1986 everyone in the SOTT band (except 4 Cat) was jamming together, A Love Bizarre video, America(1985 PR tour) I Would Die 4 U, Baby I'm A Star, Kiss and some other Parade tour closeouts, Sheila E band opening for Prince & the Revolution for Purple Rain and at time Parade.

Well, if you compare Prince's 1980 band to the group he had in 1985/86 it's barely the same thing in terms of members..not to mention style, look, and sound.

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Now, from 1990 to 1995 Prince had a core of Sonny T, Michael Bland, and Tommy Barbarella. Sonny and Michael B have even been seen/heard with him as late as 2009. Not to mention that Rhonda, Mike Scott, and Morris Hayes have been in and out of the fold for the better part of the last 2 decades. As far as people "around" you can point out that Tony M, Kirk, and Damon were in the fold since 1984, yet they are oh so very early 90's Prince. Not the same era at all. Also, didn't Prince know Sonny T from childhood?

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The point I am making is: You cannot claim that Prince 1978-1988 was an era based on the constancy of people around him (and in his band) any more so than the 90's or 2000's. His group and personnel is usually in a state of flux.

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Had to be more than just the 1980s. Of course the times influence what will happen to degrees. I mean I think the 1980s was the last decade a person could be a Super Star of the callibur of Prince, Michael Jackson and some others, for various reasons. But following Prince's music and how he began formulating his life early on will show you the beginnings of those utopian concepts. Like the message on the PR promo: Befoe He Created the Music He Lived Every Bit of It

I don't disagree. Just stating that these utopian concepts have been a continuing from then up to now. Lotusflower and Rainbow Children: just different ways of saying "Uptown." Heck, look at the cover of MPLSound....what is that, if not Prince's purple utopia?

Of course there will be differences, He's developing things, getting new ideas to add on to what was. I really don't see how God trumped Sex with Prince (looking at D&P - Come I don't see it) Parade had nothing that I can recall that showed any kind of religious shadow, and even Sex wasn't so upfront. SOTT all he had was the Cross, but that's all a different discussion.

I guess what I am saying is that if you zoom out and look at his whole career, there are thematic threads and ideas that stretch beyond the 80's into everything he has done since. So, to me, defining the eras by marking decades is fairly rudementary way of doing it because the themes of freedom dance music sex romance have always been there.

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As far as God trumping sex, it wasn't like a battle (except the talking to God at the end of "temptation"), but more an idea that Sex and God are the same aka Lovesexy.

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Lovesexy is NOT what Dirty Mind and Controversy ("sexuality") was about. Heck, part of what makes SOTT so great is because it's like the album that Prince started having actual adult concepts of relationships to go with all of his horny talk. Again, albums like 1999 and SOTT are different in that respect. The common themes between them are themes that are common to nearly all Prince albums...freedom, dance, music, sex, romance.

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Yes, the heavy "Minneapolis Sound" did change drastically, but I hear PR all over ATWIAD I can point out all kinds of sound on SOTT & Lovesexy that I hear throught the earlier albums. That's a discussion that would be good in its own thread, because I can go all the way up to 20Ten even some of these new songs I heard and bought that touch on stuff from Prince or ATWIAD or Parade.

Again, I'll agree that 1978-1984 could be considered it's own era. The beginning. The foundation, if you prefer.

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I also can find stuff on Prince albums post 1984 that have the same DNA/sound as his earliest stuff. Even his work from 1990 onwards. Yet, there are so many distinctions in that 1st decade...as there were in the 90's. The biggest example being between pre WendyandLisa Prince and post WendyandLisa Prince. To me, they are not all the same era at all.

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Again, the first 10 years are often thrown into a box because it's the 1st decade and it's basically "80's Prince", but there was too much change (as there usually is) for me to swallow it as it's own era because of all of the differences (style/sound/look/themes) that actually occured in those years.

[Edited 4/26/13 21:20pm]

Well I'll say it again, for the sake of fun Prince fan conversation (since this was posted on a Prince fan site and not a general public site) most so far have called some degree of 1978-1989 the Classic Prince era;-)

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Good points Skywalker, good conversation...

Decades

OldFriends4Sale said:

Well I'll say it again, for the sake of fun Prince fan conversation (since this was posted on a Prince fan site and not a general public site) most so far have called some degree of 1978-1989 the Classic Prince era;-)

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Good points Skywalker, good conversation...

Decades

Thanks, you too.

hhhhdmt said:

you are allowed to like whatever the hell you want. If someone thinks the gold experience or the rainbow children are great records, then they are entitled to that opinion.

If I don't like that opinion I am entitled to kill them.

skywalker said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Well I'll say it again, for the sake of fun Prince fan conversation (since this was posted on a Prince fan site and not a general public site) most so far have called some degree of 1978-1989 the Classic Prince era;-)

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Good points Skywalker, good conversation...

Decades

Thanks, you too.

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Maybe later we can start a thread that really breaks it down

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I know a lot of fans at times have combined eras in 2 like ForU + Prince, Dirty Mind + Controversy, 1999 + Purple Rain and so forth

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Sometimes that does seem to work, but then you can find strong overlaps and similarities in another period

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For example, for me, I connect For U-Prince-Dirty Mind in connection to a lot of it's simplicity, especially the ballads. But Dirty Mind & Controversy introduce New Wave and the look is similar and a few other things. Then to me Purple Rain & ATWIAD are very much alike yet very different. Parade is nothing like ATWIAD, It might be closer to SOTT, but definately if Dream Factory was released Parade & Dream Factory would have had a strong connection, the maturing of his lyrics and style in that time...

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But again, good converstation, challenging.

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would love to hear from hardcore 1990s fans, as long as they don't think it was better than the 1980s lol will have 2 take them 2 task

look Prince thru Sott defined prince .. it was his sound his themes his style his intentions his collaboration .. you all act like just cuz prince changes his underwear its a new era .. there is nothing after Sott that can be considered classic in any regard .. you diamonds and pearls and gold and rainbow fans just have horrible taste .. even prince fans know his later music sucks and certainly influences no one and certainly has nothing innovative going on enough to 'define' an era .. its mostly just prince rehash with crappy trends like elevator jazz and rap desecrating what is left of prince talent .. so if you love prince he certainly has a classic era of Prince thru Sott .. if u hate prince then yes .. gold is a classic era of prince sucking in a most classic prince way .. there is nothing classic that has come from prince since sott

^You forgot about Lovesexy. Too good and unique to be left out, even if it's weaker than it predecessors.

TrevorAyer said:

look Prince thru Sott defined prince .. it was his sound his themes his style his intentions his collaboration .. you all act like just cuz prince changes his underwear its a new era .. there is nothing after Sott that can be considered classic in any regard .. you diamonds and pearls and gold and rainbow fans just have horrible taste .. even prince fans know his later music sucks and certainly influences no one and certainly has nothing innovative going on enough to 'define' an era .. its mostly just prince rehash with crappy trends like elevator jazz and rap desecrating what is left of prince talent .. so if you love prince he certainly has a classic era of Prince thru Sott .. if u hate prince then yes .. gold is a classic era of prince sucking in a most classic prince way .. there is nothing classic that has come from prince since sott

Stop trying to enforce your opinion onto others.

"even prince fans know his later music sucks". Rubbish. You do not speak for others. People who like Gold or TRC do not have bad taste, they are perfectly entitled to their opinion

The Gold experience received highly positive reviews from major music critics. Of course, according to you, all those critics have terrible taste too.Why did TGE receive strong reviews if it is such a terrible record?

The reality, however, is that it is a strong record and up there with his best work. You simply refuse to believe that some people like prince's more recent work. Newsflash: most of us are not here following an artist whose work we haven't liked in 20 years. Most of us like atleast some of his recent work, thats why we are here. Most Prince fans like some of his recent work, and therefore most of us do not hate him.

There are also plenty of classic, YES CLASSIC, songs that prince has done since SOTT that are among his best work. Pink Cashmere, Anna Stesia, And God Created Woman, When eye lay my hands on u, She loves me 4 me etc. If you don't like these than thats perfectly fine, but you do not speak for others.

dear hhhhmdt

you are entitled to your opinion just as i am entitled to share my facts about REALITY!

Most prince fans do indeed find his last 20 years pretty bad. Most prince fans no longer buy his records anymore. Of the remaining hardcore fans, mixed with many people who just have the hots for prince, MOST of those, ahem, fans, check out whatever prince is doing, not because it is good, but because it once was so good, that it is hard to believe he has lost ALL of that talent, forever. Hard to believe yet most likely true, as his recent output rarely rises above polished turd status. Considering rolling stone gave the sludge remix of 'lets go crazy' a four star rating, and has done nothing but praise every turd that came from 3rd Eye Girl, we can EASILY conclude that media is manipulated by money and not quality critique. The Gold Experience marks the Classic Era of Prince Sucking, and nothing more. It is the beginning of a long and painfully drawn out end to prince recording career. I expect prince next record to be free with my Bed Bath and Beyond catalog soon enough. Once again hhhhmdt you confuse your vitrol for anything other than "prince dingleberries taste like a classic era to me", for the actual topic at hand, which is "classic era". List all the individual prince songs you like, there was an ERA where prince was the best music out there. The Gold era was not that era. It did not define prince sound, it ruined it. He still had a few tricks up his sleave, but for most it was a time to drop prince. Had Gold lived up to "classic era" standards, his tour would not have been such a failure, and he would likely not have had to change his name back just to get anyone to pretend to care about him again. Plus the songs are kinda crappy. Especially the lyrics. As you MUST know yet refuse to accept.

10 years of outstanding music is all the reason anybody needs to check out and discuss prince in the modern day. People who think his last 20 years are better than his first 10 years should just stick to looking a photos of prince ass. Since that is clearly what your fandom is all about. Hell, prince records would sell better with his ass on the cover and no music on it at this point.