i'm lazy... sorry

SpiritOtter said:

You make an excellent point; in the 90s (and in the 00s) Prince appeared to release far more output than in the 80s, certainly in terms of album length (I believe this was due to the advent of new technology i.e. CD capacity, but I could be mistaken).

Indeed, the quality control and distinct product marketing, either by Warner Brothers and/or Prince, in the 80s was second to none in my opinion, especially when you think about the strength of the vision for each album/concept/era within the 80s. The 90s somewhat suffered in this respect, especially from Emancipation onwards, with the beginning of less readily identifiable brand concepts/messages. I suspect this was because Prince was understandibly trying to understand new business models and methods of delivery in a way he simply wasn't required to do when he was under contract and the business side of his output was largely taken care of by a global company.

I also agree that, whilst we all appear to salivate at the release of yet more 80s outtakes, I wonder how many of us would have been as enamoured with these hidden gems had they actually been released on lengthier albums at the time. It is true that the quality is largely phenomenal in the 80s, as you would expect, however, I suspect the 90s represented the first time that Prince had free reign to put all his creations into each product, hence the lengthier, seemingly less cohesive, albums, (Emancipation, Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic, The Gold Experience, Diamonds and Pearls and Love Symbol). I suspect if the original incarnation of The Dawn had been released it might also have suffered the same fate i.e. overload.

love,

Spirit

Think about this: the song "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic" is from 88 or 89 and it was coveted and beloved as a rare gem/bootleg.

Once the song was officially released in 1999, people were no longer enamoured with it as they were other bootlegs from the same era.

OldFriends4Sale said:

namepeace said:

Sound reasoning, but in terms of his official output, we're talking "tree falling in the woods" here. Which is why I have no problem listing songs cut in the 80's but released in the 90's among his 90's body of work.

for me it's hard because it's like him releasing the Our Destiny Lust U Always or MoonBeams in 1995, it just doesn't work, it's crediting a period for something it didn't produce

I mean he released Power Fantastic (as an internet release?) in the 1990's, a song that was a cornerstone cut of Dream Factory full Revolution band live take (at his new home studio in 1986) composition by Lisa Coleman etc etc It can't represent what Prince was doing in the 1990's

I glad he remade Tick Tick Bang & Old Friends 4 Sale and released them, because I can (accept them) as 1990's cuts, but if he rel 1981Tick Tick Bang and 1985Old Friends 4 Sale in the 1990's they just wouldn't work as far as meshing with his current music and life experiences. Especially a song like Old Friends 4 Sale or Hello

I just can't count it as a 1990's era song because it doesn't really represent what the NPG was doing, same with those other songs,

When I hear Still Would Stand All Time, I'm hearing it live on the Lovesexy tour aftershows, calling Sheila E for the drums, asking for the band to come out etc

Joy in Repetion a song that segues into another DF era cut and has another DF era cut segue into it

the inspiration, the musicians, the sounds, experiments are 1980's not 1990's

I get all of that, which is reasonable and defensible.

But . . . a lot of his 1990s work was influenced by the 80s work, and the general public -- even many Prince fans -- had not heard a lot of these songs at the time they were released (as a soft release or otherwise on record).

And, there were minute differences that made hearing "Joy" before Graffiti Bridge and later on Graffiti Bridge completely different experiences. Same applies for others as well.

SpiritOtter said:

namepeace said:

The 90's wasn't a decade of "masterpieces" or "landmarks" like the 1980s, his undisputed prime. But, I think he realized that his only competition was, himself in the past (to paraphrase).

But the 90s was, for the most part, a series of moments.

1. Songs. Prince created probably dozens of his best songs in the 1990s. Most of the ones listed are great, and there are so many more which were not. "And God Created Woman," "Dark," "Emancipation," "Money Don't Matter 2Night," " Like It There," "Shhh" . . . these and many others I'd put aside (most) any given song of the 1980s.

2. Moments. I think of certain "moments" in so many of his 90's songs. The crescendos in "Love 2 The 9's," "Saviour," "My Computer," and 'Come" being just a few.

3. Performances. Prince continued to blossom as a performer and showman in the 1990s.

4. The Curveballs. There are songs that may not have been "great" per se but were still pleasantly surprising. "Circle of Amour," "Strollin'," "Tangerine," etc.

If the 1980's were a five-course meal, then the 1990's were exquisite tapas.

Nice critique, namepeace.

I hadn't thought about it, as in songs/moments (rather than albums) being a defining factor of Prince's output in the 90s, but I can see how that argument rings true in many respects.

Thank you also for reminding me of DARK and MONEY DON'T MATTER TONIGHT. I would rework my initial tracklisting above to certainly include both of these songs. However, the problem I had was that there were so many brilliant "album" songs, like these two, that it became more and more difficult for me to include one, but not the other. Hence, I would have loved to have included songs like MY COMPUTER, CALHOUN SQUARE, BILLY JACK BITCH, WHITE MANSION, STROLLIN', 3RD EYE, THE LOVE WE MAKE and I LIKE IT THERE, to name but a few, but then it became impossible to streamlime the 'best of' to two discs. Needless to say, I found it a largely impossible task, as there was just so much great material I didn't include (but would have done so in a heartbeat if it was a 4CD retrospective)!

love,

Spirit

If you expanded it to 4, given his robust output, you'd be justified!

skywalker said:

SpiritOtter said:

You make an excellent point; in the 90s (and in the 00s) Prince appeared to release far more output than in the 80s, certainly in terms of album length (I believe this was due to the advent of new technology i.e. CD capacity, but I could be mistaken).

Indeed, the quality control and distinct product marketing, either by Warner Brothers and/or Prince, in the 80s was second to none in my opinion, especially when you think about the strength of the vision for each album/concept/era within the 80s. The 90s somewhat suffered in this respect, especially from Emancipation onwards, with the beginning of less readily identifiable brand concepts/messages. I suspect this was because Prince was understandibly trying to understand new business models and methods of delivery in a way he simply wasn't required to do when he was under contract and the business side of his output was largely taken care of by a global company.

I also agree that, whilst we all appear to salivate at the release of yet more 80s outtakes, I wonder how many of us would have been as enamoured with these hidden gems had they actually been released on lengthier albums at the time. It is true that the quality is largely phenomenal in the 80s, as you would expect, however, I suspect the 90s represented the first time that Prince had free reign to put all his creations into each product, hence the lengthier, seemingly less cohesive, albums, (Emancipation, Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic, The Gold Experience, Diamonds and Pearls and Love Symbol). I suspect if the original incarnation of The Dawn had been released it might also have suffered the same fate i.e. overload.

love,

Spirit

Think about this: the song "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic" is from 88 or 89 and it was coveted and beloved as a rare gem/bootleg.

Once the song was officially released in 1999, people were no longer enamoured with it as they were other bootlegs from the same era.

true, same with the Black album, I mean it was nice to have an official cd, but I'm glad I experienced the 1987 happening

EyeJester7 said:

I find the 80's output best. But the 90's are better than most give credit. Love the EXODUS album and it is probably one of my favorites of the 90's, although I wish Prince was the lead vocal (Sonny can't do it for me.) and that the segues were all gone (they ruin the flow for me.).

There are some great highlights from the 90's for me:

Diamonds and Pearls, a great Pop album with catchy pop songs. But did any of the "hit" songs sound like anything else on pop radio?

Love the complete album vibe he formed both with the and Come albums. Come is a new version of the early Prince sound with a contemporary twist with in the theme that Prince presented.

The symbol album didn't get promoted as much as D&P because Prince was move to the R&B dept at WB giving less funds and time to support. While Madonna maintained the funding of being a Pop artist. The nail on the coffin that would be the war on WB. On a side note about the album: I think the fit of current R&B sound and Prince worked for me.

The battle with Warner didn't help album sales.

I still think that the Emancipation is a great album.I think it's Prince's greatest effort of the 90's, but suffers from producing choices, such as producing to current R&B sound of the 90's. He should have mixed it up a bit. I think Sign o The times would have suffered the same fate of Emancipation had it been a 3 disc set called Crystal Ball. The 3 discs is too much for the casual listener to handle.

TGE has great pop tunes on it. I think the segues aren't necessary, but strangely work for me on the symbol album.

Oddly RUTJfantastic is my least played and least favorite album. I can't stand the production on this joint.

NPS always comes across like an EP to me. So, I oddly enjoy it. I think if I think of it as an album then it wouldn't be as good?

[Edited 1/25/13 0:37am]