Thanks to the recent interview, I guess we now know why his jaw dropped when Madonna came through on the video feed during the L4OA video...he was telling us right then and there a part of reason for his frustration with Warners.

[Edited 1/29/13 1:13am]

Hmmm, I am non-english:

and I have no idea what this thread is about..

Madonna's video to "Take A Bow" was used in the Love 4 One Another videospecial on VH-1 in 1996 .

And then what is Prince now telling in the new interview, I guess in Billboards... ?

Prince's jaw was dropping back then, because of the beautiful but also cruel bullfighting in "Take A Bow", that's at least what I have thought all these years...

(I still haven't read that Billboard's interview, what is it specific telling?).

thedance said:

thedance said:

Hmmm, I am non-english:

and I have no idea what this thread is about..

Madonna's video to "Take A Bow" was used in the Love 4 One Another videospecial on VH-1 in 1996 .

And then what is Prince now telling in the new interview, I guess in Billboards... ?

Prince's jaw was dropping back then, because of the beautiful but also cruel bullfighting in "Take A Bow", that's at least what I have thought all these years...

(I still haven't read that Billboard's interview, what is it specific telling?).

No Prince rolled his eyes at it and clicked it off with the remote. It was the "I want you" video.

At the time I thought it was because he was sick of her & that she was still a WB artist that he detested. I was right & I agree with his interview.

Warners put millions in Madonna. She was the king & queen of the WB...I'm sure many other artist felt neglected on that label..They made her records a hit whether peeps liked them or not. Labels can make a song a hit if they want them to be one...I get the point he is making..

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

thedance said:

Hmmm, I am non-english:

and I have no idea what this thread is about..

Madonna's video to "Take A Bow" was used in the Love 4 One Another videospecial on VH-1 in 1996 .

And then what is Prince now telling in the new interview, I guess in Billboards... ?

Prince's jaw was dropping back then, because of the beautiful but also cruel bullfighting in "Take A Bow", that's at least what I have thought all these years...

(I still haven't read that Billboard's interview, what is it specific telling?).

No Prince rolled his eyes at it and clicked it off with the remote. It was the "I want you" video.

At the time I thought it was because he was sick of her & that she was still a WB artist that he detested. I was right & I agree with his interview.

Warners put millions in Madonna. She was the king & queen of the WB...I'm sure many other artist felt neglected on that label..They made her records a hit whether peeps liked them or not. Labels can make a song a hit if they want them to be one...I get the point he is making..

I think WB put their 'millions' into Madonna because, unlike Prince, she played 'the game' and she made them a lot of money over the years. She understands the business and knows what she has to do to have a hit record (promotion, interviews, videos) whereas Prince felt his records should be hits just because he thought they were good and that he didn't really have to do promotion. Right or wrong, if you aren't making the record company money, they ain't gonna give you any.

So he speaks disparagingly of Madonna for being more successful than him during his tenure under CONtract at Warner. Didn't he sign a $100M deal with Warner? Didn't the label pour millions into his Paisley Park vanity label? Didn't he change his name to unpronounceable symbol, a move that made him an object of ridicule and hurt his sales?

Prince played 'the game' with D&P & it was a big hit. But Warners did not promote the follow up symbol album like they did D&P....I do agree Madonna is a marketing genius. But from day one they promoted her to no end. They didn't do that for Prince with each album he made..

When you have an artist never missing an opportunity to castigate his label in public, the chances of that business relationship eroding are even greater.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

No i think its more to it than that. She sold her soul to the devil.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Madonna released an album every 2/3 years, not one album and 3 side-projects every bloody year: that pace alone is easier to promote. That and the fact that her music always was more accessible anyway.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

No i think its more to it than that. She sold her soul to the devil.

Heaven forbid a woman should be a good business person as well as an artist. Shame on her.

rlittler81 said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

No i think its more to it than that. She sold her soul to the devil.

Heaven forbid a woman should be a good business person as well as an artist. Shame on her.

[Edited 1/30/13 10:49am]

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

I'm sure she was good at a lot of things to get to where she was at.

Yes; smart things like growing a massive fan base, promoting her albums, creating an internet presence and reinventing her brand with deftness.

errant said:

I assumed he was rolling his eyes at the Madonna viedo because he disapproved of her re-working of a Marvin Gaye classic.

wasn't that also the time period where he wrote letters to Madonna and a few others in the industry to assist him in his fight with WB or the masters of his music or something?

rlittler81 said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

No Prince rolled his eyes at it and clicked it off with the remote. It was the "I want you" video.

At the time I thought it was because he was sick of her & that she was still a WB artist that he detested. I was right & I agree with his interview.

Warners put millions in Madonna. She was the king & queen of the WB...I'm sure many other artist felt neglected on that label..They made her records a hit whether peeps liked them or not. Labels can make a song a hit if they want them to be one...I get the point he is making..

I think WB put their 'millions' into Madonna because, unlike Prince, she played 'the game' and she made them a lot of money over the years. She understands the business and knows what she has to do to have a hit record (promotion, interviews, videos) whereas Prince felt his records should be hits just because he thought they were good and that he didn't really have to do promotion. Right or wrong, if you aren't making the record company money, they ain't gonna give you any.

Madonna was indeed EVERYWHERE....you could NOT escape her videos or airplay since Truth or Dare..up until about Ray Of Light I believe. She did her work that is for sure.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

rlittler81 said:

Heaven forbid a woman should be a good business person as well as an artist. Shame on her.

I'm sure she was good at a lot of things to get to where she was at.

come on Kcoolmuziq, you didn't go there...

there is no rumor fact story anything to back up that Madonna did other thing but hard work to get where she is

NDRU said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Prince played 'the game' with D&P & it was a big hit. But Warners did not promote the follow up symbol album like they did D&P....I do agree Madonna is a marketing genius. But from day one they promoted her to no end. They didn't do that for Prince with each album he made..

But Madonna always played the game. Not just an album here and there. She's always been easier to digest. If prince did albums like d&p every time, he could have been more like Madonna, and I would have been very disappointed

true,

But if Prince promoted his album like Madonna ... I think the lack of this is also why I have those (what if...) moments with wonderful albums like ATWIAD so much of that music should have been singled out on it's own (outside of the Parade tours) via shows, performances and videos

Prince was never the best with promoting thru videos

Also looking at how much money was wasted by Warner Brothers on albums/studio time/videos

How much money was lost and could have been made with the Black album in 1987

the lack of promotion with SOTT, the lack of touring in the States etc

And how many videos that we know of in the 2000's period alone that were completed but never released, people still have to be paid for that stuff.

It doesn't make sense on Prince's part to hire people (including band members) to do a video ie A Million Days (Musicology) and never release it

I think in the 1990's Madonna did a better job of taking what was happening in the world/society at the time (early 2 mid 1990's) and creating a scene and vision via shows, tours, videos etc

She seemed to have been more involved in 'everyday' life, than Prince who was battling WB and being shut away in Paisley Park, not really living. It didn't seem he had a direction or focus outside of trying to erase his Purple past and fighting with WB

OldFriends4Sale said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

I'm sure she was good at a lot of things to get to where she was at.

come on Kcoolmuziq, you didn't go there...

there is no rumor fact story anything to back up that Madonna did other thing but hard work to get where she is

U right! I wasn't there so I don't really know. I'm just going by what I heard & rumors..But Madonna did create a very sleazy image for herself at one time. She has cleaned up her image a lot since then.

OldFriends4Sale said:

NDRU said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said: But Madonna always played the game. Not just an album here and there. She's always been easier to digest. If prince did albums like d&p every time, he could have been more like Madonna, and I would have been very disappointed

true,

But if Prince promoted his album like Madonna ... I think the lack of this is also why I have those (what if...) moments with wonderful albums like ATWIAD so much of that music should have been singled out on it's own (outside of the Parade tours) via shows, performances and videos

Prince was never the best with promoting thru videos

Also looking at how much money was wasted by Warner Brothers on albums/studio time/videos

How much money was lost and could have been made with the Black album in 1987

the lack of promotion with SOTT, the lack of touring in the States etc

And how many videos that we know of in the 2000's period alone that were completed but never released, people still have to be paid for that stuff.

It doesn't make sense on Prince's part to hire people (including band members) to do a video ie A Million Days (Musicology) and never release it

I think in the 1990's Madonna did a better job of taking what was happening in the world/society at the time (early 2 mid 1990's) and creating a scene and vision via shows, tours, videos etc

She seemed to have been more involved in 'everyday' life, than Prince who was battling WB and being shut away in Paisley Park, not really living. It didn't seem he had a direction or focus outside of trying to erase his Purple past and fighting with WB

True!

I never really looked as Prince as a commercial artist. I didn't like when he did the whole Purple Rain thing either. I feel he purposely did ATWIAD to get rid of the after Purple Rain fans...But since he became a superstar after that movie. He had to make hits to satisfy Warners. It was a double edged sword...

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

come on Kcoolmuziq, you didn't go there...

there is no rumor fact story anything to back up that Madonna did other thing but hard work to get where she is

U right! I wasn't there so I don't really know. I'm just going by what I heard & rumors..But Madonna did create a very sleazy image for herself at one time. She has cleaned up her image a lot since then.

She has always been in your face, in the 1980's especially for her to hit that level of fame as a woman. She's always been provactive. I don't think she was sleavy

again, the 1990's early to mid if you know anything about the cultural social issues happening, and what she was doing as an entertainer you'd understand, AIDS was still being ignored, there was a lot of social sexual change happening and of course a lot of resistance, entertainers artists poets musicians are always key players during times like this,

1 reason I was a bit disappointed in Prince, if he had a message it was covered up by a lot of what was going on in his business life

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

true,

But if Prince promoted his album like Madonna ... I think the lack of this is also why I have those (what if...) moments with wonderful albums like ATWIAD so much of that music should have been singled out on it's own (outside of the Parade tours) via shows, performances and videos

Prince was never the best with promoting thru videos

Also looking at how much money was wasted by Warner Brothers on albums/studio time/videos

How much money was lost and could have been made with the Black album in 1987

the lack of promotion with SOTT, the lack of touring in the States etc

And how many videos that we know of in the 2000's period alone that were completed but never released, people still have to be paid for that stuff.

It doesn't make sense on Prince's part to hire people (including band members) to do a video ie A Million Days (Musicology) and never release it

I think in the 1990's Madonna did a better job of taking what was happening in the world/society at the time (early 2 mid 1990's) and creating a scene and vision via shows, tours, videos etc

She seemed to have been more involved in 'everyday' life, than Prince who was battling WB and being shut away in Paisley Park, not really living. It didn't seem he had a direction or focus outside of trying to erase his Purple past and fighting with WB

True!

I never really looked as Prince as a commercial artist. I didn't like when he did the whole Purple Rain thing either. I feel he purposely did ATWIAD to get rid of the after Purple Rain fans...But since he became a superstar after that movie. He had to make hits to satisfy Warners. It was a double edged sword...

oh man Purple rain had to happen, we wouldn't be here now at the .org if it didn't

a movie was going to happen,

A lot of fans who came on as a result of Purple Rain continued with Prince after

I don't think even Prince 1980's hits(a word we are using after the fact) were D&P radio friendly type hits

OldFriends4Sale said:

NDRU said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said: But Madonna always played the game. Not just an album here and there. She's always been easier to digest. If prince did albums like d&p every time, he could have been more like Madonna, and I would have been very disappointed

true,

But if Prince promoted his album like Madonna ... I think the lack of this is also why I have those (what if...) moments with wonderful albums like ATWIAD so much of that music should have been singled out on it's own (outside of the Parade tours) via shows, performances and videos

Prince was never the best with promoting thru videos

Also looking at how much money was wasted by Warner Brothers on albums/studio time/videos

How much money was lost and could have been made with the Black album in 1987

the lack of promotion with SOTT, the lack of touring in the States etc

And how many videos that we know of in the 2000's period alone that were completed but never released, people still have to be paid for that stuff.

It doesn't make sense on Prince's part to hire people (including band members) to do a video ie A Million Days (Musicology) and never release it

I think in the 1990's Madonna did a better job of taking what was happening in the world/society at the time (early 2 mid 1990's) and creating a scene and vision via shows, tours, videos etc

She seemed to have been more involved in 'everyday' life, than Prince who was battling WB and being shut away in Paisley Park, not really living. It didn't seem he had a direction or focus outside of trying to erase his Purple past and fighting with WB

I agree. Madonna's simply a more commercial artist. She markets herself better, and others market her more because of it.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Prince played 'the game' with D&P & it was a big hit. But Warners did not promote the follow up symbol album like they did D&P....I do agree Madonna is a marketing genius. But from day one they promoted her to no end. They didn't do that for Prince with each album he made..

Prince signed his 100 million contract after D&P was turned into WB. I think he wanted to show WB that he still could make hits. And after the contract was signed they screwed Prince over by putting him in the R&B dept. Which meant less radio play and less promotion that is why the symbol album sales are far less then they should have been. Prince promoted this album big time.

I'm guessing they thought they would get more money back through promoting Madonna. Just like any artist on a label, not every one is going to get the best promotion. Prince was the second fiddle to Madonna and Prince don't play that.

1992 discussion about Prince's contract:

rlittler81 said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

No Prince rolled his eyes at it and clicked it off with the remote. It was the "I want you" video.

At the time I thought it was because he was sick of her & that she was still a WB artist that he detested. I was right & I agree with his interview.

Warners put millions in Madonna. She was the king & queen of the WB...I'm sure many other artist felt neglected on that label..They made her records a hit whether peeps liked them or not. Labels can make a song a hit if they want them to be one...I get the point he is making..

I think WB put their 'millions' into Madonna because, unlike Prince, she played 'the game' and she made them a lot of money over the years. She understands the business and knows what she has to do to have a hit record (promotion, interviews, videos) whereas Prince felt his records should be hits just because he thought they were good and that he didn't really have to do promotion. Right or wrong, if you aren't making the record company money, they ain't gonna give you any.

exactly, rlittler81!

OldFriends4Sale said:

errant said:

I assumed he was rolling his eyes at the Madonna viedo because he disapproved of her re-working of a Marvin Gaye classic.

wasn't that also the time period where he wrote letters to Madonna and a few others in the industry to assist him in his fight with WB or the masters of his music or something?

Do you remember the Open letter to Madonna posted on? I believe the npg online ltd site????

Madonna: artist 2 artist, eye am sure u understand the connection eye feel
2 my music. U more than any1 at Time Warner knows the patience and care
with which we give birth 2 creation... and u maybe moreso than any1 knows
how much a new artist longs 2 find a place amongst "the chosen few" 2
flaunt those creations (and at the same time put food on one's table).
Music lawyers, managers and execs make deals best suited 4 their futures
as well as urs in most cases... OWNERSHIP OF MASTER RECORDINGS IS ALMOST
NEVER AN ISSUE! (let's remember, it was 1978!)

Eye dreamt of u and eye at the Grammy Awards and felt a need 2 write this
letter 2 u. In my dream, eye approached u and asked u if u remembered me,
and u said "sure"... u were on ur way up 2 receive 1 of numerous awards u
will no doubt receive that night, and eye asked u 2 help me with my fight
2 retain ownership of my legacy and u said, "eye don't own ur masters,
Time Warner does... if it was my company, u could have them."

"But eye say 2 u, dear sister, it IS ur company as long as u remain in
their graces... 4 all Artists, Madonna, make a stand 4 what is RIGHT...
surely they will listen 2 u!" In the dream u seemed 2 feel me and yet u
were a bit non-committal... so as u approached the podium, eye followed u,
and as we stood side by side, eye said, "b glad this a commercial break!"
and eye walked offstage and looked 4 Wyclef. Interpretaions aside, artist
2 artist, "U Can Help Us... and eye know u will becuz u REMEMBER ME."