robertgeorgeakabob said:

was your first listening of batman like mine? the future....fine, all is as it should be

electric chair....interesting piece of glam electro funk rock

arms of orion........noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

what the fuck!!!!

piss off he was on the muppets. if he was a proper rudeboy he'd have been in rainbow jammin with rod, jane n freddy.

Pretty much like that, yeah.

Sounds like a blinder doing Europe, must've been a laugh. We had tickets for Nude in Manchester. Booked the time off, had everything planned to stay up there etc. and he cancelled. Postponed it on us so we had a trip up North for nothing. It cost me a fortune. That was it for me for a good few years. Good seeing and hearing some of the gigs later though.

I heard rumours that he did do rainbow a couple of times. I mean, we all knew he was ghost-writing the Rod, Jane & Freddie stuff but I didn't know until recently that he'd show up sometimes and demand to be Bungle for the day. Makes sense now when you watch it. It's where he got all that 'rainbow children' stuff from, sleeping in Bungles bed.

skywalker said:

Fonkyman said:

Fuck sake. What are we on about? Are we talking Live or Studio? One of ya's talking about Live, another says we're talking Studio...

1. My initial post was about that, in terms of royal badness attitude, Prince still has it. I pointed to Montreux 2009 "All the critics love U..." as a PRIME example. So...live.

2. Others have talked about how he's "lost that attitude" in studio, yet cite no specific examples other than the usual post 1988 line of thinking.

3. My main point is that people often bemoan Prince for not being naughty/rude or having a fuck you attitude, but he is very much the same guy that he's always been. Whether you like the new stuff or not, that swagger and nastiness still presents itself all of the time.

[Edited 12/4/12 18:59pm]

From what I've heard he has lost the attitude in the studio. Specifically? Start with R&Rse and work your way back til you find a blinder. Good luck, you'll be gone for a while.

As for the Fuck you attitude, the swagger and nastiness, start with R&Rse on Jimmy Kimmel or whatever his name was and work your way...

How is he 'very much the same guy' and when was the last time you saw or heard him swaggering and being nasty? What was he playing?

Head?

Irresistable Ladyfriend?
DMSR?

Darling Jehova?

Spirituality?

may i suggest that the "rude boy" spirit is not ONLY manifest in songs with profanity or about sex but also includes funkiness, political anti-establishment type songs, and the unexpected sonic curve ball just because (Anne Christian to me is "rude boy") but this idea, like everything on the org is debatable. I understand the gist of the OP and I get the "live vs. recorded" dichotomy but again for me, its a false dichotomy because I find recent highlights in both. I guess the VOLUME of "highlights" is what ppl want or are alluding to. Recent manifestations of the rude boy spirit on record for ME are:

Dance 4 Me, Black Sweat, Lay Down, Sticky Like Glue, Old School eec

live...too many to count. Controversy on the W2A tour for starters!!

To the OP, I have the DVD's, I believe he pulled out 'All The Critics' cause he was losing the audience. Two shows, nearly identical setlist. Sure 'Empty Room' was great, as was 'all the critics' but yeah, there was some boring, meandering, noodling going on too.

Only IMO.

[Edited 12/5/12 11:32am]

datdude said:

may i suggest that the "rude boy" spirit is not ONLY manifest in songs with profanity or about sex but also includes funkiness, political anti-establishment type songs, and the unexpected sonic curve ball just because (Anne Christian to me is "rude boy") but this idea, like everything on the org is debatable. I understand the gist of the OP and I get the "live vs. recorded" dichotomy but again for me, its a false dichotomy because I find recent highlights in both. I guess the VOLUME of "highlights" is what ppl want or are alluding to. Recent manifestations of the rude boy spirit on record for ME are:

Dance 4 Me, Black Sweat, Lay Down, Sticky Like Glue, Old School eec

live...too many to count. Controversy on the W2A tour for starters!!

Exactly.

Marrk said:

To the OP, I have the DVD's, I believe he pulled out 'All The Critics' cause he was losing the audience. Two shows, nearly identical setlist. Sure 'Empty Room' was great, as was 'all the critics' but yeah, there was some boring, meandering, noodling going on too.

Only IMO.

[Edited 12/5/12 11:32am]

I don't disagree. It was a bit artsy/jazzlite for me, and then he stunningly just pulls out "all the critics" out of his pocket and leaves jaws dropped.

I have heard people carping about how Prince has 'lost it' since he released SOTT or even earlier.

It is understandable in that there is nothing like one's experience of hearing him for the first time or the rawness of his first records. That said, he is different now but his performances are splendid. His work, all of it, is HIS. He is there. Artists change and you lose some of the more overt angst of being young. But the artists who stay the same cease to be artists.

philmoreliz said:

I have heard people carping about how Prince has 'lost it' since he released SOTT or even earlier.

It is understandable in that there is nothing like one's experience of hearing him for the first time or the rawness of his first records. That said, he is different now but his performances are splendid. His work, all of it, is HIS. He is there. Artists change and you lose some of the more overt angst of being young. But the artists who stay the same cease to be artists.

but in the 80s he didnt stay the same from one album to the next. his tours were radically different year after year. i would rather cut my cock off and throw it in the bin than watch one of his splendid performances now. he's about as cutting edge as a glass of tap water.

robertgeorgeakabob said:

philmoreliz said:

I have heard people carping about how Prince has 'lost it' since he released SOTT or even earlier.

It is understandable in that there is nothing like one's experience of hearing him for the first time or the rawness of his first records. That said, he is different now but his performances are splendid. His work, all of it, is HIS. He is there. Artists change and you lose some of the more overt angst of being young. But the artists who stay the same cease to be artists.

but in the 80s he didnt stay the same from one album to the next. his tours were radically different year after year. i would rather cut my cock off and throw it in the bin than watch one of his splendid performances now. he's about as cutting edge as a glass of tap water.

Impressive dedication! Maybe you could employ a broken glass of tap water to do the job?

philmoreliz said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

but in the 80s he didnt stay the same from one album to the next. his tours were radically different year after year. i would rather cut my cock off and throw it in the bin than watch one of his splendid performances now. he's about as cutting edge as a glass of tap water.

Impressive dedication! Maybe you could employ a broken glass of tap water to do the job?

how do i keep the tap water in the broken glass? thankfully as i have no intention of seeing him play live my cock is safe and sound.

[Edited 12/9/12 17:15pm]

robertgeorgeakabob said:

philmoreliz said:

Impressive dedication! Maybe you could employ a broken glass of tap water to do the job?

how do i keep the tap water in the broken glass? thankfully as i have no intention of seeing him play live my cock is safe and sound.

[Edited 12/9/12 17:15pm]

The water would spill, of course. But it would moisten the shards. Depending upon your location and the condition of your pipes (not your voice, your water pipes) it would add an intereresting bacterial dimension to the undertaking.

philmoreliz said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

how do i keep the tap water in the broken glass? thankfully as i have no intention of seeing him play live my cock is safe and sound.

[Edited 12/9/12 17:15pm]

The water would spill, of course. But it would moisten the shards. Depending upon your location and the condition of your pipes (not your voice, your water pipes) it would add an intereresting bacterial dimension to the undertaking.

look here, now i steadfastedly refuse to go to a concert just so you get the obscene pleasure of knowing my cock is a bloody microbe infested monstrosity. but will you get me a tour programme please?

robertgeorgeakabob said:

philmoreliz said:

I have heard people carping about how Prince has 'lost it' since he released SOTT or even earlier.

It is understandable in that there is nothing like one's experience of hearing him for the first time or the rawness of his first records. That said, he is different now but his performances are splendid. His work, all of it, is HIS. He is there. Artists change and you lose some of the more overt angst of being young. But the artists who stay the same cease to be artists.

but in the 80s he didnt stay the same from one album to the next. his tours were radically different year after year. i would rather cut my cock off and throw it in the bin than watch one of his splendid performances now. he's about as cutting edge as a glass of tap water.

From 1986-1990 his tours were radically different from year to year.

However, Dirty Mind to Purple Rain tours has a very similar stage set up, setlist/structure, and style. "Radically different" is a bit of an overstatement for these early Prince tours.

[Edited 12/10/12 7:57am]

skywalker said:

robertgeorgeakabob said:

but in the 80s he didnt stay the same from one album to the next. his tours were radically different year after year. i would rather cut my cock off and throw it in the bin than watch one of his splendid performances now. he's about as cutting edge as a glass of tap water.

From 1986-1990 his tours were radically different from year to year.

However, Dirty Mind to Purple Rain tours has a very similar stage set up, setlist/structure, and style. "Radically different" is a bit of an overstatement for these early Prince tours.

[Edited 12/10/12 7:57am]

yeah, apart from having a different look and being centred around the albums he'd just released all those tours were virtually identical. i love the 20 min baby i'm a star jam with eric blowing his horn like bree olson that he performed on the dirty mind tour. the only thing they have in common is that they were performed on a stage. let's say they radically evolved if u wanna nitpick.

robertgeorgeakabob said:

skywalker said:

From 1986-1990 his tours were radically different from year to year.

However, Dirty Mind to Purple Rain tours has a very similar stage set up, setlist/structure, and style. "Radically different" is a bit of an overstatement for these early Prince tours.

[Edited 12/10/12 7:57am]

yeah, apart from having a different look and being centred around the albums he'd just released all those tours were virtually identical. i love the 20 min baby i'm a star jam with eric blowing his horn like bree olson that he performed on the dirty mind tour. the only thing they have in common is that they were performed on a stage. let's say they radically evolved if u wanna nitpick.

Listen, all I am saying is that there is a lot of overlap between the setlists of his early tours. It's not being nitpicky, they weren't "radically" different. He wasn't creating entirely new setlists, he was tacking on a few songs here and there from the new album. That isn't "radically different".

Furthermore, if you've seen or listened to the boots of these tours, you'll see/hear that many of Prince's solos/routines/talking points/dancing/breakdowns/instrumentations stay the same from 1980 to 1983 on many of these songs.

Dirty Mind Setlist

at Sam's (1st Ave), Minneapolis, Minnesota

1. "Do It All Night"
2. "Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad?"
3. "Gotta Broken Heart Again"
4. "Broken"
5. "When You Were Mine"
6. "Sexy Dancer"
7. "Sister"
8. "I Wanna Be Your Lover"
9. "Head"
10. "Still Waiting"
11. "Partyup"
12. "Uptown"
13. "Crazy You"
14. "Gotta Stop (Messin' About)"
15. "Dirty Mind"

Encore

1. "Everybody Dance"
2. "Bambi"

Controversy Tour Setlist

at the Carolina Coliseum, Columbia, South Carolina

1. Intro: "The Second Coming"
2. "Uptown"
3. "Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad?"
4. "Sexy Dancer"
5. "I Wanna Be Your Lover"
6. "Head"
7. "Dirty Mind"
8. "Do Me, Baby"
9. "Controversy"

Encore

1. "Let's Work"
2. "Partyup"
3. "Jack U Off"

1999 Tour Setlist

at the Norfolk Scope, Norfolk, Virginia

1. "Controversy" (Includes "1999" 'don't worry...' intro)
2. "Let's Work"
3. "Do Me, Baby"
4. "D.M.S.R."
5. Keyboard Interlude by Lisa Coleman
6. "With You" (Instrumental)
7. "Still Waiting"
8. "How Come U Don't Call Me Anymore?"
9. "Lady Cab Driver" (New version with additional lyrics)
10. "Little Red Corvette"
11. "Dirty Mind"
12. "International Lover"
13. "1999"

As far as the Purple Rain Tour goes...I agree with you. He mostly ignored the previous stuff and did the entire Purple Rain album.

However, the staging of it was the same setup as the previous tours (change brass bed for bathtub). The scaffolding/catwalks/firepole/staging was the same structure as the Dirty Mind/Controversy/1999 tours. The band had the same positioning/blocking as previous tours.

What I mean is, the look and tone of the thing wasn't radically different.

Stylistically, it was similar to what had come before.

In many ways, the Purple Rain tour was THE culmination of these tours as much as it was the culmination of the era. Yet, I would not consider it "radically different" than what came before. Now the Parade tour..that was radically different.

[Edited 12/10/12 12:05pm]

Fonkyman said:

Fuck sake. What are we on about? Are we talking Live or Studio? One of ya's talking about Live, another says we're talking Studio...

What about '89-01? ... Yeah, what about it?

It doesn't really matter. I've already said, he's always been a red hot performer. He can still do it live when he can be arsed and I'm sure he could and probably has written and recorded some blinders in the studio. I haven't heard anything decent for a while though and he certainly aint even been close to 'rude' for years.

With the comparisons I was being conservative. I coulda said to compare all the post '88 stuff to the pre. The pre '88 stuff still pisses on the post and with it on the postman. Even though it's heavily outnumbered. Just in my opinion o course.

I took the past 10 years compared to the first. Personally, though I didn't mind the Batman album it was the first sign to me that things were going dodgy. Every album after that carried on the trend. I stopped trading boots around '90 too. I just sorta lost interest in it all and fucked off clubbing. For more than a decade.

The amount of tracks on his albums I liked got fewer and fewer and I stopped buying them after Come. I still got them given as gifts but I almost chucked those out. Gold, Chaos and Drivel, Symbol, Rave, etc. It's mainly old tat. It's got to the point that I couldn't name a song on LF and Mpls sound without looking them up. I'm amazed to think that would ever happen.

I don't expect P to be writing the same sort of thing as he was in his 20s or 30s any more than I expect him to still be in his 20s or 30s. He doesn't need to be parping out the crap he has been though. He set the bar now it's like a cross on his back. Or is it a christ on his back or a holy angel?

Having that break stood me in good stead though. I've still got loads to catch up on. Here and there I've found a few blinders that I was oblivious to for years and I'm hypothetically catching up on some of the hypothetical boots too.

My point was that we haven't seen a Rude boy for a while as he hasn't been one for a while. Simple as that. Plenty's changed too. It'd be unnatural if it hadn't. Yeah he's still the same fella, just grown older like the rest of us. I wasn't the one calling him a rudeboy though was I.

HA, HA. It gets frustrating arguing with skywalker since he constantly conflates entirely separate issues. No-one has ever doubted that P can still do great live versions of his older songs so the whole premise of this thread is confusing to start with.

And since when does Prince have to be "rude" to be great. He was still rude when he made NPS and it was shit. The Beautiful Ones is not very rude and it's great. His newfound conservatism is a separate issue from the loss of his creative edge. Like you say, that loss was first noticeable back in '89 long before he found Jehovah. He was still making some great songs though. It wasn't until the late '90s that he finally started to fire nothing but blanks, but IMO that was just the inevitable outcome of his gradual decline and had nothing to do with JW.

[Edited 12/13/12 6:32am]