I was reading the avalanche of posts about the new song R ‘n R Affair; one comment that stood out talks about Prince being a sponge. I agree totally and do not at all intend this to be an insult.

We have seen how over the years Prince has been able to assimilate what's around him -- whether it be musicians in his band, artists who came before him, the “underground" scene, or pop culture in general – and re-purpose them into something unique if not brilliant. However, as the post suggested, lately he seemingly isn’t surrounded by anyone or anything that is an inspiration or challenge. No disrespect intended for his current band mates (who I imagine are very talented individuals who can reproduce practically anything from the Prince catalog), but unfortunately, they do not seem to bring anything to the table (and possibly are not allowed to)…

Sure Prince has always been in charge, but the influence Andre, Dez, Fink, Wendy & Lisa, Sheila, Levi, Sonny T & Michael B and so many others had on Prince from 1976 through the late ‘90s is undeniable. If the only inspiration is his own back catalog then maybe all we can realistically expect is lesser interpretations of the music we already know – I certainly hope I am wrong…

The problem with this though is that he is absorbing things that aren't worth absorbing, such as Autotune and many idiotic singers esp. rappers that are about.

They all want to be him and try and copy him (Rihanna/Timberlake), so I don't know why he doesn't be HIMSELF rather than try and imitate them...it's fine when he's imitating cool talented artists like from the 60s and 70s but not half the shit that passes as 'music' today....

The only person I want him to be influenced by are himself or classical musicians such as his early proteges such as Wendy and Lisa who actually influenced him and NOT the other way around....you only have to listen to the excellent 'Wendy and Lisa' debut album to hear what amazing things those girls are capable of..

[Edited 9/28/12 11:18am]

Yeah, insightful people continue to point this out in a myriad of ways.

I've called it synergy.

Someone else said he needs chemistry in the Sheila E. thread.

And so on and so on.

An artist needs to feed off other creative energy period. I wouldn't call it sponging, but that's me.

Since the beginning, artistis have benefitted from tribes, artist colonies, creative collectives, etc.

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

SynthiaRose said:

Yeah, insightful people continue to point this out in a myriad of ways.

I've called it synergy.

Someone else said he needs chemistry in the Sheila E. thread.

And so on and so on.

An artist needs to feed off other creative energy period. I wouldn't call it sponging, but that's me.

Since the beginning, artistis have benefitted from tribes, artist colonies, creative collectives, etc.

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

Yes it is very very bad - Ocean has nothing original or innovative to share with a guy who has done it all!

OldFriends4Sale said:

SynthiaRose said:

Yeah, insightful people continue to point this out in a myriad of ways.

I've called it synergy.

Someone else said he needs chemistry in the Sheila E. thread.

And so on and so on.

An artist needs to feed off other creative energy period. I wouldn't call it sponging, but that's me.

Since the beginning, artistis have benefitted from tribes, artist colonies, creative collectives, etc.

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

That's exactly what the biggest problem of today's music is: genre thinking.

funkomatic said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

That's exactly what the biggest problem of today's music is: genre thinking.

I hear you

sometimes it seems like 'everythings been done'

like this generation is a generation of reproduction: from music, fashion, movies even tv shows of the 1960s 70s 80s

some of that is good, especially if it comes from people who lived those times

SynthiaRose said:

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

That ain't gonna happen when he happily hires a guy who was the touring guitarist for Justin Timberlake.

OldFriends4Sale said:

SynthiaRose said:

Yeah, insightful people continue to point this out in a myriad of ways.

I've called it synergy.

Someone else said he needs chemistry in the Sheila E. thread.

And so on and so on.

An artist needs to feed off other creative energy period. I wouldn't call it sponging, but that's me.

Since the beginning, artistis have benefitted from tribes, artist colonies, creative collectives, etc.

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

Oh yes! You're the one who mentions how PRince is affected by the charisma of his fromer bandmates, who were all sort of unique characters.

I can't defend my request. I just love Frank and I know he loves PRince and I'd love for them to work together. Musically I don't think he's that innovative, but when it comes to song concepts and lyrics, I think Prince would enjoy walking through FRank's head and swapping energy with him.

I personally think F.O.'s songs are a jolting on the radio because they seem out of place... so he's definitely his own person and an individualist thinker. Those are the types I would like Prince to associate with, not drones. I'm not suggesting Ocean is some musical genius, but he is an out of the box thinker and Prince, formerly so, crawled back into a box a several years ago and hasn't come out since.

SynthiaRose said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Oh yes! You're the one who mentions how PRince is affected by the charisma of his fromer bandmates, who were all sort of unique characters.

Yes, I agree with it, the familiarity the newness of Prince and his sound, I still don't think Pop Culture and Stardom really took him until his sequesterd life in Paisley Park and 99% of his 1978-1988 members were gone

OldFriends4Sale said:

SynthiaRose said:

Yeah, insightful people continue to point this out in a myriad of ways.

I've called it synergy.

Someone else said he needs chemistry in the Sheila E. thread.

And so on and so on.

An artist needs to feed off other creative energy period. I wouldn't call it sponging, but that's me.

Since the beginning, artistis have benefitted from tribes, artist colonies, creative collectives, etc.

Prince needs a new tribe -- and not on the level of the goddamned NPG. He needs people doing something fresh, daring, new and challenging.

(p.s. is it bad I want him to vibe with Frank Ocean for a weekend? )

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

Good call, sponging does have a negative connotation so maybe it's better to say he absorbs what's around him.

Perhaps we can blame both a lack of influence from the band mates he's choosing and the currently barren musical landscape. In all fairness to the new generation of artists who are popular, should we really be expecting an established culteral icon to lookto THEM for inspiration? Look at the established artists over the years who humiliated themselves trying to mimic disco, rap, new wave, etc...

Maybe it's time for a "retro" album like what he did with Around the World in a Day or Exodus?

alphachannel said:

I was reading the avalanche of posts about the new song R ‘n R Affair; one comment that stood out talks about Prince being a sponge. I agree totally and do not at all intend this to be an insult.

By the way, that was my comment, and it's something that I've been saying for a decade and a half.

I see it from him not having anything or anyone to inspire him also but not meaning his own band members. I'm talking about other artists these days. Back in the 1980s, there were tons of great artists to not only give him inspiration, but also competition. These days there's none. He used to lie back then and say he didn't listen to the radio but it was very obvious that he did because you could hear traces of the new wave mixed with the funk of the era mixed in his music. And today, you can hear traces of country mixed with rock that has been going on for years (which is a horrible sound) and shit hop and neo stool (which is an even worse sound). Then you hear about him performing on stage with folks like Scary J. Blige recently. Yeah, he's being influenced but by some people that make horrible sounding music.

alphachannel said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

better word for sponging, would be soaking (up)

sponging sound cheap lol

Are there any new music genres out there?

Good call, sponging does have a negative connotation so maybe it's better to say he absorbs what's around him.

Perhaps we can blame both a lack of influence from the band mates he's choosing and the currently barren musical landscape. In all fairness to the new generation of artists who are popular, should we really be expecting an established culteral icon to lookto THEM for inspiration? Look at the established artists over the years who humiliated themselves trying to mimic disco, rap, new wave, etc...

Maybe it's time for a "retro" album like what he did with Around the World in a Day or Exodus?

With eveything going on, it's just hi time, he do something like ATWIAD Exodus SOTT but finally do a collage of music with people from his bands from 1978 - now I mean call up Gayle, put Bobby Z in there, get a choir of voices ranging... Brenda Bennett Rhonda Eddie M Steph B(sheila e guitarist) * seems like overall he's almost performed with the same people since ONA

that brass band should include Atlanta Bliss Eric Lead Eddie M just do a cohesive album of music (not too many songs) so he put the best songs on their. And work with his legacy, that's enough of a GENRE in itself

Celebrate your music and legacy and those who helped along the way

It's all brain chemistry. If you are in your formative years, the music, movies, fashion etc all are endearing to you. Once you age a few decades, these new things do not have the same effects on you as the earlier ones have. All n all (EWF), the zeitgeist of your youth is always going to seem the best and everything that comes after will be mediocre.

However I will say that Dont Stop sucks compared to Start Me Up, and even that sucks compared to Brown Suga. Incense n Candles sucks compared to The Beautiful Ones.

But to a new generation these songs are the bomb diggidy. How else to explain the rise of Lil Payne, Perry, and them?

vainandy said:

I see it from him not having anything or anyone to inspire him also but not meaning his own band members. I'm talking about other artists these days. Back in the 1980s, there were tons of great artists to not only give him inspiration, but also competition. These days there's none. He used to lie back then and say he didn't listen to the radio but it was very obvious that he did because you could hear traces of the new wave mixed with the funk of the era mixed in his music. And today, you can hear traces of country mixed with rock that has been going on for years (which is a horrible sound) and shit hop and neo stool (which is an even worse sound). Then you hear about him performing on stage with folks like Scary J. Blige recently. Yeah, he's being influenced but by some people that make horrible sounding music.

I think he reconnecting with the Family & the Time and having them open shows 4 him would have been spectacular, Sheila E opening as well.

He would have easily begin to have people from those band guest with him,

I just don't think Prince & non-Prince camp singers should happen (mostly)

alphachannel said:

Perhaps we can blame both a lack of influence from the band mates he's choosing and the currently barren musical landscape.

But this is nonsense. There's plenty of challenging music, go look up tUnE-yArDs, The Weeknd, Frank Ocean, Santigold, Cat Power, Friends, Grizzly Bear, Clock Opera, The xx, Jack White, Neon Indian, Bat For Lashes, Alt-J, Regina Spektor, El-P, Ladyhawke, M83, Major Lazer, Arcade Fire, LCD Soundsystem, Hot Chip, James Blake, PJ Harvey, Sam Sparro, Beach House, Nicolas Jaar, Poliça, Sigur Ros,... And that's just some of the things I've recently been listening to.

Back in the 1980s Prince was influenced by what he heard via all kinds of channels, and to a large degree his band members. Listen to Prince's output of the past decade and a half and you hear a man who hasn't listened to anything except himself and whatever pop crap filters through.

At this point no matter what direction he takes most of his fans will view the past through rose-tinted glasses, the lesser interpretations such as 20ten are just dandy by me.

BartVanHemelen said:

alphachannel said:

Perhaps we can blame both a lack of influence from the band mates he's choosing and the currently barren musical landscape.

But this is nonsense. There's plenty of challenging music, go look up tUnE-yArDs, The Weeknd, Frank Ocean, Santigold, Cat Power, Friends, Grizzly Bear, Clock Opera, The xx, Jack White, Neon Indian, Bat For Lashes, Alt-J, Regina Spektor, El-P, Ladyhawke, M83, Major Lazer, Arcade Fire, LCD Soundsystem, Hot Chip, James Blake, PJ Harvey, Sam Sparro, Beach House, Nicolas Jaar, Poliça, Sigur Ros,... And that's just some of the things I've recently been listening to.

Back in the 1980s Prince was influenced by what he heard via all kinds of channels, and to a large degree his band members. Listen to Prince's output of the past decade and a half and you hear a man who hasn't listened to anything except himself and whatever pop crap filters through.

Maybe the new band members are liostnening to crap pop etc as it is their cohorts?

The fact that Wendy & Lisa have gone on to be a great production team indicates to me that their role as a ‘Producer’ in the glory years was probably larger than it was ever noted on the record sleeves. That’s not to say that he couldn’t still do it alone on certain tracks, but songs like ‘Around The World In A Day’ have so many different musical colours that he has never revisited since, which (to me) indicates that it was a real team effort at the time on certain songs.

...but, you have to have a good team of course, not just 'yes' men and women.

I think it's clear that he hasn't put enough effort into his records in the sense of them being "full-fledged" albums. He's to blame for the perception of the quality of his material himself. He has some good more modern songs, some songs that remind of his previous output that make the fans automatically smile and some songs I don't even understand why he has bothered to record.

The problem with a lot of people is that if they do not hear strong enough albums they're not going to consider too many of the individual tracks that good either (thus you might get some orgers giving "0/5" ratings for his recent albums). I think he has put out some real gems during the last ten years or so, but they tend to get lost with the other stuff that isn't that inspiring.

He used to have that "I'm going to make really great record now that's going to make everyone go wow" mindset and he was motivated to follow his vision all the way through. The recent interview he gave just proves to me that he doesn't see that much point in that as the record buying audience is most likely just going to overlook his work (and I can understand that sentiment). So, instead, he seems to be happy just taking his traveling circus with him and make a lot of money by selling tickets to people that have heard enough assuring from their friends and the press that he's the best.

OldFriends4Sale said:

vainandy said:

I see it from him not having anything or anyone to inspire him also but not meaning his own band members. I'm talking about other artists these days. Back in the 1980s, there were tons of great artists to not only give him inspiration, but also competition. These days there's none. He used to lie back then and say he didn't listen to the radio but it was very obvious that he did because you could hear traces of the new wave mixed with the funk of the era mixed in his music. And today, you can hear traces of country mixed with rock that has been going on for years (which is a horrible sound) and shit hop and neo stool (which is an even worse sound). Then you hear about him performing on stage with folks like Scary J. Blige recently. Yeah, he's being influenced but by some people that make horrible sounding music.

I think he reconnecting with the Family & the Time and having them open shows 4 him would have been spectacular, Sheila E opening as well.

He would have easily begin to have people from those band guest with him,

I just don't think Prince & non-Prince camp singers should happen (mostly)

I always liked the fact that when he used to work with people, they were usually complete unknowns. The Time were guys that he grew up with locally and Vanity was a girlfriend of Rick James (although after he heard her voice, he may have wished he had left her with Rick ). Jill Jones had been a backup singer for Teena Marie and Sheila E., I think had played in Lionel Richie's band. They were working true enough, but who the hell has ever paid attention to a backup singer or a band member of Lionel Richie's? The Commodores maybe, but not Lionel Richie solo. Working with unknowns didn't make him look desperate for success and also didn't take away from his own sound either.

Sheena Easton was well known but before Prince, she was doing adult contemporary, lite rock, and even a country song or two. Prince took her, made her a slut, and gave her a stronger sound. In other words, she didn't make him worse, he made her better. But when he performs with, or even is influenced by someone that came after him, it makes his sound weaker even if those artists say that he influenced them (if he did, the stuff they have made has sounded like an extremely watered down version of him...usually they've been influenced by his slow songs and not his jams). Letting them influence him is like Little Richard flipping the script and letting Pat Boone influence him.

.

.

.

[Edited 9/28/12 14:06pm]

alphachannel said:

Good call, sponging does have a negative connotation so maybe it's better to say he absorbs what's around him.

I don't want to belabor that point -- and certainly people have disparate views on the origin of art.

But the reason I rejected the idea of sponging is because it makes the artist seem passive and derivative. But with synergy an artist is very active and individualistic. It's not just semantics for me.

I personally don't think the artist just absorbs... I think he is sparked, he feeds and is then regenerated so he can access his own creative stream, etc. Artists need stimuli -- not the end products of others, per se. IMHO So, it really doesn't matter if the stimulant is a new artist or old, master or novice ... do they provoke him? Anger him? Seduce him? Make him see a perspective he hadn't considered? It's about the energy reaction.

As a writer myself, I love watching movies, listening to music or reading classic novels before I sit to down to write a piece of fiction. I told my brother this once and he innocently said "Oh, you get ideas from them?" I was incensed. He totally missed it. That's not what I do. If I am stimulated by others, I can access my own energy and ideas. They are like conduits into the Zone.

As a creative person I've always sought creative peers just for the exchange of stimuli. But it is rare to find someone who truly electrifies you so that you awaken from tedium and do something amazing -- or at the very least someone who can feed your own energy back to you.

And @OldFriendsForSale sort of alluded to this type of lesser stimulation in the Sheila E thread when talking about how Vanity was a physical manifestation of Prince's vision. He basically fed energy to her and she interepreted in the flesh and fed it back to him. That can be very titillating to recycle your own creative power through someone, but it's also a closed circuit where you don't get fresh injections. I not even sure this kind of stimulation would work anymore because he's recycled himself into sedation.

RDHULL

It's all brain chemistry.

Oh I really like this phrase....

[Edited 9/28/12 14:09pm]

vainandy said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I think he reconnecting with the Family & the Time and having them open shows 4 him would have been spectacular, Sheila E opening as well.

He would have easily begin to have people from those band guest with him,

I just don't think Prince & non-Prince camp singers should happen (mostly)

I always liked the fact that when he used to work with people, they were usually complete unknowns. The Time were guys that he grew up with locally and Vanity was a girlfriend of Rick James (although after he heard her voice, he may have wished he had left her with Rick ). Jill Jones had been a backup singer for Teena Marie and Sheila E., I think had played in Lionel Richie's band. They were working true enough, but who the hell has ever paid attention to a backup singer or a band member of Lionel Richie's? The Commodores maybe, but not Lionel Richie solo. Working with unknowns didn't make him look desperate for success and also didn't take away from his own sound either.

Sheena Easton was well known but before Prince, she was doing adult contemporary, lite rock, and even a country song or two. Prince took her, made her a slut, and gave her a stronger sound. In other words, she didn't make him worse, he made her better. But when he performs with, or even is influenced by someone that came after him, it makes his sound weaker even if those artists say that he influenced them (which if they did, the stuff they have made has sounded like an extremely watered down version of him...usually they've been influenced by his slow songs and not his jams). Letting them influence him is like Little Richard flipping the script and letting Pat Boone influence him.

.

.

.

[Edited 9/28/12 14:05pm]

Oh, man.

johnny2000 said:

The fact that Wendy & Lisa have gone on to be a great production team indicates to me that their role as a ‘Producer’ in the glory years was probably larger than it was ever noted on the record sleeves. That’s not to say that he couldn’t still do it alone on certain tracks, but songs like ‘Around The

vainandy said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I think he reconnecting with the Family & the Time and having them open shows 4 him would have been spectacular, Sheila E opening as well.

He would have easily begin to have people from those band guest with him,

I just don't think Prince & non-Prince camp singers should happen (mostly)

I always liked the fact that when he used to work with people, they were usually complete unknowns. The Time were guys that he grew up with locally and Vanity was a girlfriend of Rick James (although after he heard her voice, he may have wished he had left her with Rick ). Jill Jones had been a backup singer for Teena Marie and Sheila E., I think had played in Lionel Richie's band. They were working true enough, but who the hell has ever paid attention to a backup singer or a band member of Lionel Richie's? The Commodores maybe, but not Lionel Richie solo. Working with unknowns didn't make him look desperate for success and also didn't take away from his own sound either.

Sheena Easton was well known but before Prince, she was doing adult contemporary, lite rock, and even a country song or two. Prince took her, made her a slut, and gave her a stronger sound. In other words, she didn't make him worse, he made her better. But when he performs with, or even is influenced by someone that came after him, it makes his sound weaker even if those artists say that he influenced them (if he did, the stuff they have made has sounded like an extremely watered down version of him...usually they've been influenced by his slow songs and not his jams). Letting them influence him is like Little Richard flipping the script and letting Pat Boone influence him.

.

.

.

[Edited 9/28/12 14:06pm]

I understand where your going.

When you enter Prince land you dressed like him, you did his sound, Sheena on Sugar Walls & U Got the Look, when she walked on the latters video set she was dress like someone in the camp

He went all out with it

At times it just seems like Prince is one of the classic sounds and doesn't need to do covers to prove good music, he had it

I know the majority of u will disagree but weve had enuuf of classic tunes from 2000 -2012 IMO....

Chocolate Box

Illusion,Coma,Pimp & Circumstance

Cinammon Girl

Call My Name

Musicology

1+1+1 = 3

Dance 4 Me

Fury

Beautiful Strange

Love

Chelsea Rodgers

The Word

3121

Song Of The Heart

Conolized Mind

Dear Mr Man

Old Skool Company

Avalanche

U Make My Sunshine

When Will We B Paid

A Million Days

Future Soul Song

Everywere

I think teh problem is the albums themselves...if he did 1 every few years.....then uve got sum great albusm right there ^

Optimus2 said:

I know the majority of u will disagree but weve had enuuf of classic tunes from 2000 -2012 IMO....

Chocolate Box

Illusion,Coma,Pimp & Circumstance

Cinammon Girl

Call My Name

Musicology

1+1+1 = 3

Dance 4 Me

Fury

Beautiful Strange

Love

Chelsea Rodgers

The Word

3121

Song Of The Heart

Conolized Mind

Dear Mr Man

Old Skool Company

Avalanche

U Make My Sunshine

When Will We B Paid

A Million Days

Future Soul Song

Everywere

I think teh problem is the albums themselves...if he did 1 every few years.....then uve got sum great albusm right there ^

Take off Musicology, C Rodgers, A Million Days, Paid, C Box, C Girl

Optimus2 said:

I know the majority of u will disagree but weve had enuuf of classic tunes from 2000 -2012 IMO....

Chocolate Box

Illusion,Coma,Pimp & Circumstance

Cinammon Girl

Call My Name

Musicology

1+1+1 = 3

Dance 4 Me

Fury

Beautiful Strange

Love

Chelsea Rodgers

The Word

3121

Song Of The Heart

Conolized Mind

Dear Mr Man

Old Skool Company

Avalanche

U Make My Sunshine

When Will We B Paid

A Million Days

Future Soul Song

Everywere

I think teh problem is the albums themselves...if he did 1 every few years.....then uve got sum great albusm right there ^

I'm sorry but I dont think any of those tunes would be classed as 'classic' outside of prince.org

I really cant believe you seriously think the Staple Singers cover is a classic....you're joking right?

[Edited 9/28/12 21:48pm]

[Edited 9/28/12 21:48pm]

BartVanHemelen said:

alphachannel said:

Perhaps we can blame both a lack of influence from the band mates he's choosing and the currently barren musical landscape.

But this is nonsense. There's plenty of challenging music, go look up tUnE-yArDs, The Weeknd, Frank Ocean, Santigold, Cat Power, Friends, Grizzly Bear, Clock Opera, The xx, Jack White, Neon Indian, Bat For Lashes, Alt-J, Regina Spektor, El-P, Ladyhawke, M83, Major Lazer, Arcade Fire, LCD Soundsystem, Hot Chip, James Blake, PJ Harvey, Sam Sparro, Beach House, Nicolas Jaar, Poliça, Sigur Ros,... And that's just some of the things I've recently been listening to.

Back in the 1980s Prince was influenced by what he heard via all kinds of channels, and to a large degree his band members. Listen to Prince's output of the past decade and a half and you hear a man who hasn't listened to anything except himself and whatever pop crap filters through.

sad to say...you are right on target.