Now, not being a wizard at anything web-wise, or a legal know-all, can orgers explain something for me - keeping it really simple, please!-

1. exactly why Prince has an issue with Internet fan sites,

and

2. does he actually have the RIGHT to have them removed?"

I can understand the control of copyrighted material, but supressing the freedom of speech?

Having seen him interviewed he clearly likes to be in control of what he says and is asked, fair enough, so do millions of folk, but as a perfomer he is putting himself on the world stage isn't he? If he doesn't want people to watch, listen, or voice an opinion then why is he a performer?

I have never met Prince and obviously don't know the inner workings of his mind. But here's my guess based on what we've all read. Prince thinks that when people circulate bootlegs without his permission, they are stealing his music. He knows that some bootleggers actually make money from it, and he probably is doubtful that anyone would do it for free. He thinks that, when he moves to stop bootleggers, he is protecting not only his rights as an artist, but the rights of other artists just starting out who do not have the protection that he has. It's a moral issue for him.

Having said that, Prince is not stupid. He knows that his hardcore fans have all listened to lots of bootlegs. When he performs an unreleased song from the vault at a concert, he knows that we like it. He also knows that lashing out against his fans does not bring good publicity, which is why he did not follow through on the threats made against prince.org several years ago.

As for his legal rights, you'd have to ask a copyright lawyer exactly what he can and cannot stop people from saying or doing over the internet. It may not be the same in every jurisdiction. But it rarely comes to that because his targets either do not fight back or, if they do, he backs down.

Remember the uproar over the dancing baby...

purplethunder3121 said:

Remember the uproar over the dancing baby...

I mailed with that lady who put up the video. She said it was Universal and not Prince. Listen, my nieces did a dance for me and posted it on youtube with Lady Gaga and their music was muted too!

Well, not wanting to go all Ben Stallman on the issue, but nobody particularly asked for this internet, we just tagged along. Also, what with this new Chicago residency, there are clearly greater forces at play than simply asking Kevin Smith and George 'the real' Clinton' to Paint the Whitehouse Black.

Who else are they going to get to play Chicago on the eve of the election? Cat Power?

I hope this answers your question.

Cx

[Edited 9/1/12 14:18pm]

funkyjam33: I just posted on the Digital Garden thread. To continue....

It's a fact that fans spreading his music is a form of marketing and helps to spread something good. But it can also over saturate the market and I think that's what he wants to stop. This is why we're left with 'some' but not all. I think it's fair game.

However, to resolve this, if ever, the stance of the bootleg fans has got to be less aggressive and less of a win-lose 'for them vs. Prince' attitude because it adds fuel to the fire and its short sighted. It's like two kids fighting over who's going to get the biggest piece of cake.

The problem is, Prince made the cake. Otherwise it would be easy. One cuts, and the other one gets to decide which piece they choose.

Maybe if we let Prince cut the cake and have some respect for the fact that he bothered to bake at all, he might share more often. We need to go for a win-win here. Or else that Gingerbread man (candy) is just going to dissolve and dissipate in the water everytime.

Prince gives millions to charity not only because it's attractive for tax purposes, but purely because he has it. We can't say that we have made that kind of money. I'm sure he has a good heart and he'd rather give money to those that need it, than some bootleggers, who never have enough and who are often the character who derive great pleasure from trashing him. I don't think it's about the money, it's about the principle and lets not forget what he went through with Warner not having ownership rights to his music. It's a sore point for him!

Believe me, I am very happy with the music I've been able to get hold of which was never distributed by Prince. I don't own complete boots but I like to watch and listen and yes some are too good not to keep. And through a lot of them, I've ordered the cd, dvd or piano book online (this dead internet that serves us so well) because it's a must have. But.....

I think that if his fan base showed more respect, Prince would distribute more. Why feed kids more candy if all they do is borrow, steal and moan? We're seldom happy with what he gives us nowdays so it's not hard to imagine that it only strengthens his resolve to not share what we so badly want.

[Edited 9/1/12 14:38pm]

Good one MrSquirrel, funny.

Thanks artist76.

MrSquirrel is being ironic. Have you clicked the links?

What happened to mrs. squirrel?

It's about control, Prince wants to control what we can and can't hear or see. I think if he had his way we wouldn't even be able to listen to albums we already own.

He wants control of his art and inteleectual property and is the first to go to the lengths he has to gain it.

I mean did u think that the mayor of Uptown was going to just let yall denizens do what ever they wanted? That's anarchy.

TheEnglishGent said:

It's about control, Prince wants to control what we can and can't hear or see. I think if he had his way we wouldn't even be able to listen to albums we already own.

No it's not an issue Prince has. Its Prince fans that have issues.

[Edited 9/1/12 20:09pm]

rdhull said:

He wants control of his art and inteleectual property and is the first to go to the lengths he has to gain it.

I mean did u think that the mayor of Uptown was going to just let yall denizens do what ever they wanted? That's anarchy.

TheEnglishGent said:

It's about control, Prince wants to control what we can and can't hear or see. I think if he had his way we wouldn't even be able to listen to albums we already own.

The issue is that he is controling things that are not his art or intellectual property. If someone makes a song list or paints a picture of Prince, that is not his property. If someone takes a photo of Prince Prince has no rights over that photo. "The first thing that needs to be understood is that every photograph is the intellectual property of the person who took the photograph."

The only things that should legally enter into his control would be things that threaten his ability to make a profit.

For example the site where they had hundreds of crazy Prince gifs that he had taken down. That was an illegal act by Prince and an anti aert act. And an un-American act. It's a basic right in this country to parody, report, or appropriate for art as long is it's not infringing on someone's business. That's why you can have political cartoons that make fun of presidents in the paper.

Bohemian67 said:

Good one MrSquirrel, funny.

la la cheers, i just had an idea that i could probably have programmed a semantic web crawler to search youtube with each word in the post then return the results as a link, but one of them would have been guaranteed to be that rap bloke going "up in here" ad infinitum.

Also i have been brainwashed by Alex Jones, but he is quite funny when he takes the piss out of trendies.

Lots of love,

Cx

Full control over something he, nor anyone, can ever have full control over. Sour grapes. Toys thrown out of pram.

Has anyone considered that, like the late Senator Stevens, Prince thinks the internet is a series of tubes, and doesn't want to get sucked into one?

TheEnglishGent said:

It's about control, Prince wants to control what we can and can't hear or see. I think if he had his way we wouldn't even be able to listen to albums we already own.

Exactly,and this is why Prince hates the Internet.It's something bigger and more powerful than he is.He hates things that he can't control or manipulate.I remember in the 90s,he was doing all those interviews,talking about the amazing possibilities of the Internet and how artists wouldn't need record companies anymore.He even said "filesharing is like rain falling",implying that it can't be stopped and that record companies are getting what they deserve.

Funny how things turned out.Now he's against the very thing that he once supported aggressively

NouveauDance said:

Full control over something he, nor anyone, can ever have full control over.

Very good point.What Prince doesn't seem to understand is that,in the Internet age,once something is "out there",nobody can control it anymore.The moment that something leaks (whether it's a movie,an album,a video or whatever),it's easily obtainable by anyone with a computer.I once was in a barber shop getting a haircut,and someone put in a DVD of the movie "American Gangster"-----a week before the film was due in theatres!! Prince faces an uphill battle if he thinks he can stop these things from happening.

funkyjam33 said:

Now, not being a wizard at anything web-wise, or a legal know-all, can orgers explain something for me - keeping it really simple, please!-

1. exactly why Prince has an issue with Internet fan sites,

and

2. does he actually have the RIGHT to have them removed?"

I can understand the control of copyrighted material, but supressing the freedom of speech?

Having seen him interviewed he clearly likes to be in control of what he says and is asked, fair enough, so do millions of folk, but as a perfomer he is putting himself on the world stage isn't he? If he doesn't want people to watch, listen, or voice an opinion then why is he a performer?

There was a time in the internet early years that Prince was one of the forerunners (along with David Bowie & Public Enemy) in using the World Wide Web to sell his music without the help of a major record label. But overtime, specific in the 2000's, getting free music via file sharing has gotten so great to the point that no one (especially the RIAA) are able to stop it. Also adding the fact that anyone can upload music videos on Bittorent, Youtube, etc, and you have a situation that does not fit well for a natural control freak such as Prince.

In a very interest twisting, the late Michael Jackson, Madonna, and (most recently) George Clinton has successfully been able to do the one thing that Prince has failed AND refused to do to save his music career: Be YouTube-friendly. In other words, let music fans upload their favorite videos as a way to educate a younger generation of music fans that may not know about the work of artists before their timeline.

Well not exactly.

Warner/Universal/UG whatever, the whole bunch of them also decide for Michael.

Michael Jackson - ..."
This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Web Sheriff.

funkyjam33 said:

Now, not being a wizard at anything web-wise, or a legal know-all, can orgers explain something for me - keeping it really simple, please!-

1. exactly why Prince has an issue with Internet fan sites,

and

2. does he actually have the RIGHT to have them removed?"

I can understand the control of copyrighted material, but supressing the freedom of speech?

Having seen him interviewed he clearly likes to be in control of what he says and is asked, fair enough, so do millions of folk, but as a perfomer he is putting himself on the world stage isn't he? If he doesn't want people to watch, listen, or voice an opinion then why is he a performer?

Keeping it simple............

1) He wants complete control

2) Nope

Bohemian67 said:

Well not exactly.

Warner/Universal/UG whatever, the whole bunch of them also decide for Michael.

Michael Jackson - ..."
This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Web Sheriff.

Sorry about that.

Michael's videos from his time with Sony Music Entertainment are currenty shown in MIchaelJacksonVEVO YouTube Channel.

Universal Music only has a say in music videos and/or promo films The Jackson 5 & Michael has done for Motown Record (currently owned by Universal Music). And even then, Universal has FAILED badly because I can still find plenty of The Jackson 5 footages on YouTube.