Diamonds and Pearls - Everything about it:

Bad Hip Hop Crossover Attempts

Tony M

Conventional Sound

Emphasis on Surface vs. Personal/Introspection

Arsenio Hall Performances

Signaled Future Songwriting and Compositional Problems

Another Regression in the Growth that was SOTT/Lovesexy

Commercialism Vs. Art (1st P Album to Tip the Scales in the Wrong Way)

*Unfortunately It Was a Major Hit (LOL)

jdcxc said:

Diamonds and Pearls - Everything about it:

Bad Hip Hop Crossover Attempts

Tony M

Conventional Sound

Emphasis on Surface vs. Personal/Introspection

Arsenio Hall Performances

Signaled Future Songwriting and Compositional Problems

Another Regression in the Growth that was SOTT/Lovesexy

Commercialism Vs. Art (1st P Album to Tip the Scales in the Wrong Way)

*Unfortunately It Was a Major Hit (LOL)

The worst moment in his career and especially his personal life was joining the JW. He deserves better.

When it comes to Prince's career as a whole I think it would've benefited from him putting less emphasis on quantity and more emphasis on quality. Don't get me wrong, he's my favorite artist and I think his quality level has been very high, but with a slightly different approach it could've been even higher.

guarinigirl2000 said:

--That fucked up thing he calls an afro on his head now.

--Letting Larry Graham talk him into becoming a JW.

--Not doing "Bad" as a duet with Michael Jackson. Yeah, I'm still stewing. That album needed some purple funk on it.

--Doing anything with Larry Graham. I see them onstage and cringe. Looks like Prince dancing with his father.

--The braids around 99-00

--That interview where he had Mayte speak answers for him.

As far as your problems with Larry Graham goes, I really can't say I agree or disagree with you. On the one side, I'm a huge Sly and The Family Stone fan, so I love the fact that Graham and Prince are friends. At the same time, I see what you mean. Those two on the same stage just doesn't look right. Not deciding to do bad always has bothered me, because before I got into Prince Bad was by far one of my favorite albums of all time, so just thinking of Bad as a duet between MJ and Prince would have been off the hook. The Braids do kinda bother me, but that interview you speak of... I absolutely loved it. I thought it was hilarious how Prince decided to be interviewed, and then not speak during it. Annoying at times yes, but I kinda see his frustration since all those questions the interviewer asked him had been asked in the past, so he was just kinda teasing her. Definitely not the worst moment of his career. I think his worst is his copyright fight with YouTube. I understand the need to make sure people don't post your music online onto sites like Youtube, you know people do just rip songs with YouTube and I see the arguement more or less, but at the same time, thats horrible Public Relations to take a video off of YouTube when its just a 30 second clip of a baby dancing to Let's Go Crazy... That alone was a huge fiasco for him.

jpnyc said:

• When he hired the stylist responsible for the outfits and hairdoes of the Rave era.

• Every single album cover art approval decision except for the black album.

• Putting Jughead on Diamonds and Pearls.

• Deciding that The Gold Experience really needed another five or six tracks of sounds layered on top to make it sound right.

• Pissing of Rosie Gaines.

I agree with all of these except for the last one which was a non-event to me...

funksterr said:

Extra-Laughable. He has never looked more desperate than the recent release

Desperate for what? He didn't actually say two words about it. He released it and moved on.

m13los said:

What do you think was the worst moment in Prince's career?

The assless pants or that video he did with that...'bathing suit'...on .

thedance said:

the huge media backlash to Prince's career, when he was at his creative peak..... in the mid 1980's.

what am I talking about?

When Prince refused to be at the We Are The World/ USA For Africa project made by MJ and his camp...

Maybe wise because that song they were singing were really cringe worthy, terrible.

but... that incident, not to show up was hurting Prince.. his reputation and his record sales, very bad,

and (imho) this caused the bad blood between MJ and Prince.

Now.. don't make this another one of those "P versus MJ threads", pleeeeasee..

I completely agree, it was this moment that a lot of people starting hating him and kept that grudge for a long long time, even if they forgot why. This was a huge fiasco, because not only did the public think it was horrible for him to not do "We Are the World" (and that decision was really publicized by the media) but his bodyguard got crazy with some paparazzi the same night the recording was taking place. This really caused a ripple of bad attitude towards him by people that really swallowed the press reports as the complete truth.

This was the scandal that was reported around the world and regular folks took it to heart in a serious way. Most all of these other things in this thread are only in the awareness of Prince fanatics.

[Edited 4/17/12 20:20pm]

phunkymunky said:

In no particular order:

• Saying "this is the last time I'm playing the hits" every year since 1978
• Allowing Kirky to do any drum programming
• Wasting time with a lot of piss-awful proteges
• Becoming a JW
• Not making more albums with the New Power Trio
• The whole lotusflower.com shit
• Making a lot of terrible promo vids
• Failing to release one good live album or DVD (Sacrifice of Victor is the best attempt but he has ridiculous sideburns)

At the time I thought they were cool, but retrospectively, yeah, those were some ridiculous sideburns weren't they...

Speaking strictly musically, because there are just waaaaaay too many dumb off-hand remarks in interviews to even single one out or try to remember them all.....

Has to be the one-two punch of NPS/Rave.

errant said:

Speaking strictly musically, because there are just waaaaaay too many dumb off-hand remarks in interviews to even single one out or try to remember them all.....

Has to be the one-two punch of NPS/Rave.

Oh, wait a minute. The extremely long wait for Crystal Ball after the pre-orders, the terrible attitude of that "Naysayer/toast" thing on top of him trying for form an Internet collective of fan site and suing and sending cease & desist letters to the ones who wouldn't joint, then Crystal Ball showing up in retail outlets before it had even been delivered to the people who paid for the funding to get it pressed. And the usual shit service from 1-800-NEW-FUNK.

Or was it the 2nd year renewal for $77 of the LotusFlow3r memberships after the site had gone defunct.

Hmmm..............

errant said:

errant said:

Speaking strictly musically, because there are just waaaaaay too many dumb off-hand remarks in interviews to even single one out or try to remember them all.....

Has to be the one-two punch of NPS/Rave.

Oh, wait a minute. The extremely long wait for Crystal Ball after the pre-orders, the terrible attitude of that "Naysayer/toast" thing on top of him trying for form an Internet collective of fan site and suing and sending cease & desist letters to the ones who wouldn't joint, then Crystal Ball showing up in retail outlets before it had even been delivered to the people who paid for the funding to get it pressed. And the usual shit service from 1-800-NEW-FUNK.

Or was it the 2nd year renewal for $77 of the LotusFlow3r memberships after the site had gone defunct.

Hmmm..............

Oh, and suing a baby for dancing to Let's Go Crazy has to be up there.

Yeah, I think suing his own fans (or threatening to sue them) for talking about him, sharing pictures of him, and being generally enthused about his work probably takes the cake

Oh man, there are so many.

The name change (business wise) wasn't good for the Brand. Although, personally it was a good thing (So says Prince.)

The public war against WB. Could have been handled better. I cringed a lot during those years.

Those two things to me, seem like the biggest PR problems long term than any other issues.

(The whole WATW song mishap went away with in a year or so.)

phunkymunky said:

• Saying "this is the last time I'm playing the hits" every year since 1978

errant said:

errant said:

Speaking strictly musically, because there are just waaaaaay too many dumb off-hand remarks in interviews to even single one out or try to remember them all.....

Has to be the one-two punch of NPS/Rave.

Oh, wait a minute. The extremely long wait for Crystal Ball after the pre-orders, the terrible attitude of that "Naysayer/toast" thing on top of him trying for form an Internet collective of fan site and suing and sending cease & desist letters to the ones who wouldn't joint, then Crystal Ball showing up in retail outlets before it had even been delivered to the people who paid for the funding to get it pressed. And the usual shit service from 1-800-NEW-FUNK.

Or was it the 2nd year renewal for $77 of the LotusFlow3r memberships after the site had gone defunct.

Hmmm..............

The Cyrstal Ball one was totally offensive.

Because, many people voiced their complaints about double-billing and not getting their merchandise, which as customers they have a right to do.

And all NPGMC (or Lov41A) had to do ws issue a statement explaining the wait, and apologizing for it LIKE ANY COMPANY SHOULD DO , but instead they send this long ass email using princebonics about how successful their 'experiment' has been and how everyone complaining are HATERS. It was odd and unfortunate. It completely should a lack of business mind.

the war with Warners in the 90s.He handled it all wrong

ufoclub said:

thedance said:

the huge media backlash to Prince's career, when he was at his creative peak..... in the mid 1980's.

what am I talking about?

When Prince refused to be at the We Are The World/ USA For Africa project made by MJ and his camp...

Maybe wise because that song they were singing were really cringe worthy, terrible.

but... that incident, not to show up was hurting Prince.. his reputation and his record sales, very bad,

and (imho) this caused the bad blood between MJ and Prince.

Now.. don't make this another one of those "P versus MJ threads", pleeeeasee..

I completely agree, it was this moment that a lot of people starting hating him and kept that grudge for a long long time, even if they forgot why. This was a huge fiasco, because not only did the public think it was horrible for him to not do "We Are the World" (and that decision was really publicized by the media) but his bodyguard got crazy with some paparazzi the same night the recording was taking place. This really caused a ripple of bad attitude towards him by people that really swallowed the press reports as the complete truth.

This was the scandal that was reported around the world and regular folks took it to heart in a serious way. Most all of these other things in this thread are only in the awareness of Prince fanatics.

I agree...some of his weird antics in 1985 really created a backlash.He was the hottest artist on the planet,but he was alienating alot of people at a time when he needed the mainstream audience to stay in his corner.When 'Parade' and 'UTCM' didn't do as well as expected,you could see that he had lost much of his 'Purple Rain' audience.

becoming a JW

talking bullshit like homophobic remarks in recent years and that burqa comment, or all that "con"-bullcrap. Makes him look like an uneducated fool.

throwing out great music but isn't willing to promote it properly

blaming mayte indirectly for the death of their child by posting an article about the dangers of make up products on his love4oneanother website - that was cold

legal harassment against fansites like housequake, prince.org and teh uptown magazine. I was really mad at him back then.

Tony M, Kirky J, TC Ellis

SoulAlive said:

ufoclub said:

I completely agree, it was this moment that a lot of people starting hating him and kept that grudge for a long long time, even if they forgot why. This was a huge fiasco, because not only did the public think it was horrible for him to not do "We Are the World" (and that decision was really publicized by the media) but his bodyguard got crazy with some paparazzi the same night the recording was taking place. This really caused a ripple of bad attitude towards him by people that really swallowed the press reports as the complete truth.

This was the scandal that was reported around the world and regular folks took it to heart in a serious way. Most all of these other things in this thread are only in the awareness of Prince fanatics.

I agree...some of his weird antics in 1985 really created a backlash.He was the hottest artist on the planet,but he was alienating alot of people at a time when he needed the mainstream audience to stay in his corner.When 'Parade' and 'UTCM' didn't do as well as expected,you could see that he had lost much of his 'Purple Rain' audience.

Yeah Prince got really cocky by 1985 and it affected would could have been a more solidifying era for him in Parade. He seemed to think Purple Rain was shallow and UTCM would be deep. the band should have been in the movie Jill Jones- the Family & Sheila E should have been in the movie

Not releaising the Black Album and cancelling the SOTT tour for Lovesexy. I think both would

have put him back on the hype similar to PR and gave him the creativity level instead of the

attempt at blending and trying to be like everyone else.

alandail said:

Adorecream said:

So many

1. Discovered Carmen Electra

2. Changed his name

3. Decided that Tony M really was a great rapper and had the wittiest pen the Twin Cities had seen.

4. Firing Cat after the lovesexy tour

5. Limited release of 20TEn

6. His humiliating gagging of youtube

7. Various homophobic incidents over the years.

8. Never playing New Zealand or Malta

9. The whole Chaos and Disorder and Newpowersoul albums being released

10. The lyrical content of some albums like Rainbow children

11. Self indulgent albums of late

12. The whole Lotusflow3r website boondoggle (Tshirts etc)

13. The whole Crystal Ball distribution fiasco

14. Glam Slam Ulysses ballet.

The bolded ones and other issues not listed can all be tracked back to a single root cause

- the moment he decided he could manage his career better than the professionals. He immediately went from a record 15 consecutive years with top 10 hits to 17 consecutive years and counting without a top 10 hit. To put the drought in perspective, Madonna has had 10 top 10 hits (and 25 #1 dance chart hits) since Prince decided to split with the professionals. I picked Madonna because they are the same age, had the same record label, and continue to release albums.

I don't buy the "but he's making more money" argument at all because most of the money he makes is from touring (Madonna has grossed $1 billion touring this century). His WB catalog has to be generating more earnings for him than his post warners catalog, and I'm sure he doesn't subtract out his own increased expenses when he talks about how much money he makes now.

Fun fact: Almost all the money any musicians make these days is from touring.

Prince was way ahead pf the curve on this one.

ludwig said:

becoming a JW

That's it in a nutshell. Not slamming his ears shut when Larry Graham started preaching at him was, for me, by far the worst career mistake he's made.

Not joining the org and heeding our opinions and advice!

To me, the worst moment in his career was when he changed his name and went on Letterman to promote an album that was "never" going to be relesased just to piss his record company off.

I still don't understand why he couldn't just rework his deal with WB to have a deal like MJ, Springsteen, Billy Joel, etc. had with Sony. If he couldn't rework the deal, he could have easily signed to Sony and had a P&D deal (like those I mentioned) and still retain his master recordings.

The Gangsta Glam music video

Is there really anything else to say about it?

udo said:

NouveauDance said:

Prince performed on stage with James Brown and MJ??? When was that?!?!?!

You must be kidding.

Yeah, the video is online. This was in '83 at a James Brown show. James invites Michael on stage. Michael obliges, singing and dancing a little bit. Then James tells the audience Michael wants him to invite Prince on stage. Prince rides on Chick's back to the stage, pulling his gloves off with his teeth.

James tells Prince he has to "do something". Prince looks nervous and ends up getting a guitar shoved into his hand. He plays it uncomfortably, then goes shirtless and dances some his famous sexy moves. But it just looks so awkward...

skipp3Rn3ls0n said:

The Gangsta Glam music video

Is there really anything else to say about it?

Wack ass proteges. Not the ones like Sheila E., The Time, & The Family, but you know who they are

The braided up hairstyle from the Rave days that looked like something from The Little Rascals.

KemiVA said:

udo said:

You must be kidding.

Yeah, the video is online. This was in '83 at a James Brown show. James invites Michael on stage. Michael obliges, singing and dancing a little bit. Then James tells the audience Michael wants him to invite Prince on stage. Prince rides on Chick's back to the stage, pulling his gloves off with his teeth.

James tells Prince he has to "do something". Prince looks nervous and ends up getting a guitar shoved into his hand. He plays it uncomfortably, then goes shirtless and dances some his famous sexy moves. But it just looks so awkward...

No way!!!!!!!!!