nursev said:

but I'm starting to feel as if Mr. Nelson has him beat with all the songs he has written for himself and other artist even the one's that are credited to his alters-is Prince the greatest song writer to ever do it? Yay or Nay? Imma say Yay

[img:$uid]http://s3.amazonaws.com/files.posterous.com/greatseth/OTHmUYPSz3vp5p0jaSQnDBW5pAfHPSIv4m9cVH3WDstT4IgWDh4ImTa2Bc6F/nod.gif?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJFZAE65UYRT34AOQ&Expires=1326087891&Signature=St7m5HAkOXH1%2FtWwtE3%2F8QC0SVI%3D[/img:$uid]Yay

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

He is ONE of them, that's fer sure.

But to name some others in my list:

[...]

Michael Jackson

You're going to start another fight and get this thread ed.

nursev said:

Dren5 said:

They don't have to - Rundgren is still the bee's knees.

I wanna fall down and worship every time I hear "A Dream Goes on Forever".

Nursev - Yes, I love Prince lol. Yes, he's a hell of a writer and probably my favorite musician, period; has been for years and I don't see that changing anytime soon. At the same time, I have to give credit where it's due.

I can respect this

Ya'll mu-fuckas ever heard of a guy named Paul McCartney?

Spanky said:

nursev said:

Dren5 said: I can respect this

Ya'll mu-fuckas ever heard of a guy named Paul McCartney?

Yeah, what's that got to do with this?

CrabalockerFishwife said:

Spanky said:

Ya'll mu-fuckas ever heard of a guy named Paul McCartney?

Yeah, what's that got to do with this?

Like I said, if we were just talking music/melody Prince and Paul would both be top of the list. But lyrics are an important part of songwriting.

STEVIE WONDER

Pomade said:

STEVIE WONDER

In a way, I agree. Like I said, Prince and Paul McCartney are great with composing music, but not lyrics; and Bob Dylan and John Lennon are great lyricists, but not the greatest when it comes to the music. Stevie Wonder actually is great at both music and lyrics.

Prince has written some great songs, don't know if he's the best...would it be accurate to say say he's written more songs than most?

CrabalockerFishwife said:

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

He is ONE of them, that's fer sure.

But to name some others in my list:

[...]

Michael Jackson

You're going to start another fight and get this thread ed.

Tis merely an opinion. As I said, he's in MY list. Doesn't have to be in anyone else's.

I ain't comparing the two by any means anymore than I'm comparing Prince to George Gershwin.

Prince is in my top 10 list for greatest songwriters of all time, no doubt.

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

CrabalockerFishwife said:

You're going to start another fight and get this thread ed.

Tis merely an opinion. As I said, he's in MY list. Doesn't have to be in anyone else's.

I ain't comparing the two by any means anymore than I'm comparing Prince to George Gershwin.

Prince is in my top 10 list for greatest songwriters of all time, no doubt.

I'm a big Michael Jackson fan, but most people here know that the slightest mention of MJ often leads to flame wars, then the lock.

WhatdoUwantme2do said:

Prince has written some great songs, don't know if he's the best...would it be accurate to say say he's written more songs than most?

Probably; though Bob Dylan has released around the same amount of music as Prince has (maybe more).

CrabalockerFishwife said:

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

Tis merely an opinion. As I said, he's in MY list. Doesn't have to be in anyone else's.

I ain't comparing the two by any means anymore than I'm comparing Prince to George Gershwin.

Prince is in my top 10 list for greatest songwriters of all time, no doubt.

I'm a big Michael Jackson fan, but most people here know that the slightest mention of MJ often leads to flame wars, then the lock.

Funniest thing about that, the sense of insecurity almost makes one draw the parallel of the man who buys a big car to overcompensate.

This is not a school yard dick measuring contest, geez!

But to keep this thread going, I"ll go edit my reply.

They're both gifted. However, calling either one the greatest is fanboy salivating.

I give it to a command McCartney - Lennon.
1. McCartney-Lennon
2. Bob Dylan
3. Smokey Robinson
4. David Bowie
5. Stevie Wonder
---------------------
more difficult. A whole group of roughly equal contenders.

I think that Prince could fight for a place in the top 10, but apparently not in the top 5

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

CrabalockerFishwife said:

I'm a big Michael Jackson fan, but most people here know that the slightest mention of MJ often leads to flame wars, then the lock.

Funniest thing about that, the sense of insecurity almost makes one draw the parallel of the man who buys a big car to overcompensate.

This is not a school yard dick measuring contest, geez!

But to keep this thread going, I"ll go edit my reply.

I hope you know I wasn't trying to be rude, but if you look at this thread about Prince as a songwriter (http://prince.org/msg/7/361092) you'll see why you can't bring up MJ in the Prince forum. I just don't want the anti-MJ trolls to come derail this thread.

edit: I still can't figure out how to link things properly. They need to get that problem fixed.

[Edited 1/9/12 4:05am]

Smokey should have a Gershwin award. Weird that he doesn't. Paul Simon, McCartney, and Stevie Wonder do. Prince as far as I know has never been inducted in the Songwriters Hall of Fame, and that's kind of weird, too.

We all have our favorite songs, so to say one person in particular is greatest of all time - it all depends on what the person likes. Sometimes a great song is something you like right off the bat, sometimes it demands repeated listenings until you wind up liking it, sometimes a song might not have meaning at a certain age, but later on, might have way more meaning to you.

I don't get the argument about Dylan's music not being up to par - he had a lot of memorable melodies.

dalsh327 said:

I don't get the argument about Dylan's music not being up to par - he had a lot of memorable melodies.

I didn't say he was bad at it, just that if you took away the lyrics, I don't think he'd be thought of as one of the greatest composers of all time. The same with John Lennon.

Paul McCartney is widely considered one of the best of all time when it comes to melodies, but lyrically I think he's average. Prince is great with music too, but his lyrics are rarely anything special enough to be thought of as one of the best lyricists.

Stevie Wonder is a good pick because his songs always had great melodies, and in the 70s, his lyrics were brilliant too.

dalsh327 said:

Smokey should have a Gershwin award. Weird that he doesn't. Paul Simon, McCartney, and Stevie Wonder do. Prince as far as I know has never been inducted in the Songwriters Hall of Fame, and that's kind of weird, too.

We all have our favorite songs, so to say one person in particular is greatest of all time - it all depends on what the person likes. Sometimes a great song is something you like right off the bat, sometimes it demands repeated listenings until you wind up liking it, sometimes a song might not have meaning at a certain age, but later on, might have way more meaning to you.

I don't get the argument about Dylan's music not being up to par - he had a lot of memorable melodies.

Yes, I always thought it is insulting.
Such an award is a great honor in the music, there is a complicated procedure getting into the Hall, so there is only a very worthy people.
Very strange that Prince had no place among the nearly 400 songwriters ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Songwriters_Hall_of_Fame_inductees

I never see George Clinton or Bootsy on these list.......and they should be.

Smokey is one of the greatest songwriters of our time. Prince has written some very good songs and a few great songs, but he isn't even close to those I've listed below IMHO.

Bob Dylan

Lennon-McCartney

Stevie Wonder

Sam Cooke

Leonard Cohen

CrabalockerFishwife said:

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

Funniest thing about that, the sense of insecurity almost makes one draw the parallel of the man who buys a big car to overcompensate.

This is not a school yard dick measuring contest, geez!

But to keep this thread going, I"ll go edit my reply.

I hope you know I wasn't trying to be rude, but if you look at this thread about Prince as a songwriter (http://prince.org/msg/7/361092) you'll see why you can't bring up MJ in the Prince forum. I just don't want the anti-MJ trolls to come derail this thread.

edit: I still can't figure out how to link things properly. They need to get that problem fixed.

[Edited 1/9/12 4:05am]

I know your reasoning and I know you were just giving me the heads up.

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

CrabalockerFishwife said:

I'm a big Michael Jackson fan, but most people here know that the slightest mention of MJ often leads to flame wars, then the lock.

Funniest thing about that, the sense of insecurity almost makes one draw the parallel of the man who buys a big car to overcompensate.

This is not a school yard dick measuring contest, geez!

But to keep this thread going, I"ll go edit my reply.

Why edit your reply? YOUR opinion is YOUR opinion. It doesn't matter who likes it or disagrees with it.

Free2BMe said:

ThruTheEyesOfWonder said:

Funniest thing about that, the sense of insecurity almost makes one draw the parallel of the man who buys a big car to overcompensate.

This is not a school yard dick measuring contest, geez!

But to keep this thread going, I"ll go edit my reply.

Why edit your reply? YOUR opinion is YOUR opinion. It doesn't matter who likes it or disagrees with it.

By edit, I mean I put a disclaimer.

My opinion stands.

[Edited 1/9/12 21:59pm]

Empress said:

Leonard Cohen

Finally!

My list goes (in no particular order because they are all The Greatest in their own ways):

1. Prince. His wordplay and melodies are fantastic. I love how his lyrics can have 2+ meanings and you won't even really get all of them, ever. And not to get nerdy, but dude can compose some serious counterpoint. I adore his genre-mixing too. It's like he's so fluent in any musical language he chooses to know about that he can write in it, but somehow still manage to make it funky and intrinsically Prince. He is just fantastic.

2. Stevie Wonder. Love him. There isn't much to say because he's just so great. The chords he uses, the lyrics he writes...ah-mazing. I think it's because he doesn't have the visual crutch that everyone else has and can write more closely about how things actually are as opposed to how they seem. His lyrics are so real and honest. Not to mention his range is crazy so he can just keep building on emotion in the melodies he writes.

3. Mariah Carey. Her melodies and lyrics are fantastic, particularly during the earlier-to-middle portion of her career. She's very good at painting visuals just with lyrics alone. I also love how she can slip in "fancy" words like elusive or something like that into a club-banger, pop hit. Most writers feel they have to dumb stuff down for the public. Particularly the American public.

4. Carole King. This woman is awesome. Her stuff is down-home, but sophisticated. And the chords she uses are so simple, but so effective!

5. Rod Temperton. YES. He can make you dance even when you don't want to dance. He too is really awesome at counterpoint, particularly between the voice and the bass.

6. Michael Jackson. I love his use of random sounds like car parts, machinery, and just everyday stuff to create a very rhythmic/mechanical, yet funky vibe to all his songs. He could write a killer melody, and the rhythms he'd use were very effective as well.

7. Dolly Parton. She doesn't get a whole lot of credit for her skills, but her lyrics are so emotion-filled. She's a storyteller too (as most country artists are) and she creates a full scene of whatever she's writing about. She doesn't feel the need to crowd her songs up with too much flashy junk, just letting the purity of the words and the melody speak for themselves.

thank god someone brought up Carole King.

And who ever said that Paul Mcartney can't write decent lyrics doesn't know what the fuck they are talking about.

muirdo said:

thank god someone brought up Carole King.

And who ever said that Paul Mcartney can't write decent lyrics doesn't know what the fuck they are talking about.

I'm not sure if you're talking about me, but I didn't say he couldn't write decent lyrics; I said he's not one of the best lyricists ever. I've heard every Beatles, Wings and solo album, so I know his music well.

imago said:

Cole Porter pwns both of them.

FUGGIN' AGREED LIKE A MUG

RoseDuchess12 said:

My list goes (in no particular order because they are all The Greatest in their own ways):

1. Prince. His wordplay and melodies are fantastic. I love how his lyrics can have 2+ meanings and you won't even really get all of them, ever. And not to get nerdy, but dude can compose some serious counterpoint. I adore his genre-mixing too. It's like he's so fluent in any musical language he chooses to know about that he can write in it, but somehow still manage to make it funky and intrinsically Prince. He is just fantastic.

2. Stevie Wonder. Love him. There isn't much to say because he's just so great. The chords he uses, the lyrics he writes...ah-mazing. I think it's because he doesn't have the visual crutch that everyone else has and can write more closely about how things actually are as opposed to how they seem. His lyrics are so real and honest. Not to mention his range is crazy so he can just keep building on emotion in the melodies he writes.

3. Mariah Carey. Her melodies and lyrics are fantastic, particularly during the earlier-to-middle portion of her career. She's very good at painting visuals just with lyrics alone. I also love how she can slip in "fancy" words like elusive or something like that into a club-banger, pop hit. Most writers feel they have to dumb stuff down for the public. Particularly the American public.

4. Carole King. This woman is awesome. Her stuff is down-home, but sophisticated. And the chords she uses are so simple, but so effective!

5. Rod Temperton. YES. He can make you dance even when you don't want to dance. He too is really awesome at counterpoint, particularly between the voice and the bass.

6. Michael Jackson. I love his use of random sounds like car parts, machinery, and just everyday stuff to create a very rhythmic/mechanical, yet funky vibe to all his songs. He could write a killer melody, and the rhythms he'd use were very effective as well.

7. Dolly Parton. She doesn't get a whole lot of credit for her skills, but her lyrics are so emotion-filled. She's a storyteller too (as most country artists are) and she creates a full scene of whatever she's writing about. She doesn't feel the need to crowd her songs up with too much flashy junk, just letting the purity of the words and the melody speak for themselves.

I agree with this list!!!

He might be the best of his generation, but if you're talking about all time, then he pales by comparison to most of his predecessors.

His claim to fame has always been his musicianship, not his lyrics.