..I suspect that we all love this incredible track - who remembers the version from the SOTT video!.

Anyway I guess we all understand why he doesn't acknowledge 'the cross' due to his religious beliefs which is perfectly acceptable. However surely 'a cross' can also be viewed as highly symbolic of the troubles we all face. Perhaps lyrically it is too difficult for him to use the line 'don't u die without knowing the cross' [apologies if i've got the lyric wrong!] but I still think it is such a simple and yet majestic song that come to life when done live.

Anyone agree?.

He just replaces words these days, so no worries.

A few years back he performed it as "The Christ"

These days, he may change the lyrics a bit more performing older hits.

Black day, stormy night.

No love, no hope in sight.

Don't cry--he is coming.

Don't die, without knowing....the chemtrail.....

Look, he's a visionary, ok?

From what I have heard...JW don't beleive Jesus died on the cross or beleive he was everything Christians beleive he was......this is why he sings "The Christ" instead of "The Cross".....

It would be so cool to see Prince wearing a crucefice on his neck and sing the Cross.i miss those days.

Look at the cover of Parade,he was wearing it.

I don't think you understand how seriously Witnesses take their translation of Christian mythology. They don't believe that there ever was a cross, and they're quite adamant about making sure other people know they feel that way.

Jehovahs gang dont like the cross.........dont acknowledge the cross so as long as prince worships Jehovah u aint got a chance of him doing it any time soon...

Off course i know ,that was the reason why i said it.

[Edited 8/8/11 18:25pm]

I just found a television appearence of him doing this with Chaka Kahn and Larry Grahm. Pretty great, other than Larry Grahm. Anyone know when this is from?

I'd love to see him do it again, but sadly it will always be The Christ.

funkyhead said:

..I suspect that we all love this incredible track - who remembers the version from the SOTT video!.

Anyway I guess we all understand why he doesn't acknowledge 'the cross' due to his religious beliefs which is perfectly acceptable. However surely 'a cross' can also be viewed as highly symbolic of the troubles we all face. Perhaps lyrically it is too difficult for him to use the line 'don't u die without knowing the cross' [apologies if i've got the lyric wrong!] but I still think it is such a simple and yet majestic song that come to life when done live.

Anyone agree?.

He won't play it again. If I'm not wrong, JW's look at the Cross as a Pagan symbol. I could be wrong about that but I think that's what I've heard.

The performance he did of The Cross (which he changed to The Christ) with Larry Graham, to me anyway, was very creepy. He kept looking at Larry like, "See? I'm learning, I'm doing it the way you told me, not Cross, Christ! right?"

Like he was under mind control or something.

Maybe it's 'too much' for what he's doing now? Singing 'the cross' or even 'the christ' - those 1999/Cream/Kiss money makers are going to the bar.

Maybe he's changed his mind about the whole 'one piece of wood or two, vicar?' thing any way - he won't make a big deal about it if he backtracks on something.

NouveauDance said:

prime said:

From what I have heard...JW don't beleive Jesus died on the cross or beleive he was everything Christians beleive he was......this is why he sings "The Christ" instead of "The Cross".....

No, they don't believe he was crucified on a cross, but rather on a tree - that the word stauros is incorrectly been translated into cross rather than "upright stake". They may be right about this.

Prince's change in the lyric doesn't mean JW want to diminish the significance of Jesus, but rather they believe you don't need a symbol to represent Christ.

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship. How many people pray to the cross rather than praying to Jesus. Or speak of the power of the cross rather than the power of Jesus?

I'm not a JW, but this is one area where what they say makes a ton of sense in the context of the Bible. To me it makes a lot more sense than what I see of the catholic church (I'm also not a catholic) where they pretty much worship the Pope. I'm not sure where they got that from the Bible.

alandail said:

prime said:

From what I have heard...JW don't beleive Jesus died on the cross or beleive he was everything Christians beleive he was......this is why he sings "The Christ" instead of "The Cross".....

No, they don't believe he was crucified on a cross, but rather on a tree - that the word stauros is incorrectly been translated into cross rather than "upright stake". They may be right about this.

Prince's change in the lyric doesn't mean JW want to diminish the significance of Jesus, but rather they believe you don't need a symbol to represent Christ.

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship. How many people pray to the cross rather than praying to Jesus. Or speak of the power of the cross rather than the power of Jesus?

I'm not a JW, but this is one area where what they say makes a ton of sense in the context of the Bible. To me it makes a lot more sense than what I see of the catholic church (I'm also not a catholic) where they pretty much worship the Pope. I'm not sure where they got that from the Bible.

Actually, there is no doubt historically that it was a cross, a very common method of capital punishment for first century Romans. Thousands were crucified in Judea in the years before and after Jesus.

The transaltion issue is simply that the common greek word "stauros", originally used to describe a pike, was by the first century, also used to describe a cross (when used in capital punishment). This word is used in dozens of instances of first century writing to describe Roman cruxifiction.

The mistake (IMHO) that Jehova's witnesses make is to take the original definition, ignore the historical evidence for usage, and then claim to have a more accurate interpretation. It makes as much sense as someone in the distant future finding one of our posts that says "I'd hit that girl anytime", and claiming that the true meaning was "I would strike that woman" since the original definition of hit is to strike. But with a little comparison to other contemporary postings, we would soon understand what the author meant.

plasticwood said:

alandail said:

No, they don't believe he was crucified on a cross, but rather on a tree - that the word stauros is incorrectly been translated into cross rather than "upright stake". They may be right about this.

Prince's change in the lyric doesn't mean JW want to diminish the significance of Jesus, but rather they believe you don't need a symbol to represent Christ.

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship. How many people pray to the cross rather than praying to Jesus. Or speak of the power of the cross rather than the power of Jesus?

I'm not a JW, but this is one area where what they say makes a ton of sense in the context of the Bible. To me it makes a lot more sense than what I see of the catholic church (I'm also not a catholic) where they pretty much worship the Pope. I'm not sure where they got that from the Bible.

Actually, there is no doubt historically that it was a cross, a very common method of capital punishment for first century Romans. Thousands were crucified in Judea in the years before and after Jesus.

The transaltion issue is simply that the common greek word "stauros", originally used to describe a pike, was by the first century, also used to describe a cross (when used in capital punishment). This word is used in dozens of instances of first century writing to describe Roman cruxifiction.

The mistake (IMHO) that Jehova's witnesses make is to take the original definition, ignore the historical evidence for usage, and then claim to have a more accurate interpretation. It makes as much sense as someone in the distant future finding one of our posts that says "I'd hit that girl anytime", and claiming that the true meaning was "I would strike that woman" since the original definition of hit is to strike. But with a little comparison to other contemporary postings, we would soon understand what the author meant.

you ignored the other part of what I said

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship.

alandail said:

you ignored the other part of what I said

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship.

Slightly ironic coming from a egotistical, diva pop star who demands worship talking about worshiping

Its bullshit anyway...all this my religion is right, yours is wrong, your wrong to think this, im right to worship that.

He changes his mind more than Larry changes his diaper

I'm waiting for the day Prince turns Muslim like MJJ did. I think MJJ

had to suffer deeply to make that move. Prince is just around the

corner, not so much in his personal life, but the way he sees the

world. Christianisty of any sort, just doesn't bring humans to the

point of seeing our meandering paths. But this is for another

forum. For now, both versions are beautifully sung, and love Larry Graham

on The Christ.

funkyrake said:

I'm waiting for the day Prince turns Muslim like MJJ did. I think MJJ

had to suffer deeply to make that move. Prince is just around the

corner, not so much in his personal life, but the way he sees the

world. Christianisty of any sort, just doesn't bring humans to the

point of seeing our meandering paths. But this is for another

forum. For now, both versions are beautifully sung, and love Larry Graham

on The Christ.

MJJ wasn't a Muslim, lol, and Prince will probably never be a Muslim. He seems to admire burqas though.

smoothcriminal12 said:

funkyrake said:

I'm waiting for the day Prince turns Muslim like MJJ did. I think MJJ

had to suffer deeply to make that move. Prince is just around the

corner, not so much in his personal life, but the way he sees the

world. Christianisty of any sort, just doesn't bring humans to the

point of seeing our meandering paths. But this is for another

forum. For now, both versions are beautifully sung, and love Larry Graham

on The Christ.

MJJ wasn't a Muslim, lol, and Prince will probably never be a Muslim. He seems to admire burqas though.

Forgive my ignorance but I thought Prince did change his religion briefly to one of the islamic faiths around the Emancipation period (hence the inlay photo)

I too am pretty sure MJ was a muslim at the time of his death

purpledoveuk said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

MJJ wasn't a Muslim, lol, and Prince will probably never be a Muslim. He seems to admire burqas though.

Forgive my ignorance but I thought Prince did change his religion briefly to one of the islamic faiths around the Emancipation period (hence the inlay photo)

I too am pretty sure MJ was a muslim at the time of his death

Oh did he really? Hmmm....never knew that.

And no, Michael was not a Muslim. Those were tabloid lies. Marlon, Jermaine, and Michael's former lawyer both denied it.

The Cross is one of his best songs. It would be nice if someone with a great voice would cover it, and make it popular now.

smoothcriminal12 said:

purpledoveuk said:

Forgive my ignorance but I thought Prince did change his religion briefly to one of the islamic faiths around the Emancipation period (hence the inlay photo)

I too am pretty sure MJ was a muslim at the time of his death

Oh did he really? Hmmm....never knew that.

And no, Michael was not a Muslim. Those were tabloid lies. Marlon, Jermaine, and Michael's former lawyer both denied it.

Im not sure - im not an uberfan but I thought he questioned his christian faith when he son died and dabbled and the Larry came along and introduced JW theories to the vulnerable Prince and the rest as the say is history.

alandail said:

you ignored the other part of what I said

They view the cross, wether it is the correct sybol or not, as a form of idol worship.

I ignored it because it's not really relevant. Where JW and Christianity break is not with the worship or non worship of the cross (no mainline christian denomination teaches a worship of the cross itself. In refering to the "power of the cross" they mean the effect the sacrifice of Christ had on mankind, not that two sticks tied together make magic). I don't doubt some people believe there is power in the cross itself, but that is different than saying the christian dogma teaches it.

What is relevant, and where JW and Christians do break is not the worship of a cross, but the worship of Christ. Because JW do not believe Jesus is God, they do not believe he (much less his cross) should be worshipped.

JW are interesting in that they rest much of their teaching on their unique translation of the bible (which no reputable secular scholar supports). Case in point, the very word "Jehovah" is a mistranslation of "Yahweh". Ironic considering that they feel this is God's one true name.

K, enough with the JW stuff. I also like "The Cross", and am thankful it was committed to tape before Prince had second thoughts about the meaning.

smoothcriminal12 said:

funkyrake said:

I'm waiting for the day Prince turns Muslim like MJJ did. I think MJJ

had to suffer deeply to make that move. Prince is just around the

corner, not so much in his personal life, but the way he sees the

world. Christianisty of any sort, just doesn't bring humans to the

point of seeing our meandering paths. But this is for another

forum. For now, both versions are beautifully sung, and love Larry Graham

on The Christ.

MJJ wasn't a Muslim, lol, and Prince will probably never be a Muslim. He seems to admire burqas though.

[Edited 8/10/11 7:07am]

All religions are good religions as long as they teach peace, love, charity,

forgiveness, earth stewardship ("worship" is ok too), and to steer free

of judgement. Also no religion is good too, according to John Lennon ("Imagine")

Prince does get a bit preachy at times. I vote he gets peachy and preaches

the peach! I do love that unlike too many other artists, Prince is not afraid to

warn people that our earthly existence as we know it may not be here forever.

Most of his fans are so busy worshipping him that they fail to listen to his little

warnings or brush them off as "Prince is just sounding "political"".

So in another question, what do we like best about Prince, this is it for me.

Loved it that MJJ also sang about earth stewardship and rascism problems.

Great songs and great messages from both of them. MJJ was also JW in

his early life.

when all is said and done it leaves us with a simple yet brilliant song that deserves to be heard live again. As long as we don't get Shelby screaming 'clap yo hands, somp yo feet' all over it!!

funkyhead said:

when all is said and done it leaves us with a simple yet brilliant song that deserves to be heard live again. As long as we don't get Shelby screaming 'clap yo hands, somp yo feet' all over it!!

That made me laugh

funkyhead said:

..I suspect that we all love this incredible track - who remembers the version from the SOTT video!.

Anyway I guess we all understand why he doesn't acknowledge 'the cross' due to his religious beliefs which is perfectly acceptable. However surely 'a cross' can also be viewed as highly symbolic of the troubles we all face. Perhaps lyrically it is too difficult for him to use the line 'don't u die without knowing the cross' [apologies if i've got the lyric wrong!] but I still think it is such a simple and yet majestic song that come to life when done live.

Anyone agree?.

Oh I wiiiiissssssssshhhhhhhhh he would play it live!!

He needs to play this, along with Last December.