BoySimon said:

OK.

It isn't Prince's best song because it's a reaction, albeit one of his best, to the influx on rap into the mainstream. Prince reacted to the late 80s rap influx by recording songs like this one. By the time he recorded Days of Wild he'd got quite good at it. Days of Wild is a good song. One of Prince's best? No.

Prince's best comprises songs that make your eyes roll back inside your head, make your skin grind and burn, make your attention become fixed... Days of Wild... "I don't think so". Sign of the Times, Shockedelica, Hello, I Wonder U, The Exodus Has Begun, Something in the Water, Automatic, When Doves Cry, Anotherloverholenyohead, Love or Money, Alexa de Paris, 17 Days, Just As Long A We're Together, Bambi, When You Were Mine, Housequake, Condition of the Heart, Erotic Cty, How Come You Don't Call Me?, Posessed, Head, Controversy, Dirty Mind, Count The Days, Return of the Bump Squad... etc... All of these are songs that Prince has recorded and they are better than Days of Wild.

Is that ok?

I think this is some flawed logic.

Tell me that the album Dirty Mind wasn't Prince's reaction to New Wave in the early 80's?

Tell me that songs like "Delirious", "Jack U Off" and "Horny Toad" were not a nod to the rockabilly revival brought about by groups like The Stray Cats.

Prince's most famous song "Purple Rain" was a reaction to/his take on stadium anthems and, reportedly, inspired by Bob Seger to a certain extent.

Many moments of Prince touching on different genres are his interpretation/reaction to popular movements within mainstream music. Prince often takes music trends and makes them purple with his own touch/sound/feel.

Lastly, this may be a stretch, by I've always suspected that "Batdance" was inspired by the song "Oh Yeah" by Yello.

[Edited 7/22/11 11:07am]

skywalker said:

BoySimon said:

OK.

It isn't Prince's best song because it's a reaction, albeit one of his best, to the influx on rap into the mainstream. Prince reacted to the late 80s rap influx by recording songs like this one. By the time he recorded Days of Wild he'd got quite good at it. Days of Wild is a good song. One of Prince's best? No.

Prince's best comprises songs that make your eyes roll back inside your head, make your skin grind and burn, make your attention become fixed... Days of Wild... "I don't think so". Sign of the Times, Shockedelica, Hello, I Wonder U, The Exodus Has Begun, Something in the Water, Automatic, When Doves Cry, Anotherloverholenyohead, Love or Money, Alexa de Paris, 17 Days, Just As Long A We're Together, Bambi, When You Were Mine, Housequake, Condition of the Heart, Erotic Cty, How Come You Don't Call Me?, Posessed, Head, Controversy, Dirty Mind, Count The Days, Return of the Bump Squad... etc... All of these are songs that Prince has recorded and they are better than Days of Wild.

Is that ok?

I think this is some flawed logic.

Tell me that the album Dirty Mind wasn't Prince's reaction to New Wave in the early 80's?

Tell me that songs like "Delirious", "Jack U Off" and "Horny Toad" were not a nod to the rockabilly revival brought about by groups like The Stray Cats.

Prince's most famous song "Purple Rain" was a reaction to/his take on stadium anthems and, reportedly, inspired by Bob Seger to a certain extent.

Many moments of Prince touching on different genres are his interpretation/reaction to popular movements within mainstream music. Prince often takes music trends and makes them purple with his own touch/sound/feel.

Lastly, this may be a stretch, by I've always suspected that "Batdance" was inspired by the song "Oh Yeah" by Yello.

[Edited 7/22/11 11:07am]

Fair point, well made.

Go back to the thread. Don't disagree at all, but would ask that you take into consideration the title of the the thread not the essence. for a change.

The studio version is great too, but it's mixed badly imo.

One of may favourite songs ever, I really got into P after seeing this on The Beautiful Experience... best live version ever!

vitriol said:

You can say what you want but even if it's a good song musically (not even near his best musical efforts), lyrically it's the same as most Prince tracks: talkin' loud and sayin' NOTHIN'.

Are you insane?

These are some of the most poignant lyrics he's ever written.

jasontate said:

vitriol said:

You can say what you want but even if it's a good song musically (not even near his best musical efforts), lyrically it's the same as most Prince tracks: talkin' loud and sayin' NOTHIN'.

Are you insane?

These are some of the most poignant lyrics he's ever written.

Vitriol might not understand the words, because English is not his first language

802 said:

jasontate said:

Are you insane?

These are some of the most poignant lyrics he's ever written.

Vitriol might not understand the words, because English is not his first language

Vitriol is more than capable of speaking for himself and his English seems to be perfectly fine. Are you on the pull or something?

The version of DOW from the VH1 Love 4 1 Another special was the best version in terms of capturing the feel for the song. Short, heavy, and more concise than the album version.

Their is another version from about 8 years ago which is more jazzy and was atrocious

I had this track on my iPod all weekend, and was surprised to see it being discussed. I feel it's one of his most underrated songs, but not one of his best.

I prefer Prince's rock/pop/R&B over his experiments with Rap, but I feel this track is much more than that. I saw this live several times in the mid 90's at late night Paisley Parties. He would get on the bass and just destroy this track, turning it into a long, extended funky jam. He was still in his phase of being pissed off at Warner Bros, and with that chip on his shoulder, he seemed to have a real purpose when he was playing. I think it's kind of cool that the song really only works "live" and that it wasn't officially released as a studio track.

The version I have on the Dawn is better...same performance I think, just edited differen tly.

JoeTyler said:

the studio version is unlistenable

the epic Crystal Ball version is all I need

Its alright with the melody and feel, but the lyrics are just "Mf this and mf that" Its crude gangasta rap wannabe stuff. Way below the cultural level of Prince, even Prince won't sing it now.

Take out the swearing and what do you have left?

I think this is some flawed logic.

Tell me that the album Dirty Mind wasn't Prince's reaction to New Wave in the early 80's?

Tell me that songs like "Delirious", "Jack U Off" and "Horny Toad" were not a nod to the rockabilly revival brought about by groups like The Stray Cats.

Prince's most famous song "Purple Rain" was a reaction to/his take on stadium anthems and, reportedly, inspired by Bob Seger to a certain extent.

Many moments of Prince touching on different genres are his interpretation/reaction to popular movements within mainstream music. Prince often takes music trends and makes them purple with his own touch/sound/feel.

Lastly, this may be a stretch, by I've always suspected that "Batdance" was inspired by the song "Oh Yeah" by Yello.

[Edited 7/22/11 11:07am]

Fair point, well made.

Fair point, well made, indeed. The only comments I would add to those examples mentioned above is that:

Allegedly, Prince only considered those versions of songs for Dirty Mind to be demos for finished arrangements - who knows what would have happened if, I believe, if was Steve Fargnoli hadn't told him that he had his finished album right there.

AND

Purple Rain may have been a reaction to the stadium anthems of the day... this may explain why it is not one of Prince's best songs - formulaic and dull. Just like Days of Wild isn't one of Prince's best songs - bland and uncreative - only made credible because Prince suddenly released a rap song that wasn't embarrassing and transformed by superb live performance.

The point you make about the earlier material is that Prince's reaction to New Wave/Rockabilly demonstrated a creative take on a new/revised style of music. Days of Wild does not. Though, I still stress, I do think it is a good song... just not 'one of the best songs Prince ever did'.

Adorecream said:

Its alright with the melody and feel, but the lyrics are just "Mf this and mf that" Its crude gangasta rap wannabe stuff. Way below the cultural level of Prince, even Prince won't sing it now.

Take out the swearing and what do you have left?

Hardly - have you even listened to the lyrics, or could you not get past the "crudeness and swearing" (blimey, that must make it hard to be a fan of Prince!).

Its actually the complete opposite of "gangster rap" in it's intention, but done in the same style - a dichotomy which is absolutely typical of Prince's style. Take 2 opposites and smash them together. Its about modern times still being crazy with people shooting folk and cussing women. The second verse in particular is all about respecting women, unlike most of the other rap you hear.

Is that really below the "cultural level of Prince"? Seems on a par with what he's mostly done.

Mindflux said:

Adorecream said:

Its alright with the melody and feel, but the lyrics are just "Mf this and mf that" Its crude gangsta rap wannabe stuff. Way below the cultural level of Prince, even Prince won't sing it now.

Take out the swearing and what do you have left?

Hardly - have you even listened to the lyrics, or could you not get past the "crudeness and swearing" (blimey, that must make it hard to be a fan of Prince!).

Its actually the complete opposite of "gangster rap" in it's intention, but done in the same style - a dichotomy which is absolutely typical of Prince's style. Take 2 opposites and smash them together. Its about modern times still being crazy with people shooting folk and cussing women. The second verse in particular is all about respecting women, unlike most of the other rap you hear.

Is that really below the "cultural level of Prince"? Seems on a par with what he's mostly done.

I don't mind swearing and cursing in a song, as long as it flows with the melody, but the swearing here is added as a garnish, and really the amount of cursing before the 90s is minimal, its a few cuss words in a few trax like Sister, Lets Pretend were married etc, but those songs were well constructed, melodically inspiring and funny as hell. Days of Wild is weak and repeats a tired message about respecting women. But the line "Call a bitch a hoe, I don't think, if a woman ever said I did, shes a motherfxxkin liar"so he is cursing them out there. I just do not like his 90s stuff as it was trend following rather than trend setting, and unfortunately the 1990 -1995 period was a time when cursing in music became very popular, usually it was in gangsta rap, but rock groups like Rage against the machine, Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chilis were cursing their heads off too.

To me gratuitous swearing shows a person is bereft of decent vocabulary.

Adorecream said:

Mindflux said:

Hardly - have you even listened to the lyrics, or could you not get past the "crudeness and swearing" (blimey, that must make it hard to be a fan of Prince!).

Its actually the complete opposite of "gangster rap" in it's intention, but done in the same style - a dichotomy which is absolutely typical of Prince's style. Take 2 opposites and smash them together. Its about modern times still being crazy with people shooting folk and cussing women. The second verse in particular is all about respecting women, unlike most of the other rap you hear.

Is that really below the "cultural level of Prince"? Seems on a par with what he's mostly done.

I don't mind swearing and cursing in a song, as long as it flows with the melody, but the swearing here is added as a garnish, and really the amount of cursing before the 90s is minimal, its a few cuss words in a few trax like Sister, Lets Pretend were married etc, but those songs were well constructed, melodically inspiring and funny as hell. Days of Wild is weak and repeats a tired message about respecting women. But the line "Call a bitch a hoe, I don't think, if a woman ever said I did, shes a motherfxxkin liar"so he is cursing them out there. I just do not like his 90s stuff as it was trend following rather than trend setting, and unfortunately the 1990 -1995 period was a time when cursing in music became very popular, usually it was in gangsta rap, but rock groups like Rage against the machine, Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chilis were cursing their heads off too.

To me gratuitous swearing shows a person is bereft of decent vocabulary.

I think the cursing in this song actually "fits".Unlike,say,"P Control" where it all sounds forced and silly."Days Of Wild" is Prince's most convincing and most credible hip hop number.For once,he doesn't sound like he's posturing or pandering.

Adorecream said:

Mindflux said:

Hardly - have you even listened to the lyrics, or could you not get past the "crudeness and swearing" (blimey, that must make it hard to be a fan of Prince!).

Its actually the complete opposite of "gangster rap" in it's intention, but done in the same style - a dichotomy which is absolutely typical of Prince's style. Take 2 opposites and smash them together. Its about modern times still being crazy with people shooting folk and cussing women. The second verse in particular is all about respecting women, unlike most of the other rap you hear.

Is that really below the "cultural level of Prince"? Seems on a par with what he's mostly done.

I don't mind swearing and cursing in a song, as long as it flows with the melody, but the swearing here is added as a garnish, and really the amount of cursing before the 90s is minimal, its a few cuss words in a few trax like Sister, Lets Pretend were married etc, but those songs were well constructed, melodically inspiring and funny as hell. Days of Wild is weak and repeats a tired message about respecting women. But the line "Call a bitch a hoe, I don't think, if a woman ever said I did, shes a motherfxxkin liar"so he is cursing them out there. I just do not like his 90s stuff as it was trend following rather than trend setting, and unfortunately the 1990 -1995 period was a time when cursing in music became very popular, usually it was in gangsta rap, but rock groups like Rage against the machine, Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chilis were cursing their heads off too.

To me gratuitous swearing shows a person is bereft of decent vocabulary.

Eh?

Ok - you're clearly not getting it, so I'm not sure how much effort I should spend responding, but here's a couple of points;

1) The "cursing" fits the "Gangster rap" style whilst the content is the opposite. An artistic vehicle that Prince has used throughout his career.

2) Positive messages about women is hardly "tired". And certainly rare in the genre he was playing with this track. Is standing up for homosexual rights also tired? Is the fight against racism tired?

3) He's not "cursing them out" (ie. women) where he says that if a woman accuses him of calling her a bitch or ho, then she's lying. That's not cussing anyone - its setting up a premise that he's never done it, so someone would be lying if they said he did. How is that "cursing" someone?

4) "Swearing" is just language and is often used to add weight to the feeling. Its ridiculous to suggest that someone is bereft of vocabulary, just because they swear! Its just words and words that make up part of the language you speak. Just because some pious individuals decided they were offensive is neither here nor there. The words exist and convey meaning. End of.

[Edited 7/26/11 5:24am]

Mindflux said:

Adorecream said:

I don't mind swearing and cursing in a song, as long as it flows with the melody, but the swearing here is added as a garnish, and really the amount of cursing before the 90s is minimal, its a few cuss words in a few trax like Sister, Lets Pretend were married etc, but those songs were well constructed, melodically inspiring and funny as hell. Days of Wild is weak and repeats a tired message about respecting women. But the line "Call a bitch a hoe, I don't think, if a woman ever said I did, shes a motherfxxkin liar"so he is cursing them out there. I just do not like his 90s stuff as it was trend following rather than trend setting, and unfortunately the 1990 -1995 period was a time when cursing in music became very popular, usually it was in gangsta rap, but rock groups like Rage against the machine, Pearl Jam, Red Hot Chilis were cursing their heads off too.

To me gratuitous swearing shows a person is bereft of decent vocabulary.

Eh?

Ok - you're clearly not getting it, so I'm not sure how much effort I should spend responding, but here's a couple of points;

1) The "cursing" fits the "Gangster rap" style whilst the content is the opposite. An artistic vehicle that Prince has used throughout his career.

2) Positive messages about women is hardly "tired". And certainly rare in the genre he was playing with this track. Is standing up for homosexual rights also tired? Is the fight against racism tired?

3) He's not "cursing them out" (ie. women) where he says that if a woman accuses him of calling her a bitch or ho, then she's lying. That's not cussing anyone - its setting up a premise that he's never done it, so someone would be lying if they said he did. How is that "cursing" someone?

4) "Swearing" is just language and is often used to add weight to the feeling. Its ridiculous to suggest that someone is bereft of vocabulary, just because they swear! Its just words and words that make up part of the language you speak. Just because some pious individuals decided they were offensive is neither here nor there. The words exist and convey meaning. End of.

[Edited 7/26/11 5:24am]

1. Gangster rap is not a style, its a cretin swearing to a drum machine beat, no talent, no skill, just raw angst.

2. I meant the delivery of the message, Prince's nod to female rights is token, Prince is notorious for his usage of women as sex objects only and is frequently known to treat women around him as sex objects and inferiors. And since when he has stood up for gays. I am gay and he does not stand up for me. He belongs to a satanic hate cult, Prince HATES gays and makes it known, he's the worst type of closeted gay around.

3. Point taken, but why can't he say the woman is a liar rather than a motherfxxking liar.

4. Most people who have swear word laden music have mean levels of education, seldom anything above high school. Prince finished high school thats almost unique. Most rappers like 50 cents can barely string two words together without resorting to swearing or heavily derived vernacular speech. Swearing in music to me, is a lack of education. You will often hear words in these songs that are also slang terms for longer and more complex words "Pussy got bank in her pocket - rather than Pussy has a large sum of money on her person", and shortened or poorly pronounced versions of long words like "Washintin, or Chitown, welfah, suh, suga, supa, gubbamin etc. I mean look at 50 cent, that man has an IQ of about 70.

[Edited 7/26/11 22:01pm]

Yeah this is one of those songs that is burned into my consciousness. I will just randomly start to hear the lyrics in my head from time to time. It's definitely his best rap song and one of his best songs of the 90s fo sho.

Adorecream said:

Mindflux said:

Eh?

Ok - you're clearly not getting it, so I'm not sure how much effort I should spend responding, but here's a couple of points;

1) The "cursing" fits the "Gangster rap" style whilst the content is the opposite. An artistic vehicle that Prince has used throughout his career.

2) Positive messages about women is hardly "tired". And certainly rare in the genre he was playing with this track. Is standing up for homosexual rights also tired? Is the fight against racism tired?

3) He's not "cursing them out" (ie. women) where he says that if a woman accuses him of calling her a bitch or ho, then she's lying. That's not cussing anyone - its setting up a premise that he's never done it, so someone would be lying if they said he did. How is that "cursing" someone?

4) "Swearing" is just language and is often used to add weight to the feeling. Its ridiculous to suggest that someone is bereft of vocabulary, just because they swear! Its just words and words that make up part of the language you speak. Just because some pious individuals decided they were offensive is neither here nor there. The words exist and convey meaning. End of.

[Edited 7/26/11 5:24am]

1. Gangster rap is not a style, its a cretin swearing to a drum machine beat, no talent, no skill, just raw angst.

2. I meant the delivery of the message, Prince's nod to female rights is token, Prince is notorious for his usage of women as sex objects only and is frequently known to treat women around him as sex objects and inferiors. And since when he has stood up for gays. I am gay and he does not stand up for me. He belongs to a satanic hate cult, Prince HATES gays and makes it known, he's the worst type of closeted gay around.

3. Point taken, but why can't he say the woman is a liar rather than a motherfxxking liar.

4. Most people who have swear word laden music have mean levels of education, seldom anything above high school. Prince finished high school thats almost unique. Most rappers like 50 cents can barely string two words together without resorting to swearing or heavily derived vernacular speech. Swearing in music to me, is a lack of education. You will often hear words in these songs that are also slang terms for longer and more complex words "Pussy got bank in her pocket - rather than Pussy has a large sum of money on her person", and shortened or poorly pronounced versions of long words like "Washintin, or Chitown, welfah, suh, suga, supa, gubbamin etc. I mean look at 50 cent, that man has an IQ of about 70.

[Edited 7/26/11 22:01pm]

Ok, whatever dude - that's your opinion, a severely biased one at that. Things that display this are quotes such as;

"Prince is notorious for his usage of women as sex objects only and is frequently known to treat women around him as sex objects and inferiors"

"He belongs to a satanic hate cult"

"Prince HATES gays"

"he's the worst type of closeted gay around"

You know this for a fact, do you? You know him that well? Its all your perception and says more about you than anything! And, by the way, I didn't suggest that he "stands up for gays", I simply asked if standing up for gay rights is tired, from anyone? Same with racism. Because, the blatant answer is NO. As a gay man (which I knew, its why I said it - you know, thought it might connect with you), I thought you might be feeling that one. Seems not.

And, perhaps the most banal of your statements is;

""Pussy got bank in her pocket - rather than Pussy has a large sum of money on her person"", which you put down to "a lack of education" - completely laughable and belies your lack of education, particularly when it comes to art! That is called word-play, its ARTISTIC LICENCE and has been used since the times of Chaucer (should you know who he is).

So, I guess its a good job you're not writing songs, eh?!

"So, on the evening of July 27th, we will commence a delightful soireé and perform festivities as though it were actually the year 1999, despite the fact its not"

What's it like to look down on everyone from up there? Cold, is it?

[Edited 7/27/11 4:26am]