This is a thread from a while back which will give you an idea of the amount of bootlegs out there, but remember, this is not a complete list of what is circulating by a long shot.

http://prince.org/msg/7/352071

Imaginative said:

langebleu said:

Can you provide several examples of audience recordings that, in your view, only an experienced collector or engineer would be able to detect to have the tell-tale signs of an audience recording because they sound that perfect?

Although a soundboard patch is the most direct way to record a band, and sometimes the cleanest, it isn't always the best sounding. The sound person is mixing the music to sound good in the room, not on a tape. The PA is often used mainly to fill in drums and vocals with the guitar and bass amps on the stage, so the mix may have little or no sound from these instruments, providing a tape of drums and vocals with only the minimal guitar and bass sound picked up by the vocal mics. (A good example of this is the beloved "Small Club" show, where the bass being generated from the kick drum and keyboards, slightly overwhelms Levi's bass guitar in the mix, which is often hard to hear in comparison.) Even if all the instruments are in the mix, it may be mixed for the room and sound odd played back on a home stereo.

As a rule of thumb, the smaller the venue, the more likely it is that the soundboard mix will be unsatisfactory. This rule applies mainly to electrically amplified bands and less to acoustic or bluegrass bands which may run all the instruments throught the PA even in a tiny room. A well made audience or front of board (FOB) tape can often sound better than a soundboard of the same show, which is the reason that some bands do not allow soundboard feeds.

To answer your question, way too many to list, but I'll give you a few examples. Still working my way through my Prince boots, so they won't all be Prince.

Prince:

6/25/02: Xenophobia

8/29/07: London (I prefer the "Indigo Chronicles"—which contains MANY excellent audience recordings version to the "Prince, Josh, Cora" version)

Dylan:

12/19/97: El Rey, Los Angeles

9/24 & 9/25, 2000: Portsmouth Guild Hall (one of the best audience recordings I've ever heard.)

If you're really interested, I would check out the Digital Gardener website, and search out for some of the audience recordings rated A or A+. He also posts here, so maybe he'll chime in with some more excellent Prince audience recordings.

It's not a secret among bootleg collectors that great audience recordings can sound better than a decent soundboard. Again, if you're really interested (from your tone, I'm not sure you are), I would seek reviews and get some of the best ones.

[Edited 6/25/11 9:54am]

some or maybe most of those Purple Rain soundboards are horrible! Compared to the Neon Rendezvous rehearsal or the official Syracuse concert release.

Thanks for the examples, Imaginative.

As you have pointed out elsewhere, it's a bit difficult to judge if someone already has most of Prince's bootlegs and knows which are audience or soundboard already. However, I still would expect that most people could tell the difference between the two, even if they are less of a collector - particularly for a Prince performance.

After all has been said though, I think the possibility of Prince adopting the approach you suggest is remote no matter how much anyone else might prefer an audience recording over soundboard output. I guess I'd summarise the reasons as follows:

1. Prince records all his performances and therefore would likely see little need to turn to other recordings.

2. He has previously shown a distinct preference towards a sound arrangement - as was confirmed in an online interview with his engineer after the 'ONA ... Live!' release). Prince prefers recordings which tend to place the audience pretty much in the background (as I recall, only one or two house microphones used for the audience capture for ONA). It does mean, as you point out, that the audience experience / atmosphere etc is more subdued ... but that seems to be the way Prince prefers it.

EDIT:

I've tracked down Scottie Pakulski's interview from November 2003. In fact, no crowd microphones were used:

"I asked Prince if he wanted crowd mics, and his reply was that he preferred it to sound just like a studio recording with the caveat of the punchiness and dynamics of a live show"

.

[Edited 6/26/11 4:56am]

Imaginative said:

databank said:

Dude this has been rehashed over and over

Some people HAPPEN to like Prince's recent output, and I'd rather have new material than remasters.

Just because YOU and even because MANY people don't like it doesn't mean it's worthless or shouldn't happen, u know...

"Dude," you obviously didn't read the OP. I never said that I didn't like the new material. The issue is whether studio albums are even needed to release the new material. Maybe if you freed your mind of it's 20th Century thinking, you would grasp the concept.

[Edited 6/25/11 9:43am]

I don't understand the question, sorry. Can u please re4mulate?

Imaginative said:

Although a soundboard patch is the most direct way to record a band, and sometimes the cleanest, it isn't always the best sounding. The sound person is mixing the music to sound good in the room, not on a tape. The PA is often used mainly to fill in drums and vocals with the guitar and bass amps on the stage, so the mix may have little or no sound from these instruments, providing a tape of drums and vocals with only the minimal guitar and bass sound picked up by the vocal mics. (A good example of this is the beloved "Small Club" show, where the bass being generated from the kick drum and keyboards, slightly overwhelms Levi's bass guitar in the mix, which is often hard to hear in comparison.) Even if all the instruments are in the mix, it may be mixed for the room and sound odd played back on a home stereo.

As a rule of thumb, the smaller the venue, the more likely it is that the soundboard mix will be unsatisfactory. This rule applies mainly to electrically amplified bands and less to acoustic or bluegrass bands which may run all the instruments throught the PA even in a tiny room. A well made audience or front of board (FOB) tape can often sound better than a soundboard of the same show, which is the reason that some bands do not allow soundboard feeds.

I said virtually the same thing a few weeks ago here: http://prince.org/msg/7/3...&pg=12

from reply #343:

"I've recorded many local bands at clubs by hooking in to the soundboard. I've found that many times, even though it was soundboard, there were major issues.

For example, often, especially in clubs (as opposed to arenas), the guitar amp(s) are so loud on stage that the soundman has the guitar very low in the mix (if not completely pulled out). It sounds good in the room because you still hear the guitars from the amps. But on tape, you only hear guitar where it bled through other mics... Obviously the soundman couldn't worry about my tape when he had a room full of paying patrons, so, no too bad for me.

I've noticed this kind of thing on SBD boots as well."

This is official live releases are usually recorded with a mobile studio, outside of the venu, with their own mix, independent of the house mix.

databank said:

Imaginative said:

"Dude," you obviously didn't read the OP. I never said that I didn't like the new material. The issue is whether studio albums are even needed to release the new material. Maybe if you freed your mind of it's 20th Century thinking, you would grasp the concept.

[Edited 6/25/11 9:43am]

I don't understand the question, sorry. Can u please re4mulate?

Being that Prince has such a dedicated base of fans and a bootleg cottage industry, if Prince wanted to release new material (i.e. for the sole purpose of having it heard and enjoyed, not necessarily to make money) all he would need to do is perform it live. The fans would take care of the rest. Follow?

But wouldn't that mean that only hardcore Prince fanatics would ever get to hear him? And would Prince really be the kind of person who'd want that?

I agree, it could be done technically, but it would never happen with Prince. Maybe Radiohed or NIN or somebody else .. just not Prince, I think.

But I agree. In this day and age, you can and should be creative with your stuff and how you get heard.

Nah. Prince could rent out the rights to his vaults. Say, a five year lease at, erhm, something millions up front to the right to release as much, as little, as many songs, albums, DVDs as they thought profitable (and they'd be responsible themselves for everything, promotion and whoring of the material and all that) with some X percentage of the earnings going to Prince still. And after five years, the rights could return to Prince and he could yet again rent out his rights at some up front money. I'd like to see that happen.

[Edited 7/4/11 6:32am]

Cravens said:

But wouldn't that mean that only hardcore Prince fanatics would ever get to hear him? And would Prince really be the kind of person who'd want that?

I've got news for you. Only hardcore fans have heard anything Prince has done since the mid '90s.

Would Prince make music for only his hardcore fans? Umm, Madhouse, New Power Generation, NPGMC releases, etc. Yeah, I think Prince could do it. The reality is that this is how the new breed of artists will make money; selling their recordings to a small but loyal fanbase. As long as the artist's following is "small but loyal," their music will be out of reach to widespread piracy of their material.

Imaginative said:

Cravens said:

But wouldn't that mean that only hardcore Prince fanatics would ever get to hear him? And would Prince really be the kind of person who'd want that?

I've got news for you. Only hardcore fans have heard anything Prince has done since the mid '90s.

Would Prince make music for only his hardcore fans? Umm, Madhouse, New Power Generation, NPGMC releases, etc. Yeah, I think Prince could do it. The reality is that this is how the new breed of artists will make money; selling their recordings to a small but loyal fanbase. As long as the artist's following is "small but loyal," their music will be out of reach to widespread piracy of their material.

Apart from Musicology, that's hardly news. For a new breed of artists .. they'd have to make it big first, before they could use those circles of fans to distribute their new noises. Radiohead couldn't have started out in the same way as they are closing these days, what with fan generated DVDs being endorsed and all.

Anyway, my key point was: As long as we don't know Prince's intention for his music, it's still hard to say if he really wants or wanted his music to be well known or not. I don't think it's much of a stretch to imagine that Prince has a disproportional sense of his own abilities to be successfull, but really doesn't know how to obtain that level of distribution. I truly think Prince's self image is too distorted to make that sort of choice - letting fans do the work. He's too VIP in his own eyes, I think.

I'm not disagreeing in that it could work. And it could even be an exciting new direction for a lot of artists, even for Prince, but inside Prince's own head and the laws of physics that he imagines the world works by .. would he think it's that great an idea? Neither of us can "prove" or disprove any of this, it's only a guessing game, and I'm guessing against.

7Spelling edit.

[Edited 7/4/11 9:03am]

Imaginative said:

databank said:

I don't understand the question, sorry. Can u please re4mulate?

Being that Prince has such a dedicated base of fans and a bootleg cottage industry, if Prince wanted to release new material (i.e. for the sole purpose of having it heard and enjoyed, not necessarily to make money) all he would need to do is perform it live. The fans would take care of the rest. Follow?

IDK, audience recordings aren't very interesting in most cases IMHO, and anyway if Prince just wanted to release new music without making money he could just do it online (or even on CD's) without losing money) with a professionnal sound quality.

databank said:

I think you've been listening to the wrong audience recordings. Besides, it costs Prince money to record and release. This way, it wouldn't cost him and dime.