Just put on "Manic Monday" and try to sing the lyrics of "1999"along with it. Calling them "virtually identical" is an exaggeration - unless you don't care about things like phrasing or the pitch and duration of notes.

I'd record myself doing it and post it here, but that would be a copyright infringement according to the .org policies.

novabrkr said:

Just put on "Manic Monday" and try to sing the lyrics of "1999"along with it. Calling them "virtually identical" is an exaggeration - unless you don't care about things like phrasing or the pitch and duration of notes.

I'd record myself doing it and post it here, but that would be a copyright infringement according to the .org policies.

Well, anyone can do it themselves presumably. You are right in that they are not virtually identical, but they are definitely the same chord progression and melody. The only difference is the pitch.

Okay, I played them on the keys.

Seems like, 1st and 3rd lines have more or less the same notes, although they have a different "swing" and "punctuation" to them. 2nd and 4th on lines on the two songs are certainly different, but they can be understood as different type of "responses" to the first line.

You could say that both melodies are simply built around by the repetition and variation of the first line, which is what they share.

What makes the melodies sound different on the recorded versions is the way they are sung. The phrasing is jut very different. One is a funk track, the second sort of a dreamy pop piece with a lighter rhythm driving it underneath. The difference disappears somewhat when played on the keys as the phrasing and the tone of voice used by the vocalist(s) is what separates the two songs most notably from each other. It's actually quite interesting to observe how much the small differences matter.

novabrkr said:

Okay, I played them on the keys.

Seems like, 1st and 3rd lines have more or less the same notes, although they have a different "swing" and "punctuation" to them. 2nd and 4th on lines on the two songs are certainly different, but they can be understood as different type of "responses" to the first line.

You could say that both melodies are simply built around by the repetition and variation of the first line, which is what they share.

What makes the melodies sound different on the recorded versions is the way they are sung. The phrasing is jut very different. One is a funk track, the second sort of a dreamy pop piece with a lighter rhythm driving it underneath. The difference disappears somewhat when played on the keys as the phrasing and the tone of voice used by the vocalist(s) is what separates the two songs most notably from each other. It's actually quite interesting to observe how much the small differences matter.

That's pretty cool.

I almost wish someone would do that treatment to Express Yourself and Born This Way.

novabrkr said:

Okay, I played them on the keys.

Seems like, 1st and 3rd lines have more or less the same notes, although they have a different "swing" and "punctuation" to them. 2nd and 4th on lines on the two songs are certainly different, but they can be understood as different type of "responses" to the first line.

You could say that both melodies are simply built around by the repetition and variation of the first line, which is what they share.

What makes the melodies sound different on the recorded versions is the way they are sung. The phrasing is jut very different. One is a funk track, the second sort of a dreamy pop piece with a lighter rhythm driving it underneath. The difference disappears somewhat when played on the keys as the phrasing and the tone of voice used by the vocalist(s) is what separates the two songs most notably from each other. It's actually quite interesting to observe how much the small differences matter.

i play keys too and would agree modulated is a better way to put it. you can sing 1999 over manic monday perfectly if you follow the pitch changes. the feel of the songs and the rhythm tracks are so different that i didn't hear it for years and even then it had to be pointed out to me. both are great tracks, something else they have in common.

robertgeorgeakabob said:

novabrkr said:

Okay, I played them on the keys.

Seems like, 1st and 3rd lines have more or less the same notes, although they have a different "swing" and "punctuation" to them. 2nd and 4th on lines on the two songs are certainly different, but they can be understood as different type of "responses" to the first line.

You could say that both melodies are simply built around by the repetition and variation of the first line, which is what they share.

What makes the melodies sound different on the recorded versions is the way they are sung. The phrasing is jut very different. One is a funk track, the second sort of a dreamy pop piece with a lighter rhythm driving it underneath. The difference disappears somewhat when played on the keys as the phrasing and the tone of voice used by the vocalist(s) is what separates the two songs most notably from each other. It's actually quite interesting to observe how much the small differences matter.

i play keys too and would agree modulated is a better way to put it. you can sing 1999 over manic monday perfectly if you follow the pitch changes. the feel of the songs and the rhythm tracks are so different that i didn't hear it for years and even then it had to be pointed out to me. both are great tracks, something else they have in common.

that's a great point. 1999 is more obviously "call and response" as used extensively in funk. manic monday less so as it's more poppy and the 2nd line is more a continuation of the 1st line. as you say small differences matter!

novabrkr said:

Okay, I played them on the keys.

Seems like, 1st and 3rd lines have more or less the same notes, although they have a different "swing" and "punctuation" to them. 2nd and 4th on lines on the two songs are certainly different, but they can be understood as different type of "responses" to the first line.

You could say that both melodies are simply built around by the repetition and variation of the first line, which is what they share.

What makes the melodies sound different on the recorded versions is the way they are sung. The phrasing is jut very different. One is a funk track, the second sort of a dreamy pop piece with a lighter rhythm driving it underneath. The difference disappears somewhat when played on the keys as the phrasing and the tone of voice used by the vocalist(s) is what separates the two songs most notably from each other. It's actually quite interesting to observe how much the small differences matter.

Definitely!

I had never noticed the similarities until this thread. If it was gregorian chant, they might sound a lot closer than they actually do. INstead , they are totally different songs that share something intrinsic.

I don't quite agree about the third lines of the verse being the same, though. It's the same melodic shape but 1999 moves it down in pitch. I have always thought this was an interesting aspect to 1999's melody, it's like a harmony, but sung as melody.

[Edited 4/22/11 10:31am]