SquirrelMeat said:

Tremolina said:

They deserve to be treated right.

Thats why i would rather see a deal with WB. If Prince has full control over the remasters he'll try and re-write history.

That is a very valid fear of mine, and i'm guessing, quite a large number of others.

If it goes down to that, then I can see why WB don't want that lol

SquirrelMeat said:

WB might offer to handle it like they did with A-ha. Only the 2 biggest selling albums got the double disc remastered treatment.

If these hypothetical remasters emerge as well-made as those a-ha remasters are, I might actually shed a tear of joy.

Timmy84 said:

Tremolina said:

All the performing artists, can reclaim their part in the sound recording's copyright after 35 years, if there are more than one on the recording, and if their contributions are not works for hire.

The beauty of For You and Prince is that these albums do not suffer these issues. When the rights to these albums revert after 35 years they are fully and completely owned by Prince. All the music and lyrics AND the full sound recording. But not the artwork perhabs.

I see. So in other words, when it gets to Dirty Mind, Controversy, 1999, Purple Rain, Around the World in a Day and the likes, there is a more heated battle with those albums as opposed to the sole musical composition from For You and Prince.

Didn't Prince already say last year he has gotten back his first three albums masters? "Dirty Mind" last year. If that is the case he should get "Controversy" this year & so on & so on. So why are people on here acting like he hasn't gotten any of the masters back?

^ Well if it's 35 years instead of 30, he didn't get the masters back then.

electricberet said:

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

Honestly, I think vinyls may be making a comeback, of sorts. I was in Radio Shack, this past weekend and while I was looking around. I noticed that they had several new stereo systems that you can connect an iPod or mp3 player to. Nothing surprising about that, I know.

The surprising part, for me anyway, was they all had turntables. I couldn't even remember the last time, I'd seen turntables for sale in Radio Shack.

Yes, that's true. There have been stories about young people finding their parents' old vinyl records and buying new turntables to play them, then starting their own vinyl collections. This is great for record companies, because you can't illegally download a vinyl record. But it's not clear whether this is a long-term trend or just a passing fad. You can't take a vinyl record to the gym or play it in your car.

Don't tell the record companies but these new turntables come with USB connections for connecting to computers and archiving vinyl collections.

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

electricberet said:

Yes, that's true. There have been stories about young people finding their parents' old vinyl records and buying new turntables to play them, then starting their own vinyl collections. This is great for record companies, because you can't illegally download a vinyl record. But it's not clear whether this is a long-term trend or just a passing fad. You can't take a vinyl record to the gym or play it in your car.

Don't tell the record companies but these new turntables come with USB connections for connecting to computers and archiving vinyl collections.

That takes all the fun out of it.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Timmy84 said:

I see. So in other words, when it gets to Dirty Mind, Controversy, 1999, Purple Rain, Around the World in a Day and the likes, there is a more heated battle with those albums as opposed to the sole musical composition from For You and Prince.

Didn't Prince already say last year he has gotten back his first three albums masters? "Dirty Mind" last year. If that is the case he should get "Controversy" this year & so on & so on. So why are people on here acting like he hasn't gotten any of the masters back?

There was a thread about this. It's possible that he technically "owns" his masters now but that WMG retains the exclusive distribution rights, in which case he still has to deal with them. If he really does own the masters outright, why doesn't he give us the deluxe remastered edition of Dirty Mind now, however he wants us to hear it?

WB's making their money in Twilight and Harry Potter.

He's too focused on the shows right now to think about his back catalog. I remember Neil Young tried to work on that box set "Archives" for over a decade because he just kept working on new music, and I think when Blu-Ray came out, he thought it was the perfect format for what he wanted it to be.

I'd actually like to see him put everything out in one shot, in a numbered limited edition with a coffeetable scrapbook, then release the remastered CDs/lossless downloads individually.

I don't see him rewriting history. I mean, Jenna Jameson will always be considered a porn star, and those movies will always be around no matter how clean of a life she currently lives. Maybe he'll write up liner notes or put a sticker on the CD as a disclaimer that he no longer feels the way he did at the time he wrote it.

dalsh327 said:

WB's making their money in Twilight and Harry Potter.

He's too focused on the shows right now to think about his back catalog. I remember Neil Young tried to work on that box set "Archives" for over a decade because he just kept working on new music, and I think when Blu-Ray came out, he thought it was the perfect format for what he wanted it to be.

I'd actually like to see him put everything out in one shot, in a numbered limited edition with a coffeetable scrapbook, then release the remastered CDs/lossless downloads individually.

I don't see him rewriting history. I mean, Jenna Jameson will always be considered a porn star, and those movies will always be around no matter how clean of a life she currently lives. Maybe he'll write up liner notes or put a sticker on the CD as a disclaimer that he no longer feels the way he did at the time he wrote it.

Actually, Warner Music Group split off from Time Warner in 2004, so the film studio has no relationship with the record company. Prince's back catalog is a lot more important to WMG than it would have been to Time Warner.

I think Guys & Girls....u think 2 much about what might be coming !!

Timmy84 said:

Tremolina said:

All the performing artists, can reclaim their part in the sound recording's copyright after 35 years, if there are more than one on the recording, and if their contributions are not works for hire.

The beauty of For You and Prince is that these albums do not suffer these issues. When the rights to these albums revert after 35 years they are fully and completely owned by Prince. All the music and lyrics AND the full sound recording. But not the artwork perhabs.

I see. So in other words, when it gets to Dirty Mind, Controversy, 1999, Purple Rain, Around the World in a Day and the likes, there is a more heated battle with those albums as opposed to the sole musical composition from For You and Prince.

Since there aren't any other peformers on the first two albums, legally there can be no debate who all the recording rights should revert to.

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Timmy84 said:

I see. So in other words, when it gets to Dirty Mind, Controversy, 1999, Purple Rain, Around the World in a Day and the likes, there is a more heated battle with those albums as opposed to the sole musical composition from For You and Prince.

Didn't Prince already say last year he has gotten back his first three albums masters? "Dirty Mind" last year. If that is the case he should get "Controversy" this year & so on & so on. So why are people on here acting like he hasn't gotten any of the masters back?

Because the talk about 30 years is basically unconfirmed hearsay. Don't you think something would have happened on the remaster front by now, if it were true?

It's only the podcast guys who said that he said that he would get them back them after 30 years already. The law however says 35 years, as did Prince HIMSELF before in a written NPG online interview (no hearsay). Prince further hasn't confirmed that he has gotten some of the first masters back already.

With that I am not saying that he doesn't. He could have made a deal on it already. Perhabs so far only a deal on the first albums and not the big ones yet. But why hasn't anything happened yet then?

Tremolina said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Didn't Prince already say last year he has gotten back his first three albums masters? "Dirty Mind" last year. If that is the case he should get "Controversy" this year & so on & so on. So why are people on here acting like he hasn't gotten any of the masters back?

Because the talk about 30 years is basically unconfirmed hearsay. Don't you think something would have happened on the remaster front by now, if it were true?

It's only the podcast guys who said that he said that he would get them back them after 30 years already. The law however says 35 years, as did Prince HIMSELF before in a written NPG online interview (no hearsay). Prince further hasn't confirmed that he has gotten some of the first masters back already.

With that I am not saying that he doesn't. He could have made a deal on it already. Perhabs so far only a deal on the first albums and not the big ones yet. But why hasn't anything happened yet then?

Because a deal like that takes time.Prince has been extremely happy lately. Something is going on & ready 2 happen...

^ But thing is we don't know for sure. We're not sure if there's a deal coming or not. And Prince sometimes can be in a good mood just to be in a good mood. Guess we shall see.

skywalker said:

muleFunk said:

Who,outside of the fanbase, would jump at buying a old Prince record?

It's just not financially rewarding for both parties.

People will buy anything if it's promoted well/successfully.

I think there is a HUGE untapped market of younger fans that would be into Prince, but aren't into him because Prince (talking music and merchandise) hasn't been marketed to them (or anyone besides existing fans) properly for awhile now.

Think about Prince's renaissance back into the mainstream in 2004. He was all over MTV, BET, VH1 etc. He had the most successful tour of the year, and was everywhere. That one year of proper marketing has sustained/pushed Prince's career up through now. From 2004 onwards, all he has had to do is make a few appearances and he's selling out shows, winning more awards than he did in the 90's, and even having albums crack the top 10.

Bottom Line: I think that Prince has the potential to "sell" to younger generations like any of the all time greats do, just like Jimi, The Beatles, Bowie, Pink Floyd, Zeppelin, Bob Marley, MJ, etc.

Promotion is the key but will Prince ever agree to be under the direction/guidance of WB again in order to make that happen ?

muleFunk said:

Promotion is the key but will Prince ever agree to be under the direction/guidance of WB again in order to make that happen ?

My guess is that Prince is over the old feud with WB, especially since the people he was feuding with in the 1990s no longer run the company (and it isn't even the same company). Prince would be taking the same bargaining position, I expect, if the masters were owned by EMI or another label (and in fact they may be soon, depending on what happens with the WMG bidding).

Someone help me understand exactly how these "remasters" are going to make the ton of cash the folks here think that it is going to? Prince could have, at anytime, re-recorded this material. Even updated the instrumentation to give it a current sound. All this material is out there now. A remastering is going to do what? Make it clearer? As much as I love this music, the sound makes them period pieces. The heavy use of certain synth sounds made them the vanguard in the 80's, but is a scarlet letter on them today. The reason why, as muleFunk said, certain bands like Hendrix, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, Led Zep, Bob Marley, Bon Jovie and Bowie have had such success with remasters is that their perspective genres have not changed all that much. Rock is still rock, Reggae is still reggae. Acoustic drums and guitar, occasional piano. They same instrumentation used today. So while being older music, still fits in with a current rotation. The Beatles jumped a generation,and Pink Floyd, spending 15 years on the charts with one album, plowed through one. Musicians still play and record with Fender and Gibson guitars. The mini Moog and Yamaha DX-7 are not coming back.

I think Prince realizes this. That is why there is no big rush to open the "vault".The record buying/downloading industry is driven buy the youth, 16 to 27. (Wasn't that the age limit on American Idol?). They identify with people in their generation. In his 50's, Prince looks like he is in his 30's. But 30 ain't 20.

The financial future for Prince is in just what he is doing right now. The live show. Nobody is doing what he is doing. Nobody can. That is something that is unique to him and sets him leap years ahead of his contemporaries. He is not promoting anything right now except the show. No movie, no new album. He is touring on the hits. What will a remaster bring to the table that is not already there?

leonche64 said:

Someone help me understand exactly how these "remasters" are going to make the ton of cash the folks here think that it is going to? Prince could have, at anytime, re-recorded this material. Even updated the instrumentation to give it a current sound. All this material is out there now. A remastering is going to do what? Make it clearer? As much as I love this music, the sound makes them period pieces. The heavy use of certain synth sounds made them the vanguard in the 80's, but is a scarlet letter on them today. The reason why, as muleFunk said, certain bands like Hendrix, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, Led Zep, Bob Marley, Bon Jovie and Bowie have had such success with remasters is that their perspective genres have not changed all that much. Rock is still rock, Reggae is still reggae. Acoustic drums and guitar, occasional piano. They same instrumentation used today. So while being older music, still fits in with a current rotation. The Beatles jumped a generation,and Pink Floyd, spending 15 years on the charts with one album, plowed through one. Musicians still play and record with Fender and Gibson guitars. The mini Moog and Yamaha DX-7 are not coming back.

I think Prince realizes this. That is why there is no big rush to open the "vault".The record buying/downloading industry is driven buy the youth, 16 to 27. (Wasn't that the age limit on American Idol?). They identify with people in their generation. In his 50's, Prince looks like he is in his 30's. But 30 ain't 20.

The financial future for Prince is in just what he is doing right now. The live show. Nobody is doing what he is doing. Nobody can. That is something that is unique to him and sets him leap years ahead of his contemporaries. He is not promoting anything right now except the show. No movie, no new album. He is touring on the hits. What will a remaster bring to the table that is not already there?

I think a significant reason why they haven't been released may be a difference in opinion between Prince and WMG as to exactly how much money they would make. I can only speak for myself, but I would certainly pay for better-sounding but uncensored digital versions of Prince's classic albums, particularly if they came with deluxe booklets including more information about the making of the albums and extra photos (as remasters sometimes do). The official CD versions of the albums that were not originally issued on CD obviously sound worse than the vinyl, and you can't take the vinyl to the gym. You can tell from reading this board that many other Prince fans would want to buy the remasters. The question is how many of those milllions of casual fans who bought Purple Rain in 1984 would buy the remasters.

leonche64 said:

Someone help me understand exactly how these "remasters" are going to make the ton of cash the folks here think that it is going to? Prince could have, at anytime, re-recorded this material. Even updated the instrumentation to give it a current sound. All this material is out there now. A remastering is going to do what? Make it clearer? As much as I love this music, the sound makes them period pieces. The heavy use of certain synth sounds made them the vanguard in the 80's, but is a scarlet letter on them today. The reason why, as muleFunk said, certain bands like Hendrix, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, Led Zep, Bob Marley, Bon Jovie and Bowie have had such success with remasters is that their perspective genres have not changed all that much. Rock is still rock, Reggae is still reggae. Acoustic drums and guitar, occasional piano. They same instrumentation used today. So while being older music, still fits in with a current rotation. The Beatles jumped a generation,and Pink Floyd, spending 15 years on the charts with one album, plowed through one. Musicians still play and record with Fender and Gibson guitars. The mini Moog and Yamaha DX-7 are not coming back.

I think Prince realizes this. That is why there is no big rush to open the "vault".The record buying/downloading industry is driven buy the youth, 16 to 27. (Wasn't that the age limit on American Idol?). They identify with people in their generation. In his 50's, Prince looks like he is in his 30's. But 30 ain't 20.

The financial future for Prince is in just what he is doing right now. The live show. Nobody is doing what he is doing. Nobody can. That is something that is unique to him and sets him leap years ahead of his contemporaries. He is not promoting anything right now except the show. No movie, no new album. He is touring on the hits. What will a remaster bring to the table that is not already there?

Prince alreaddy has re-recorded them.

Thats not the point. Remasters are an excellent sales tool to re-sell an album to a fan that has previously bought it. It has nothing to do with the sound of the times.

Look at the strong sales of the remasters by Depeche Mode and Pet Shop Boys. They sound dated, and they contain instruments that are dead and buried, but thet doesn't matter. Fans want the clarity, and extensions of their most treasured audio.

electricberet said:

leonche64 said:

Someone help me understand exactly how these "remasters" are going to make the ton of cash the folks here think that it is going to? Prince could have, at anytime, re-recorded this material. Even updated the instrumentation to give it a current sound. All this material is out there now. A remastering is going to do what? Make it clearer? As much as I love this music, the sound makes them period pieces. The heavy use of certain synth sounds made them the vanguard in the 80's, but is a scarlet letter on them today. The reason why, as muleFunk said, certain bands like Hendrix, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, Led Zep, Bob Marley, Bon Jovie and Bowie have had such success with remasters is that their perspective genres have not changed all that much. Rock is still rock, Reggae is still reggae. Acoustic drums and guitar, occasional piano. They same instrumentation used today. So while being older music, still fits in with a current rotation. The Beatles jumped a generation,and Pink Floyd, spending 15 years on the charts with one album, plowed through one. Musicians still play and record with Fender and Gibson guitars. The mini Moog and Yamaha DX-7 are not coming back.

I think Prince realizes this. That is why there is no big rush to open the "vault".The record buying/downloading industry is driven buy the youth, 16 to 27. (Wasn't that the age limit on American Idol?). They identify with people in their generation. In his 50's, Prince looks like he is in his 30's. But 30 ain't 20.

The financial future for Prince is in just what he is doing right now. The live show. Nobody is doing what he is doing. Nobody can. That is something that is unique to him and sets him leap years ahead of his contemporaries. He is not promoting anything right now except the show. No movie, no new album. He is touring on the hits. What will a remaster bring to the table that is not already there?

I think a significant reason why they haven't been released may be a difference in opinion between Prince and WMG as to exactly how much money they would make. I can only speak for myself, but I would certainly pay for better-sounding but uncensored digital versions of Prince's classic albums, particularly if they came with deluxe booklets including more information about the making of the albums and extra photos (as remasters sometimes do). The official CD versions of the albums that were not originally issued on CD obviously sound worse than the vinyl, and you can't take the vinyl to the gym. You can tell from reading this board that many other Prince fans would want to buy the remasters. The question is how many of those milllions of casual fans who bought Purple Rain in 1984 would buy the remasters.

Ok Electricberet, you have helped me understand. Your suggestions of a booklet, photos, and the stuff are a great idea. It will definately add value to the project and make it more appealing to someone who is on the fence.

SquirrelMeat said:

leonche64 said:

Someone help me understand exactly how these "remasters" are going to make the ton of cash the folks here think that it is going to? Prince could have, at anytime, re-recorded this material. Even updated the instrumentation to give it a current sound. All this material is out there now. A remastering is going to do what? Make it clearer? As much as I love this music, the sound makes them period pieces. The heavy use of certain synth sounds made them the vanguard in the 80's, but is a scarlet letter on them today. The reason why, as muleFunk said, certain bands like Hendrix, The Beatles, Pink Floyd, Led Zep, Bob Marley, Bon Jovie and Bowie have had such success with remasters is that their perspective genres have not changed all that much. Rock is still rock, Reggae is still reggae. Acoustic drums and guitar, occasional piano. They same instrumentation used today. So while being older music, still fits in with a current rotation. The Beatles jumped a generation,and Pink Floyd, spending 15 years on the charts with one album, plowed through one. Musicians still play and record with Fender and Gibson guitars. The mini Moog and Yamaha DX-7 are not coming back.

I think Prince realizes this. That is why there is no big rush to open the "vault".The record buying/downloading industry is driven buy the youth, 16 to 27. (Wasn't that the age limit on American Idol?). They identify with people in their generation. In his 50's, Prince looks like he is in his 30's. But 30 ain't 20.

The financial future for Prince is in just what he is doing right now. The live show. Nobody is doing what he is doing. Nobody can. That is something that is unique to him and sets him leap years ahead of his contemporaries. He is not promoting anything right now except the show. No movie, no new album. He is touring on the hits. What will a remaster bring to the table that is not already there?

Prince alreaddy has re-recorded them.

Thats not the point. Remasters are an excellent sales tool to re-sell an album to a fan that has previously bought it. It has nothing to do with the sound of the times.

Look at the strong sales of the remasters by Depeche Mode and Pet Shop Boys. They sound dated, and they contain instruments that are dead and buried, but thet doesn't matter. Fans want the clarity, and extensions of their most treasured audio.

Squirrel Meat, you make sense to me. I was thinking more in the terms of luring new fans into the fold. All of these groups have established fan bases that will purchase any release as a collector. The amount of money that some seem to think is going to be made from these, to me, seems unrealistic. Saw Depeche Mode in Hong Kong in 2009 I think. The energy and excitement of the show is where they shine, like I said with Prince. The songs may be dated, but the live show is not.

leonche64 said:

electricberet said:

I think a significant reason why they haven't been released may be a difference in opinion between Prince and WMG as to exactly how much money they would make. I can only speak for myself, but I would certainly pay for better-sounding but uncensored digital versions of Prince's classic albums, particularly if they came with deluxe booklets including more information about the making of the albums and extra photos (as remasters sometimes do). The official CD versions of the albums that were not originally issued on CD obviously sound worse than the vinyl, and you can't take the vinyl to the gym. You can tell from reading this board that many other Prince fans would want to buy the remasters. The question is how many of those milllions of casual fans who bought Purple Rain in 1984 would buy the remasters.

Ok Electricberet, you have helped me understand. Your suggestions of a booklet, photos, and the stuff are a great idea. It will definately add value to the project and make it more appealing to someone who is on the fence.

Add a live CD and DVD and a CD of previously unreleased (bootleg) material, package it in a nice box and I will be more than happy to buy it.

Tremolina said:

leonche64 said:

Ok Electricberet, you have helped me understand. Your suggestions of a booklet, photos, and the stuff are a great idea. It will definately add value to the project and make it more appealing to someone who is on the fence.

Add a live CD and DVD and a CD of previously unreleased (bootleg) material, package it in a nice box and I will be more than happy to buy it.

Now you have added cost to the project, that will make it prohibitive to many fence sitters. Remember, a big reason the music companies are dying is that they got too greedy. If the added features push it up around the $50 USD mark, it may be doomed.

leonche64 said:

Tremolina said:

Add a live CD and DVD and a CD of previously unreleased (bootleg) material, package it in a nice box and I will be more than happy to buy it.

Now you have added cost to the project, that will make it prohibitive to many fence sitters. Remember, a big reason the music companies are dying is that they got too greedy. If the added features push it up around the $50 USD mark, it may be doomed.

No reason why they couldn't give us both: basic remasters with a few bonus tracks and new liner notes/cover art for each album, followed by a career-spanning box set with some additional stuff. Just look how many times Yoko has been able to sell the same John Lennon albums over and over, and his solo catalog is puny compared to Prince's (even if you're just looking at the Warner years). The key is marketing, as others have noted. But Prince is already doing a good job getting his name out there with the W2A tour. Just put together some kind of new album for WMG to promote along with the remasters, and you basically have the formula in place.

Don't expect remasters or any new physical packages of Prince or most music in general. We will most likely just have better streaming options. Better tablet and app integration.

Physical copies are basically dead now.

V10LETBLUES said:

Physical copies are basically dead now.

Not here

Tremolina said:

leonche64 said:

Ok Electricberet, you have helped me understand. Your suggestions of a booklet, photos, and the stuff are a great idea. It will definately add value to the project and make it more appealing to someone who is on the fence.

Add a live CD and DVD and a CD of previously unreleased (bootleg) material, package it in a nice box and I will be more than happy to buy it.

This would be a great idea and with the right promotion it would be very successful. The beatles promotion for their remasters was excellent, posters and tv ads were everywhere.

I think downloading and streaming is the way for him, like he did in the old days.

SquirrelMeat said:

If Prince had any sense, he would try and do a deal now.

The masters clock is ticking in his favour, and the current WB directors will be looking to produce short term profits, so thay can strike a deal with EMI that will give them gold plated pensions.

In return for Prince agreeing to the remasters under the WB label, he should ask for early release of the master tapes and an increased artist percentage in the sales.

Prince could make one final big day. Agree to a worldwide hits tour with regional releasing of the remasters.

Then he can sit back on his millions and he'll have his masters.

The first five words of your post explain why this won't happen.