mozfonky said:

2elijah said:

I remember that song being discussed here a while ago, and it basically caused an avalanche.

ya, anytime this type of topic comes up in any situation in america there will be fireworks. White people are not accustomed to being on the recieving end of vilification and or outright abuse. as Paul Mooney once said, "they kill me with their sensitivity". Us Indians, blacks, asians or whatever darker persuasion you may be, well, we see things much differently. We hear stories from our older folks, we see things done even in our lifetimes and just wonder "what is wrong with white people" and it feels warranted to talk shit about them. I think the logic is, all the destructive things done, physically, psychologically and spiritually to leave some of us in tatters to this very day and to leave us walking on eggshells between two worlds, well, we feel it's ok to talk a little shit.

aaawww shyt its on now.... *gets in line to the concession stand*

[img:$uid]http://www.libertytheater.com/images/liberty_concession_stand.jpg[/img:$uid]

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

thedance said:

^ 1) Michael Jackson loooked sooo goood back then. Shame what happened to his look later, Bad and onwards,

2) Forgive, but as a dane I could not care less about lincoln and racism.

3) About Avalanche, the song...: never liked this song, or the ONA Piano album.

Boring....

[Edited 3/6/11 5:00am]

Since M.J's death, the truth has came out that he really did suffer from vitalago. He lightened some portions of his skin to balance out the discoloration. So what's your point?

jason7sh said:

thedance said:

^ 1) Michael Jackson loooked sooo goood back then. Shame what happened to his look later, Bad and onwards,

2) Forgive, but as a dane I could not care less about lincoln and racism.

3) About Avalanche, the song...: never liked this song, or the ONA Piano album.

Boring....

[Edited 3/6/11 5:00am]

Since M.J's death, the truth has came out that he really did suffer from vitalago. He lightened some portions of his skin to balance out the discoloration. So what's your point?

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

Racial prejudice and discussions of slavery in pre-America/America's past, is a "touchy" topic and will always be met with tension, anger and people uncomfortable with discussing it. Whether it's noted within a lyric of a song or one brought to the table, so-to-speak. Obviously too many "uncomfortable truths" for many to absorb. The only kind of justice is human justice, and people educating/re-educating themselves on the human species in general and not live by the lie or perception that there is a "superior" race among us.

By the way, thanks for your "openness" on this topic though but unfortunately, many of those "issues" you listed are still a major problem in this country, and when one makes an effort to discuss race in the Politics & Religion section on this site, often times, it has been met with disrespect and accusations of "crying victim" or trying to impose "white guilt" on others, which to me makes absolutely no sense, just because someone brings a societal issue to the table for discussion.

Sure there are many situations that must be worked out within a
"every" community, not just the black community as a whole, and when it's a situation that affects a group on a national (international basis in specific situations) basis, then there's a problem, and it needs to be addressed.

Getting back to America's racist past, I think what many are forgetting is despite the many barriers that were put up against many Blacks discriminated in the past, many survived because of their mental and spiritual strength, and did not allow someone else's racial prejudices, ignorant mockery of them, deter them from pursuing their dreams and opportunities afforded to others, while not offered to them, on a fair, just and equal basis. Even if 10 doors were slammed in their faces, many persevered.

In my opinion, education is one of the best weapons to fight against racial prejudice/hatred and ignorance.

[Edited 3/8/11 11:36am]

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

And what reparations have you made?

jason7sh said:

thedance said:

^ 1) Michael Jackson loooked sooo goood back then. Shame what happened to his look later, Bad and onwards,

2) Forgive, but as a dane I could not care less about lincoln and racism.

3) About Avalanche, the song...: never liked this song, or the ONA Piano album.

Boring....

[Edited 3/6/11 5:00am]

Since M.J's death, the truth has came out that he really did suffer from vitalago. He lightened some portions of his skin to balance out the discoloration. So what's your point?

Vitiligo made him get 7,000 nose jobs, plus cheek implants and a cleft in his chin?

errant said:

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

And what reparations have you made?

I contributed thousands of dollars annually to the NAACP events. I've hired many A.A's in my company. I've contributed donations to two Charter Schools and I mentor young inner city African American males. 2elijah, you are a good person with a good heart, however, to strike the final blow against bigotry and racism in America, it's going to take decent hard working and educated Whites to finally put this issue to bed. Folks like erant and spinlight are obviously still living in the mental caves of Europe. African culture and civilization gave light to the world. Africa has always been denied its due in the annals of world history. I'm ashamed of the bigots that are on my side. I'll continue to fight this battle no matter what it takes. I have racist and bigots in my family that I'm still trying to tame.

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

I think you won't find a pot to piss in because the American government has been subjugating and terrorizing its own people for centuries. You think it is only the black people? lmao.

Spinlight said:

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

I think you won't find a pot to piss in because the American government has been subjugating and terrorizing its own people for centuries. You think it is only the black people? lmao.

Speaking of ignorance here, Spinlight...reparations can be in the form of decent quality low income housing, the elimination of police brutality and a better urban school system. When will you mature and begin to see the light and stop putting a spin on everything? I had friends that thought like you until they saw the light. Now they are members of the human family and no longer see race, class and sex. Spinlight, come out the cave and become a member of the hue - man family.

Spinlight said:

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

I think you won't find a pot to piss in because the American government has been subjugating and terrorizing its own people for centuries. You think it is only the black people? lmao.

That's true, not only that, white people have never treated white people well, at least not in the history I'm aware of. That's the problem, it seems the whole society is based on really rigid, militaristic rules so that everything has become a game of rank and a game of competition and sabotage. White people aren't any happier from what I see in my life. Sad thing is, these days, white people seemed to have become more civil, i say seem because I suspect there is a lot that is dormant. Anyway, the mess they have made of blacks and even indians makes it so there are a lot of things about them both that I try to avoid as much as possible, divide and conquer is a very real phenomenon.

jason7sh said:

errant said:

And what reparations have you made?

I contributed thousands of dollars annually to the NAACP events. I've hired many A.A's in my company. I've contributed donations to two Charter Schools and I mentor young inner city African American males. 2elijah, you are a good person with a good heart, however, to strike the final blow against bigotry and racism in America, it's going to take decent hard working and educated Whites to finally put this issue to bed. Folks like erant and spinlight are obviously still living in the mental caves of Europe. African culture and civilization gave light to the world. Africa has always been denied its due in the annals of world history. I'm ashamed of the bigots that are on my side. I'll continue to fight this battle no matter what it takes. I have racist and bigots in my family that I'm still trying to tame.

Slavery had been abolished everywhere in Europe by 1833 (50 years ahead of the US). But thank you for adding your own bigotry to this thread.

Genesia said:

jason7sh said:

Since M.J's death, the truth has came out that he really did suffer from vitalago. He lightened some portions of his skin to balance out the discoloration. So what's your point?

Vitiligo made him get 7,000 nose jobs, plus cheek implants and a cleft in his chin?

No, vitiligo didn't make M.J get this work done. M.J swallowed the pill of White Supremacy physical feature dominance. The entertainment industry has always been harsh on A.A's. This is why some bleached their skin, sharpened their noses and straightened their hair. It was the only way they could make it. Look at Prince. P rode on the lie for years that his mom was White and father was Black. This was so that he could cross over and gain White acceptance. Many Black artist do this. James Brown is one of the few exceptions. White supremacy dominance in the entertainment industry has produced a Colonized Mind for sure.

Genesia said:

jason7sh said:

I contributed thousands of dollars annually to the NAACP events. I've hired many A.A's in my company. I've contributed donations to two Charter Schools and I mentor young inner city African American males. 2elijah, you are a good person with a good heart, however, to strike the final blow against bigotry and racism in America, it's going to take decent hard working and educated Whites to finally put this issue to bed. Folks like erant and spinlight are obviously still living in the mental caves of Europe. African culture and civilization gave light to the world. Africa has always been denied its due in the annals of world history. I'm ashamed of the bigots that are on my side. I'll continue to fight this battle no matter what it takes. I have racist and bigots in my family that I'm still trying to tame.

Slavery had been abolished everywhere in Europe by 1833 (50 years ahead of the US). But thank you for adding your own bigotry to this thread.

Genesia, there is no bigotry here from me. I am a White male and I am proud of my European ancestry. What I've stated in my quote above is the truth. Face it, the truth must be told and I'm here to deliver it. I'm here to excorcise the hate out of some of you. This is my Christian duty. Come 1, Come all - I will tame the beast. . .

jason7sh said:

errant said:

And what reparations have you made?

I contributed thousands of dollars annually to the NAACP events. I've hired many A.A's in my company. I've contributed donations to two Charter Schools and I mentor young inner city African American males. 2elijah, you are a good person with a good heart, however, to strike the final blow against bigotry and racism in America, it's going to take decent hard working and educated Whites to finally put this issue to bed. Folks like erant and spinlight are obviously still living in the mental caves of Europe. African culture and civilization gave light to the world. Africa has always been denied its due in the annals of world history. I'm ashamed of the bigots that are on my side. I'll continue to fight this battle no matter what it takes. I have racist and bigots in my family that I'm still trying to tame.

I've lived through racial prejudice throughout my life, so it is not difficult to know the signs or recognize the behavior when I encounter it. I know how to deal with it, and when I do, it's usually on an an "individual" basis. I blame it on ignorance and miseducated minds. I've always saw it as a challenge, and for someone to tell me I couldn't or can't do something because of my skin color was a joke to me, because I've always known that my skin color/ethnicity never defined my capabilities or who I am spirtitually or mentally. So when faced with a challenge, what do you do? You challenge it.... ...and lawd knows I love taking that opportunity.

You should not be angry at those, even within your racial background/ethnic group that don't or are not ready to embrace the truth about racism/racial prejudice or America's history of it. They have to come to grips with that on their own. Even when slavery was abolished in various parts of the world, at different time periods, much of the racist mentality still existed giving birth to post-slavery conditions years later, so racial prejudice remained in the minds of many, despite the abolishment of slavery.

For one to think abolishing slavery would erase all racial prejudice, then they are living in a bubble. That's like saying the slaveholder who raped African girls/ women wasn't racist, because he lifted up their skirts and laid down with them. Yet when he impregnated those girls/women, he sold the children he had from those females, and didn't claim or treat them as his own. Yes America has an ugly past and one can see why it is a difficult topic to discuss with ease, as well as for some to admit that Lincoln was a product of his time and not surprising that he held racist beliefs about those of African-descent.

At least you took the time and effort, and had the how's and why's to initiate your own interest and research and sought education on it, and that's a good thing and the difference between you and others who choose to remain ignorant in their own prejudices. Nice chatting with you.

[Edited 3/7/11 13:10pm]

jason7sh said:

errant said:

And what reparations have you made?

I contributed thousands of dollars annually to the NAACP events. I've hired many A.A's in my company. I've contributed donations to two Charter Schools and I mentor young inner city African American males. 2elijah, you are a good person with a good heart, however, to strike the final blow against bigotry and racism in America, it's going to take decent hard working and educated Whites to finally put this issue to bed. Folks like erant and spinlight are obviously still living in the mental caves of Europe. African culture and civilization gave light to the world. Africa has always been denied its due in the annals of world history. I'm ashamed of the bigots that are on my side. I'll continue to fight this battle no matter what it takes. I have racist and bigots in my family that I'm still trying to tame.

that's noble and admirable and I won't criticize that for a second. But my own life has told me that the way to deal with it, is to deal with it alone, meaning being THE BOSS that's really the only way and i think Malcolm X was correct in every way when he called for black business' and black centralized self-help with NO outside help so that black people would develop not only the confidence but also self-sufficiency in that black people support black business, whatever your criticisms of the NOI might be, that was the one thing they did and had right and it got fucked up. MLK had the wrong answers and Malcolm had the right ones and the proof of this is that the black community as a whole did not benefit overall from the movement of King. They did not. For whatever mistakes indians make, they are making quantum leaps with the casinos, huge leaps along with huge mistakes, but it's better than where they were.

jason7sh said:

Genesia said:

Slavery had been abolished everywhere in Europe by 1833 (50 years ahead of the US). But thank you for adding your own bigotry to this thread.

Genesia, there is no bigotry here from me. I am a White male and I am proud of my European ancestry. What I've stated in my quote above is the truth. Face it, the truth must be told and I'm here to deliver it. I'm here to excorcise the hate out of some of you. This is my Christian duty. Come 1, Come all - I will tame the beast. . .

I will not be preached to by your hypocritical ass.

Genesia said:

jason7sh said:

Genesia, there is no bigotry here from me. I am a White male and I am proud of my European ancestry. What I've stated in my quote above is the truth. Face it, the truth must be told and I'm here to deliver it. I'm here to excorcise the hate out of some of you. This is my Christian duty. Come 1, Come all - I will tame the beast. . .

I will not be preached to by your hypocritical ass.

Genesia, I can see that the excorcising of your soul is working. That explains your bitterness in your comment above. Where am I being hypocritical? Don't just say it, sight and quote examples.

jason7sh said:

Spinlight said:

I think you won't find a pot to piss in because the American government has been subjugating and terrorizing its own people for centuries. You think it is only the black people? lmao.

Speaking of ignorance here, Spinlight...reparations can be in the form of decent quality low income housing, the elimination of police brutality and a better urban school system. When will you mature and begin to see the light and stop putting a spin on everything? I had friends that thought like you until they saw the light. Now they are members of the human family and no longer see race, class and sex. Spinlight, come out the cave and become a member of the hue - man family.

Speaking of ignorance nothing. You think that a charade of overcompensation and guilt is going to wash away the sins of the past? Please, kid. Grow up and live in the real world. You're delusional. You are playing directly into the hands of the people who orchestrated the race wars in the first place. You are born and bred on the Haves and Have Nots concept and you keep it alive and well, thriving on the bigotry born deep inside your heart. I don't need to pay back reparations because I see people for who they are and not the race they represent. When I talk to you, I talk to you for who you are and as you are, not your entire culture. What bigoted and small-minded person walks around thinking the way you do? Divide and conquer and you play directly into that with your nonsense.

Togetherness has nothing to do with what you speak of. And any person who respected you for who you were wouldn't expect you to pay back some arbitrary amount. The fact you have converted your god into the A.A. culture makes you no less enslaved than the people within that community were.

2elijah said:

jason7sh said:

African Americans should be heard and allowed to express their feelings concerning oppression, racism and bigotry hear in this forum whenever they choose to. I'm an advocate for some type of reparations for all African Americans whose ancesters suffered under slavery. We gotta right the wrongs. Prince makes this point on Chaos and Disorder. Call it White guilt, but I call it Black Justice. Issues such as poverty, police brutality, job discrimination and decent housing needs to be addressed.

Racial prejudice and discussions of slavery in pre-America/America's past, is a "touchy" topic and will always be met with tension, anger and people uncomfortable with discussing it. Whether it's noted within a lyric of a song or one brought to the table, so-to-speak. Obviously too many "uncomfortable truths" for many to absorb. The only kind of justice is human justice, and people educating/re-educating themselves on the human species in general and not live by the lie or perception that there is a "superior" race among us.

By the way, thanks for your "openness" on this topic though but unfortunately, many of those "issues" you listed are still a major problem in this country, and when one makes an effort to discuss race in the Politics & Religion section on this site, often times, it has been met with disrespect and accusations of "crying victim" or trying to impose "white guilt" on others, which to me makes absolutely no sense, just because someone brings a societal issue to the table for discussion.

Sure there are many situations that must be worked out within a
"every" community, not just the black community as a whole, but when it's a situation that affects a group on a national (international basis in specific situations) basis, then there's a problem, and it needs to be addressed.

Getting back to America's racist past, I think what many are forgetting is despite the many barriers that were put up against many Blacks discriminated in the past, many survived because of their mental and spiritual strength, and did not allow someone else's racial prejudices, ignorant mockery of them, deter them from pursuing their dreams and opportunities afforded to others. Even if 10 doors were slammed in their faces, many persevered.

In my opinion, education is one of the best weapons to fight against racial prejudice/hatred and ignorance.

[Edited 3/7/11 11:53am]

For those of you who laugh and joke about the effectiveness of reparations, well here's an example in addition to the Native Americans where it has worked. The Jews in ancient Egypt when they left Pharoah's bondage of slavery, they were given reparations with cattle and tools. With that, they came out of Egypt and has been successful many generations after that. Genisia, Spinlight and Errant, here are six books that I recommend that you read so that you can become enlightened. The Mis-Education of The Negro by Carter G. Woodson, The Autobiography of Malcolm X by Allex Hailey, The Destruction of African Civilization Chancellor Williams, The Isis Papers by Francis Cress Welsing, They Came Before Columbus by Ivan Van Sertima. To put icing on the cake, here's a book that was written by a White Canadian that you should read and it will educate you on why White Supremacy racism is in existence, The Iceman's Inheritance by Michael Bradley. If you just read the introduction, you'll get a spoonful of wisdom about yourself.

Spinlight said:

jason7sh said:

Speaking of ignorance here, Spinlight...reparations can be in the form of decent quality low income housing, the elimination of police brutality and a better urban school system. When will you mature and begin to see the light and stop putting a spin on everything? I had friends that thought like you until they saw the light. Now they are members of the human family and no longer see race, class and sex. Spinlight, come out the cave and become a member of the hue - man family.

Speaking of ignorance nothing. You think that a charade of overcompensation and guilt is going to wash away the sins of the past? Please, kid. Grow up and live in the real world. You're delusional. You are playing directly into the hands of the people who orchestrated the race wars in the first place. You are born and bred on the Haves and Have Nots concept and you keep it alive and well, thriving on the bigotry born deep inside your heart. I don't need to pay back reparations because I see people for who they are and not the race they represent. When I talk to you, I talk to you for who you are and as you are, not your entire culture. What bigoted and small-minded person walks around thinking the way you do? Divide and conquer and you play directly into that with your nonsense.

Togetherness has nothing to do with what you speak of. And any person who respected you for who you were wouldn't expect you to pay back some arbitrary amount. The fact you have converted your god into the A.A. culture makes you no less enslaved than the people within that community were.

Take the joint out of your mouth and stop being a dope. There is no love in your heart exept for yourself. You still can't accept the fact that Sheila is considered Black by many standards. Fascistic thoughts won't get you anywhere. Open your mind to wisdom instead of pain. When you open your heart to love instead of hate, then one day, you'll be welcomed in the Purple Rain !!!

Insofar as reparations, here is my opinion: Native Americans have been given alot by the government, my (black) stepdad raised me to believe my royalty checks were a coverup for a guilty conscience. The USA has paid reparations of sorts to others, my Japanese gung fu teacher recieved 15,000 a few years ago, none of which he wanted to take. How the fuck do you replace what's been lost? You cannot, but my point is, everyone else gets the dough but when it comes to black folk there has always been some reason not to do much. Not that it means anything. I get checks 2 times a year, it's nothing that will change my life, the way I was raised (good and bad) or change my status in this society. It doesn't make me feel equal to no one or that I am a citizen, like I said, what's gone is gone. The money just is a false way for the man to clear his conscience when nothing can really fix what's gone.

and let us not forget, that as badass as Prince is and how brilliant some of his songs are, he never wrote songs like that until he couldn't get his way with his record label, I don't believe for a minute that Prince reallyt had the kind of integrity of say a Stevie Wonder or a Marvin Gaye, Please..

I love it and I love "Dreamer" too.